New Mars Forums

I think that trying to harvest water from surface regolith is a fool's errand. I discussed my method of obtaining water years ago on this website. GW is absolutely correct. I proposed mining frozen chunks and transporting to an indoor and heated facility in wagons, and allow to simply thaw in a pressurized environment. Will need lotsa wagons per day, but something that's relatively lightweight or the purpose.

To address the comments by GW, what will be needed are Pfaudler Stainless steel reactors in a 5,000 gallon capacity. These could be transferred to Mars by Starship, and with plenty of room to spare for additional cargo. Then there's the heating system to consider--after the refrigeration system. That's how I would approach the problem as an industrial chemist. I would first build a working model here on Earth as a "proof of concept" system before throwing it through several hundred million miles on Starship. Without a viable system, the mission is DOOMED!

A comment here about an experience everyone here should undertake about aviation: a visit to the Evergreen Air and Space Museum in McMinnville, Oregon.

I did that about 12 years ago while working on my private certificate in Albany, Oregon. I drove there from where I was working at the time, and it was worth the drive and the entrance fees. The Main Building, at that time, had an awesome display dominated by the Howard Hughes Hercules--the Spruce Goose. Tucked under one wing of the airplane was an SR-71 "Blackbird," and next to it was a complete Martin Marietta Titan rocket lying on it's side so the engines could be examined. I also paid a few bucks for a complete interior tour of a fully restored B-17, and after talking with one of the docents about the Spruce Goose, shelled out $50 for a complete interior tour of it. That included--after talking nicely to the tour guide--was allowed to sit in the pilot's seat and hold the controls. What a thrill for a wannabe pilot! I had just soloed a few weeks earlier and was initially visiting McMinnville to scout the field for my big solo cross country flight required for the private certificate. This was even before the Leonardo DeCrappo movie "Aviator," the film about Howard Hughes.

To reply to those who want to impose their views and Vaccines on others. I could have had the vaccine long before I was diagnosed with Covid-19, a.k.a "Wuhan virus." As a professional chemist/biochemist who worked over 45 years in the fine chemicals industry--after taking a look at some of the "other ingredients," there are plenty of reasons to decline the kind invitation to pump various poisons into my body. Thimoserol, a Mercury derivative, is found in most vaccines. This is the same reason I don't ever get "my flu shots that are free."

The Swedes are doing things correctly. Develop Herd Immunity. My daughter and her husband didn't get the Vaccine, both have had the Wuhan Virus with no worse symptoms than a cold. Many health care professionals are reluctant to be Vaccinated, and businesses are being threatened with closure when the employees refuse to become guinea pigs or victims of the vaccine-pharmaceutical industry.

As usual, the mainstream media is going along with this massive and unConstitutional scheme.

My first symptoms were a headache and fever. I went to UC Health urgent care for diagnosis and was immediately transferred to the hospital by ambulance. (UC Health = University of Colorado Health system). Upon admission, my blood Oxygen level was lower than the 90% level for no supplemental Oxygen required. I was put in bed, on Oxygen at 2 liters a minute, given oral Dexamethasone, and another antiviral medication by IV. The next morning my Oxygen level was fine, and a stepwise reduction in gas flow was started, reducing the flow by 500 ml per minute at a time, and done with additional reductions at 8 hour intervals. By the next evening my Oxygenation was above 90 % without any supplemental being administered. I was allowed out of bed to sit up in a chair and read as well as taking my meals. I was maintained on 4 mg Dexamethasone per day and had the antiviral once a day by IV. On day 4, I was discharged from the hospital to go home  with my oral medication and no necessary Oxygen.

I arrived at my home to find my tenant also had Covid-19, but wasn't very sick and he was under a 10 day quarantine. I was also  quarantined an additional 5 days after returning home.

The lingering after effects were actually worse than the disease treated in the hospital. One practitioner diagnosed me as having viral pneumonia, but that was due to an incorrect interpretation of a chest X-ray.

Long term chronic fatigue and the loss of taste lingered for nearly 8 weeks. Other than the lingering fatigue, I suffered no lasting ill effects, and have 8 months of Natural Immunity ahead of me.

This is what the Secretary-General of the United Nations thinks. Either grind your molars about his view-or simply laugh it off.

https://spacenews.com/un-secretary-gene … -to-space/

It's more the precursor to the standard "save the starving babies" argument, reiterated for the zillionth time, telling people that the way they spend their own money should be somehow, regulated, and used for the way someone else thinks it should be spent.

Louis-
Once again, I decry the absence of a "thumbs up" icon or emoji for comments made on this website. Your latest post was spot-on.

And it appears that the non Governmental mission is nicely underway.
Since two of the crew are rated as certificated pilots, and they will be doing experiments, all should be rated as Astronauts instead of space tourist-passengers.

Just finishing up reading a biography of Musk that was purchased for me to read whilst recovering from my bout with COVID-19.

ELON MUSK
Tesla, SpaceX, and the Quest for a Fantastic Future
by: Ashlee Vance

Written with some input from Elon himself, but not entirely a pretty picture; expose the man's flaws and isn't nonstop cheerleading.

I just would like to revisit the earlier thread here about growing plants on Mars being affected by Cosmic Rays, versus the experiment that was conducted using radioactive Cobalt as a source of gamma radiation.
When I read the comments about this experiment, I developed an itch in the back of my brain that this wasn't a reasonable experiment, so I made a note to myself to check things out. I was quite interested in Cosmic Radiation earlier in my career, so I decided to do a bit of research.

Cosmic Rays are NOT a form of electromagnetic radiation, but are particles (atomic nuclei) travelling at relativistic velocities.

Gamma Rays are a form of electromagnetic radiation and photons are involved, not truly particles.

On the basis of this information, I decided that the experiment regarding plant growth was fatally flawed in it's interpretation. Plants have been successfully grown aboard the ISS, which is subjected to Cosmic rays, although somewhat attenuated intensity.

The Moon in an inhospitable place, compared to Mars.
Just an observation about the dust issues there.

I agree with GW and his assessment of the "real world" situation. After all, Neil Armstrong took a ride outside the restricted airspace flying the X-15.

The real key here is that they (1) achieved the stated goal, and (2) all came back alive without wrecking anything.