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#26 2005-08-25 09:50:27

clark
Member
Registered: 2001-09-20
Posts: 6,345

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

What happened to the good ol days when people just siphoned gas from their neighbors tank with a hose? [sigh]

Bunch of savages now a days.

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#27 2005-08-25 18:12:30

srmeaney
Member
From: 18 tiwi gdns rd, TIWI NT 0810
Registered: 2005-03-18
Posts: 976

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Any one who buys petrol is financing terrorism any how. Any government that doesnt outlaw the manufacture of petrol engine cars is profiting from terrorism.

Buy more electric busses...!!!! Put a bus stop every half a Kilometre.


PS: An almost empty fuel tank is more explosive that a full one...

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#28 2005-08-25 18:21:11

John Creighton
Member
From: Nova Scotia, Canada
Registered: 2001-09-04
Posts: 2,401
Website

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Any one who buys petrol is financing terrorism any how. Any government that doesnt outlaw the manufacture of petrol engine cars is profiting from terrorism.

Buy more electric busses...!!!! Put a bus stop every half a Kilometre.


I'd go for it. If the people fighting in Iraq are really sponsored by the Saudi's then your right.

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#29 2005-08-25 18:49:39

srmeaney
Member
From: 18 tiwi gdns rd, TIWI NT 0810
Registered: 2005-03-18
Posts: 976

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Best hope the next presidential candidate isnt a shareholder in oil wells.

I bet you that the real reason they dont like CUBA is because they refuse to recognise their territorial claim over Gulf of Mexico Oil fields...


"Oh my god, Cuba has Oil...Cuba is holding out on the US. Invade, Invade Now..."

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#30 2005-08-28 21:03:19

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 25,989

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Well with Katrina bearring down on the coast of Lousiana. My wife mentioned the nightly news stating that oil prices would be effected since there are oil fields and tankers in the gulf. Sure this maybe sensationalism but with gas already rising again oil for heating is next.

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#31 2005-08-29 03:37:24

srmeaney
Member
From: 18 tiwi gdns rd, TIWI NT 0810
Registered: 2005-03-18
Posts: 976

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Typical Northern Hemispherians: too cheap to buy warm clothes, too overpaid to get an electric car.

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#32 2005-08-29 03:41:12

Grypd
Member
From: Scotland, Europe
Registered: 2004-06-07
Posts: 1,872

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

I wish it was sensationalism but those oil production wells in the gulf where all abandoned 2 days ago and the crews returned to land. This is a safety of life thing but with production stalled this will put prices up a bit more sorry folks.

What though is the biggest threat is if New Orleans gets hammered as a large percentage of the USA's refinery,piping and tanker ports are located in and around that city. Any severe damage to the city will be bad for this sector of the oil industry as these are all based on the shore or just behind the threatened levies. One of the principal hubs of the USA's oil production capacity is located 60 miles south of New orleans and with most of the gas and oil from the mexican gulf going through it produces about 30% of the oil needed by the USA.


Chan eil mi aig a bheil ùidh ann an gleidheadh an status quo; Tha mi airson cur às e.

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#33 2005-08-29 05:34:15

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 25,989

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Typical Northern Hemispherians: too cheap to buy warm clothes, too overpaid to get an electric car.

In correct my heat is shutoff during the day, windows heavily plastic covered to fight against drafts. Doors have drop blankets for night time sealing to drafts. My heat is set to keep pipes from freezing.

For the not getting an electrical vehicle, sure I would love to. I buy used automobiles, since I can ill afford new costs, high insurance coverage cost that do not pay.

I have never seen a used electrical vehicle ever for sale in new England and if I did it would be nearly new priced.

As for the wage comment I earn less than most for the job type in electronics engineering, about half as much. Most work for nearer to minimum wage ($5.45) in my state in comparison to neighboring ones.

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#34 2005-08-29 12:13:19

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 25,989

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

This is good news if the president follows though.
Bush Mulls Tapping Oil Reserves

A decision was expected later in the day.

The storm already forced the shutdown of an estimated 1 million barrels of refining capacity along the nation's Gulf Coast.

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#35 2005-08-30 04:29:42

srmeaney
Member
From: 18 tiwi gdns rd, TIWI NT 0810
Registered: 2005-03-18
Posts: 976

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Not a good idea. Oil having just climbed above seventy dollars a barrel...It is better that Americans pay real world prices for their petrol rather than risk draining the security reserves. Private sector needs to change its posture.

Considering the Steel Tarrifs saved one job in the steel industry for every ten it cost in steel using industries, Government needs to cut the private sector loose.

It needs to starve in the wilderness for a few years. That way we will know what kind of wolf it is.

"Step away from those oil subsidies with your hands in the air!"

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#36 2005-08-30 08:04:23

C M Edwards
Member
From: Lake Charles LA USA
Registered: 2002-04-29
Posts: 1,012

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Not a good idea. Oil having just climbed above seventy dollars a barrel...It is better that Americans pay real world prices for their petrol rather than risk draining the security reserves. Private sector needs to change its posture.

Yes.  Depleting oil reserves is a bad idea right now.  However...

I suspect that Kenneth Deffeyes is correct.  We are near the point of peak oil production, which means we are at the cusp between a buyers market and a sellers market for oil.  In the world oil market's current economic regime, queing (when you order, where it comes from, and how fast it's shipped) has more effect on price than the interplay of supply vs. demand.  We are now in a worldwide version of "the Market Game", as described in Chaotic Dynamics textbooks.  In that case, a stable source (like the strategic oil reserve) can stabilize prices more than any increase in supply. 

Hurricane Katrina has just halted about a third of US oil shipping for the next month.  If the strategic oil reserve can make up that difference for one month without depleting it, then maybe it should be used to do so.  That one month might keep US gasoline prices under $6/gallon for another year.

However, SpaceNut, I fear that extending that intervention over an entire season might rob us of the ability to do it again.  We should not do that.

If your heating bill gets too terrible, you could consider coming to live in New Orleans.  I hear they'll have lots of room... well, space, anyway.   sad


"We go big, or we don't go."  - GCNRevenger

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#37 2005-08-30 09:10:52

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 25,989

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Not a good idea. Oil having just climbed above seventy dollars a barrel...It is better that Americans pay real world prices for their petrol rather than risk draining the security reserves. Private sector needs to change its posture.

Yes.  Depleting oil reserves is a bad idea right now.  However...

In that case, a stable source (like the strategic oil reserve) can stabilize prices more than any increase in supply. 

Hurricane Katrina has just halted about a third of US oil shipping for the next month.  If the strategic oil reserve can make up that difference for one month without depleting it, then maybe it should be used to do so.  That one month might keep US gasoline prices under $6/gallon for another year.

However, SpaceNut, I fear that extending that intervention over an entire season might rob us of the ability to do it again.  We should not do that.

If your heating bill gets too terrible, you could consider coming to live in New Orleans.  I hear they'll have lots of room... well, space, anyway.:(

Yup agreed on the duration of fuel reserve tapping for short term only.

As for moving the grass is always greener elsewhere but only for a little while when the same problems exist where ever you go.

Another draw back to the rising costs are to be noted by the Poverty rate at 12.7 percent, 4th straight rise of which I am probably nearer to that static since I make less than this..

Household income unchanged
The median household income, meanwhile, stood at $44,389, unchanged from 2003.

So what is poverty level:

The poverty threshold differs by the size and makeup of a household. For instance, a family of four with two children was considered living in poverty if income was $19,157 or less. For a family of two with no children, it was $12,649. For a person 65 and over living alone, it was 9,060.

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#38 2005-08-30 16:17:49

srmeaney
Member
From: 18 tiwi gdns rd, TIWI NT 0810
Registered: 2005-03-18
Posts: 976

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Just double the tax on automotive companies making petroleum using vehicles in favour of alternatives. declare petroleum for industry and government only, and break the back of the petroleum powered car industry.

Force change.

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#39 2005-08-30 17:36:14

John Creighton
Member
From: Nova Scotia, Canada
Registered: 2001-09-04
Posts: 2,401
Website

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Just double the tax on automotive companies making petroleum using vehicles in favour of alternatives. declare petroleum for industry and government only, and break the back of the petroleum powered car industry.

Force change.

I'm with you.

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#40 2005-08-30 20:52:49

srmeaney
Member
From: 18 tiwi gdns rd, TIWI NT 0810
Registered: 2005-03-18
Posts: 976

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Japan declares that it is able to withstand oil at $100 dollars per barrel!
http://www.japantoday.com/e/?content=ne … &id=347697

All well and great. But can Asia free itself of Oil dependency? Can they convert the Cargo container ships to nuclear power and come out of this as an economic superpower that puts the USA and Europe down at the bottom with the other third world countries.

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#41 2005-08-30 20:58:28

John Creighton
Member
From: Nova Scotia, Canada
Registered: 2001-09-04
Posts: 2,401
Website

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Japan declares that it is able to withstand oil at $100 dollars per barrel!
http://www.japantoday.com/e/?content=ne … &id=347697

All well and great. But can Asia free itself of Oil dependency? Can they convert the Cargo container ships to nuclear power and come out of this as an economic superpower that puts the USA and Europe down at the bottom with the other third world countries.

That link was kind of devoid of information.

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#42 2005-08-30 21:16:30

srmeaney
Member
From: 18 tiwi gdns rd, TIWI NT 0810
Registered: 2005-03-18
Posts: 976

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

It comes from data in a report that will set you back substantially.

BY comparrison the USA declares itself capable of coping with $40 a barrel.\

http://www.nbc4.tv/money/3647838/detail.html

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#43 2005-08-31 00:04:50

John Creighton
Member
From: Nova Scotia, Canada
Registered: 2001-09-04
Posts: 2,401
Website

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

It comes from data in a report that will set you back substantially.

BY comparrison the USA declares itself capable of coping with $40 a barrel.\

http://www.nbc4.tv/money/3647838/detail.html

Well, if it is true it is awesome for Japan. However, until the rest of the world can do without middle eastern oil the rest of the world is going to have a tough time persuading   the middle eastern countries to do a better job dealing with there radical leaders. Money talks.

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#44 2005-08-31 04:00:04

Grypd
Member
From: Scotland, Europe
Registered: 2004-06-07
Posts: 1,872

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

It is due to Japan being able to move substantial quantities of food and necassary items by use of there highly developed train system. A very high economic price of oil will hurt in the plastics and chemicals industry but it should not have too much effect on transportation links.

The USA in particular relies on the cost of oil being cheap and cannot fall back on other transportation means like Japan. Western countries like the UK are in a bad situation too as they also are heavily dependant on road transport for delivery of goods. Though I do know that in the UK the train is making a big comeback especially when powered by electricity.

Still its going to be a sore one for a while till they can get oil production back into some form of order and this means Iraq and Venezuela too as they hold incredible capacity.


Chan eil mi aig a bheil ùidh ann an gleidheadh an status quo; Tha mi airson cur às e.

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#45 2005-08-31 04:09:47

srmeaney
Member
From: 18 tiwi gdns rd, TIWI NT 0810
Registered: 2005-03-18
Posts: 976

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Unfortunatly for certain nations, they (the big oil producers) have the ability to sell at a quantity below production levels and keep the price of oil high. The consequence is that they can suck the petroleum using nations dry over the next hundred years rather than worry about a client state such as the USA converting to alternate energy.

The number one private business of the future will be mass transit. Rather than a Taxi, a mini-bus. For ten dollars a seat, a ride from a fixed subburb site to an Urban centre location for ten passengers. Once each way per day=200 dollars a day.

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#46 2005-08-31 04:22:31

Grypd
Member
From: Scotland, Europe
Registered: 2004-06-07
Posts: 1,872

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

When oil prices start to rise then it starts to make the alternatives and the costs of implementation look a lot more attractive. The Oil cartels actually want to keep prices low as they know we have reached the point where technology actually has alternatives to there product and if they price too high they can be hoisted by there own petards.

It is not in the interest of OPEC to actually have the world leached of its diet of crude oil and like in the seventies they have put a lot of money into ensuring that our craving for oil is met and the alternative energy sources are just ignored as too expensive. But we may have reached the point of peak oil and this means there is going to be less and less around and with demand increasing the prices must rise and stay high no matter what they wish.

Now alternatives begin to look a lot more interesting again and the only one that has the capacity to keep the USA in the lifestyle it currently enjoys is that of a hydrogen economy. Now all they need is platinum, wonder where they can get it. Hmmmm roll


Chan eil mi aig a bheil ùidh ann an gleidheadh an status quo; Tha mi airson cur às e.

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#47 2005-08-31 04:40:40

srmeaney
Member
From: 18 tiwi gdns rd, TIWI NT 0810
Registered: 2005-03-18
Posts: 976

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

On the contrary Gryphd. They must match as close as possible the supply vs demand curve. Too little output puts the price up, and considering the alternatives are dependent on an oil based tool up period, the longer they can keep people buying oil even at just below the supply vs demand curve which the US has spent many decades distancing itself from by picking up saudi oil "subsidies"  the current price is just below the curve and as long as they allow the price of oil to match this new level of demand, local economies will be better for it, although still dependent on oil. That is how you prolong a resource without losing a market. Corporations will adapt rather than change because there is still too much profit in oil.

Instead of building a megatower in the urban city, Corporations will start buying outer suburbs and converting them into corporate residential zones which have all the technological advances needed for better families. Pop into the central office once a week to drop off and pick up. Microsoft tower spread across the suburbs.

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#48 2005-09-01 05:22:14

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 25,989

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

Well then how is this explained other than by price gouging. I went to the store last night and the cars fuel guage was on E with warning light on already for tank being low.

The local gulf fuel supplied cumberland farms store was selling gas at $3.07 a gallon much to my surprise since only the day or so before it was at $2.79.

This morning while driving thou the area I noticed other gulf supplied stations selling there's for only 2.79. 

News station report also indicated one station in the state selling at 3.29 a gallon. Talk about sticker shock....

The supply demand curves do not always follow the reality..

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#49 2005-09-01 05:51:27

Palomar
Member
From: USA
Registered: 2002-05-30
Posts: 9,734

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

*Hi SpaceNut:  Yeah, our gasoline prices have jumped an average of 30 cents per gallon too.  Currently we're hovering around $2.95 for a gallon of regular, though a few places (maybe 3) around town are still selling for $2.49 -- I presume they're going to keep whatever stock they currently have at that price (which won't last long).  My husband filled up our vehicles yesterday at one of the $2.49 places of course. 

I think my husband is finally accepting the situation.  He's got runarounditis -- go here, go there.  He's disabled and does do stuff around the house/yard while I'm working, but still...  neutral  The runarounditis is coming to a screeching halt.

Since he's doing so much better with VNS therapy for his seizures, it may be time to dust off the motorcycle and use it half the time.  Though I'm extremely reluctant; I don't like motorcycles (even with a helmet, which I always wear) and still don't like him using it either.

In El Paso gasoline jumped from an average of $2.48 per gallon Tuesday morning to $2.98 by late Tuesday afternoon.

Maybe we'll finally see some of those damned gas-hog Hummers and SUVs off the road.  That's one benefit to this I suppose.

--Cindy


We all know those Venusians: Doing their hair in shock waves, smoking electrical coronas, wearing Van Allen belts and resting their tiny elbows on a Geiger counter...

--John Sladek (The New Apocrypha)

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#50 2005-09-01 06:38:28

Cobra Commander
Member
From: The outskirts of Detroit.
Registered: 2002-04-09
Posts: 3,039

Re: Current Gasoline/Petrol Price$

$2.98 by work.

$3.29 near home.

If it hits $4.00 I'm taking my vacation time. Can't afford to drive in, need to be paid to stay home.  big_smile

Strangely though, I must confess to a certain degree of schadenfreude in the whole situation. So many people are taking it so badly, flipping out over it. I can't help but be amused at times.

Like the guy at work that drives a Ford Excursion and constantly bitches about Bush gouging uslol Comedy gold.

I'd get a motorcycle, but the potholes here are killer. Not even potholes really, but craters. I've started naming them.

At the very least, when the papers or tv news say we're at a "record price" for gas they are finally right. They've been saying it for months it seems but never adjust for inflation. Thanks to Katrina we are officially at record high prices in real dollars.


Build a man a fire and he's warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.

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