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#1 2017-02-14 22:22:26

Void
Member
Registered: 2011-12-29
Posts: 3,889

Electrical power from solutions

I have been looking at this for some time.
http://cen.acs.org/articles/91/web/2013 … sions.html
https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti … tra-power/
Previously I mentioned power from salt solutions.
It appears that now they are looking at energy from CO2 solutions.

Both of these might be adapted to Mars, as of course Mars has the CO2 in abundance.

However I am wondering if the same could be done with Ammonia and Water.

In any of the three cases, salt water solutions, CO2 water solutions, and Ammonia water solutions, I could anticipate solar heat and possibly nighttime cold being used to pry the components apart, to produce differing solutions that could be used to generate power like a flow battery.

The articles do mention some problems with dealing with CO2 solutions, it is not an actual economic process just yet.
Salt solutions are plausible.

Such a process might also involve a turbine, but I think I will leave it out of this discussion beyond this mention.

It would use Membranes. In a flow battery type method.

The two solutions would be Ammonia Water.  One solution having more Ammonia than the other.  Now I have no evidence that this will work.  I simply speculate that it will since salt water solutions, and CO2 solutions have that ability.

The reason I am interested in Ammonia Water solutions is they are an antifreeze, and might better work in some level of the Martian cold.

I think for re-separating the solutions solar distillation would be the process.

If it works, then the core of the electric generation process would involve Membranes.

I am sort of interested in this aspect since it seems that it is anticipated that 3D printers can make them rather well and easy.
http://www.3dprintingprogress.com/artic … technology
Quote:

Innovative, more accurate membranesThe use of 3D printing techniques offers novel membrane preparation techniques that are able to produce membranes of different shapes, types and designs, which can be more precisely designed, fabricated and controlled than any other membrane fabrication method currently available.
Read more at: http://www.3dprintingprogress.com/artic … technology

So, the point being that for any of the mentioned solutions usable on Mars (Perhaps), Membranes would matter, and 3D printing apparently is going to improve that technology.

Just now I am wondering about Ammonia Water solutions.

Last edited by Void (2017-02-14 22:48:14)


I like people who criticize angels dancing on a pinhead.  I also like it when angels dance on my pinhead.

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#2 2017-02-15 17:38:32

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 23,122

Re: Electrical power from solutions

Power-generating stations worldwide release 12 billion tons of carbon dioxide every year as they burn coal, oil or natural gas; home and commercial heating plants release another 11 billion tons. A team of Dutch scientists has a use for it.

I read the articles and from the second  here is the reason for wanting to create power from a side process that is required to clean the exhaust. While on earth this is a dependable benefit to the power producers but for mars there is a negative energy need for starting the process.

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#3 2021-06-16 12:02:54

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 7,349

Re: Electrical power from solutions

For SpaceNut .... for the item below, I looked for topics that contain the word "power" ... there are many of them ...

In the midst of all the topics, I found this one, and since Void is on Sabbatical, I decided to add this report about power  consumption in Texas to try to stimulate discussion of electrical power requirements for (reasonably) comfortable living on Earth, with a view to how that might extend to Mars.

For Calliban ...

The quote below is from a press report about challenges facing residents of Texas as requests to dial back on power use are in the news.


According to the
summer Seasonal Assessment of Re-
source Adequacy, a typical range of
thermal generation outages on hot sum-
mer days is around 3,600 megawatts.
One megawatt typically powers around
200 homes on a summer day.

1,000,000 / 200 is 10000 / 2 or 5,000 watts

That would be 5000/1000 * 24 = 120 kwh

Does that number look about right to you, for a home in a desert climate?

Google came up with this (much lower) figure:

About 8,200,000 results (0.91 seconds)
How much electricity does an American home use? In 2019, the average annual electricity consumption for a U.S. residential utility customer was 10,649 kilowatthours (kWh), an average of about 877 kWh per month.

877/30 >> 88/3 >> 29+ kwh per day ... what a difference!

(th)

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#4 2021-06-16 16:31:30

Calliban
Member
From: Northern England, UK
Registered: 2019-08-18
Posts: 1,154

Re: Electrical power from solutions

A power consumption of 120kWh per day sounds extreme, if we are talking electrical energy consumption.  Typical US would be about 20kWh per day; Europe about half that.  If it is total energy consumption, including heating, then maybe not so extreme as an annual average for a large house in a cold climate.  It would be higher still, if we accounted for the energy cost of all materials in the house and the energy needed to pay for its various adornments.  So, it depends.  If we were to estimate energy consumption per capita including energy embodied in consumed products, transportation, individual share of infrastructure, etc, then I think most people would be shocked by how much they consume.  Globalisation has hidden this reality from most people.


Interested in space science, engineering and technology.

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