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#1 Re: Human missions » ManforMars - A Mars wagon train » 2004-06-04 10:43:13

I think watching a Martian base operate and grow will be exciting enough for the general public. And long rover outings will be just as interesting as if the entire base were mobile. Plus, I think if we're on Mars the hard part of public relations is behind us. If enough support has been sustained to get us there, it shouldnt be hard keeping public interest long as there are always new things to do and new places to explore. Part of the reason the moon got so boring is that it doesnt have a canyon the size of the US or the tallest mountain in the solar system. People will want to see someone cross that canyon and climb that mountain.

#2 Re: Human missions » Space Bonds? - to fund the Bush plan » 2004-05-03 20:31:29

http://www.washingtondispatch.com/artic … ml]article here

Thoughts anyone? Could this idea of selling bonds to pay for the Bush plan actually work?

#3 Re: Human missions » Space Elevators.....How Soon? » 2004-05-03 18:49:57

I would be extremely surprised if we see a space elevator in the next 15 years. Although it would make Mars much more convienient, I don't see us harnessing an asteroid with as-of-yet untested technologies before we go to Mars, which is quite possible with existing technologies. I believe a space elevator may come sometime after a permanent residence is established on Mars, as this would provide a great use for the elevator and huge economic opportunities.

#4 Re: Human missions » Bush and Mars and Re-election - Bush and Mars and Re-election » 2004-05-03 17:40:07

If only Congress could do this...
If only Congress could do that...
If only...If only...If only...

If only people didn't call for those in power to do the governing for them.  If only people would stop using, "I can't do enough, so I won't do anything" as an excuse to not take action.

I have in fact written to not only the President and Senators of my state, but also other Congressmen in the appropriate committees (the House's Space and Aeronautics Subcommitte, and the Senate's Science, Technology and Space Subcommittee), urging them to support a Mars mission in any way they can, and that the moon is not the right goal for NASA (in my opinion). Many have not responded, but the Senators of my state have shown support, with one even passing my letter on to NASA. It is good that some Congressmen show support, but my letters will indeed not be enough. IF ONLY( tongue ) everyone who supports Mars missions would let their thoughts be known to Congress, we may get somewhere.

#5 Re: Human missions » Bush and Mars and Re-election - Bush and Mars and Re-election » 2004-05-02 22:01:33

True, but one speech is better than no speech, and one speech is definetly better than not supporting the plan (as you noted Kerry does).

And Hazer is right, fight for it we must! However writing, calling, or even visiting congressmen about the issue will only go so far, when they have so much else on their plates to consider, and so many other things they would rather spend the national budget on.

If only congress could somehow see past the imediate expenses to the enormous returns such a mission would bring, not only in science and technology (I know, blah, blah, blah... we've all heard this all before roll ), but more importantly to the progress of humanity.

#6 Re: Human missions » Bush and Mars and Re-election - Bush and Mars and Re-election » 2004-05-01 21:55:19

Kerry does not support manned missions to the moon or Mars.

Damn. :realllymad: Well then I guess I know who's getting my vote.

#7 Re: Human missions » Bush and Mars and Re-election - Bush and Mars and Re-election » 2004-05-01 13:30:46

Whether or not this plan goes anywhere will most likely be up to the next administration, and the following one as well. If Bush is re-elected, hopefully he will stick to it and make sure the Moon to Mars Comission's report doesnt end up in the same stack as the 90-Day Report. However, if Kerry is elected it could be another story.

BTW, anyone know Kerry's stance on the issue, or if he has one at all?

#8 Re: Martian Politics and Economy » Living on mars. - Would you personally live on Mars? » 2004-05-01 13:23:14

Yeah seems to be a re-occuring theme here. I'd go to Mars one way without giving it a second thought, if it wasn't for the girlfriend and family I'd be leaving behind forever. Of course I'd love for them to come along too, but most wouldn't easily give up the comforts of Earth. To me living on Mars would be an epic adventure, but to her it would be more like living in a tuna can. *Sigh*  roll

#9 Re: Terraformation » Speed Bumps to Terraforming (Anywhere) » 2004-04-30 18:23:27

I would say "Blues" and "Greens" fall in the same category, in that they are both for terraforming rather than against it. Enough air pressure to walk around without a suit is a goal common to both, however I'm sure you would agree it is not the final goal.

Indeed it will take more than a lifetime to fully terraform, which is all the more reason to support every aspect of the project for the benefit of future generations.

#10 Re: Civilization and Culture » Red Mars, Green Mars, Blue Mars - K.S.R.'s novels....Sci-Fi or reality? » 2004-04-24 23:29:01

I just wanted to see what those of you who have read Kim Stanley Robinson's trilogy think of his books. Do you think they are realistic or just good Sci-Fi novels? Right now I am about half way through Green Mars, and personally I think his novels are proablby very close to what will happen with Martian colonization, with the transnational corporations controlling everything, Earth in shambles, and the revolution at the end of Red Mars. Comments?

#11 Re: Not So Free Chat » A new bet? - When will shuttle fly? » 2004-04-22 22:54:24

Regarding that article, it doesn't sound good for the shuttle fleet... but at least there is a glimmer of hope for Hubble. smile

#12 Re: Intelligent Alien Life » Which wold be "scarier" - Alone or not alone » 2004-04-22 09:29:05

In the interest of my race's survival, I am a firm supporter of stepping out into the Cosmos both well-armed & dangerous.

Sounds like a good plan to me. I mean just look what happened to the Native Americans... that could be the entire human race, whats' left of us living in small designated areas. Nukes and fast ships should be our gunpowder and horses, to ensure this doesnt happen.

#13 Re: Human missions » The First to Mars - Who will it be? » 2004-04-21 20:08:48

I don't doubt that China has the technical capabilities and motivation to put a man on Mars, but I do doubt that the US will let them be the first. It would mean the beginning of the end of the American dominated era, and I just don't see this country letting that happen over someting we are just as capable of doing.

#14 Re: Water on Mars » Active Springs & Glacier- Nilosyrtis Mensae, Ma - Active Springs and glaciers on Mars » 2004-04-20 14:56:03

...collects at the poles or leaks off to space...

I have been wondering about this...is it possible for water or moisture, or anything for that matter, to just leave the planet off into space? Excluding ejecta from asteroid impacts and things like that, it seems like Mars' gravity and atmosphere would hold everything in.

I was having a debate with a friend a few days ago about this, and I claimed that will all the evidence of past water on Mars, it must still be there somewhere, in the polar caps and underground. He said, "Well maybe it went out into space," but I didnt think this was possible. Is it?

#15 Re: Martian Politics and Economy » Selectionism - An Ideology for Martian Settlement » 2004-04-20 00:07:51

I believe that the people who design and build those neighborhoods should decide what kind of political and economic systems those neighborhoods should have.

You mean vote? Sounds like democracy to me.

#16 Re: Terraformation » should we or shouldn't we? - Are you for or against Terraforming? » 2004-04-19 23:51:31

I'm all for terraforming. If we wait until every inch of Mars is put under a microscope, valuble time will be lost on a project that is sure to take quite awhile. Some say we have no experience in such a venture, but as the process goes on for centuries I'm sure we will get better at it.

I'd be interested to hear what the percentages were on the other sites you polled.

#17 Re: Terraformation » Speed Bumps to Terraforming (Anywhere) » 2004-04-19 17:12:37

Yeah that is pretty suprising KSR is a Red, it sure doesnt show in his novels. But regardless, that quote pretty much embodies why I am a Green. Following the Red's logic, we should have left Noth America untouched and crammed Earth's growing population into Europe, so as not to harm any of the continent's natural beauty.

#18 Re: Not So Free Chat » A new bet? - When will shuttle fly? » 2004-04-18 22:29:47

Well I hope you are right. It's just that the way this return to flight date seems to keep slipping, and with a retirement date drawing closer, it is not too far fetched that the shuttle may not fly again, in which case we would have to either change objectives or find another way to complete them.

#19 Re: Not So Free Chat » A new bet? - When will shuttle fly? » 2004-04-18 20:22:38

Is it possible to finish all that in less than 5 years to meet the 2010 retirement date?

#20 Re: Water on Mars » water water every where and nota drop to drink. - Water any one? » 2004-04-18 17:39:03

Some interesting pictures there, some of that stuff does look like it may have been blurred out, especially between the rocks in pictures 3 and 4. And also a very intriguing object in picture 11.

But I just can't see why NASA would have any reason whatsoever to cover things up like this. Its not like they've found E.T. or something, it's just rocks... hardly enough to cause hysteria in the public. And if there is liquid water in some of those pictures... why deny it or cover it up instead of announcing a monumental discovery that would give NASA the publicity, credibility, and public support it so badly needs.

#21 Re: Not So Free Chat » A new bet? - When will shuttle fly? » 2004-04-18 17:13:02

Actually I am not sure at all, it was just an assumption which is proablby wrong. But it seems to me that there must be another way to finish ISS, and the way things are looking with the shuttle as of now, it might not be a bad idea to start finding it if ISS is to ever be completed.

I realize our international comittment to finish ISS, and that not finishing what you start is not the best way to operate... but how much would completion of ISS add to its current capabilities (which will soon be put on the back-burner anyways when Moon to Mars gets underway)? Not much I would think. It's like putting money into a dying car when you should be saving for a new one. Not a very good analogy I know, but you get the point.

#22 Re: Human missions » The First to Mars - Who will it be? » 2004-04-18 09:56:04

Just wanted to see what everyone thinks about this... most of the choices listed have announced some sort of plan (be it near-term or long-term) to put men on Mars. So the question is, who will be first? And will one group's progress cause other groups to step it up a bit to get there first? (i.e. if this private Russian company can actually do it soon, will the US speed things up?)

#23 Re: Not So Free Chat » A new bet? - When will shuttle fly? » 2004-04-18 01:18:09

IMO NASA should stop pouring money into a vehicle that will last another 5 years at most. ISS can be finished without us, and the reality is that even it will become obselete in  a decade or two. Hardly worth the trouble when there is so much more out there that needs exploring.

Quit practicing in the driveway and take humanity out for a joy ride!!

#24 Re: Intelligent Alien Life » Universal Life - Is all - complex life in the universe similar? » 2004-04-18 00:56:26

I would have to say that extraterrestrial life definetly does exist. It is just a matter if we will ever find it, of if it will find us. Im sure that if such life is "intelligent" life, it wants to make contact with someone else just as much as we do. It would be very egocentric to think that we are the only ones in this entire universe, I mean look at the size of it! Other life has to exist. The glorious night sky is proof enough of this for me, and to think that what is visible to the eye is only a tiny fraction of what is out there is completely mind boggling.

I am sure we are not alone, and IMO we should be putting more resources into finding and making contact with those who share our gift of life in this universe. I cannot think of a more profound discovery.

#25 Re: Terraformation » Speed Bumps to Terraforming (Anywhere) » 2004-04-17 22:11:16

I think terraforming is not a question of if, how, or why, but rather it is a question of when. The fact is people will eventually go to Mars and live there permanently. And when that happens is it inevetable that they will sooner or later attempt to terraform, so that generations and generations down the line, people will be able to walk outside in the free air. Chances are it is a dead rock, so changeing the environment there would be no less ethical (perhaps more ethical) than the many things that we change on the living Earth everyday. I know this quote may be a little played out, but IMO they are wise words:

"We are the consciousness of the universe, and our job is to spread that around, to go look at things, to live everywhere we can. It’s too dangerous to keep the consciousness of the universe on one planet; it could be wiped out. Mars will always remain Mars, different from Earth, colder and wilder. But it can be Mars and ours at the same time. And it will be. There is this about the human mind: if it can be done, it will be done. We can do it, so we will do it. So we might as well start."           -Kim Stanley Robinson

To me that sums it up.

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