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#1 2005-01-31 06:16:19

SpaceNut
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From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 23,122

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid14]There have been in several of the human threads talk about what has been grown on the ISS. The list cantains snow peas fourth harvest and now will contain two more candidates.

ISS crewmembers to grow radish, lettuce

Experiments involving radish plants were carried out aboard the ISS several years ago, producing very small radishes[/quote:post_uid14]

What others have been tried?[/color:post_uid14]

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#2 2005-01-31 18:22:23

Commodore
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From: Upstate NY, USA
Registered: 2004-07-25
Posts: 1,021

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]Ah, shouldn't we be growing food to.. you know... eat it?[/color:post_uid0]


"Yes, I was going to give this astronaut selection my best shot, I was determined when the NASA proctologist looked up my ass, he would see pipes so dazzling he would ask the nurse to get his sunglasses."
---Shuttle Astronaut Mike Mullane

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#3 2005-01-31 21:56:55

SpaceNut
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From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 23,122

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid14]To do real experiments would not only be to actually eat what is produced but I would also hope that they would study pollination. Creation of a seed stock capable of early mars conditions before we get to teraforming the planet and for moon colonization.[/color:post_uid14]

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#4 2005-01-31 22:50:26

Euler
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From: Corvallis, OR
Registered: 2003-02-06
Posts: 922

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]You would have to devote a lot of resources to the project if you wanted the astronauts to be able to grow all of their own food.  That is why they are starting with small scale expiraments.[/color:post_uid0]

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#5 2005-01-31 23:35:36

Commodore
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From: Upstate NY, USA
Registered: 2004-07-25
Posts: 1,021

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]You would have to devote a lot of resources to the project if you wanted the astronauts to be able to grow all of their own food.  That is why they are starting with small scale expiraments.[/color:post_uid0][/quote:post_uid0]
[color=#000000:post_uid0]The biggest investment would be the volume. Water can largely be recycled. Minerals for a hydroponic system would probably not be needed in a quanity that would be terribly difficult to provide. Lighting units are power hungery, but we probably won't go far without a reactor.

Gravity, or the lack there of, might be an issue.[/color:post_uid0]


"Yes, I was going to give this astronaut selection my best shot, I was determined when the NASA proctologist looked up my ass, he would see pipes so dazzling he would ask the nurse to get his sunglasses."
---Shuttle Astronaut Mike Mullane

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#6 2005-02-05 01:12:25

Pulaskee
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From: US,Maine
Registered: 2005-02-05
Posts: 10

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]

Lighting units are power hungery, but we probably won't go far without a reactor.
[/quote:post_uid0]

Why not use sunlight? If it is to harmful, why not filter it with water or relflect it with darkented wood/metal?[/color:post_uid0]


I am an amateur at best.

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#7 2005-02-05 01:40:31

Rxke
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From: Belgium
Registered: 2003-11-03
Posts: 3,667

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]There is one problem with that, at least on the ISS. Since it is in LEO, the sun comes up and goes down every two hours or so... Which will probably not help the plant's sense of time, heehee, but it would also cause a very short start-stop-start again photosynthesis cycle...
Maybe (probably) that's not too bad, plants are quite errr... robust, but it might complicate experiments.

And the sunlight would have to come through either a winow or some kind of fiberoptics tthingy... How big should the window be? Windows in space are hard to do, they tend to leak around the seams, have to be quit thick to not just blow out... Expensive and heavy.

It would be interesting to do a small-scale experiment, for sure, even if it was just to see how good or bad it works on certain crops.[/color:post_uid0]

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#8 2005-02-05 01:48:38

Pulaskee
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Posts: 10

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]I forgot about LEO. i was thinking more of the trip to mars or other bodies. the window size would not need to be to big i would think becouse you could refelct the light? i know here on earth you could and i beleive that light acts just about the same up there. you could also use...um...that paint that glows in the dark. (last post to night.) to continue a dim lighting....hum...maby that could replace the lighting on the ISS. lol[/color:post_uid0]


I am an amateur at best.

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#9 2005-02-07 07:51:53

SpaceNut
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From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 23,122

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid14]Well on the moon there would be no above ground green house, it would be undergound with lighting being made artificially.

On mars above ground would do but the climate would need to have a power source to keep it warm even at night and probably supplimented for daylight sun levels at first.

How would one build an external green house for the ISS or the moon. Would that not require solar panels that are opaque or adjustable for the amount of sunlight blocking and a chamber just behind them for the plants to grow within.[/color:post_uid14]

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#10 2005-02-07 12:46:38

SpaceNut
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Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid14]This article list some of the hardware and experiments returning on the next soyuz.

[url=http://www.insidebayarea.com/dailyreview/localnews/ci_2558180] Danville astronaut packs items for return to Earth
Chiao and Russian prepare for Discovery's arrival at Space Station [/url]

Scientific research also high-lighted the week. Sharipov conducted three runs with the Russian Plasma-Crystal experiment,   while Chiao worked with two student experiments. "Plazmennyi Kristall" studies how plasma-dust crystals and fluids behave in microgravity when excited by radio waves. Chiao installed the EarthKAM experiment on a bracket in one of the Station's windows. Students at 160 middle schools around the world have snapped more than 900 Earth observation images by remote control.

Chiao also worked with the Space Experiment Module-Satchel project, which contains 11 sample vials, one each from schools around the United States. The sample vials are exposed to microgravity for three to six months.
[/quote:post_uid14][/color:post_uid14]

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#11 2005-02-07 17:58:36

Grypd
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From: Scotland, Europe
Registered: 2004-06-07
Posts: 1,868

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]Well on the moon there would be no above ground green house, it would be undergound with lighting being made artificially.

On mars above ground would do but the climate would need to have a power source to keep it warm even at night and probably supplimented for daylight sun levels at first.

How would one build an external green house for the ISS or the moon. Would that not require solar panels that are opaque or adjustable for the amount of sunlight blocking and a chamber just behind them for the plants to grow within.[/color:post_uid0][/quote:post_uid0]
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Simple dig a pit make a dome then cover it and then use mirrors. This provides radiation and micro meteoroid protection.

There are some very good designs for domes that with reflected light provide a reasonable supply of light to the plants while protecting from the very hazardous to plants ultravoilet radiation.[/color:post_uid0]


Chan eil mi aig a bheil ùidh ann an gleidheadh an status quo; Tha mi airson cur às e.

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#12 2005-02-07 21:30:48

SpaceNut
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Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid14]But with the trouble some down mass to the red planet being a must for survival, what can we expect to take from these vary design you have mentioned above. Are they light weight and easy to setup or time consuming to make use of?[/color:post_uid14]

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#13 2005-02-10 20:39:58

SpaceNut
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From: New Hampshire
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Posts: 23,122

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid14]Thou the main topic is plant I also wanted to keep track of all food oriented items within this thread. Snails are a possible item and the SNAILS TO GO ON SPACE MISSION will be Russia's Biomedical Research Institute attempt to study organs of balance.

Other ISS-based scientific experiments planned for this spring will involve tritons, crawfish and planaria worms. Planaria, for instance, are to take part in a study of the regeneration process. It is common knowledge that if a worm is cut into pieces, each will develop into an individual within days. At least, this is how it works on Earth. But whether this is the case under zero-gravity, as well, yet remains to be seen.
[/quote:post_uid14][/color:post_uid14]

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#14 2005-02-22 13:01:29

Rakial
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From: Toronto, Canada
Registered: 2004-02-29
Posts: 18

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid9]

Thou the main topic is plant I also wanted to keep track of all food oriented items within this thread[/quote:post_uid9]

I read somewhere that low-pressure makes plants act as if they're drying out.

As well don’t you need all kinds of microorganisms to help soil along to break components for plants to absorb? In the totally sterile environment like Mars there are no organisms of any kind (well, that’s still to be determined)[/color:post_uid9]

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#15 2005-03-19 08:21:08

srmeaney
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From: 18 tiwi gdns rd, TIWI NT 0810
Registered: 2005-03-18
Posts: 976

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]What about Sugarcane? A couple of Agricultural modules devoted to waste water disposal and CO2 scrubbing would give the tourists something to do.[/color:post_uid0]

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#16 2005-03-19 08:30:39

srmeaney
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From: 18 tiwi gdns rd, TIWI NT 0810
Registered: 2005-03-18
Posts: 976

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]Yes, plants do act as if they are drying out. The pores that take in Nutrients close up because the 'door swings inward' if internal pressure is greater than the external one, it takes more energy from the plant to breathe so it hibernates. That is why they will have to maintain the Ag modules as high pressure zones with a higher methane and CO2 percentage environment.[/color:post_uid0]

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#17 2005-04-04 05:18:38

srmeaney
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From: 18 tiwi gdns rd, TIWI NT 0810
Registered: 2005-03-18
Posts: 976

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]Plants in clear plastic cylinders without soil. Try one of the Orchid species such as the AloeVera which will clump and entangle. Basicly a simple nutrient spray allows biological waste to be turned into plant food.

Genetic engineering of the food supply might want to look at transfering the genes of the Orchid varieties into regular plants so they can be grown pretty much in the Air. That would allow for improved yields on space stations.[/color:post_uid0]

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#18 2005-04-04 08:43:54

dicktice
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From: Nova Scotia, Canada
Registered: 2002-11-01
Posts: 1,764

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]That's interesting. Would you care to describe how such an orchid plant would develop from germination through maturity, in zero-gee?[/color:post_uid0]

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#19 2005-04-05 02:16:37

srmeaney
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From: 18 tiwi gdns rd, TIWI NT 0810
Registered: 2005-03-18
Posts: 976

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]You dont. You take up the root stock and grow from there.[/color:post_uid0]

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#20 2005-04-20 05:58:44

SpaceNut
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From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 23,122

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]I wish that some sort of itinuary was posted for thes but will just need to view it find out what will be on the agenda.

[url=http://commerce.senate.gov/hearings/witnesslist.cfm?id=1472] International Space Station Research
Science and Space Hearing[/url]

Webcast: Click here to view a live webcast of this hearing.

Description: The Senate Commerce Committee's Science and Space Subcommittee has scheduled a hearing on International Space Station Research Benefits for Wednesday, April 20, 2005, at 10:00 a.m. in room 253 of the Russell Building. Senator Hutchison will chair this subcommittee hearing.[/color:post_uid0]

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#21 2005-04-26 09:16:01

SpaceNut
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From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 23,122

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]Now on the note of the ISS, the latest crew has arrived and the latter has departed but what did we gain for the last 6 plus month stay from this crew.
They stuggled though a food shortage and had lots of bumps along the way by the oxygen system but they did make it back ok.
They had plant and animal experiments that were returned from the station, hopefully with much success these experiments were run and to which the question that only the station could answer having forfilled this goal. But it was done on a very expensive dime.

Female CRICKETS, sprouted BEANS AND ITALIAN GRAPEVINE RETURN TO EARTH WITH COSMONAUTS

All of these had been brought to the station 10 days ago by an Italian, Roberto Vittori, who had successfully carried out the ENEIDE scientific program on board the station.

"During his ten-day flight he studied the specific behavior of insects. These were Italian crickets which were used to test the effects of weightlessness on them," a Mission spokesman told RIA Novosti.

"As part of the VINO experiment, he tested the ability of grapevine grafts from Italy's Tuscany plantations to survive and grow in space flight conditions," the source told the agency.

Besides, Vittori studied the effect of zero gravity and hostile space factors on cell cultures of the rat thyroid.

The Italian's task was to assess the possibility of growing in space fresh and ready-to-use foods which are expected to be obtained from vegetable crop sprouts, specifically the beans.
[/quote:post_uid0][/color:post_uid0]

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#22 2005-05-02 08:31:52

srmeaney
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From: 18 tiwi gdns rd, TIWI NT 0810
Registered: 2005-03-18
Posts: 976

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]How about pineapples in space. The "orchid" cutting from which it grows doesnt necessarily require growing media. as long as it gets the nutrients in a spray, and some level of circulation, the fruit should grow well. Granted it takes several years to approach fruiting maturity.
As Snails are the only real source of meat-protien worth mass producing in space for space colonies one would have thought there would have been experiments on it.

Little consideration has been given to the production of food in zero-g for space production and supply. Most of it seems to be done to prove the theories of university graduates rather than a test of long term mass production.[/color:post_uid0]

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#23 2005-05-02 11:14:14

SpaceNut
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From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 23,122

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]The Snails In Spaaaaaaaace! can be found here while you bring up another possible research plant.

I guess the chances of growing them in a simi greenhouse on mars would be that most will be much like potatoes, carrots ect while very few at first will be like apples or other fruit. But the possiblity of a pineapple that I have heard nothing of from the ISS.

Does anyone have a list of those that have been grown on the ISS or of the future species that may be tried?[/color:post_uid0]

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#24 2005-07-17 16:43:38

Mace
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From: California, USA
Registered: 2005-07-17
Posts: 38

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

[color=#000000:post_uid0]Why can't the entire planting/harvesting system be automated with controlled lighting, carbon dioxide content, etc.? Then the process can be perfected in a close environment here on Earth and the whole thing could be shiped off to Mars or any other place.[/color:post_uid0]

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#25 2007-05-31 11:53:38

Yang Liwei Rocket
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Registered: 2004-03-03
Posts: 993

Re: Iss Plant growth experiments - planning the future in 0g

There is a big challenge here, how to be keeping space food equipment small, light and easy to maintain during a two-year Mars trip and without costs going out of control


'first steps are not for cheap, think about it...
did China build a great Wall in a day ?' ( Y L R newmars forum member )

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