Froggy's

DonPanic · 2005-10-01 14:34:39

LO

French Mirages took part in a "mission of support to fire", during an operation carried out against Talibans to the south-east of ze country.
French Mirages took part Saturday 1er in a "mission of support to fire", at ze time of an operation was carried out against Talibans at ze south-east of Afghanistan, announced ze French ministry of Defense in an official statement.
"Saturdays October 1, two air patrols, made up of two Mirage FICR and two Mirage 2000 D, carried out a mission of support to fire in ze south-east of Afghanistan to ze profit of the coalition (military international) "Enduring Freedom" (immutable Freedom), indicates zis official statement.
"In connection with ze troops on ze ground, Mirage FICR and ze Mirage 2000 of ze detachment 'Serpentaire' were engaged within ze framework of an operation against ze Talibans", specifies ze text of the Staff of ze armies.
Since August 2005, ze ministry for Defense recalls, France deployed, at ze time of ze legislative elections in Afghanistan, an air detachment composed of three Mirage FICR and three Mirage 2000, based with Douchanbe (Tadjikistan). Two tankers KC 135 FR are also based in Manas in Kirghizistan.
Zis device is engaged in favour of ze international Force of assistance to ze safety of NATO in Afghanistan (Isaf) and of ze operation "Immutable Freedom", still specifies ze ministry. "It is suitable for carry out missions of air presence and of alarm in flight, photographic survey, support fire and in-flight refueling", it adds.
France is present in Afghanistan wiz more zan 600 soldiers within Isaf.
Zis intervention occurs whereas ze Afghan president, Hamid Karzaï, will pay Monday at Wednesday his first official visit in France, and its first displacement abroad since ze parliamentary elections of September 18, whose results will be known only on October 22.
Mr. Karzaï will be received Monday at 11H00 in ze Elysee Palace by Jacques Chirac.

:mrgreen:

Are Froggys waking up :shock: ?

SpaceNut · 2005-10-01 20:15:35

I am puzzled as well since this is not the normal French (as well as others) stance towards war like actions.

DonPanic · 2005-10-03 05:57:11

LO

I am puzzled as well since this is not the normal French (as well as others) stance towards war like actions.

Don't you think that, France has peace corp troops in former Yugoslavia, Ivory Coast, Haïti, Afghanistan, has survey warships in the Oman Gulf.
No troops in Iraq, because french secret services were aware of no WMD and that Saddam removal would bring much more problems than his regime, as now proved obvious.

This action is also retaliations at talibans: http://www.iht.com/articles/2005/09/18/ … oldier.php

We struggle against algerian islamoterrorists :
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20050927/wl … ststargets

While closely cooperating with US at war on terrorists
http://english.people.com.cn/200507/05/ … 94085.html

And this 10/3 Monday morning, four other suspected GIA terrorists were sent in custody.

Commodore · 2005-10-03 13:59:57

That translator is terrible.

But I don't see the problem. French planes took part in Operation Infinate Justice, in Afganistan, as part of NATO.

Good job. I suppose we have to thank the French for that.

Although its not clear that they expended any munitions.

srmeaney · 2005-10-05 08:58:35

A History of the Knights Templars

Founded in 12th century as a military order devoted to providing safe conduct to Pilgrims. All their wealth and income is sourced from donations from pilgrims. They were Mercanaries with religious charter. They were provided with immunity from excommunication and had the right to recruit excommunicated Knights (who would need the blessing of a Bishop). They have taken Vows of Poverty, Chastity, and Obedience.

1127-Expanded membership across europe.
1128-A council was held to sanction the order.
1153-Templar Knights across Europe are granted land from assorted Kings.
1163-Laws requiring absolute obedience to the Grand Master are established.
They are allowed to establish their own churches and are exempt from tithes and non Templar specific Papal dictates. Disputes between Parish Priests and the Templars are decided by the Pope in their favour.
1186/87-Templars begin provoking numerous fights and battles between Christians and Saracens disrupting the new alliance between Saladin and the Count of Tripoli. In one provoked fight involving seven thousand Saracen, numerous brother Hospitaliers are slaughtered and their Grand Masteris forced to flee.
1189-Templars purchase Cyprus for one hundred thousand gold besants.
1190/91-Famine strikes.
1192-Templars aid Richard by directing him into Egypt as a back door into the Holy land.
1217-Construction of the Templar Fortress (Castle Pilgrim) at Acre begins.
1218-Castle Pilgrim is the stronghold from which the fifth Crusade is directed.
1228-Conflict between Templars and the Hospitalier/Tuetonic Orders escalates into open violence.
1239-Templars were until this point dependent on income from Lands, estates , donations to their churches, payments from Pilgrims. After this point numerous temples are used as money markets and banks which rather than stockpile the gold, lend it out. Because of their vow of Poverty charging interest is illegal, but to get around this a rent is charged which exceeds the true rent by the amount of interest.
Popes and kings begin depositing their great fortunes with these financial houses of the Templars. The income of the Templars can now be measured in hundreds of thousands from rent on towns, to rent on money. They are also involved in high volume money changing across the Traderoutes Between Europe and Asia from which they make vast profit.
1244-Completion of Templar Fortress Safed near Gaza.
Mongols Sweep across the Holyland destroying Saracen Cities and pushing the Frankish kings out. The Franks sell their Lands to the Templars and retreat to Europe.
1291-Templars pull back to Cyprus and This becomes their Central Citadel of Operations. It is here that a great library is built.
1303-The Templars are involved in a Quarrel with the Pope. Eventualy the Pope's replacement restores and advances their right to acquire land.
1305-Numerous Kings and Princes, greedy of the Wealth of the Templars, begin a conspiracy to take it all. The Templars are charged with Heresy and Immoral acts (Banking and Associating with Non Christians).
1307-Templars are denounced to the Inquisition, hundreds of Knights are arrested and tortured. Kings were now openly conspiring to take "Church Assets" for themselves.
By the end of the Year even the Pope (desiring to control Templar wealth) orders the arrest of All Templars.
1308-Templars across all of Europe are tortured and executed for their secrets and wealth.
1312- Membership peaks with fifteen thousand Templar Knights. At this time the slaughter of the Knights Templars by the Vatican Inquisition and European Kings had reached the rate of one Templar Knight every hour of every day of every year for the final two years of executions.
1314-The Templar Trials having lasted over six years end in the execution of their Grand Master.

Paris and Rome had become slaughter houses of Chaos and Carnage. Execution after Execution turned these Cities from Beacons of Civilization into the heart of the two most evil civilizations on Earth all because each their leaders (the King of France and the Pope) so desired the emense wealth of the Knights Templars. Wagons piled high with corpses were leaving these cities every day that the bodies might be burned in great funeral fires or dumped in mass graves.

At its very peak The Templars had something in the magnitude of a million gold coin in resource and currency as an annual income at a time of Bankruptcy and economic collapse amongst European Kingdoms.

After their destruction, International Trade and commerce Collapses, Turks expand into Southern Europe, Brutal criminal punishments become the norm for the next several hundred years, and Witch persecutions become commonplace. Europe Falls into the Dark Ages and does not re-emerge for another two hundred years.

DonPanic · 2005-10-18 05:52:43

LO
Ze second A-380 Airbus prototype took air zis morning.
Wizz an all froggy logic, it will be numbered "04"
Tests will be carried on very cold taking off and landing conditions.

DonPanic · 2005-10-18 05:55:07

That translator is terrible.

DonPanic · 2005-10-30 03:59:20

LO
-First A380 flight to Frankfurt airport to study airport equipments fitted to allow 550 people transit.

-India and South Korea to enter in ITER research tokamak consortium.

-Froggies side USA in sanctions threats at Syria for Rafic Hariri former lebanese prime murder plot.

DonPanic · 2005-11-08 05:14:32

LO
If you want to know more about riots in France, ask questions.
Just notice that up to now, police didn't have had any gunshot at rioters.

Palomar · 2005-11-08 05:59:35

LO
If you want to know more about riots in France, ask questions.

*There's lots of things I could say (especially what the world's reaction would be if this were occurring in America [gloating, "you asked for it," etc]).

Just notice that up to now, police didn't have had any gunshot at rioters.

What I have noticed is that now it might be spreading into Germany (Berlin) and Belgium (Brussels). I'd feared it might; such violence is infectious it seems.

So the French gov't has called for a curfew, beginning last evening. After 10 or 11 nights of rioting. That seems like "too little, too late."

I feel sorry for the good, decent, law-abiding French people caught up in this malefic mayhem. It angered me to read about ambulance personnel being attacked (stones were thrown at them) and the ambulance itself set on fire when they were trying to take an ill person from their home to the hospital.

It seems to me, DonPanic, that the French gov't has been trying for a long time to adopt a morally superior stance to America. This rioting surely highlights your own nation's social ills. Unfortunately a lot of good, decent people are being victimized in the meanwhile.

French economy is lagging, from what I hear there aren't a lot of jobs available, and then there's the annual 1-month holiday from work (how do you manage that anyway?). It seems this was going to boil to the surface sooner or later.

I really do hope -- for your guys' sake -- the situation is soon brought under control and it doesn't spread further.

--Cindy

clark · 2005-11-08 06:24:42

All together now, "Let them eat cake!"

Am I the only one who thought France was better when Frenchmen only argued outside the cafe on whether the "table" is?

Cheer up, France is bound to win, they are fighting themselves. Think about it.

Okay, I never claimed I was polite or well mannered. Ve va la Republic!

Palomar · 2005-11-08 08:47:42

State of emergency declared in France

*But the violence/rioting does seem, thankfully, to be decreasing. Last night not as violent as the night before: Less towns seeing rioting activities, less cars torched. Unfortunately late last week the rioting seemed to decrease and the next day it virtually exploded; hopefully that won't happen again.

The social issues remain and will need to be dealt with, but hopefully the rioting and violence will soon end. I can't imagine what the good and decent folks of France have been going through... ::shakes head::

--Cindy

noosfractal · 2005-11-08 12:26:11

If you want to know more about riots in France, ask questions.

Will Le Pen win the next election because of them?
_

DonPanic · 2005-11-08 13:00:48

So the French gov't has called for a curfew, beginning last evening. After 10 or 11 nights of rioting. That seems like "too little, too late."

There is a heavy responsbility of our Security minister, Mr Sarkosy which said that he would "karcherize" suburbs. (Unlike in USA, towncenters are unhabited by rich peoples, and poor peoples are pushed away from centers)
He sanctionned police officers trying to thame teens having sports with them, and decided to set a repressive policy, displacing policemen which knew which teens were good or bad guys.
"Karcher cleaning" hurted teens pride. Many demonstrated or rioted saying "we aren't cockroaches to be that treated".
But don't mistake, in spite of some racist behaviour, french police roughness would seem very very soft compared with US police brutality at black citizens.

It seems to me, DonPanic, that the French gov't has been trying for a long time to adopt a morally superior stance to America. This rioting surely highlights your own nation's social ills. Unfortunately a lot of good, decent people are being victimized in the meanwhile.

Propaganda... as well as USA supposed to be the country of Freedom. (Maybe sometimes, US women will no more be free to abort)

French economy is lagging, from what I hear there aren't a lot of jobs available, and then there's the annual 1-month holiday from work (how do you manage that anyway?). It seems this was going to boil to the surface sooner or later.

You should know that Frenchies never eat at work, so chewing time isn't accounted in working hours , that french working hours productivity is among the worlds' highest. French workers have cut hollydays time in shorter periods, one whole week each three monthes so that with more relaxing time, that increases working time productivity. But frenchies' annual working time is equal to average european annual working time.
Our country suffers high unemployment rate as well as inadequation of working talents with job proposals. We score a lot of litterature and social sciences high graduates which refuse to work in building industry, computer industry, which lack workers and have to import immigrant workers.
Tradition is to have a centralized power which take all decisions, organise Science and Research so that private enterprises have weak Rn'D departments.

French economy isn't so bad, for instance Renault, after having taken control of Nissan and brought Nissan back to benefits, might try to take control of GM.
French enterprises have high benefit ratios, and the unemployment rate is very slowly decreasing, but largely not enough.
Problem is our heavy bureaucracy, almost heavier than the former red states one, lack of banks boldness which do not fund and help emerging enterprises, so that creating an enterprise is a very tough job in France.

DonPanic · 2005-11-08 13:04:32

If you want to know more about riots in France, ask questions.
Will Le Pen win the next election because of them?
_

Mr Sarkosy tough politics are bound for attracting Le Pen's electors.
Anyways, Mr le Pen is hatred by 75% of the froggies, as a "soft neonazi", so that he will never acces to power.

Earthfirst · 2005-11-08 13:04:41

Paris is burning, where is the military? Have the leaders of the roits been rounded up and public beheaded yet, The police are beening shot at. In America the police would break out the machine guns and put a lot of hurt on them. Nothing like been shot at to get the idea that its wrong to kill people, burn cars, schools, and churchs. If we burned down a islamic hodo center they would call us racistist, but when they do it, its call social justice? France used to be a strong nation but liberism has weaken it to the point were an islamic revelution has started. If the islamist get control of frace they will have nukes. The US will not stand for this and will yet again have too liberate france from a forign invader. It was France who stop the islamist from invading western Europe in the medevil time. Now they up and let them in to the point were they can take over.

DonPanic · 2005-11-08 13:23:41

Paris is burning, where is the military? Have the leaders of the roits been rounded up and public beheaded yet, The police are beening shot at. In America the police would break out the machine guns and get put a lot of hurt on them. Nothing like been shot at to get the idea that its wrong to kill people, burn cars, schools, and churchs. If we burned down a islamic hodo center they would call us racistist, but when they do it, its call social justice? France used to be a strong nation but liberism has weaken it to the point were an islamic revelution has started. If the islamist get control of frace they will have nukes. The US will not stand for this and will yet again have too liberate france from a forign invader. It was France who stop the islamist from invading western Europe. Now they up and let them in to the point were they can take over.

Here, we don't send army at kids ! Most of them are teens.
Problem is that this insurgengy is spontaneous and has no real leaders.
We're strong enough to reset law and order without killing people and consider that gun shooting at kids is the deepest barbary !
And we don't need US to crush islamists in here, try and offer your violent method to the Brits, or try to protect USA against further islamists attacks.
We have defeated an islamist attack try on Paris by plane hijacking, NOT the US !
So, Mr Earthfirst, we don't need your lesson.

DonPanic · 2005-11-08 13:53:46

All together now, "Let them eat cake!"
Am I the only one who thought France was better when Frenchmen only argued outside the cafe on whether the "table" is?
Cheer up, France is bound to win, they are fighting themselves. Think about it.
Okay, I never claimed I was polite or well mannered. Ve va la Republic!

In my own Paris district, with high ethnic mixity, not the least trouble, not a single fire. Tourists are still visiting without any danger.
We are laughing when seeing US press reports. Fires are impressive, but in fact, there are very few violent struggles.
In cities suburbs, for whole France, there are just some thousands crazy guys which set fire to what they can when they see there no cops or no citizen watch around.
Citizen watch patrols are being organized, to help police.
When insurging kids' parents will be condemned for their children behaviour and will lock them home, peace and order will be brought back soon.

Palomar · 2005-11-08 14:02:36

We are laughing when seeing US press reports. Fires are impressive, but in fact, there are very few violent struggles.

*I don't know which US press reports you are seeing nor from which US media outlets, but what I have seen (quite a lot of coverage) generally "only" shows car fires, firemen trying to extinguish the car fires with water hoses, debris littering the streets, etc.

I've not seen physical scuffles, violent struggles, etc.

One exception showed a couple of youths running about, throwing things...that's it.

The reports don't seem exaggerated to me.

But c'mon, DonPanic. Nearly 1500 cars torched and over 300 towns seeing arsonist behavior isn't anything to brush off...regardless of where it is occurring.

And 1 elderly man died as a result of youths beating him severely.

But American news sources aren't exaggerating the situation, IMO.

--Cindy

clark · 2005-11-08 14:16:27

On average, 80 cars are set on fire in France every day. What's a few more?

12 days of riots, and what, two people dead? A tragedy, sure, but given the length and supposed extent of the situation, what has really happened that demonstrates things are out of control?

In America, we have a black out, and we have multiple murders, looting, and arson- all in a very brief amount of time, ten times worse then what we have seen in france over the course of a week.

So what I am really saying is, even French rioters are lazy.

DonPanic · 2005-11-08 14:21:18

LO Palomar
The very tittle "Paris is burning" seen on some sites or news papers or magazines front page is caricatural.

Most of the 5000 burned cars will be paid back by insurances. What is really dramatic is the number of burned schools, to be rebuild, one factory and some shops fire dammaged which have to lock out about one hundred employees.

What compared with a single tornado wastes when reaching a small US town ?

So what I am really saying is, even French rioters are lazy.

very coward, too :oops:

Palomar · 2005-11-08 14:28:44

LO Palomar
What compared with a single tornado wastes when reaching a small US town ?

*A tornado is an act of nature. The riots in France are volitional acts by emotional humans. There's a difference.

DonPanic, using the US as a comparison (in whatever regard) or pointing out perceived flaws in US journalism aren't helping your nation's social ills.

--Cindy

Grypd · 2005-11-08 14:31:22

I have been following the riots and have obviously been very interested in what caused them.

The reason for the start was the deaths of two ethnic minority youths in a powerstation. Locals claim they where in there to hide from police but the police state they where not even looking for them. This was the trigger.

The route cause was though the facts that even though France has a very strong political consensus that Race and religion should not be a factor in anything in practice the ethnic minorities tend to gather in certain areas, in short ghetto's. These people in these districts are less able to get jobs though they still recieve state welfare which for a country France's is very good. Unemployment is 2 to 3 times higher though in these areas from the general 10% that is nationwide. So what happens is that there is an ethnic minority which has no work and has too much time on there hands concentrated in areas. There is also the general minority wide hatred of the police.

This is what is causing these disturbances and they are communicating across Blogs but this is more a chance to boast of there successes and to goad each other to do more damage.

Palomar · 2005-11-08 14:37:39

and they are communicating across Blogs but this is more a chance to boast of there successes and to goad each other to do more damage.

*Not surprising. Likely by the 3rd night it was no longer even remotely connected (in the rioters' minds) to the alleged initial provocation but rather was simply hooligans and unruly troublemaking types taking advantage and "going for it."

Which is another reason stuff like this needs to be nipped in the bud -- before the garden-variety troublemakers and/or emotionally disturbed people jump on the bandwagon and join in...

DonPanic · 2005-11-08 14:41:09

DonPanic, using the US as a comparison (in whatever regard) or pointing out perceived flaws in US journalism aren't helping your nation's social ills.

Yes, dear, in France, I struggle day after day against usual racism, against hate at Arab country originated peoples, I go and teach Science for free or very small wages in these poor districts, I can't do much more personnaly, and, as you can see, I'm not agressively critic at USA, except for Bush, war at Iraq, but now majority of US citizens are critic too, and I'm strongly against "Intelligent Design" as a non scientifical theory.

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