Snipers - Why are they loathed?

Palomar · 2003-04-04 15:34:43

*No, this isn't a joke...it's just something that popped into my mind about 10 minutes ago.

A few years ago I watched a TV program on the History Channel about snipers in Vietnam, and maybe even the Korean War.

***(Note: I'm -not- interested in discussing the current war with Iraq...thank you).***

I was surprised to learn that snipers were loathed by their own comrades. Apparently snipers were often picked entirely at random by commanding officers -- a finger was pointed into a crowd and bam -- you're a sniper, you're on your own for a duration.

It's a bit easier to understand why a person volunteering to act as a sniper might be resented by his comrades, given the social nature of we humans. However, to resent someone for having to obey orders on an involuntary basis; sorry, I don't understand it. Of course, I clearly understand why the enemy hates snipers, and we theirs.

I came to view the sniper as being of great service to his comrades, and the fact that he's out there alone with no one else to cover his back and look out for him should, I think, warrant some respect.

I've always been interested in little sociological difficulties like these. Any ideas as to why snipers are resented? Is it because they are perceived as breaking some social rules or mores/values of war -- even by their comrades in arms?

I'm just curious what you guys think about this -- particularly as most folks reading and interacting here are men. You probably have more insight about this than I do.

Just curious...thanks.

--Cindy

Shaun Barrett · 2003-04-04 18:08:14

Sorry, Cindy.
I have no idea why snipers are loathed by their own comrades, unless it's just as you suggest. Soldiers know how much they despise the 'sneaky' sniper on the other team and, somehow, the hatred for all snipers flows from that.
Maybe they suspect all snipers come to enjoy their work.
It does seem to be a gruesome thing - killing someone who probably doesn't even realise, at that moment, that they're in the cross-hairs. They might even be relaxing for a few precious minutes with a cigarette or a bite to eat - then they're dead!

Josh Cryer · 2003-04-04 19:52:43

One of the rather interesting conundrums of war. It's not ethical to set boobie traps, but it's ethical to shoot someone in the head from far away without them even knowing you're there.

I used to play DDay when I had cable. You could play as a sniper. No surprise that a majorty of players always wanted to play as a sniper. Sniping is sneaky. I preferred to be regular infantry, made me appreciate the difficulties of American infantry during WW2.

dicktice · 2003-04-05 10:19:58

Trained Canadian snipers, working always in pairs in the mountains of Afganistan, used 50-caliber, especially-long sighted rifles against the Taliban...and they were acclaimed both by the USA-ans as well as the Canadians. Go figure.

Number04 · 2003-04-07 08:41:50

Because snipers don't play fair. Who ever they are hunting has no chance to fight back. I can only imagine that if your buddy got called to be a sniper, you might not like him because he gets to stay out of the main battle and stay safe.

clark · 2003-04-07 09:16:35

Why do people have an aversion to morticians? Grave diggers? The guy who pulls the switch?

In the thick of battle, you try to kill the other guy before he kills you.

A sniper sits and waits, then kills whoever walks by. It is random, there is very little in the way you can do to protect yourself. You walk along, then blam, you're dead.

Or, if the sniper follows protocol, you get wounded and used as bait- the sniper picking off any others who try to help you.

I believe some of the historical aversion arose from special forces being used as snipers. There is an uneasy tension between regular military, and special forces- at least prior to WW2.

As a side, I heard a rumor that Mr. Rogers was a sniper, but I haven't bothered to see if it was true.

Josh Cryer · 2003-04-07 17:01:46

I'm more perplexed by the double standard. For example, if we have CIA operatives dressed in civilian clothes and they manage to bomb a mosque, it's okay. But if the enemy dons civilian clothes when it's equally useful, say, to repulse us, it's not okay, and in fact, is brutal, evil, and so on.

BTW, a two second Google search would seem to debunk the Mr. Rogers Is A Sniper idea, though it would've been interesting if he really was.

soph · 2003-04-07 20:16:56

But we don't, and wouldn't do that. There's no real double standard if it's really not done. If an American bombed a mosque, the world would go into an outrage.

The double standard is how gentle we have to be in tendering to everybody's feelings around the world. Training terrorists is okay, but pointing it out, well that isn't!

Josh Cryer · 2003-04-08 01:12:52

If anyone wants to educate soph, feel free.

soph · 2003-04-08 04:27:14

Go ahead, since you brought it up.

clark · 2003-04-08 06:54:36

Soph, we have numerous paramilitary people on the ground in Iraq. We have spies, and military in civilian clothes, as they operate behind enemy lines.

We have well over 10,000 special ops in Iraq now. They are doing everything from targeting for air strikes, to search and capture/kill missions of various Iraq leadership.

The opening salvo for this war was an attempt to assaginate the entire Iraq leadership.

There has been a few news reports of US units (not neccessarily US military) using schools as command bases (i believe this occured in Nothern Iraq with the Kurds). Using schools like this is a violation of the Geneva convention, and it is behavior we accuse the Iraq regime of engaing in.

I can't say i fault the Iraqi's for dressing in civilian clothes- if our country was invaded, would you announce your intention to harm the aggresor? Not likely.

The US military though, I believe, has shown quite a bit of restraint and has been acting honorably towards the Iraqi people.

Just remember, when it comes to self preservation, there are no rules.

soph · 2003-04-08 17:01:22

We don't fake surrender, though. And we don't do this with our regular fighters. Our special ops forces, the ones that do the fighting, are clearly military troops, as well as the troops that do the heavier fighting.

The soldiers that rescued PFC Lynch were in obvious fighting gear.

clark · 2003-04-09 09:36:27

No, we don't fake surrender. Yet, if our countrhy was invaded by a vastly superior foe, I am less inclined to believe that we might not try things like this. And this isn't really happening with the Regular Iraq army, it occurs with their paramilitary.

Our special ops forces, the ones that do the fighting, are clearly military troops, as well as the troops that do the heavier fighting.

No, our special ops are behind enemy lines, in civilian clothes to blend in. Perhaps they aren't opening fire with a machine gun, but they do targetgeting for airstrikes. So instead of using a gun, they call in someone else to drop a bomb.

It's a technicality, and I for one see no room for debate on this issue. This is happening, the right and wrong of all of it is a bit academic. People are dying either way.

Both sides are doing what they feel is neccessary to win, or survive.

soph · 2003-04-10 16:09:42

No, we don't fake surrender. Yet, if our countrhy was invaded by a vastly superior foe, I am less inclined to believe that we might not try things like this. And this isn't really happening with the Regular Iraq army, it occurs with their paramilitary.

If it ever got to that point, it would probably be a nuclear war, and secondly, the American public is so well armed with weapons as a whole that the civilians themselves could fight a guerrila war for literally decades.

dicktice · 2003-04-11 08:03:52

Soph: As a former infantryman, why must you drag "nuclear" into everything! That's no fun....

dicktice · 2003-04-11 08:10:56

Why do people have an aversion to morticians? Grave diggers? The guy who pulls the switch?

I think you should at least be allowed to arm-wrestle with the guy who pulls the switch. It's that being strapped-down so helplessly; it drives me crazy just imagining it. Talk about claustrophobia...!

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Re: Snipers - Why are they loathed?

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