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#201 2021-04-16 16:25:12

GW Johnson
Member
From: McGregor, Texas USA
Registered: 2011-12-04
Posts: 4,576
Website

Re: Mars InSight lander

Sure.  But it is expensive. 

GW


GW Johnson
McGregor,  Texas

"There is nothing as expensive as a dead crew,  especially one dead from a bad management decision"

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#202 2021-04-16 18:50:02

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 23,096

Re: Mars InSight lander

I get you with the impactor modified for going deeper by continued forces. Sure if the thrust were a upward pointing such as to able to apply the force in opposition to fuel penalty for the use and its also going to depend on the ability to throttle that force as required as to much is just over kill for fuel use and not enough would be of no benefit to igniting the thrust in the first place.

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#203 2021-06-03 20:12:11

SpaceNut
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From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 23,096

Re: Mars InSight lander

The solar panels are very dirty and now NASA Mars lander dumps dirt on itself to battle dusty solar panels

The move worked because larger sand grains carried smaller dust particles off the surface of the panels. It was timed for a windy part of the day. "Sure enough, with winds blowing northwest at a maximum of 20 feet (6 meters) per second, the trickling of sand coincided with an instantaneous bump in the spacecraft's overall power,

So pushing without scratching the surface....

Mars is nearing its farthest point from the sun, which means InSight was already gathering less sunlight.

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#204 2021-06-04 04:49:30

tahanson43206
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Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 7,326

Re: Mars InSight lander

For SpaceNut re #203

Thanks for this report of an idea by a staff member being given a try!  Nice to see the attempt, and the improvement in performance.

Future rover designs might include the ability to tilt the solar panels, which would improve performance of this locally sourced cleaning method.

It took decades (and the addition of a scoop arm long enough to reach over the solar panels) for this idea to appear.

(th)

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#205 2021-06-25 21:31:34

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 23,096

Re: Mars InSight lander

GW reported on the solar power levels...
NASA's InSight Mars lander might die by April if it doesn't get a significant energy boost

Spring is coming for when the rovers temperature will use less power to keep warm but its also the time when dust is going to gets higher in the atmosphere blocking the critical sunlight from hitting the already covered panels.

BB1fDQYt.img?w=768&h=768&m=6

InSight's solar panels are already about 80% obscured, and their daily energy production has dropped from nearly 5,000 watt-hours to less than 700 watt-hours, Banerdt said, according to Foust.

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#206 2021-07-23 20:41:36

SpaceNut
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From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 23,096

Re: Mars InSight lander

Mostly in a hibernating state at this time scientists are however getting plenty of time to look at the collected data from the seismic unit. In historic first, NASA spacecraft maps what lurks below the surface of Mars

A team reviewing the potential for InSight to extend its mission last year warned that the spacecraft's power margins would require new measures to keep going after July 2021. Otherwise, power levels "are likely to reach critically low levels during the proposed EM [extended mission]" that ends in December 2022, compromising potential science return, the panel said at the time.

The first try on May 22 increased energy output by 25 to 30 watt-hours, he said. But the second and third attempts only showed a moderate increase, although he said the three cleanings offered "a little bit of headroom that we didn't have before."

That is a huge drop from when it first landed November 2018, when the robotic lander was generating roughly 5,000 watt-hours of power...

of course the thoughts we have had are answered next

While relying on solar panels may seem risky in such a dusty environment, doing so lessens the amount of mass at launch, lowering cost and complication for the mission, JPL officials said. Adding dust-removing brushes or fans could add failure points or problems to a long-running mission.

unlike solar nuclear does not have this issue

Bigger NASA Mars robots such as the Perseverance and Curiosity rovers use nuclear power, making them more flexible in working in severe environments — but also more dependent on dwindling plutonium-238 decay levels over time. Perseverance, which just landed in February, should have enough power to go for 14 years, NASA officials have said. Curiosity is still going strong, nearly nine years after landing on Mars in August 2012.

the next problem if its getting more power later is communications as the

The next major mission challenge for InSight after aphelion will be around Oct. 7, when Earth and Mars are on opposite sides of the sun. This period of "solar conjunction" happens every two years and can interrupt signals between the planets, so NASA stops active communications with its Mars missions for a few weeks as a precaution.

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#207 2021-07-24 10:03:46

GW Johnson
Member
From: McGregor, Texas USA
Registered: 2011-12-04
Posts: 4,576
Website

Re: Mars InSight lander

The panels on Insight were deployed as horizontal surfaces,  and without any dust removal capability.  For a lander intended for a long mission,  that was a very serious,  very stupid,  design mistake,  with consequences that were entirely predictable. As was also the mole "drill" rig.

Most of the press releases are intended to shift attention away from those totally-egregious design mistakes.  The only one that is not intended from the outset to divert attention from incredibly bad management decisions,  is what the seismic instrument has found.  Being more successful than expected,  it served to divert attention anyway.  THAT one was not made in the USA,  by the way.  It is French.

GW

Last edited by GW Johnson (2021-07-24 10:06:01)


GW Johnson
McGregor,  Texas

"There is nothing as expensive as a dead crew,  especially one dead from a bad management decision"

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#208 2021-07-24 10:20:23

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 23,096

Re: Mars InSight lander

It sort of had to be after a 2 year wait plus to get it fixed for possible continuation of the insight mission to begin with.

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#209 2021-09-23 19:35:48

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 23,096

Re: Mars InSight lander

2nd times he charm hope...


Seems that insight has survive its low power and is doing science NASA's InSight lander has finally detected 3 big Mars quakes, including one that lasted nearly 90 minutes

The robot beamed the data from its seismometer back to Earth, and NASA scientists realized they had what they'd been waiting for: a big quake. Insight had recorded a magnitude 4.2 Mars quake - the kind NASA scientists had been wanting to observe since Insight touched down on the red planet in November 2018.

Two other big ones recently rolled through, too: On August 25, the lander felt two quakes of magnitudes 4.2 and 4.1.

Before these, the biggest quake the lander had felt was a 3.7 in 2019.

Saturday quake was five times more energetic than the 3.7-magnitude rumble.

InSight has detected more than 700 quakes in total, and they've revealed a lot about the planet's interior already. Scientists have learned that Mars' crust is thinner than they thought, and that it's more like the moon's crust than Earth's - it's broken up from asteroid impacts.

The panels look like this after 1000 sol's on mars

BB1fDQYt.img?h=799&w=799&m=6&q=60&o=f&l=f

ust a meir 30 whrs was enough to keep it on

In June, the team was preparing to shut down the seismometer, and Banerdt told a NASA group that the lander's life might not last past April 2022, according to SpaceNews.

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