How many non-Americans on this forum - Don't read this, OK!

atitarev · 2004-02-10 20:51:28

I wonder if there are many non-English active users (people from on-English speaking countries) on this forum and what they think about the site.

Also, pasting here Japanese word for Mars ???? (Kasei) to see how it is displayed. The same Chinese characters are pronounced Huoxing (Huohsing) (depending on what transliteration you use). Of course it means "Fire Star". I want to convert this to an image and make it my Avatar.

Rxke · 2004-02-11 14:39:19

It's quite easy to check that out... click the members' profile, most people fill it out with their details, like country, interests, etc... Of course, not everybody does this, but the regulars tend to take some time to do it, after a while

And yes, i have the impression there is a fair amount of non-English speaking visitors on this board, wixh is a good thing, because different nationalities= different views, so interesting discussions (mostly )

atitarev · 2004-02-11 16:39:19

Thanks for the tip, Rxke. I think you are from Holland, aren't you? I know you can see profiles from Topic Trackers, is there another way? You can't get people's profile from the posts.

Today, I clicked on Members button and got the following error. Is it where you can see the profiles when it works?

Ikonboard CGI Error
Ikonboard has exited with the following error:
Undefined subroutine &MemberlistView::title_end_show_row called
This error was reported at: Sources/Memberlist.pm line 465, line 64.
Please note that your 'real' paths have been removed to protect your information.

I get the impression that it's mainly American board judging by the discussions. I don't mind, the site is great and the topics are very interesting but I can't help getting impression about some arrogance and narrow-mindedness of some (I mean some, not many!) of the readers when the talk about politics. I don't want to offend anyone, it is natural to people to be focused on their culture and their own kind. It is different on the forums where people from different countries and backgrounds communicate. Although, the discussions can be a bit aggressive at times but generally people learn from each other and in the end they reconcile. I am a passive user on this forum. I mostly read postings, butting in only occasionally, because I can't contribute much and because of my complex about my English. What I'd like to do is to promote somehow this forum in non-English speaking countries - Russia, Germany, France, Japan, China and others. Why? Because I believe space exploration is international, planets and moons should be explored in cooperation. I take part in linguistic, penpals forums. I am Russian, fluent in German, functional in French, learning Japanese and know a little bit of Chinese (Mandarin). I am not sure it will work but I've got some ideas.

dicktice · 2004-02-11 17:12:51

atitarev: Please don't stop posting--and while you're at it, consider the addition of Swahili to your language portfolio, because of my obsession with using Mt. Kilaminjaro, in Tanzania, for future mag-lev track launching up its slopes.

Adrian · 2004-02-11 17:21:24

It would be wonderful to get more international users on these forums, atitarev, and I hope that you aren't discouraged from posting because of your English - it seems just as good as anyone else's here.

I feel that we have a good balance of people on New Mars so far and that the vast majority of discussions are good-humored and constructive, which for the Internet is pretty decent. I'd definitely encourage you to let more people around the world know about New Mars - it might even be worth setting up a special forum here for that purpose if we get enough people.

atitarev · 2004-02-11 19:07:51

atitarev: Please don't stop posting--and while you're at it, consider the addition of Swahili to your language portfolio, because of my obsession with using Mt. Kilaminjaro, in Tanzania, for future mag-lev track launching up its slopes.

I would consider this, dicktice but not because of your obsession with Mt. Kilaminjaro, but if there were enough scope and it would be good for my career. Besides, I don't think Tanzanians could contribute significantly to the space exploration and there are public discussions in Tanzania about flying to Mars but I would welcome a Tanzanian if he wanted to talk.

atitarev · 2004-02-11 19:24:58

It would be wonderful to get more international users on these forums, atitarev, and I hope that you aren't discouraged from posting because of your English - it seems just as good as anyone else's here.
I feel that we have a good balance of people on New Mars so far and that the vast majority of discussions are good-humored and constructive, which for the Internet is pretty decent. I'd definitely encourage you to let more people around the world know about New Mars - it might even be worth setting up a special forum here for that purpose if we get enough people.

I agree. There are some related forums in different countries and I found that they share same values and aspirations as people on this forum who just dream that human Mars exploration starts sooner or talk seriously about how things should be done. Uniting people in one forum would be great, I read different ones, this one is the best I know, has more users, the design is good and ideas are very interesting. The governments' desisions start from people's minds. If the voters support something, the governments will support this too. Sorry, got carried away.

I am working on my own site (not Mars related but will have links to this forum). I have already posted on some forums and newspaper article discussions inviting people to have a look and post their opinion.

Palomar · 2004-02-11 19:40:47

I get the impression that it's mainly American board judging by the discussions.

*I hope you don't mind a U.S. citizen chiming in.

Off-hand, I count only 6 *regulars* (who visit New Mars nearly every day, post nearly every day [and who do not exhibit trollish behavior], and have been members for over a year) who are U.S. citizens.

Our Canadian regulars generally share very similar phraseology and spelling with folks in the U.S. (it may be easy to confuse nationality on that basis...I don't know, of course).

As for a more international presence:

We have folks who regularly (or somewhat regularly) post from Australia, New Zealand, and various European nations including England, Holland, and Sweden.

I've seen a member from Croatia and another from Slovakia. We've formerly had a member from India...I don't know where he went.

I think it's more fair to say this message board is mainly WESTERN in its "flavor."

As for bringing in more international folks: I'm all for it.

But how do we go about it bringing them in? This is the internet. I don't feel like a missionary; I'm also monolingual. I'm not quite sure how to say the following, but I sometimes am stymied by an impression I pick up from some non-U.S. folks (I am -not- implying you are this way) that if there is not an interest (of whatever sort/degree) or momentum in their nation (of whatever sort/degree), it is somehow America's fault. ? Perhaps my impression is wrong, however; my apologies if so. I guess I'm just a big proponent of "step up and take the initiative" (whether individually or on a national basis).

As for politics: I can't speak for anyone but myself when I say I also consider myself a Global Citizen [heck, I claim citizenship to the entire Solar System. ], and there are a few other U.S. participants here who also seem similar to me.

When I was in college in the late 1980s, my best friends were all international students (2 Chinese, 2 Japanese, 1 Mexican, 1 Bolivian). Also 75% of my "Age of Voltaire" members are not U.S. citizens.

Just my thoughts.

--Cindy

atitarev · 2004-02-11 20:02:03

*I hope you don't mind a U.S. citizen chiming in.

Of course not Cindy, I welcome everyone's post. I like your posts, BTW.

I am surprised about the level of international users, I still don't how you figured this out. My Members button still doesn't work ?!

Yeah, I know it's a free world and you can't force anyone to join. It's just not enough promotion, although this forum has the largest number of users I know - I give credit to the organizers. My idea is I found some posts with no answers or with no support from people who have similar ideas to the the uses on this forum who just happen to use wrong forums or search engines only in their own language. I join in the discussion and give them links to here. Sometimes a plain advertizing post would work. Having to post in a foreign language is only offputting for some but not all.

The knowledge of English is good around the world, so if people post here, they will most probably do it in English. (You can stay monolingual, if you wish, Cindy).

I want to come up with a post message - invitation to this forum - a short statement, which I want to translate into other languages, or just post in English where appropriate and occasionally post on some forums/discussions I know to see if it works.

I have a cosmopolitan mind too - probably because I travelled a lot and tried to learn too many languages. I like that about Australia, which is similar to the US in many ways. Multiculturalism is a big thing here, it's gone worse, though with the current government.

Palomar · 2004-02-11 20:05:09

*I hope you don't mind a U.S. citizen chiming in.
Of course not Cindy, I welcome everyone's post. I like your posts, BTW.
I am surprised about the level of international users, I still don't how you figured this out. My Members button still doesn't work ?!

*Click on the "Profile" button at the bottom of my post...you'll see a row of buttons:

"Profile" - "Send Msg" - "Email"

Click on "Profile" and you'll see U.S.A. listed as my location. Of course, not everyone fills out their Profiles.

And by the way: Happy Belated Birthday!

--Cindy

atitarev · 2004-02-11 20:14:38

Thanks for that, Cindy. I used the profile button a while ago, slipped out of my mind.

Still to get an idea of all users, you have to click on profiles of each user, right?

Thanks for the congratulations.

Palomar · 2004-02-11 20:28:25

Still to get an idea of all users, you have to click on profiles of each user, right?

*Yes.

Fortunately, most regular participants have filled out their Profile -- at least partially (including national location).

--Cindy

atitarev · 2004-02-12 02:07:27

I'm glad I hooked some serious pessimists on a couple of other forums into a discussions. Not sure whether they join the discussion here but the word is spreading.

Shaun Barrett · 2004-02-12 05:26:49

A belated welcome to New Mars, Atitarev. I tried to keep up with all the new contributors for the first year or two of my membership here, by giving them a welcome. But with recent developments on Mars, new members have been sprouting like mushrooms in the dew!
:laugh:

If you are worried about your English, then the majority of us have problems because you write it better than most of the natural-born English-speaking people I know!

It's good to see that a well-travelled person, such as yourself, who has seen many places and met many people, has chosen to live in God's own country, Australia!
I congratulate you on your wisdom and common sense in recognising the country of my birth as the only sensible place to settle down!

[P.S. Sorry I missed your birthday ... I hope it was a good one.]

atitarev · 2004-02-12 06:28:48

Hi Shaun,

Thank you for your nice message. Greeting you from Melbourne. Haven't been up in Queensland yet but planning to.

Yes, Australia is great. I never regretted coming here.

It's getting late now, talk to you later.

atitarev · 2004-02-12 23:29:12

Just want to share on my "work" promoting New Mars internationally. There are quite active discussions in some places but they are much smaller in number of users and posts.

Apart from joining discussions on Russian forums, I started posting in a German:
[http://www.nachtwelten.de/vB/showthread … genumber=2]Mars macht mobil...

If you're wanna laugh at my French posting,
click on [http://forums.futura-sciences.com/viewt … 4&start=20]A la Conquete de Mars

I'll take it easy, if something comes up, I'll look for Japanese forums.

It depends on discussions going on in a particular forum but can someone suggest a good statement/description about the New Mars Forum?

Rxke · 2004-02-28 09:10:44

"New Mars: Serious Mars Discussion." That's the official name, anyhow...

BTW I'm from Belgium, not Holland, but it's ok, everybody confuses those countries...

Hard to describe New Mars... Of course it's about Mars (well, duh) and sometimes some fairly sohisticated ideas get worked out, it's a board with virtually no 'trolls' so signal-nois ratio is quite high. And of course it's not only about Mars, a lot of other stufff gets discussed, too.
And most important: We love to hear from you! (if you're interested in Mars, at least, though sometimes a 'dissident' could be good, too...)

A bit off-topic:
The only 2 things i miss here, to be honest, is a 'rules and regulations' section, so you can point out to (minor) trolls they are doing stupid things...
And an 'introduce yourself- biography' thread, where you can say 'hi' to the rest of the board, if you feel like it... Or can post links you personally think are interesting etc... The profile page might be a bit restrictive, esp. initially in the get-to-know eachother phase...

atitarev · 2004-02-28 15:23:51

Hi Rik,

I figured your country when I looked at your profile later, I thought you were from Holland because you referred to the Dutch language a few times in your posts. Sorry for the confusion.

And most important: We love to hear from you! (if you're interested in Mars, at least, though sometimes a 'dissident' could be good, too...)

Thank you! I am not upset with anyone, I am just kind of busy at the moment with other things but I do read the new posts and if I feel like adding something, I do. I find your posts very interesting.

Rxke · 2004-02-28 15:34:52

Feeling is likewise, Anatoli, but... It was a general welcome, you asked us to describe New Mars, to make some kind of an 'advertisement,' so I tried...

But of course it is aimed towards you, too, good to see somebody with a background like yours on this board!

'Bout the "Dutch" confusion: Officialy we speak Dutch ('Nederlands' in Dutch) but we're officially the Flemish people, from Flanders, the Dutch speaking part of Belgium. So unofficially our language is Flemish (Vlaams) same thing, minor differences, history etc... And *very* confusing for people outside The Netherlands/Belgium/Flanders...

atitarev · 2004-02-29 23:34:12

Feeling is likewise, Anatoli, but... It was a general welcome, you asked us to describe New Mars, to make some kind of an 'advertisement,' so I tried...
But of course it is aimed towards you, too, good to see somebody with a background like yours on this board!
'Bout the "Dutch" confusion: Officialy we speak Dutch ('Nederlands' in Dutch) but we're officially the Flemish people, from Flanders, the Dutch speaking part of Belgium. So unofficially our language is Flemish (Vlaams) same thing, minor differences, history etc... And *very* confusing for people outside The Netherlands/Belgium/Flanders...

Oh, I didn't get that you were making a statement about New Mars, Rik. Thanks for that. I will add this to the ads I am making up.

I don't feel confused about languages used in Europe, it's pretty straightforward. I haven't been to Belgium but I was in different places in Germany and once in Holland.

As for the Asians languages, it's more complicated. I was envolved in a hot online discussions on a Japanese language forum where some people started abusing each other because of a mix-up about what we call a language and what we call a dialect, whether Japanese is close to Chinese as Italian to Spanish or not, and whether Cantonese is a dalect of Chinese or a separate language. That was funny because nobody was able to convince anyone and there was no moderator to stop the fight.

I'll keep trying but looks like interest to Mars and space exploration is dropping again in other forums, posts are more pessimistic. Maybe because nothing is happening and no short-term plan has been developed for the Mars mission.

P.S. You don't need to complain about your English in your siggie, Rik, you "sound" like native to me, although I am not the one to judge.

Rxke · 2004-03-01 05:33:46

Anatoli,

'bout the pessimsm... 'long time' mannned-space enthousiasts are 'used to' delays... it's always in the next 10-15 years we will blablabla... I remember ISS was once supposed to be completed in 2000-2001, now it's more going to be 2010 etc...
The latest flurry of news, plans etc. gave us the idea it was all going to happen 'tomorrow' (The Chinese, Bush's plans, before they were official, the space-elevator...)
When reality strikes, you realise it's not for 'tomorrow'...

About the language: for you it might sound simple, but for a lot of people it is not, esp. if you live in a "big" language-group, liek English/American or Spanish etc...
And about my sig. Thanks, but i'm keeping it there, as a "disclaimer," I might "sound" native, but i'm not, not at all, and sometimes i phrase things funny or clumsy and upset people that way... Our culture is heavily influenced by the Anglo-Saxon, so we pick these things up, but we're far from really good in English, because we use a mix of "good-sounding" words we read/hear in the media.
My sister, for instance, sounds Australian, really! That's simply because she's a huge fan of the soap "Neighbours" so when she speaks, and even writes English, it is with a distinct Aussie twang! My English is a mix of American and English. For example, I'm used to wite 'colour', but realise it's evolving to 'color,' lately...

DanielCook · 2004-03-01 07:05:41

Goeie dag! Rxke ...

I'm originally from South Africa and my home language is Afrikaans - another dialect of Dutch. (Just thought I'll chime on on that fact ...)

Rxke · 2004-03-01 08:30:41

Veel groeten, Daniel!

You know, i don't even know if the word 'groeten' would be good Suidafrikaans... I always saw Afrikaans more as an independent language than as a dialect... I once read a computermanual in Afrikaans, man that was *great* for me... all those neologisms you guys were way more creative in adapting computer-speak than we did...

aaah, language... it can be frustratigly difficult to express yourself, esp. if you're non-native, but it such a great instrument... to play with

DanielCook · 2004-03-01 12:06:07

Drop the the "n" at the end, and there you go! (Groete is a nice Afrikaans word.)

In a way, an Afrikaans speaking person would converse more easily with Flemish speaking person, than a Dutch person (that's my understanding anyway). The Afrikaans language is a delightful bastard of several languages, principally Dutch, but with some French and Malay thrown in for good measure.

To be honest, some of the Afrikaans adaptations to "computer" speak are quite hilarious, IMHO. Too often a literal translation from English - e.g. Windows becomes "Vensters" ... :laugh:

Well - we all can't be poets, unfortunately ... <shrug>

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