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#1 2026-10-02 08:42:05
- Void
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- Registered: 2011-12-29
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Comment Box to moderators.
(th) and perhaps other moderators, may pose a challenge to a post, where I might feel that a reply may excessively burden the flow of thinking in that particular topic. If it is allowed I will demonstrate a reply for such a situation where I may comment in detail, and even deviate from to topic to demonstrate a possible truth.
Be careful what you wish for.
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#2 2026-10-02 08:44:11
- Void
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Re: Comment Box to moderators.
Here is a query to me from a moderator (th), that may need a detailed reply, which I am not allowed to reply-post to directly: https://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.ph … 66#p241866
Here is the target of the query of (th): https://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.ph … 64#p241864
When I checked for my sources, either they were not recorded or my brain had flatctulence.
You question to me, (th), is both off the point but in another way important. A precise number may be important to future calculations, but was not particularly important for the notion of a Starship that is being used below possible capacity. So, nothing is wrong with you challenging me, but again the exact number may or may not be important.
But you challenge did cause me to consider a new factor perhaps not yet considered. The Pez Dispenser has dry mass, and is used for dispensing Starlink Satellites. Do we consider the Pez Dispenser as part of the Starship, or is it part of the Cargo?
I feel it is acceptable to view it in either manner, but if questioning the payload to orbit, it is only fair to be aware that a payload may require "Disposable Accessories", that are part of the burden imposed on Starship.
It could be true that the Pez Dispenser may be reused, if a Starship is reused. But alternately I have wondered in the future if such Mass should be extracted from the Starship before it lands, and if that mass should be possible to put to a useful purpose in orbit after its removal from a Starship?
On a wild guess, if the Pez Dispenser were a weight of 4 tons, at a price of $127.00/kg, then the value of it in orbit by mass might be considered.
At that presumed price, then $127.00 * 1000 gives $127,000.00 to lift one ton to orbit. 4 tons then is $508,000.00 I believe.
So, if you can put a 4 ton deployment device to use in orbit the cost of lifting it had been that much. To cost of mass producing and installing Pez Dispensers seems to me to be likely less than that.
And if we remove the Pez Dispenser in orbit, the ships task of surviving the heat of reentry is reduced by the energy stored in 4 tons of mass in orbit.
Allow this new topic or not, I have replied. Even if your calculation of 52 tons for the 20 Satellites were precisely correct, the mass that flight 14 lifted might be considered to be more than 52 tons.
Ending
Last edited by Void (2026-10-02 09:02:20)
Be careful what you wish for.
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#3 2026-10-02 09:34:16
- Void
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Re: Comment Box to moderators.
I screwed up a post here that I have moved to here: https://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.ph … 99#p241899
I am sorry.
Perhaps Calliban and Robert will consider a modification as well.
Last edited by Void (2026-10-02 18:59:32)
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#4 2026-10-02 12:10:49
- Calliban
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- Registered: 2019-08-18
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Re: Comment Box to moderators.
Shrinking sea ice means that the entire Canadian North and Northern Alaska is now accessible by ship for a larger part of the year. That makes all of the resources far more accessible. That opens economic opportunities for whatever resources exist in these parts. Oil, natural gas, coal, uranium, copper, rare earths, etc. Unfortunately, it also means that these areas need defending in a way that wasn't necessary before. Canada and the US need to increase the size of their destroyer fleets. Both need surveillance satellites capable of monitoring activity in these remote areas.
Last edited by Calliban (2026-10-02 12:16:06)
"Plan and prepare for every possibility, and you will never act. It is nobler to have courage as we stumble into half the things we fear than to analyse every possible obstacle and begin nothing. Great things are achieved by embracing great dangers."
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#5 2026-10-02 12:43:48
- RobertDyck
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Re: Comment Box to moderators.
As the arctic thaws, more and more of the arctic will be ice free in summer. And for an ever longer period of time each summer. That will make all the resources of the arctic ocean accessible. And large ships can traverse the Northwest Passage.
For reference, here is a record of global temperature calculated from ice cores from Antarctica. Blue is the EPICA ice sheet, green is the Lake Vostok. Peak during the last interglacial roughly 125,000 years ago is 6°C above the pre-industrial temperature. 260,000 years ago was two interglacial periods ago; for some reason the interglacial was cut short so was shorter time and didn't reach the same peak as other interglacials. About 370,000 years ago was 3 interglacials ago; it reached a peak of 5°C above the pre-industrial temperature. They found an ice deposit even deeper, extending 800,000 years ago. There's an ice age roughly every 100,000 years. Roughly 80,000 years of ice age, and 20,000 years of interglacial. So the 800,000 year ice core records 8 ice ages and 8 interglacial periods. The long term trend is each peak is higher than the last. The point is just due to nature, the peak temperature will be warmer than today. Do not expect the peak to be limitied to 1.5°C above the pre-industrial temperature. More likely it will be 6°C, the same as the last interglacial period. Good news is that peak is not due for another 2,000 years. That does not mean it will happen all at once. It means slow but steady global warming for the next 2,000 years, with each summer setting new record highs.
During the last interglacial period, the north polar ice cap completely melted during the summer. At the warmest period. It will again.
(Image from Wikipedia. Click image for Wikipedia page.)
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