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For SpaceNut re doors in the proposed scientific airlock system for Mars...
https://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.ph … 38#p236738
Are you asking a question about the flat doors?
I can't tell from the wording.
The round doors are (obviously) pressure doors.
The flat doors are dust doors that do not handle pressure, unless the very light Mars wind sends a few molecules at the outside.
It's time for our NewMars Airlock topic to start moving beyond examples provided by others.
We have the Image Server now to host images of designs.
The Image Server can host images of equations.
We can store non-image documents on Dropbox when that is necessary.
It should be possible for us to begin building a knowledge base that future Mars pioneers can access to answer questions about what size screw goes where in the outer sand door mounting flange.
If a person has never designed something before, they might not know that all designs start with arbitrary sizes and dimensions for things. Get started and someone will tell you soon enough if you are off base.
Calliban did not worry about someone telling him how large the dome should be. He liked 200 Meters and went with it.
No one objected, and lo and behold! It turns out the Superbowl is 208 meters in diameter. That is a quite feasible size.
We human have recent experience with it. Let's get started and plan to make adjustments as we go.
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For SpaceNut re garage on Mars ...
Your recent posts have inspired this thought....
Let's consider creating a standard metal building for equipment maintenance out of the wind and free of sand.
Let's pick a building from the assortment of buildings on Earth. We have many vendors of build-it-yourself metal buildings.
We want the building to be large enough to handle whatever vehicles the various Nations will be sending to Mars in the early years.
Just pick one and see if it weighs less than 40 tons when shipped.
If it does, go to the next step. Can the building hold up to conditions on Mars? My guess is it will, because it is designed for Earth, and Earth is rough on buildings.
Does the building require a concrete foundation? What can we do instead?
GW Johnson has written about floor solutions for Mars. Can we use one of those?
Now to the crucial question: Can a robot or a team of robots assemble the building?
I don't think that has ever happened? Possibly not.
Can it happen? Of course it can. What does it take to make it happen? It should be obvious, but for our readers, I'll spell it out.... It takes a single human being who is obsessed with making it happen. Are there such human beings on Earth today? I think there must be, because there are so many difficult projects under way around the world in 2025.
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For SpaceNut re garage on Mars ...
Re https://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.ph … 41#p236741
Nice! Great Find! Nice Image!
Ok... we have two ways to go... Please do both.
I'd like to see the building you found developed further. That building is plenty large for a great number of vehicles, and you can make it as long as you need.
Please find out what the shipping weight of the entire structure might be. That would include all the panels and the frame and the fasteners.
There might be additional components but just include them. Please don't second guess the builders. They know more than you or I ever well so let's not waste time trying to redo their work. What I want to know is: will that system ship for under 40 tons, and will the panels fit inside a Starship?
*** The second path is to obtain the measurements of the Starship hull and determine what you can make by cutting it in half longitudinally.
If you do ** that ** you may have a structure strong enough to hold a meter or two of regolith, if you anchor the bottom correctly and if you pile regolith against the sides. Please do NOT try to solve ANY of the details yourself. Neither you nor I have ** any ** idea what needs to be done, but we have two fully qualified engineers in the group who do. Let's not waste any of our valuable time worrying about details.
I would like to see two proposals coming out of this topic:
1) Original Quonset hut building
2) Split Starship building
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For SpaceNut ... just curious ... does 2026 feel any different than 2025 did?
There were celebrations all over the world New Year's Eve. I watched one of the college football playoffs last night. My team lost but ** someone ** had to lose. At least we got ** that ** far.
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For SpaceNut re conversation with your AI friend about huts on Mars...
Your AI friend clearly does NOT understand this would be an unpressurized hut.
Your AI friend clearly does not possess engineering knowledge, or even ** any ** facts about the hull of Starship.
The Starship hull is designed to withstand some internal pressure but I'm not sure how much. The main design feature is the ability to carry massive vertical load.
The question an engineer would have to answer is how well a 1/2 cross section of the cylinder could be adapted for the hut application.
Your AI friend clearly does not have a clue, and it is going to need a lot of careful guidance before it can produce anything useful.
You have the opportunity to provide guidance for your AI friend. Otherwise it is just flailing about.
You have the opportunity to re-read GW Johnson's advice on how to make a sturdy floor for the hut.
Your AI friend has (apparently) not yet had an opportunity to read GW's guidance.
Please keep attempting to help your AI friend to produce useful results.
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The internal pressure has not been given as to how high we would require to make use of outer ware space suit for use. It will need to be determined due to radiation protection requirement. which could be as low as 2 meter of regolith.
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For SpaceNut ... your post #4056 does not explain what you are talking about.
The hut outside for vehicle maintenance ls not pressurized, so workers have to wear Mars suits.
If you want shirtsleeve you have an entirely different problem to solve. Let's try to keep the two separate from each other.
It is (or should be) relatively easy to simply set up a perfectly normal earth-style Quonset hut.
Why not just DO that? It would be useful and this forum would make a contribution.
It is beyond the capability of this forum to design a pressurized garage for tank sized vehicles on Mars.
It is very much within our capability to design an unpressurized garage to keep dust out and provide light for work, as well as storage for those tools you've recommended for humans to use.
Let's do what we CAN do and leave impossible or nearly impossible tasks for someone else.
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For SpaceNut re outdoor garage to protect workers and equipment from sand blown wind.
That does not reduce risk and still causes equipment to cold sink into non operational.
What is this, SpaceNut ??? Is this how you deal with requests? Are we trying to avoid work by coming up with one excuse after another to avoid just doing the job? We need an unpressurized Quonset hut on Mars, so let's just find out what it takes and provide the information so someone can make it happen.
We have two plausible choices... We can ship a standard design to Mars as is, straight from the factory.
Or we can split a Starship into two halves and weld them together to make a ** really ** long Quonset hut.
We need the assistance of a ** real ** engineer to figure out how much overburden the Starship can take, and likewise for the standard factory Quonset hut.
We are NOT going to solve these details so let's not try. And let's not ask our AI friends to perform engineering unless we get one qualified to do engineering.
We already have a specification for a strong floor in the forum Archive. Let's just use that and quit fussing around.
is there a factory designed Quonset hut that weights under 40 tons and will fit inside a Starship? If there is let's provide that information to our readers.
We are NOT in the business of taking risks. The investors who are going to make this happen are able to handle risks.
Let's do what we can do, and find the appropriate talent for those things we cannot do.
Update: GW just published an article about how to make landing pads (or floor for a Quonset hut).
The rocket vehicle landing pads article is now posted on the exrocketman site. It has drawn a lot of readership in only an hour or so. I think I sent you an earlier version of it as a pdf file. What I posted is the very latest version. It has a search code: 01012026. It includes a photo taken on the country highway in front of my house, that shows what "crush rut" roadbed damage actually looks like.
https://exrocketman.blogspot.com/?01012026
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For SpaceNut re garage on Mars ...
Why are you adding an airlock to the dome?
The dome won't exist until you build it, and you're going to need that garage outside for a LONG time before there is anything to connect to it.
Why make this more complicated than it needs to be?
All we need is a simple garage with doors to keep the dust out.
The strength to pile regolith on top is a nice bonus but it is NOT necessary. What ** is ** necessary is a shelter where you or your robots can work on machinery with good lighting and protection from Mars sand laden winds.
It is possible for this forum to stop adding bells and whistles?
Let's agree upon a reliable garage and set it aside for when the plans are needed.
You cannot ** plan ** to cut a Starship in half so I vote for just dropping the idea.
What you ** can ** do is find a Quonset hut on Earth and ship it to Mars.
Let's do that.
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For SpaceNut ... kbd512 provided an additional path forward for the garage initiative.
We have the opportunity to split the initiative into at least three branches.
The first and primary need is a shelter with good lighting and protection from Mars sand.
That first tier should be a candidate for a simple import from Earth, assembled by robots on Mars.
The next tier could be one that provides protection for human workers, and in that case it must be stronger and able to support meters of regolith. That is a much more difficult problem to solve, so some thought will be required.
The next tier is the one that kbd512 suggested ... It would involve excavation of a Crater wall.
Benefits would be many, so such a concept is well worth pursuing.
It seems to me that a vendor who offers a simple lighted garage or hanger will have customers from day one.
Here is a list of the titles we have in Projects today:
Replies Views Last post
Sticky: Project Management - Documentation - Guidelines by tahanson43206
2 7 2025-03-31 08:52:35 by tahanson43206Liquid Nitrogen frozen chicken eggs by RobertDyck
2 11 2025-12-21 09:47:17 by SpaceNutBrick Dome for Mars Village by tahanson43206
22 114 2025-12-21 09:39:53 by SpaceNutWaste management in Calliban's Dome by tahanson43206
4 20 2025-12-21 09:36:27 by SpaceNutGreenhouse, 400 square meters, long, thin, using 3-5-8 Mars Atmosphere by tahanson43206
18 74 2025-12-18 17:37:35 by SpaceNutMars Business Calendar as a Profit Center for the Mars Society by tahanson43206
2 10 2025-12-18 13:09:28 by tahanson43206Automate Daily Recap Labels Edits by tahanson43206
5 36 2025-12-18 12:31:46 by tahanson43206War drones by RobertDyck
21 116 2025-11-07 19:26:46 by kbd512Asteroid mining: Ring/Jaws/Bag - Calliban by tahanson43206
2 18 2025-10-06 09:15:38 by tahanson43206Optical Plane Photon Capture Deep Space Exploration Vessel by tahanson43206
9 39 2025-09-19 08:18:38 by tahanson43206On Earth Test System for Optical Plane space vessel Heating Pipe by tahanson43206
2 5 2025-09-19 08:17:44 by tahanson43206Venus Exploration/Mining Equipment and Procedures by tahanson43206
17 70 2024-12-28 15:51:30 by kbd512Prototype One Ton Thrust Solar Thermal Space Tug run for 1000 seconds by tahanson43206
2 9 2024-12-23 09:21:14 by tahanson43206Space Tug for Departure from LEO by tahanson43206
2 10 2024-12-09 15:04:20 by tahanson43206DARPA Proposal Process by tahanson43206
6 21 2024-10-27 21:13:14 by tahanson43206Demonstration Project Aldrin Cycler Counter Rotating Habitats by tahanson43206
2 19 2024-10-21 08:18:57 by tahanson43206Asteroid mining: Icicle Capture - tahanson43206 by tahanson43206
1 5 2024-10-11 10:10:09 by tahanson43206Book Project: So You Want to be a Space Pilot by tahanson43206
8 24 2024-08-16 09:50:23 by tahanson43206Compressed Air Automobile for Mass Market by tahanson43206
4 22 2024-08-08 10:13:15 by tahanson43206Design of Solid Fuel Rocket for SpinLaunch by tahanson43206
2 10 2024-06-27 09:09:06 by tahanson43206Fuel Depot on Phobos - Ship Carbon and Water - Make methane and LOX by tahanson43206
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For SpaceNut re https://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.ph … 75#p236775
You've introduced an interesting new variation in this post.... the topic is about a garage, but you've branched to include airlocks, and then you've introduced the interesting idea of an airlock for Starship that might have landed.
In thinking about that, it seems to me the Starship will have an airlock for space egress. But that airlock will be ill suited for service on Mars, so advanced planning might include your suggestion of an onsite airlock for that landed Starship.
Plus... earlier you had suggested making a garage out of the Starship. The top part of the Starship will be where crew have been living, so that is a reasonable base for living for a while. However, the bottom tank section might be removed and adapted for purposes such as storage or work activity.
If the Starship remains vertical after landing, then your advance planning might have provided a complete system to swing up next to the Starship and provide the Mars style airlock as well as ladders for crew to use to descend to the surface.
Your advance planning might provide additional services as well.
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For SpaceNut re alternate topic for garage...
https://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.ph … 82#p236782
The "in situ" track quickly got off track ... please consider investigating the company you found to see if their prefabricated product can be shipped to Mars.
In addition, please find out if the kit can be assembled by robots ... I'm thinking of Optimus or the Chinese equivalent.
Optimus should be capable of learning how to assemble the kit on Earth, and it should be able to carry out the same task on Mars, despite the lesser gravity and the presence of Mars atmosphere.
In the course of developing the new topic we can learn about Optimus and other humanoid robots.
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For SpaceNut ....
Need to know is how many starship are required to land all of these items.
No you don't !!!
Starship is poorly suited for landing.
GW Johnson designed an entire suite of superior vehicles.
It almost seems as though you never read all that work.
Perhaps you just think that SpaceX is the only game in town?
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starship is the only ship planned to go to mars.....Nasa is not, GW ships need builders and that not happening in current culture.
Even Bezo is finding that out...
If you do not know the mass we are sending then you are not going but for a show that we can do so and then stopping maybe never going again
SpaceX's Starship is the leading vehicle currently in development for human missions to Mars, designed as a fully reusable system to carry large crews and cargo, with plans for initial cargo flights by 2030 and human landings potentially in the late 2030s. NASA and other agencies are also developing concepts, often involving elements like the Orion spacecraft for Earth return and potential Deep Space Habitats, but Starship is the most prominent contender for the actual transit and landing.
SpaceX Starship
Concept: A massive, fully reusable rocket system (Super Heavy booster + Starship upper stage) designed for interplanetary travel, including Mars colonization.Capabilities: Can transport up to 150 metric tonnes (fully reusable) or 250 tonnes (expendable) to orbit, significantly more than any current rocket.
Mars Approach: Uses aerodynamic braking for entry into Mars' atmosphere and a powered vertical landing, similar to its Earth landings.
Timeline: SpaceX aims for the first cargo flights to Mars around 2030, with human missions following, possibly in the late 2030s.
NASA & Other ConceptsOrion & Deep Space Habitats: NASA's potential approach involves using the Orion capsule for crew transport to Mars orbit, paired with a separate Deep Space Habitat for the long journey.
Design Reference Missions (DRMs): NASA has studied various concepts, including nuclear thermal and solar electric propulsion, for efficient Mars transit.
Project Orion (Historical): An ambitious, but discontinued, 1960s project exploring nuclear pulse propulsion for massive Mars payloads.
Key Challenges for Mars Ships
Long Duration: Missions take many months, requiring robust life support and radiation protection.
In-Orbit Refueling: Starship needs to refuel in Earth orbit to have enough propellant for the Mars journey.Reliable Landing: Safely landing such a large vehicle on Mars is a significant technical hurdle.
In essence, SpaceX's Starship is leading the charge with a singular, reusable vision, while NASA and international partners focus on multi-component systems and gradual technological development for future human expeditions
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