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#1 2002-07-05 22:39:19

scottgbeach
Banned
Registered: 2002-07-05
Posts: 3

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

Draft Constitution of the Provisional Government of Mars

(Revised 7-5-02: SGB)

Section 1. This Constitution shall become effective when it has been adopted by the Mars Society and when the United Nations declares that Mars shall be governed and settled in accordance with this Constitution.

Section 2. Before the establishment of two permanent human settlements on Mars, this Constitution may be amended or repealed during any annual meeting of the Mars Society. After the establishment of two permanent human settlements on Mars, this Constitution may be amended or repealed in accordance with laws adopted pursuant to this Constitution.

Section 3. Any person may advocate the amendment or repeal of this Constitution. Any number of people may associate for the purpose of advocating the amendment or repeal of this Constitution. Any person may advocate the repeal of this Constitution and the adoption of two or more sets of laws which would divide the Provisional Government of Mars into two or more political entities. Any number of people may associate for the purpose of advocating the repeal of this Constitution and the adoption of two or more sets of laws which would divide the Government into two or more political entities.

Section 4. A statute is a law adopted pursuant to this Constitution. Before the establishment of two permanent human settlements on Mars, statutes may be adopted, amended, or repealed during any annual meeting of the Mars Society. After the establishment of two permanent human settlements on Mars, statutes may be adopted, amended, or repealed in accordance with statutes adopted by a Parliament composed of equal numbers of representatives from each settlement.

Section 5. An ordinance is a law adopted pursuant to a Settlement Charter. The ordinances adopted pursuant to a Settlement Charter shall be subordinate to the Constitution and statutes of the Provisional Government of Mars.

Section 6. The Government may issue Settlement Charters. Twenty or more people may jointly apply for a Settlement Charter. Such application shall be submitted in writing to the Terrestrial Embassy of this Government or to any terrestrial Consulate. Such application shall be accompanied by the payment of an application processing fee of one ounce of gold. Each Settlement Charter shall authorize the applicants to construct a Center Monument on the surface of Mars and to adopt ordinances for the governance of an area ten kilometers in radius, as measured from the Center Monument, and to establish a permanent settlement within that area. A Center Monument may be constructed at any location on the surface of Mars but shall not be constructed within twenty-one kilometers of any other Center Monument and shall not be constructed at any location that will infringe the terms of a lease issued pursuant to Section 8 of this Constitution.

Section 7. The Government may establish and maintain a Terrestrial Embassy and one or more terrestrial Consulates.

Section 8. The Government may establish and maintain a Mars Development Bank. The Bank may lease portions of Mars to people, companies, and states for periods of up to 50 martian years. At least 80 percent of the revenues derived from such leases shall be used to fund the establishment and maintenance of stations and settlements authorized pursuant to Sections 6 and 9 of this Constitution. A lease may prohibit or restrict the establishment of settlements in the leased area. The Bank may also coin money for use on Mars and at the Terrestrial Embassy and Consulates and at stations and settlements established pursuant to Section 9 of this Constitution. This law shall not be construed as prohibiting a settlement from adopting ordinances that provide for the coining of money for use within the settlement. This law shall not be construed as prohibiting a settlement from adopting ordinances that provide for the use of another settlement's money or that provide for the use of a terrestrial nation's money.

Section 9. The Government may construct a Center Monument on the continent of Antarctica and exercise sovereignty over an area ten kilometers in radius, as measured from the Center Monument, and may establish and maintain one or more prototype martian stations and settlements in that area. That Center Monument may be constructed at any location on Antarctica but shall not be constructed at a location that would interfere with the research program of any other state.

Section 10. The flag of this Government shall consist of three vertical stripes. The stripe at the hoist end of the flag shall be red, the central stripe shall be green, and the final stripe shall be blue. The hoist or flag width shall be two-thirds of the fly or flag length and the width of each stripe shall be one-third of the flag length.

Section 11. Weapons shall not be transported to Mars. Parliament may adopt statutes that regulate the manufacture and possession of weapons.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Draft Resolution of the Mars Society

Resolved, that the Mars Society does hereby adopt the foregoing Constitution of the Provisional Government of Mars.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Draft Resolution of the General Assembly of the United Nations

Whereas, the Mars Society was founded to promote the exploration and settlement of Mars; and

Whereas, the Mars Society has adopted a Constitution of the Provisional Government of Mars; and

Whereas, that Constitution will facilitate the orderly and peaceful settlement of Mars; now, therefore, be it

Resolved, That the General Assembly of the United Nations does hereby declare that Mars shall be governed and settled in accordance with the Constitution of the Provisional Government of Mars.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Draft Ordinances for the Voters of Port Zubrin

Whereas, The Mars Society adopted the Constitution of the Provisional Government of Mars on ; and

Whereas, The General Assembly of the United Nations declared on , 20; and

Whereas, That Settlement Charter provides that the people who applied for the Charter may construct a Center Monument on the surface of Mars and may adopt ordinances for the governance of an area ten kilometers in radius, as measured from the Center Monument, and may establish a permanent settlement within that area; now, therefore,

We, the undersigned, do hereby adopt the following ordinances:

Section 1. We shall be collectively known as the Voters of Port Zubrin and theseordinances shall be known as the Ordinances of the Voters of Port Zubrin.

Section 2. These ordinances shall become effective when one of us, or our duly appointed agent, constructs a Center Monument on Mars.

Section 3. The area around our Center Monument, out to a distance of ten kilometers, shall be known as Port Zubrin.

Section 4. These ordinances shall govern our activities on Mars and the activities of all persons in Port Zubrin.

Section 5. We and other people may, subject to the provisions of these ordinances, construct and own homes and businesses in Port Zubrin.

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#2 2002-10-31 10:38:49

Ares
Member
Registered: 2002-06-12
Posts: 12
Website

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

I've read your essay, and I find it interesting and
thought provoking.  However, my views differ somewhat.

Most people, yourself included, seem to think that
colonization of Mars, and the legitimization of any
Martian government or force of law must originate with
an existing governmental body, such as the UN.  This
is the reverse of how power truly flows. 

The powers of government is derived from the consent
of the governed.  This is true no matter how far down
the line you go (i.e. with national as well as
international governments.) 

Humanity does not need to wait (indeed IMO it can't
afford to wait) for the UN (or any government) to
authorize or legitimize a Mars colony in order to
settle Mars.  It will be legitimized by its very
existence by virtue of the people who inhabit it.

My vision for the ARES Concordant is this:  as a sort
of colonial government in exile.  Its stated purpose
is to colonize Mars -- no more, no less. 

One of the tasks necessary to achieving this goal, is
to agree upon a document (which I have notionally
called the Ares Concordant) which would delineate the
structure of any colonial government.

Another task is raising capital.  Obviously this is a
fairly daunting task, but not unsurmountable.  One
method I've devised for raising capital is through the
sale of "land certificates."  These certificated would
entitle the holder to a certain amount of land upon
the establishment of a colony on Mars by the ARES
Concordant. 

People do not need an existing government entity (such
as the UN) to legitimize their claim to land on Mars.
In the case of the American frontier, land was largely
owned by virtue of the fact that people lived on it. 
they didn't own the land because the US government
told them they did.  In fact the US government did not
exist in the area until a certain number of people
lived there, and then applied for statehood.  Of
course, there are exceptions to the rule (such as the
Oklahoma territory.)

In closing, existing national governments need not be
involved in the colonization of Mars.  All that is
needed is for individual citizens to decide that it
should be done.  Once humans are on the face of Mars,
they will form their own government. 

This is the pattern which settlement usually takes --
people decide to go, and then decide how to govern
themselves once they get there.

I would like to hear your take on my argument.  I know
the project is ambitious, but bold steps must be taken
where space is concerned.  The governments of the
world have largely failed us in this respect.


A non-profit effort to establish  The Ares Concordant
a permanent, human colony     info@aresconcordant.org
on Mars.                                 [url=http://www.aresconcordant.org]www.aresconcordant.org[/url]

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#3 2002-10-31 17:14:09

Cobra Commander
Member
From: The outskirts of Detroit.
Registered: 2002-04-09
Posts: 3,039

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

All these "Martian Constitutions", while interesting at times, are kind of a pointless exercise. Mars colonies will need some form of backing on Earth just to get the funding, whether it be government backing or corporate funding. In either case, the colonists will have large parts of the constitution written for them as a condition of that funding. No one is going to fund a Mars colony just for the hell of it; they'll want some return and a fair amount of control.
Eventually the colony will throw off the old and devise a government of their own, in which case any Terran-written constitution would be meaningless. Current planning for Martian government should probably be limited to basic principles rather than actually writing out a legal framework.


Build a man a fire and he's warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.

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#4 2002-11-01 09:13:51

turbo
Banned
From: Jacksonville, Florida
Registered: 2002-08-01
Posts: 76

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

I have to agree with Cobra Commander on this one.  I keep seeing an "Outland" type of environment for the first decades of any Mars settlement.  A "company town" established to support some industry (like mining) with an infrastructure to make sure the production continues.

At the very least, a small experimental station like those in Antarctica.  A international mix of scientists and support staff taking ice core samples, weather observations, etc.  Managed just like ISS is now.  Maybe the development of the company towns will grow from this tiny start.

Until any settlement or network of settlements is self-sustaining, true self-government is only a dream. The early years will follow some treaty among earth nations and later the company policies of the contractors that build and support the settlements.  There may be some degree of labor unions as the settlements become more numerous and a pool of specialists evolves. 

The timeclock will proceed any constitution on Mars.  That's fine with me, so long as we GET THERE and then STAY.

turbo

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#5 2002-11-01 16:00:51

Scott G. Beach
Banned
Registered: 2002-07-08
Posts: 288

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

A "company town" established to support some industry (like mining) with an infrastructure to make sure the production continues.

Turbo:

Mars will only have "company towns" if we allow that sort of development pattern.  We have the option of promoting the development of resident-controlled towns where people make their own laws and can own their own homes and businesses.

Scott


"Analysis, whether economic or other, never yields more that a statement about the tendencies present in an observable pattern."  Joseph A. Schumpeter; Capitalism, Socialism and Democracy, 1942

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#6 2002-11-01 19:06:27

Scott G. Beach
Banned
Registered: 2002-07-08
Posts: 288

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

Current planning for Martian government should probably be limited to basic principles rather than actually writing out a legal framework.

Cobra Commander:

I agree that, "Current planning for Martian government should probably be limited to basic principles rather than actually writing out a legal framework."  I favor a Martian constitution that (1) minimizes the possibility of intersettlement warfare and that (2) gives settlers the power to establish governance systems of their own design. 

Scott


"Analysis, whether economic or other, never yields more that a statement about the tendencies present in an observable pattern."  Joseph A. Schumpeter; Capitalism, Socialism and Democracy, 1942

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#7 2002-11-02 09:01:53

turbo
Banned
From: Jacksonville, Florida
Registered: 2002-08-01
Posts: 76

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

I'd like nothing better than to see Mars develop with independent settlers.  Right now, only governments and large corporations have the ability to fund such missions, and from the looks of things Russia may not be among them. 

A small project like Translife may be possible with a surplus ICBM booster, but that's LEO, and from where would the thing be launched?  I know of no privately owned facility.  An abandoned oil rig in the Gulf of Mexico, or maybe off the Brazilian coast may work, but funding is still the major hurdle.

I have no doubts CANADA and other nations are able to do it all with less money, but for right now the ledger just doesn't support a mission to Mars without government and large corporate assistance.

Maybe a taikonaut needs to walk on the Moon to trigger a Space Race to Mars.  I think our favorite red planet is willing to wait a little longer.

turbo

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#8 2002-11-02 20:04:21

Aetius
Member
From: New England USA
Registered: 2002-01-20
Posts: 173

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

With NASA's current plans, Mars will have to wait at least several more decades before any Americans set foot there. That's not to say that other nations couldn't get there first. It's just that NASA's blueprint for the future seems to be to pour money into more space stations at the Lagrangian points after the ISS is completed. I know that what NASA wants (ideally) is a spaceport for orbital construction, but my concern is that the (no pun intended) astronomical costs of endless redesigns and delays will leave no money for anything but a few nice-looking but underfunded and basically useless space stations. Well, not totally useless. Maybe they'll be able to do on-orbit servicing of the new space telescope.

Hopefully "The Case For Mars" has been translated into Mandarin Chinese.

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#9 2002-11-03 10:38:57

turbo
Banned
From: Jacksonville, Florida
Registered: 2002-08-01
Posts: 76

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

The way the NASA budget comes and goes, I doubt anything other than ISS will be completed.  Some rework and some small boosters, and Mir could be orbiting Mars right now.  I remember when the decision came down to let Skylab die.

Maybe it's just me, but wasn't a golden opportunity missed by not retrieving that Saturn V third stage?  Up for decades with no Van Allen belt for protection, I bet that "spacejunk" could speak volumes about micrometeroids and long term radiation exposure of metals.  A "lessons learned" primer on how to build interplanetary craft.

Who was it before that mentioned salvaging the inactive nuke satellites and all?  Skylab was a converted third stage, now there's one already up there we can track.  Launch costs courtesy of Apollo.

The offer still stands on piloting Columbia to Cydonia!

If the Dutch East India Company worked the way NASA does, they'd never have gotten past the Azores.

Dear NASA, cojones are required for space.  Dear Congress, 100% success is not possible (this is a government project after all) so let the scientists and engineers experiment.
It's called "intestinal fortitude", and with it we have set foot on the Moon.  If none is left, then I expect a whopping tax return, I know a spaceport in need of repairs.

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#10 2002-12-06 09:15:17

Ian
Banned
Registered: 2002-01-08
Posts: 236

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

Section 11. Weapons shall not be transported to Mars. Parliament may adopt statutes that regulate the manufacture and possession of weapons.

How will governments of Mars stop people from smuggling weapons in?

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#11 2002-12-06 10:18:09

Cobra Commander
Member
From: The outskirts of Detroit.
Registered: 2002-04-09
Posts: 3,039

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

Section 11. Weapons shall not be transported to Mars. Parliament may adopt statutes that regulate the manufacture and possession of weapons.

How will governments of Mars stop people from smuggling weapons in?

The real question is how can a Martian government stop anyone who wants weapons from making them. Who needs a firearm when a cylinder of compressed oxygen and a pipe will work quite nicely for putting a hole through somebody.


Build a man a fire and he's warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.

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#12 2002-12-06 14:02:14

soph
Member
Registered: 2002-11-24
Posts: 1,492

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

it shouldnt be tied to one organization- i.e. the mars society, unless they are the first to build and send people to the planet.

there are no laws against people privately sending outer space missions, so i still think the american private sector will be the first to send people to mars.

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#13 2002-12-09 14:27:39

clark
Member
Registered: 2001-09-20
Posts: 6,362

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

there are no laws against people privately sending outer space missions, so i still think the american private sector will be the first to send people to mars.

The FAA may disagree with you here. While technically there are no laws against priavetly funded space missions, there are laws against LAUNCHING priavetly funded space missions- there are regulations and federal oversight/management of all companies and business's that are looking to launch anything uinto space (from US).

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#14 2002-12-09 14:30:25

soph
Member
Registered: 2002-11-24
Posts: 1,492

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

if a mars-capable mission were assembled, i think the faa and nasa would be too politically pressured that they had to allow the launch to go through.

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#15 2002-12-09 14:35:13

clark
Member
Registered: 2001-09-20
Posts: 6,362

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

Fair enough.

Now, what is the possibility of a consortium of priavte business and individuals investing 10-20 years, and 10-50 billion dollars for a Mars capable mission?

If regulations don't get ya, reality will.

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#16 2002-12-09 15:25:29

soph
Member
Registered: 2002-11-24
Posts: 1,492

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

actually pretty high.  considering that bill gates lost near a billion dollars on the xbox, a game system, whats to say nobody, let alone a group of people, will be willing to risk that much for a potentially very lucrative investment?

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#17 2002-12-09 15:29:31

clark
Member
Registered: 2001-09-20
Posts: 6,362

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

actually pretty high.

I think you are.  tongue (a friendly jibe)

There is no "lucrative" investment involved with sending people to Mars. Not unless the laws of physics are changed, or some radically new technology is introduced that chanegs the economics.

Most billionares got rich by being savy with their money, not stupid.

And it is doubtful that there is enough support to create a large publicly funded intitive.

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#18 2002-12-09 16:48:50

soph
Member
Registered: 2002-11-24
Posts: 1,492

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

there is plenty to be made.  the people that build it will have it made, just like the people who go.

on the surface- books, speeches...accross the world.

after that, sell the hardware, the blueprints...if they patented their work, they might be able to swing out advertisements, selling space (how much would a lab company spend to have exclusive rights to equipment on a mars mission?)...

they could cover the cost by having NASA spending an amount per astronaut it wanted to send (say $ 10 million apiece?), to cover at least part of the launch cost (theyd still save money on paying for shuttle launches).  they could also claim some landfor themselves (perhaps a regulatory comittee could be established to set aside how much), and parcel it out for later investors...

they could send launches of people, having them play full cost plus say 10%, for their portion of the flight cost, who wanted to go (again, regulated "immigration").

im not talking about lucrative in terms of metals, or what have you...but in already existing ways of making money.

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#19 2003-01-07 12:18:39

colonist
Member
Registered: 2002-03-23
Posts: 24

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

There woud be a lot of way to proffit from a Mars mission. If the ISPP system is used it could be recharged periodicaly and expanded to provide a lot of chemcals for the base. Insturments could be tended by base personel for outside concerns that "rent" base resources for various experiments. Such experiments need not be strictly scientific (how much would certain groups pay for clode-up photos of the cydonia region?) to be undertaken at a proffit.

Some data aquired on a day to day basis can be sold to interested parties over the net. Weather, soil composition, chemical production efficiency and prety much ANYTHING that can be reduced to data and sent back. Another possibility is to send daily "personal logs" to be sold to interested parties (there could be a graduate thesis on long term semi-isolation effects made from such logs).

For the REAL big bucks, excess life suport could be leased by organisations wishing to send personell to Mars. They send the people with basic suplies to our colony and we keep them alive for the agreed upon time in addition to suplying the fuel for the return trip. In return, a portion of the cargo capacity of the lander is used to bring suplies to the colony and any hardware not needed for the return trip (unloading gantry, refueling hoses, landing legs, descent chutes, etc.) are made to be easily recovered by the base crew. In this manner the bases expansion could be financed by our own resources.

just a few thoughts.

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#20 2003-01-16 07:48:23

Ares
Member
Registered: 2002-06-12
Posts: 12
Website

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

Now, what is the possibility of a consortium of priavte business and individuals investing 10-20 years, and 10-50 billion dollars for a Mars capable mission?

Who's to say it has to be business. 

there is plenty to be made.  the people that build it will have it made, just like the people who go.

on the surface- books, speeches...accross the world.

I agree.  The way to make money on Mars is to sell a product with no launch costs ...  Information.

Now, who's up for making SURVIVOR: Mars.  cool


A non-profit effort to establish  The Ares Concordant
a permanent, human colony     info@aresconcordant.org
on Mars.                                 [url=http://www.aresconcordant.org]www.aresconcordant.org[/url]

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#21 2003-04-13 22:15:15

Charno
Member
From: Chicago
Registered: 2003-04-13
Posts: 20

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

Constitutions are pointless. They're just pieces of paper that will be broken later. Notice how the US government doesnt follow its supposed "guiding document" at all.

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#22 2003-04-14 04:33:47

soph
Member
Registered: 2002-11-24
Posts: 1,492

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

Oh dear.  Anti-Americanism in an irrelevant thread.

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#23 2003-04-14 15:45:04

Charno
Member
From: Chicago
Registered: 2003-04-13
Posts: 20

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

Oh dear.  Anti-Americanism in an irrelevant thread.

The post wasn't really anti-american, though I am very proud to be anti-american.. since american seems to be defined as a supporter of police state militarism.

Since you couldnt get beyond the shock value of my post and see what i was trying to convey, i'll explain a bit more. History shows that constitutions have not been preserved. America is an excellent example of this. There's gun control, a standing army, and wars without an actual declaration of war by congress. These all violate the constitution.

How a government acts it is not defined by a constitution, just like how the Church acts isnt necessarily defined by the teachings of Jesus as it is ideally. Its determined by economic, political, and social factors not a piece of paper.

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#24 2003-04-14 15:50:28

clark
Member
Registered: 2001-09-20
Posts: 6,362

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

No, The US constution is not just a poece of paper like you paint it to be, and it is not a straight-jacket to prevent action in times of need, like you intimate in your posts.

It is open to interpretation, changable, flexible, and circular.

Even if it is as you say, that only demonstrates the character of the Untied States since we still are free. you don't need a piece of anything to prove that.

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#25 2003-04-14 19:14:19

Charno
Member
From: Chicago
Registered: 2003-04-13
Posts: 20

Re: Draft Laws for Mars - Laws for the Peaceful Settlement of Mars

No, The US constution is not just a poece of paper like you paint it to be, and it is not a straight-jacket to prevent action in times of need, like you intimate in your posts.

It is open to interpretation, changable, flexible, and circular.

Even if it is as you say, that only demonstrates the character of the Untied States since we still are free. you don't need a piece of anything to prove that.

Hardly free by the criteria of those who wrote the constitution. They revolted against 1% of the taxes we have today.

And yes, I've heard the "living document" stuff before. But whats the point of the document if its so "alive" that there are laws that flatly contradict what it says? I guess, like the bible for the catholics, its all open to "interpretation".

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