Parallel tracks of progess or lack of it.

Void · 2012-05-11 16:01:57

I just thought I would express my overall opinion of current behaviors concerning potential extraterrestrial activities of humans.

One that I have a great deal of anxeity about is what I see as the aparent desire by some to discover a second genesis, to discover/prove that life arrises spontaniously from non life. I could take a relegious track and express a "Belief" that life only comes from the will of a creator.

However, that would be a poor position to take, if you wanted to argue against a different "Faith" based effort to prove that humankind only answers to itself.

I guess I see that the need of some to find a second genesis on Mars is a problem. It is not a problem if one occured, only that I have a great concern that all efforts to move humankind to Mars will be sabataged by an elete group who expouses a religion of non-diety, and wants to justify it's right to rule. That is I am concerned that all the efforts of human kind will bent to that agenda.

So, rather than do direct battle with them, I choose to side step what they are after.

I read an article, it was not offensive in itself, not a wrong thing, but it made me aware that the agenda is to gather information from distant star systems using DNA, and extreme miniturization. What is it they want to discover?

Why is it so much more important to discover alien life, than to promote the happyness of the human race I wonder?

I have to conclude that it is so that they can claim the non-existance of God, and so that they can invent the morality they want to invent, that is the one where they get to do what they want.

I am afraid, that this is the sad truth.

It may be foolish to express this in words, but I feel it is more foolish to go into direct conflict with this group. They are obviously quite intellegent, if perhaps missing other components of the human equasion.

This is my primary anxiety about Mars as an objective, that I feel that they can and will sabatoge any effort to go there.

They do not respect humanity's asperations to be free, on the contrary, they believe in control.

While they are correct that more data can be collected by robots, they forget that in the relm of space we will never discover what is on the other side, because for each discovery will be an endless array of new other sides. So, they will lean further and further on machines to discover information. The biggest prise they seek is a second genesis, so that they can engage in a religious control system contrary to the historical ones.

So even though it seems silly I now support robotic centered exploration of the Moon, and before that in fact also the current efforts expressed by business enterprises to exploit NEO asteroids.

I believe that I read a book by someone from India that there are four places where power is quested in:
-Priests (Reading Books, making reality conform to a book. The use of books/story telling to rule humans.).
-Acquisitioners (Books for sums, business.)
-Warlords (The use of tools to rule humans.)
-Intellectuals (I guess perhaps the decendants of warlords, who learned to use tools to manipulate further objects to attain wealth rather than gashing animals and humans with them).

So,
-I support remote control equipment to mine the Moon (With human marginally in proximity of the Moon as it is productive).
-The exploitation of NEO objects.
-The futher expansion to the Astroids except Ceres. (Unfortunately Ceres will likely be held in the zoo of objects that the people I speek of hope to find a second genesis on).

I love the idea of Mars and Ceres, but I think too much interference will come from those who want this discovery of a second genesis.

The second tract of the Moon and Asteriods is one they will be less inclined to interfere with.

So for the above reasons, I think I have very little left to discuss here.

Most or all of you are very good to interact with, but find too much regidity, and too much ego in a few cases.

Last edited by Void (2012-05-19 12:21:56)

Void · 2012-05-19 12:51:42

I realize that I am more or less a free rider here, and don't set the rules, but it is my opinion that you should have sections which are not directly involved with Mars, but specifically with the Moon, NEO, and main belt asteroids each.

This would get you more membership, since for instance a great deal of my interest is in the advancement of telerobotics for the Moon.

You can also pull in other science as well such as apparatus to the physically challenged, since I think there is a direct parallel to operating machines remotely on the Moon, and having physically challenged people pioneer the testing of telerobotic equipment.

Obviously there is also the robotic mining of NEO. This is similar, but less close to realtime interactions.

So, realtime is best represented by the use of devices on Earth by Physically challenged persons, use of devices by humans on the Moon, use of devices operated remotely on the Moon from a "L1-L5" location, and the use of devices operated from the Earth on the Moon.

I see this as being an opportunity to couple space activities with medical activities, and to put it bluntly, the medical has a lot of money, and much more will be spent before all we baby boomers go silent. On the other hand there are very clever people here, who could advance medical prostesis using their mental capacity.

So it is symbiosis as far as I am concerned.

As for Mars, I have been following threads about life on Mars, and that material is very interesting. I am willing to believe that it is very likely that Mars has a Cousin biosphere to that of Earth, through Transspermia (Panspermia?). Anyway I think that even if Mars had had it's own genesis, it is likely that wherever microbial life first occured, it was passed back and fourth between at least the Asteroids, Mars, Earth, and Venus.

It seems likely that Earth was most likely the bigest reservoir of life for most of the era's that occured.

So, if this is true, I would expect a lot of resistance to contamination of Mars for some time. However, eventually the only way to study life on Mars if it exists will be with close in Telerobitics, and even then it will likely be impossible to not contaminate the planet eventually with current Earth organisms.

I really think that in the end the human race will have to decide that the Earth and Mars biospheres are connected and evolving, and that the transfer of organisms is natural. Hopefully nothing to terrible might come here from Mars.

But you see all of this, the possiblity that the Earth could be contaminated, and the fact that many will resist the presence of Earth organisms on Mars, will slow down the process of settlement of Mars, unless it can be proven with high probability that there is no life on Mars, and I am betting that there is life at this point on the basis of the articles I have read here.

So, I think that medical telerobotics could be coupled to Lunar telerobotics, and also NEO telerobotics, and that could allow settlers on Phobos and Demos, which are apparently rouble piles, and that experience would lead to expansion into the Main Astroid belt.

Mars could be extensively explored for life from Phobos and Demos using telerobitics, and Mars would or would not be settled depending upon the findings.

My own opinion is that after significant study of any existing biosphere on Mars, it would be alright to introduce people and the organisms they associate with, since if transpermia has occured the life forms are related anyway. It would be similar to finding a new continent with new creatures, and yet how long could it be kept in total isolation? Eventually the isolation would fail, so there is not particular reason to be too obsessive about it.

Some people might think that this would be slighting Martians, but I think that if the Humans eventually do travel to other solar systems, Mars life would travel with them, so, it is also helping the continuation of the Martian life line, if there is one.

Some people want to freeze a situation, but really things change all the time.

So, that is my advice. Provide sections for the following, even if they are not directly "Mars":

Telerobotics:
1) Medical
2) Lunar
3) NEO
4) Mars from Phobos and Demos

If this is done then winning can occur, because if humans are force to bypass Mars for settling, they still have a path forward. If however eventually they can settle Mars, then they would have some very powerful tools to do it with.

If for instance the go ahead occured, then they could move the telerobotics headquarters to the surface of Mars.

But of course what you do is your own business. I am otherwise resuming my break.

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#1 2012-05-11 16:01:57

Parallel tracks of progess or lack of it.

#2 2012-05-19 12:51:42

Re: Parallel tracks of progess or lack of it.

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