Stoke Space

RGClark · 2023-07-09 09:24:02

Perhaps Stoke Space should mention noted rocket designer Philip Bono was the originator of the idea of using a plug nozzle for cooling on reentry:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_Bono

It would be wise also to note Bono used the increased efficiency of an aeroplug/aerospike on launch in his designs rather than dismissing it.

History of the Phoenix VTOL SSTO and recent developments in single-stage launch systems.
January 1992
Authors: Gary Hudson
Fkx1cfwXEAIYWDF?format=jpg
https://www.researchgate.net/publicatio … ch_systems

This is important because doing a delta-v calculation via a rocket equation a hydrolox stage like the Stoke Space stage with a 10 to 1 mass ratio, a la the Centaur stage, could actually reach orbit with an aerospike nozzle.

NASA proved 20 years ago that the aerospike works by actually building it and testing it:

XRS-2200/RS-2200 LINEAR AEROSPIKE ENGINE DATA SHEETS.

http://heroicrelics.org/info/aerospikes … -2200.html

Bob Clark

Last edited by RGClark (2023-07-09 09:27:36)

Mars_B4_Moon · 2023-07-09 09:52:40

Founded by a group of former Blue Origin and SpaceX employees, Andy Lapsa and Tom Feldman with the company.

'heat shield'

https://twitter.com/stoke_space/status/ … 3093827585

'Washington poised to be the next Silicon Valley of the space industry, it just needs workers'

https://lynnwoodtimes.com/2023/07/06/sp … ry-230705/

Mars_B4_Moon · 2023-09-18 03:11:05

Stoke Space puts its test rocket through a successful hop in central Washington state

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/stoke-sp … 31060.html?

Hopper2’s 15-second flight took place at Stoke’s test facility at Grant County International Airport in Moses Lake, Wash., at 11:24 a.m. PT. A hydrogen-fueled rocket engine sent the test vehicle to a height of 30 feet, with a landing 15 feet away from the launch pad, Stoke CEO Andy Lapsa told GeekWire.

“It’s the last test in our development program for Hopper, and by all accounts, it’s been very successful,” Lapsa said.

Stoke Space was founded in 2019 by Lapsa, a veteran of Jeff Bezos’ Blue Origin space venture; and Tom Feldman, who worked at Blue Origin after interning at SpaceX. In addition to the testing grounds at Moses Lake’s airport, the company has a 21,000-square-foot engineering and manufacturing headquarters in Kent, Wash., not far from Blue Origin’s HQ.
In 2021, the company raised $65 million in a funding round led by Microsoft co-founder Bill Gates’ Breakthrough Energy Ventures. And earlier this year, Stoke won the go-ahead to take over Cape Canaveral Space Force Station’s Launch Complex 14 in Florida, the site of John Glenn’s history-making Mercury launch in 1962.
Going forward, Stoke’s team will concentrate more fully on developing its rocket’s first stage and ramping up operations in Florida, Lapsa said.

Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2023-09-18 03:12:45)

Mars_B4_Moon · 2023-09-18 06:02:35

In the first months of 2023, Stoke Space finished the construction of their full scale second stage, stating that it was going to perform "hops", similar to SpaceX's Starhopper Prototype. Founded by Andy Lapsa and Tom Feldman it is developing a fully reusable space launch vehicle.

https://twitter.com/stoke_space/status/ … 0540883195

We're on a mission - starting with 100% reusable rockets.

Void · 2023-09-18 15:14:30

Nice catch Mars_B4_Moon.

Here is another video I was going to place here as well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZB4EZvywhDQ
Quote:

Stoke Space Just Completed Its First Vehicle Flight
TheSpaceBucket

I hope I get to see them bring it to completion.

Done

Last edited by Void (2023-09-18 15:24:53)

Void · 2023-09-19 10:01:52

I was puzzling over the Stokes Space 2nd stage, and for a while pondering its potential flexibility.

As I have thought for Starship, options may exist for the non-locomotive part of the 2nd stage, that would be the Fairings/Capsule and the contents of which ever you considered to use. I think they have many options.

1) Dispose of the Fairings when the air becomes thin enough, let the fall to the ocean, or burn up.
2) Keep them and use the enclosure to carry mass down to a landing.
3) Leave the Fairings/Capsule up in orbit, and perhaps sell them to some entity, such as Neumann Space, or some space station builder.

Then I wondered if they are successful with their prototype, could they supersize it, and put that on a SpaceX Super Heavy as it's 1st stage booster? I don't know if sizing up will work out. Don't get me wrong, I am not dismissing Starship, it has qualities that will be needed for some purposes. But as I said the prototype has to be demonstrated as practical, and then perhaps you could try to supersize it.

Stoke Space uses Hydrogen to cool its heatshield, not by a skin evaporation method, but it seems by a sort of Hydrogen steam engine that runs a pump to circulate the cooling fluid, Hydrogen.

For a long time, I have wished to figure out how to cool something like that with Liquid Oxygen. My feelings are that it would be very hard and perhaps impractical, even not possible.

I am anxiously awaiting a video by Isaac Arthur about mining atmospheres.

And I have considered rotavators before to scoop atmosphere, but it occurred to me that the bulk of what you would scoop would be Nitrogen. Nitrogen is not noble but is rather well behaved relative to many other elements. Perhaps Nitrogen could become a coolant for atmospheric entry? And you might collect considerable Oxygen and also some Argon, perhaps 1% of content. These would all be useful.

It seems to me that this might be the most practical way to use tethers in orbit.

As for propulsion to make up for the drag, I believe that the Europeans have an electric propulsion that can handle Nitrogen.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospher … propulsion
Quote:

Atmosphere-breathing electric propulsion
Busek Co. Inc. in the U.S. patented their concept of an Air Breathing Hall Effect Thruster (ABHET) in 2004,[15] and with funding from the NASA Institute for Advanced Concepts, started in 2011 a feasibility study that would be applied to Mars (Mars-ABHET or MABHET), where the system would breath and ionize atmospheric carbon dioxide.[16] The MABHET concept is based on the same general principles as JAXA's Air Breathing Ion Engine (ABIE) or ESA's RAM-EP.[17]

So, I don't know if a Nitrogen Steam Engine heat shield cooler could work, but after all the atmospheric gasses collected may have many uses.

Of course, some people might get nervous about scooping the Earth's atmosphere. I am sure doom porn would emerge about it. In much of the use of those collected gasses, they could be fired retrograde to the Earth's spin and the orbit of the spacecraft ejecting them. So, it may be possible to have them reach zero speed, and they would just plunge back down into the atmosphere. At least that is how I see it.

If this could be done, then we would not bother to move Oxygen from the Moon to LEO. Now as far as Starship goes, it might be able to use a Steam Engine Active Cooling with Nitrogen as well.

The two ships if they can work at the size to go onto Super Heavy, might actually complement each other. Or not, I don't know at this point, but Starship may likely be more suitable for deep space, including Mars.

Now as far as electric rockets go, freight might be moved efficiently in CIS Lunar Space using them. Neuman Drive, Argon, and maybe Nitrogen. The Moon may be where Starship goes to refill Oxygen before departing for other planets and asteroids.

Done.

A question might be "Can the output of an electric rocket be sprayed at orbital space junk to make its orbit decay sooner?".

Done.

Last edited by Void (2023-09-19 10:37:58)

Void · 2023-09-19 11:02:30

In reference to the just prior post;

If atmospheric mining using a rotavator was possible for Earth, then we might consider if it could work for Venus and Mars. There should be less space junk around those planets at least at this time.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospher … propulsion
Quote:

This technology could also be utilized on any planet with atmosphere, if the thruster can process other propellants, and if the power source can provide the required power, e.g. sufficient solar irradiation for the solar panels, such as Mars and Venus, otherwise other electric power subsystems such as a space nuclear reactor or radioisotope thermoelectric generator (RTG) have to be implemented, for example for a mission around Titan.

So, if a rotavator had one or two engines that dipped into the Earth's atmosphere, it might be able to tank some of the collected gas and use it for propulsion even when the engine was far out of the Earth's atmosphere. And possibly some of the collected gas could be moved down to hub.

For Earth, I am supposing solar power would be provided at the hub and distributed somehow to the tether end(s) electric rocket engines.

Done.

Last edited by Void (2023-09-19 11:09:06)

Mars_B4_Moon · 2023-10-09 06:05:14

Stoke Space Announces $100 Million in New Investment

https://www.spacedaily.com/reports/Stok … t_999.html

Void · 2023-10-14 21:06:28

Something more: Nova Rocket: https://gizmodo.com/nova-reusable-rocke … 1850907043

I have seen a video that suggests that this can be a Moon ship, and I like that.

So, they intend to have in orbit refilling also.

https://www.bing.com/videos/riverview/r … ORM=VRDGAR

Don't get me wrong, I am still a Starship/SpaceX fan, but this makes it even harder for the luddites, to yet again kill the space effort in the crib.

Then consider that if SpaceX and Stoke teamed up, then a Starship could refill a Stoke spacecraft. The Stoke ship is smaller, and runs on Hydrogen and Oxygen. Refilling might happen in LEO, or maybe even in an orbit of the Moon.
.

Done

Last edited by Void (2023-10-14 21:25:58)

Void · 2024-01-07 20:43:30

Some people may like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_S350j1HQA
Quote:

Stoke Space CEO Andy Lapsa - Fully Reusable Rockets - NSF Live
NASASpaceflight
885K subscribers

Of course, if it can continue to live and evolve it looks good to me, perhaps for the Moon and maybe even Mars as a complimentary system to Starship.

It takes a little bit to get sound on the video.

Time will tell.

Done

Last edited by Void (2024-01-07 20:44:56)

Void · 2024-03-15 08:40:12

A bit of interesting materials in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOXzwA5x980
Quote:

Stoke Space is about to launch the most efficient rapidly rocket in the world!
TECH MAP

Talks about orbital refilling, and sort of might go further than LEO.

Moon Lander???

Well, if water on the Moon, this one has Hydra Lox.

Mars? Well, I would expect that it would travel as a cargo on another propulsion system to do that, but would it perhaps make a good ship to use on Mars?

I presume that for Mars, it might not need a booster.

But they have to get to be proficient at LEO work first, of course.

The ship will have retained dual fairings on hinges, I think.

So, this is to be called "NOVA"?

Done

Last edited by Void (2024-03-15 08:45:43)

Void · 2024-03-24 11:16:38

Here is an interesting interview: https://www.bing.com/search?q=%22A+Full … AD&pc=U531
Quote:

Global web icon
YouTube
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEa1Jnmxz0g
" A Fully Reusable Rocket" - Stoke Space VP Interview - YouTube
Jan 7, 2024 · SpaceX OVZON-3 Launch. LIFTOFF! SpaceX 1st Starlink To Cell Satellites. " A Fully Reusable Rocket" - Stoke Space VP Interview #StokeSpace #NOVA #Interview Join us as we …

I really hope that their method works. Even if it is limited too LEO, it would be a wonderful thing.

I am wondering if it could be sized up and put on top of the SpaceX Superheavy. I am not dismissing the Starship, rather, I think maybe this device could be supportive of Starship, such as refilling it.

At in the interview, it is stated that Methane will not work well for the cooling method they are trying. Hydrogen would be the best. So, they use Hydrogen on their 2nd Stage.

It is stated that they will likely use both hungry hippo fairings, which would remain attached, and also may be able to recover fairings in the ocean like SpaceX does.

I am very hopeful for these people.

Done

Last edited by Void (2024-03-24 11:25:51)

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