Science Education and Paying Mission Costs - 2 topics really: funding and education

sparis · 2004-05-17 19:01:43

I believe in space exploration. I'm a hard-core scientist. I belong to the Amateur Telescope Makers of Boston, the oldest such group in the U.S. I love science fairs and science museums and scientific shows and talks and books...

And yet...

Many high-paying jobs are being outsourced to workers in lower-wage, mostly third-world countries like India and China. I have seen estimates of up to 14 million such jobs being exported within the next few years.

The amount of wages to be lost within the next few years has been estimated to be over $150 billion, and probably much more. I am an excellent case in point, having been laid off 1 1/2 years ago and yet to find a job that pays even half of what I previously earned.

So please tell me exactly who is going to pay for outer space missions? The $10,000 per year worker in India? I don't think they're paying taxes here in the U.S. I'm not paying any taxes. My friends aren't paying any taxes.... So how do we pay for everything?

Second, some "baby boomers" have begun to retire. They're leaving their jobs in the science and engineering industries. But my figures from the IEEE and the ACM show that enrollment in science and engineering programs is down (15% and more) and declining. After all, who wants to spend 10 years (silly me!) earning multiple science degrees only to end up working in a dead-end job as a file clerk or a Walmart cashier?

So...who is going to run and staff these space and science programs?....Ahhh...I forget... we can import scientists from the Indian Institute of Technology on H1-B visas...right?

I think this issue of outsourcing is a legitimate cause for concern and threatens the long-term viability of American science and engineering research and development. I would like to hear comments from readers.

Rxke · 2004-05-17 20:22:46

sparis,

I feel your pain,

I lost my job, too, years ago. Sollicitating for other jobs got me the answer i was too expensive, to put it bluntly

Difference was: i *didn't* have a high degree, though, but was not 'un-educated' either. and i was considered too old to be 'interesting' (i was not even 30, then!)

Jobs i was eligible for went either to the unschooled (lower wages) or... third world countries, where labour is cheap.

So I went back to school (still am)

I'm European, but i guess it's the same where you live.

Friends of mine, in IT, got the sack too, all of a sudden, and everybody starts talking about outsourcing.

At first, being unemployed too, i didn't see the difference, we 'grunt-workers' had to cope with that problem for years, and nobody really cared...

But... Despite my being 'un-very-high-schooled' I *am* the intellectual type, and am of the conviction that knowledge is the 'new gold standard' of society, getting more important every year...

So, your concerns are very valid. Knowledge-based outsourcing is harmful for a country's long-term well-being. It disencourages people to study, wich is VERY bad news...

My -very personal- solution: I'm currently studying something *very* specialised, in my country (10mil peeps) there are currently 4 people with the degree, of wich 2 work outside Belgium, you get the picture. So it was a lucky choice (i didn't choose it because of that, though, just very lucky coincidence) Already i got very tempting offers in my second year. Yes, i do realise, it is not a solution for everybody. But sometimes studying *still* gives you the best chances to earn a living...

Palomar · 2004-05-17 21:05:31

Many high-paying jobs are being outsourced to workers in lower-wage, mostly third-world countries like India and China. I have seen estimates of up to 14 million such jobs being exported within the next few years.
The amount of wages to be lost within the next few years has been estimated to be over $150 billion, and probably much more. I am an excellent case in point, having been laid off 1 1/2 years ago and yet to find a job that pays even half of what I previously earned.
So please tell me exactly who is going to pay for outer space missions? The $10,000 per year worker in India? I don't think they're paying taxes here in the U.S. I'm not paying any taxes. My friends aren't paying any taxes.... So how do we pay for everything?

*Hi sparis. Excellent point. Outsourcing has been discussed at New Mars (sparingly), but only in connection with election-year politics. Somehow I missed -your- "angle" on it (except for having read about the retiring NASA employees and rapidly accelerating age gap there). And the Baby Boomer issues...big time.

Frankly speaking, for quite a while now I've been continually gaining the impression that the U.S.A. has probably missed its "window of opportunity" for getting a real foothold in space...a *continual, progressive, out of LEO* foothold. That impression just keeps building, I'm sad to say. We should have been to Mars by 1987 -- *humans* on Mars.

Not to mention the multi-trillion $ deficit and all the $ being sunk into war. Reminds me of a political cartoon I saw about Bush's "Space Program"; it shows him standing in a big EMPTY Fort Knox vault with his arms outstretched -- "space" indeed. :-\

--Cindy

Palomar · 2004-05-18 17:50:20

*There is perhaps another matter involved in all this. I saw a newspaper headline today regarding all the $ flowing out of the U.S.A. ($30 billion last year alone), because migrant workers (or workers on Green Card status) are sending a lot of their earnings home, to relatives still living in the impoverished nation the worker came from.

This is a difficult humanitarian situation. How can these people be criticized? Wouldn't we do the same thing, if we were in their shoes? Come to a rich nation, make big money (by comparison), knowing your relatives are living in poverty conditions back home? They're doing jobs most U.S.-born folks are "too good" to do. And if they're here legally...

So...here's more $ not being spent in the U.S. Of course, these people are paying taxes on their wages.

Well, I'm not an economist. Hopefully I'm not making a bit of "ado" about nothing, but just thought I'd mention it.

--Cindy

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#1 2004-05-17 19:01:43

Re: Science Education and Paying Mission Costs - 2 topics really: funding and education

#2 2004-05-17 20:22:46

Re: Science Education and Paying Mission Costs - 2 topics really: funding and education

#3 2004-05-17 21:05:31

Re: Science Education and Paying Mission Costs - 2 topics really: funding and education

#4 2004-05-18 17:50:20

Re: Science Education and Paying Mission Costs - 2 topics really: funding and education

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