The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

Void · 2015-12-15 16:38:43

Per your comments on Hydrocarbons, I mostly agree.
But if Natural Gas did evolve there, it would likely contain a content of Hydrogen which possibly be reacted against the tiny quantity of Oxygen and Carbon Monoxide in the atmosphere, if that can be extracted economically.
To avoid time wasting, it appears that we can choose not to commit on the certainty of the existence of Natural Gas on Mars. I will settle for a maybe.

However if you read previous posting, it indicates the probability of evolving Hydrogen using a Serpentization process. That might be enhanced with solar heat.

***

Initial sources of energy on Mars can be from devices delivered, and will have to be.

From there, developing Thorium seems to me to be an improbable next energy step. Too complex most likely.

Antius seems to be working on some type of energy source requiring less high tech. Things like that and/or solar will almost certainly have to be the next level.

Perhaps from there you could go to Thorium.

***

After that, other systems can be examined technologically at least. If they cannot deliver for a reasonable cost, then they should be set aside.

Now I will bother you further. I know your qualifications, and certainly I am less likely to understand drilling than someone like you. But for the sake of investigation:
*

Enhanced geothermal system

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced_ … mal_system

Unlike hydrothermal, EGS may be feasible anywhere in the world, depending on the economic limits of drill depth. Good locations are over deep granite covered by a 3–5 kilometres (1.9–3.1 mi) layer of insulating sediments that slow heat loss.[6] EGS wells are expected to have a useful life of 20 to 30 years before the outflow temperature drops and the well becomes uneconomic.

*

A HOT DRY ROCK GEOTHERMAL ENERGY CONCEPT
UTILIZING SUPERCRITICAL CO2 INSTEAD OF WATER

https://pangea.stanford.edu/ERE/pdf/IGA … /Brown.pdf

A novel renewable energy concept -- heat mining using
supercritical CO2 (SCCO2) for both reservoir creation
and heat extraction -- is here proposed. This concept
builds on the earlier, very extensive Hot Dry Rock
(HDR) research and development effort conducted by
Los Alamos National Laboratory at Fenton Hill, NM.

*

Enhanced in Situ Leaching (EISLEACH) Mining by Means of
Supercritical Carbon Dioxide - TOUGHREACT Modeling

https://www.imwa.info/docs/imwa_2014/IM … ab_190.pdf

Abstract Waste rock piles and mine tailings exert severe impact on the environment. Especially, groundwater is a
critical issue when it comes to subsurface mineral extraction. The objective of this paper is to study the physical
and chemical impact of scCO2 on carbonate rock as a minable ore reservoir through numerical simulations by
means of TOUGHREACT. Carbonic acid is formed when scCO2 gets mixed with water; as a result calcite
dissolution occurs. Subsequently, dissolution of calcite creates voids and increases porosity. Even a small increase
in porosity has significant effect on enhancement of permeability and thus leaching efficiency.
Keywords in situ leaching, TOUGHREACT, EISLEACH, supercritical CO2

*
Liquid Air:

Wind Turbines Power Liquid-Air Energy Storage

http://spectrum.ieee.org/energywise/ene … gy-storage

One startup energy company is looking to reinvent not only wind energy, but also energy storage.
Keuka Energy recently launched a 125-kilowatt prototype vessel that uses its novel floating wind turbine design paired with liquid-air energy storage to create a steady source of electricity.
Unlike traditional wind turbines, which have three blades and a central gearbox, Keuka’s turbine is a pinwheel of aluminum blades that sits atop a floating V-shape platform containing liquid air.
The Florida-based company claims that its wind turbine design allows for larger turbines that could produce far more electricity. The world’s largest single offshore wind turbine is currently about 6 megawatts; Keuka says its full-size turbines could produce at least double that amount.
Liquid-air energy storage, also sometimes called cryogenic energy storage, is a long-term energy storage method: electricity liquefies air to nearly -200°C and then stores it at low pressure. When the energy is needed, the liquid air is pumped to a high level of pressure and heated to a gas state. The gas then drives a turbine.
Although it is an attractive energy-storage technology because of its long duration, liquid-air energy storage requires a significant amount of electricity to make the liquid air, limiting its usage by utilities. Keuka claims that because its design substantially reduced the cost by supplying the power directly from the turbines to the liquefaction equipment.
The company also says its wind turbine design is more cost effective, thanks to elimination of the gear box and the use of light-weight aluminum blades that cost less than 10 percent the price of traditional composite blades. Even if the technology is effective and can come in at lower costs, Keuka will likely face a long road to acceptance by the notoriously risk averse utility industry.
Keuka is not the only startup looking to advance liquid-air energy storage. In 2014, General Electric signed an exclusive global licensing deal with Highview Power Storage, a U.K. startup that makes utility-scale liquid-air energy storage systems.
Another similar technology that has gained more traction is compressed-air energy storage, which does not have the energy density of liquid air, but so far has proven more cost effective. Compressed air, while a cheap form of energy storage once built, is still expensive to build and geographically limited; underground caverns are needed to store the air.
Other startups are also looking offshore for cheap energy storage. Bright Energy is developing a system that would use offshore renewable energy to store compressed air in vessels in the ocean. Canadian startup Hydrostor also has a design to store compressed air underwater.
If Keuka’s 125-kilowatt prototype is successful, it plans to launch a larger 25 MW demonstration project in early 2017.

*

Bioleaching
Bioleaching is the extraction of metals from their ores through the use of living organisms. This is much cleaner than the traditional heap leaching using cyanide.[1] Bioleaching is one of several applications within biohydrometallurgy and several methods are used to recover copper, zinc, lead, arsenic, antimony, nickel, molybdenum, gold, silver, and cobalt.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bioleaching

***

All of the above except the liquid air will involve drilling.
Not all of them can be done at the same time.

For Mars and CO2 liquid, it is fair to say that due to .38 gravity, drilling could go deeper. However such a technology will be practical only when the industrial/technological infrastructure is rather advanced. Perhaps economical might be to inject a Water/Salt/CO2 mix which should be corrosive. If it can also support microbes, then they might be engineered and selected to help leach metals from the fracked rock. Ideally then you could extract a heated fluid and use that heat as well as dissolved metals.

If the heated fluid is allowed to depressurize, the CO2 might bubble out, and this might actually cause the metals to precipitate as solids.
The CO2. A little foggy here. If a very cold brine absorbs CO2 as dissolved gas, and then that fluid heated up, then CO2 can be made to bubble out. Perhaps run a turbine. The CO2 cooled off, the brine cooled off, the two joined again in a solution, then injected into the well again.

Mining an power perhaps. But it is for a significant time from now.

Otherwise just inject liquid CO2 and allow it to blow out of the well as a pressurized gas.

***

As for on Earth, I think a look at combining EGS;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced_ … mal_system
And wind powered liquid air;
http://spectrum.ieee.org/energywise/ene … gy-storage
Might be worth the trouble. Wind needs a storage method, Liquid Air needs a heating method.
The two together might be rather good.
Maybe the EGS wells will last more that 20-30 years this way also.

As far as the evolution of energy on Earth and in the USA especially goes.
We drop COAL for energy.
Then we drop Oil for energy.
Use up the bulk of the Natural gas, and perhaps get into these renewable methods. Perhaps the culture changes by then and we also go to Thorium reactors on Earth.

I certainly be dead by then so it won't be my decision or problem.

Last edited by Void (2015-12-15 17:28:06)

Void · 2015-12-15 23:41:48

Hydridity (Yet another scheme)

http://phys.org/news/2015-12-hydricity- … power.html

http://spectrum.ieee.org/energywise/ene … +Spectrum)

Furthermore, this new solar thermal energy design can generate electricity with standalone efficiencies approaching up to an unprecedented 46 percent, researchers say. This is because the high-temperature steam leaving high-pressure turbines can run a succession of lower-pressure turbines, helping make the most of the solar thermal energy the system collects.
Moreover, the hydrogen fuel the system generates can be burned to generate electricity after nightfall, for round-the-clock power. The researchers say the efficiency of this hydrogen-to-electricity system could reach up to 70 percent, comparable to the highest reported hydrogen fuel cell efficiencies.

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/hydricity

It is fun to see all these schemes. It is like the beginning of something where there are incredible numbers of variations being tried. Eventually a set of a few will take hold and be maintained. Not necessarily the same set for Earth and Mars.

To do the same thing on Mars, you would need twice as many mirrors or so, but of course what a Hydrogen source (And Oxygen) can do for you on Mars, is massively more important than what it can do on Earth. And on Earth, I am guessing that it's effects can be massive.

I really think we should be considering a future where we could have it all. An increasing standard of living and a healthy planet, and greater freedom from people enslavers.

I think also that for semi-arid areas, if you are deflecting say 80% of the sunlight from hitting the ground by sending it to a solar power tower, you could then bring the moisture level of the soils so shaded up, perhaps up enough for some type of productive agriculture.

Lets say in climates similar to the Dakota's and down to the gulf of Mexico almost.

You might also cause more rain, because instead of reflecting that heat into the sky directly, you put it to work to make electricity and Hydrogen. A cooler sky will allow more rain and snow to form in it. That is how if you can get trees to grow in places, a cooler sky is created, and the potential for precipitation is improved.

Last edited by Void (2015-12-15 23:51:20)

Void · 2015-12-16 12:26:15

GW Johnson,

My last two posts may have seemed excessively dismissive of your comments to the point of perhaps being a bit rude. That is not my intention. I posted this stuff in the "Not So Free Chat", because for this topic I wanted to have the freedom to put emphasis on processes for the Planet Earth. If it is also possible to consider adapting them to Mar, that is OK also.

If you are correct that Thorium is the ultimate answer on Mars, then that's OK with me, but a healthy and prosperous technological/industrial civilization on Earth will promote the settlement of Mars quite a bit, so even then these items may have indirect importance for our common focus of Mars.

If I were to try to join as many of the ideas in the previous post together as possible, I think the following might make some sense.

1) Hot Process: (EGS)
Pump a mixture of Carbonated Salty Water into a well, and include bioleaching as an objective.
2) Cold Process:
Create a liquid air output situation from windmills.
3) Solar process:
Hydridity (Outputs Hydrogen, Oxygen, and superheated steam).

It was not my original objective to focus on the extraction of minerals, but now it seems like it could be important.

In the #1 EGS process you could add Hydrogen, and Oxygen and other chemicals to the Carbonated Salty Water fluid to inject into the well
to feed your microbes which should be selected and engineered to extract minerals from the well. Hydridity should supply some of those.

So, the intention is to bring back up heated fluid with dissolved minerals. This will also tend to etch out the cracks in the rock further.

The water does not have to be that hot to be useful, as it is going to be used to warm up liquid air to turn a turbine. When the water is suddenly cooled, and perhaps the CO2 if allowed to boil out of it, minerals should come out of solution as solids. So, then they could be collected.

As for the #3 Solar process, if you really wanted to during times of high solar output (Sunny weather), it is possible that heat could be injected back into the wells.

Anyway this could be one way that some minerals could be gained in the future for use on the Earth. And with 3 different energy sources, it is naturally fairly balanced as far as energy output meeting demand without major deficiencies.

To adapt to Mars, you would have to use the cold of night for your #2 Cold process.

Of course to a degree this process replicates what happens naturally in ocean vents on Earth.

Void

Last edited by Void (2015-12-17 12:29:35)

Void · 2015-12-17 12:33:26

I would like to make an addition pertaining to the last two posts.

1) For Mars, drilling and fracking can be expected to be things that might occur much later, however it is fortunate that ice covered lakes and the inclusion of dune materials into the bottoms of them will serve as a reasonable substitute, until drilling and fracking are possible on Mars. In using salt pond methods, temperatures of significant elevation can be achieved at the bottom of such lakes, the heat held by inhibited convection and insulation. So the bottom of such lakes may substitute in many ways for drilled wells until drilled wells can be accomplished on Mars.

2) Wind power will not occur in significance until the planet is significantly terraformed, but we are fortunate that the cold of the night can generate cryo liquids and solids from the atmosphere of Mars, with assistance.

3) As for Hydricity, that is a capability that would be desired as soon as possible.

Last edited by Void (2015-12-17 12:37:26)

Tom Kalbfus · 2015-12-19 10:09:23

Void wrote:

I would like to make an addition pertaining to the last two posts.
1) For Mars, drilling and fracking can be expected to be things that might occur much later, however it is fortunate that ice covered lakes and the inclusion of dune materials into the bottoms of them will serve as a reasonable substitute, until drilling and fracking are possible on Mars. In using salt pond methods, temperatures of significant elevation can be achieved at the bottom of such lakes, the heat held by inhibited convection and insulation. So the bottom of such lakes may substitute in many ways for drilled wells until drilled wells can be accomplished on Mars.
2) Wind power will not occur in significance until the planet is significantly terraformed, but we are fortunate that the cold of the night can generate cryo liquids and solids from the atmosphere of Mars, with assistance.
3) As for Hydricity, that is a capability that would be desired as soon as possible.

I think if you have the power to terraform Mars, you won't need wind power much!

Void · 2015-12-20 19:47:24

Oh, well I don't necessarily agree.

That big yellow ball called the sun, that's a fusion reactor. Been running for perhaps 4.5 billion years. Burns real Hydrogen. Your interfaces? Sunlight>Temperature differences > wind. So there.

Can you say Thorium? Can you say fusion reactor (On Mars)? Nice.

Still, there is that energy in the wind. Alright, it will be a cost/benefit based decision.

Thing is, most likely best terraform of Mars has perhaps 250 mb of mostly O2. Nights still very cold, days somewhat warmer than now.

I guess you would have a choice, perhaps you would want the high winds, or perhaps you would add a super greenhouse gas, and the nights would not get that cold, the days even warmer.

Still, if a windmill were made to dissipate heat through it's blades, to the universe, then it could be quite a source of cold, and in one use, liquid atmosphere.

In a case where you also used Hydricity, and also geothermal (For energy, thermal storage, and mining), that cold would be quite useful.

I am not going to give you a free pass on this. Prove to me that fusion power plants on the surface of Mars, or Thorium reactors will be more cost effective for the benefits received than the triad I suggest (Wind-liquid air, Hydricity, Geothermal-Heat-thermal storage-Mining).

The ball is in your court

Tom Kalbfus · 2015-12-21 16:45:52

The thin winds of Mars do not carry much energy, the Sun is half again as far away from Mars as it is from Earth. One could also argue that the Sun might be a good source of energy as far out as Jupiter if you had enough solar collectors. If you could make the atmosphere of Mars much thicker, you would need a lot of energy to do that. Even if the atmosphere were as thick as Earth's the weaker rays from the Sun won't drive the Martian winds as hard as they do on Earth. We probably will have harnessed other sources of energy by the tie we terraformed Mars. By that time, any chunk of ice or hydrocarbons that contained hydrogen, would be a source of energy.

Void · 2015-12-21 22:02:20

OK, Tom, maybe.

By that time, any chunk of ice or hydrocarbons that contained hydrogen, would be a source of energy.

So, I asked for relative costs. Don't see that you bothered.

Otherwise, yes, of course, if fusion is cheep, then why do we bother to build power plants? Why not wait for fusion?

It's unknown. Prove it.

By the way, Mars provides a much colder night and a much colder winter. And with the thin atmosphere presumed (Not now, but at 250 mb), the wind speeds would be quite high, which assumption I base on what Antius, has said, however I do with happiness give him freely all powers to disavow me.

And on another line, very happy to tell, you that I fully intend this topic to be about possible activity on Earth which I consider worth promoting, and adaptation to Mars is secondary. Your cautions have some merit, but the evidence offered is insubstantial.

Last edited by Void (2015-12-21 22:06:33)

Void · 2015-12-23 16:05:50

No offence was intended Tom.

Back the topic, this seems to support the notion of extracting minerals by the methods I previously indicated.

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/y2011/0219769.html

Abstract:
Geothermal brine always contains some carbon dioxide in solution. Separating steam from geothermal brine removes the carbon dioxide, sharply increasing the pH of the brine and causing precipitation of pH sensitive minerals, including calcium carbonate, magnesium silicate and other metal silicates, clays, and metal sulfides. The binary heat exchanger in a steam-binary hybrid geothermal power plant is especially sensitive to scale deposition from flashed geothermal brine, and application of expensive scale inhibitors is required.
Deposition of scale in the binary heat exchanger can be controlled by separating a small amount of gas-rich vapor from the brine before the main stage of steam separation, and combining this gas rich vapor with the flashed brine before in enters the binary heat exchanger. The carbon dioxide thus added to the brine will decrease pH, decreasing or completely blocking precipitation and deposition of pH sensitive minerals as scale.

So, the objective of avoiding scale, and also extracting minerals are in opposition to each other for the design contemplated above. I am not sure that that has to be a show stopper though.

Could you first extract the minerals from the solution using Electrowinning, and then use the anti-scaling method?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrowinning

The point is that when you would drill for geothermal energy/storage, you would also target minerals far below, and be able to bring them up. Perhaps with the use of bioleaching.

Yes, I am fumbling around, but the notions are there.

On the other hand, perhaps it is possible to "Boil" a mix of CO2 and H20 steam out of the solution, by drawing a vacuum using liquid air to condense those vapors into a fluid. That fluid should be rather mineral free. The tank where the steam flashed from would of course be in danger of mineral precipitations, but it would not be a metal heat exchanger, so it might endure it fairly well. A concentrate of minerals would develop, and perhaps such concentrating will aid Electrowinning. As for the undesired precipitants, perhaps that would fall like a snow in the tank. It might be possible to remove it as a tailings. As for coating the inside of the tank, perhaps reasonable methods would allow the scale to fall off from an applied mechanical force. Maybe even sound waves flexing the tank walls.

Obviously I am not high tech here. Just grasping at possibilities/straws.

So, your turbine would not directly involve the brine/CO2 mix, but would perhaps turn a Liquid air turbine instead. The liquid air being boiled by thermal transfer through a heat exchanger where the condensing CO2 and H20 mix adds heat in a phase change from vapor to liquid, and where on the other side of the heat exchanger, liquid air is boiled.

Last edited by Void (2015-12-23 16:22:32)

Void · 2016-01-01 12:53:57

(And to think my New Years resolution (In reserve) is to quit this site).

Anyway for Russia haters here is something:

http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=PROP
t?s=PROP&lang=en-US&region=US&width=300&height=180

This is not investment advice! I have no idea what PROP will do.

One Technology That Could Change The Global Oil Industry

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/one-techn … 00048.html

I believe that this was invented by the Russians. St. Petersberg?

Anyway, it shows that who you choose for your friends matters.

Other options include juvenile delinquents that due to their lust and seeing an opportunity seek to prey on the other people on Earth, trying to justify their behaviors with a religious hierarchy. Ignoring Intellect, and Aquisitioning except to behave like warlords, to satisfy their lusts to have other people as slaves, and to be excused to murder other people, violating their rights, and essentially making a living by theft, the theft of what belongs to other humans on the planet.

The Russians are not above error, but they seem much better partners, than those people running around in bathrobes just now.
At least they can produce useful machines.

Last edited by Void (2016-01-01 13:06:59)

Void · 2016-01-01 23:41:52

I am sorry people, but this has gone on long enough. Replies that I get back indicate that you either do not receive what I send or don't bother to read them. This has been going on for years.

I'm done.

I will change my password to something I don't remember, hoping to cut myself off.

I am really mad. The Mars dream belongs to a lot of other people than what I see here. And you guys have it coming, bigtime.

Oh yeah, Goodby!

Last edited by Void (2016-01-01 23:42:34)

SpaceNut · 2018-03-25 14:23:49

Well US gas prices rise 7 cents a gallon over past 2 weeks

The average U.S. price of regular-grade gasoline shot up 7 cents a gallon over the past two weeks to $2.66. The increase brings the price of gas to 32 cents a gallon higher than it was at this time last year.
The highest average price in the contiguous 48 states was $3.54 in the San Francisco Bay area. The lowest was $2.22 in St. Louis.
The average price for diesel fuel rose a penny, to $3.01.

We are going the wrong way again....

Void · 2018-03-26 06:49:39

I keep saying that I am going to take a brake, and I will, but I see that I may have a responsibility to respond to this specific post, because of historical facts.

I can appreciate the pain a consumer may have for the cost of fuel. I would not ask you to not care about that.

However, in this game there are many factors.

If the price goes up then so also goes up the supply of energy. So, we are fortunate that that relationship exists. We will never get our energy for free.

The Arabs said themselves that the Arab has the power of the tongue, the Chin the power of the hand, and the Frank the power of the mind.

We are leaving an era where the literate get to rule the technological with impunity. Charging endless rents against the technological for "No Value Added" behaviors.

For the kids:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impunity

Specifically in the USA we have these potential energy assets:
1) Coal (Being phased out, until methods of safe usage are invented).
2) Conventional Oil and Natural Gas.
3) Shale Oil and Natural Gas.
4) Oil Sands (Yes, quite significant amounts in the USA, not to mention Canada).
5) Oil Shale (Massive amounts, not to be confused with Shale Oil).
6) Solar (Exempting Alaska, the Northern USA at a latitude similar to France, the southern areas similar to Saudi Arabia).
7) And wind. As the Europeans must use this one we can certainly rely on them to sell their technological achievements in this area to us.

And the Canada is a different America that calls itself Canada, or if you resent that we could also say that America/USA is a different Canada that calls itself America or USA.

I have very little sympathy for planetary cultures which maintain their right to rule upon words, and chants, or some outdated ideological story of entitlement. Those who honor lazy mouthy rent taking.

But then I see a lot of reason to think that they are toast at this point and also going forward for a long time.

Done.

Last edited by Void (2018-03-26 07:02:07)

SpaceNut · 2018-03-26 17:23:05

I have been looking a lower cost vehicles and came across a hybrid....

A Bike Or A Car? Meet Podbike! 4-wheel electric bike with features not found in any other bike.

For those that are city driving this is the perfect 35mph vehicle and qualifies in some states as no licence to use on the road.

Add a few solar panels that pull out and charge while you are away.

Void · 2018-03-26 18:10:06

Well, I like that.

For a while I rented an apartment in a northern-more city. It had a garage stall in the basement. As I live in a rather dire north area, I think you can relate that some days it would not pay to go out in such a vehicle. Heavy snowfalls mostly being the issue. However, if you plan your life right, you don't need to go out. Not if you are retired or work from home. Not necessarily.

I have a relative who still lives in that facility. She does just fine even though perhaps being 88 years old. She plays games with friends, swims in the swimming pool. Does OK. Tries not to drive at night per her eyes.

That vehicle might be just the thing for her. If she could use it 90% of the time in the various weather conditions, that would be sufficient. And economical.

As a second vehicle, indeed perhaps useful even for a family situation.

And then what about the supposed future with self driving cars? Well if you needed a multi-person vehicle then rent it, a self driving vehicle for that purpose. But if you just want to go get lunch or something, go to the drug store or shopping, that little thing you show could be quite a deal.

Just watch out for giant trucks. You ain't gonna win that!

louis · 2018-03-26 18:17:43

Think we need to take methane seriously as a potential energy source on Mars. We know there are methane signatures on Mars - so we may find deposits that can be harvested. Then it's simply a question of creating Earth like atmospheres in pressurised environmental, essential by getting plants to process CO2 and thus create Earth like air. We can then burn methane and power generators in those plant habs.

SpaceNut · 2018-03-26 18:41:05

Sure I might not fare so well in a nor'easter but then again not being retired means using them in good weather.
sbarro-twike295.jpg?zoom=2&resize=640%2C400

https://www.electricbike.com/the-twike-challenge/

twikesnow.jpg?w=400&ssl=1

tahanson43206 · 2021-07-26 09:55:56

For SpaceNut ... this topic is the ONLY one in the forum that contained the word "oil" ....

It's here thanks to Void, who could not have known the shape of the world in 2021, from the vantage point of 2015.

I haven't read the topic, so don't know what it covers ... hopefully this post will fit in ...

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/oil- … 18327.html

It’s an interesting twist to see this fossil fuel push in a nation that was once a leader in green energy. Brazil had built a hydroelectric industry before it even started tapping offshore fields in the 1970s, and dams still provide more than 60% of the country’s electricity. But this has left the entire economy exposed to dam-crippling droughts, which have become more intense and prolonged in recent years amid climate change. That’s pushed the country to expand thermal power plants to provide greater security to the grid.

Peter Millard
Mon, July 26, 2021 6:00 AM

This article goes into the outlook for Brazil.

It would be a shame for all that potential lubricating oil to be burned, but that is what the future holds if nothing changes.

(th)

Void · 2021-07-26 17:22:09

(th) very considerate of you to let me off on old predictions.

But what you post tells the truth, that if methods cannot be found to reduce the use of Coal, or other alternatives, people will do it rather than to live in poverty. Peter
Zeihan has mentioned such.

So, a massive task falls to those who might lift the weight of it. That is just reality.

Done.

SpaceNut · 2021-07-26 17:38:55

There was at one point a peak oil topic but I am still searching for it....

still not finding with google search
peak oil newmars.com\forums site:newmars.com

tahanson43206 · 2021-07-26 17:56:49

For SpaceNut re #70

Thanks for the example of how to use Google to search the forum archives!

SearchTerm:Google search see post #70 for example
SearchTerm:Search using Google

(th)

Mars_B4_Moon · 2021-09-15 07:19:09

More Republicans and Democrats and Libertarain types call on Biden to designate Taliban as terrorist group

Ted Cruz, accused of ‘tantrum’ for blocking Biden security picks, digs in over Nord Stream pipeline
https://www.dallasnews.com/news/politic … -pipeline/

as for engineers and rockets from Eastern Europe, the Zenit family seems long dead

the last thing to come out of there was 'Firefly Aerospace'?

Ukrainian entrepreneur’s rocket explodes shortly after launch
https://www.kyivpost.com/technology/ukr … aunch.html

kbd512 · 2021-09-15 07:36:11

I seem to recall that the entire Democrat Party threw a 4-year-long tantrum over the simple fact that the American people elected President Trump to office. Since President Trump had appointees who were never given a confirmation hearing, I think turnabout is fair play. Beyond that, their infantile impeachment attempts, which all failed, made it plainly known that they would stop at nothing to overturn the vote of the American people. Since all is fair, they should quit whining.

SpaceNut · 2021-09-28 17:48:31

There is a real energy crisis in Europe that was created by a combination of political missteps, climate change fear-mongering and a woke energy policy that could leave much of Europe and Asia undersupplied as they head into winter.

Distillate inventories that include things like heating oil are 14% below the five-year average. That is a huge deal. Because of the shortages of natural gas and propane around the globe, countries will look more to oil and distillate fuels to keep factories running and the heat on. Propane inventories are at a dangerously low level of 21% below the five-year average.

Prices for natural gas, the most common way to heat homes and a leading fuel source for generating electricity, have surged more than 180% over the past 12 months to $5.90 per million British thermal units. Natural gas hasn't been this expensive since February 2014.

Sure would feed the next articles video

Consumers soon will face severe electricity bill shock: Wood Mackenzie video

Mars_B4_Moon · 2022-02-24 08:25:51

Oil jumps to $105 global stocks tumble

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/mar … raine.html

New Mars Forums

Announcement

#51 2015-12-15 16:38:43

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#52 2015-12-15 23:41:48

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#53 2015-12-16 12:26:15

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#54 2015-12-17 12:33:26

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#55 2015-12-19 10:09:23

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#56 2015-12-20 19:47:24

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#57 2015-12-21 16:45:52

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#58 2015-12-21 22:02:20

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#59 2015-12-23 16:05:50

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#60 2016-01-01 12:53:57

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#61 2016-01-01 23:41:52

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#62 2018-03-25 14:23:49

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#63 2018-03-26 06:49:39

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#64 2018-03-26 17:23:05

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#65 2018-03-26 18:10:06

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#66 2018-03-26 18:17:43

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#67 2018-03-26 18:41:05

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#68 2021-07-26 09:55:56

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#69 2021-07-26 17:22:09

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#70 2021-07-26 17:38:55

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#71 2021-07-26 17:56:49

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#72 2021-09-15 07:19:09

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#73 2021-09-15 07:36:11

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#74 2021-09-28 17:48:31

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

#75 2022-02-24 08:25:51

Re: The Oil Price War 2015, nations, money flow, spacefaring.

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