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#1 2002-12-17 17:00:32

Echus_Chasma
Member
From: Auckland, New Zealand
Registered: 2002-12-15
Posts: 190
Website

Re: Ozone hole and Global Warming

What do you guys think?

I personally think it might just be part of a natural cycle that we have sped up with greenhouse gas emissions.
I don't want to try and use scientific info to back that up cos I'll probably get shot down. :-P


[url]http://kevan.org/brain.cgi?Echus[/url]

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#2 2002-12-17 17:58:09

AltToWar
Member
Registered: 2002-09-28
Posts: 304

Re: Ozone hole and Global Warming

Is global warming a bad thing?

Yes.  millions will have to relocate.  As polar ice caps melt the ocean levels will rise.  Manhattan will be gone, as will most of Great Britan.  Drastic changes in weather will cause havoc with agraculture.

Is global warming happening?

Permafrost is melting, ice caps are receding, the average world tempature has risen 1 digree.

This all could be just a temporarily fluctuation, but every year that goes by it seems more likely.

Are we causing global warming?

We emit a shitload of CO2.  As we continue to grow in population and prosperity, we will continue to put out more CO2.

China is on the verge of a massive industrial revolution.  If china feeds that revolution on coal and oil, expect the man made CO2 output to increase 2 or 3 times over.

CO2 is a greenhouse gas.

Is CO2 the cause of global warming? or would the world tempature have increased anyhow?

We cannot know for sure.  Our shitload of CO2 emissions are certianly not helping, though.




Global warming seems to be happening.  Lowing our CO2 emissions might not stop the problem.  Odds are that it will slow it down, though.  It would not hurt the global warming situation, that's for sure.


If you have built castles in the air, your work need not be lost; that is where they should be. Now put the foundations under them. -Henry David Thoreau

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#3 2002-12-17 18:15:05

soph
Member
Registered: 2002-11-24
Posts: 1,492

Re: Ozone hole and Global Warming

fuel cell engines would help tremendously.  china's three gorges dam will provide immsense amounts of power--i dont think theyll need too much fossil fuel power. 

nuclear power would help reduce emissions too.  fission would be useful, isolated from people, because despite the claims by some thats its completely safe, and others that theyre death traps, i think that they are very important, but we should treat them with care.  once fusion comes, we have our situation set.

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#4 2002-12-17 22:55:58

Josh Cryer
Moderator
Registered: 2001-09-29
Posts: 3,830

Re: Ozone hole and Global Warming

We only have to look at Venus to know that global warming is occuring. In fact, I think Venus was the first thing scientists saw when they considered what could happen with greenhouse gasses. But even if we don't look at Venus, we can see that this so called life cycle is largely myth. Looking at cores on the north and south pole, and trying to determine how much ice had melted in any given summer over a period of a few thousand years, there is no indication that we are in a regular cycle. In fact, Earth's north risidual polar cap, the one that exists in the summer, will be fully melted by 2015-2020 if current estimates pan out. That's right, ice that hasn't melted in thouands of years is due to simply melt away (it's already melted quite a ways already, at a few meters a year if I recall correctly).

Though I personally don't think it's as great a threat as some environmentalists claim, I certainly do see it as a threat. Current computer models suggest that the ocean could rise as much as 15 feet (or was it meters? It was a lot, if I recall correctly). Such a rise in water could prove economically, as well as ecologically, and agriculturally, catastrophic; it's an end of the world as we know it type of deal. Ports would no longer be useable. Sea property would simply cease existing. Temperatures would rise, and the tropics would become desert. Animals would die. Plants would die. We would become venus.

I think the cheapest, most economically viable solution is biofuels. We can actually continue to use fossil fuels, there's nothing wrong with carbon in the environment, it's only not so good in gaseous form. Plants have shown to grow more each year, so I think old Mother Nature can take care of herself. The key is simply not going so far as to cause an insulating effect. When the north cap finally melts, there will be more thermal energy hitting the planet (ice reflects thermal energy back into space, as light). This would in turn heat the oceans more, and cause a cascade effect. The south polar caps would melt. The ocean would become warmer. And the cycle would continue.

We'll see what happens when China begins to really start consuming in the coming years. I'm optimistic, though.


Some useful links while MER are active. [url=http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/home/index.html]Offical site[/url] [url=http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/MM_NTV_Web.html]NASA TV[/url] [url=http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/mer2004/]JPL MER2004[/url] [url=http://www.spaceflightnow.com/mars/mera/statustextonly.html]Text feed[/url]
--------
The amount of solar radiation reaching the surface of the earth totals some 3.9 million exajoules a year.

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#5 2002-12-18 23:42:41

Echus_Chasma
Member
From: Auckland, New Zealand
Registered: 2002-12-15
Posts: 190
Website

Re: Ozone hole and Global Warming

Hmm, that would suck. I can't stand temperatures over 25oC.


[url]http://kevan.org/brain.cgi?Echus[/url]

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#6 2002-12-26 16:12:56

Auqakah
Member
From: England
Registered: 2002-07-13
Posts: 175

Re: Ozone hole and Global Warming

The worst effect of all of a dramatic rise in sea levels - such as 7 meters over the next fifty to a hundred years, which is the figure which seems popular at the moment - would be the loss of Earth's beaches. That means the complete destruction of the tourist industry; which happens to support the aerospace industry. That means the loss of a great many things; probably including the worlds space programs.


Ex Astra, Scienta

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#7 2002-12-26 19:47:35

oker56
Banned
Registered: 2002-06-30
Posts: 85

Re: Ozone hole and Global Warming

George Bush Jr say?  "Oh, we'll just adjust . . ."

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#8 2002-12-26 19:48:57

oker56
Banned
Registered: 2002-06-30
Posts: 85

Re: Ozone hole and Global Warming

. . . and then procede to allow loggers to cut down even more trees!  I love this guy! Not!  And he supports nuclear propulsion!

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