Colonizing mars one way trip vs short stay - would you go to stay?

srmeaney · 2005-03-19 23:08:24

Do you have what it takes to be a colonist? Or are you just a tourist?

Martian Republic · 2005-03-20 09:47:40

Do you have what it takes to be a colonist? Or are you just a tourist?

We gotten into this discussion before. That we need people that will spend ten to twenty years on Mars to get the process going. Even if you could find those people, you could or would find a lot of people wanting out of this project after about five years or so. Second, you would still have to find a way to supply this Mars colony until it big enough and has enough agro-industrial mining capacity to stand on it own and that would take awhile for that happen. Beside that, we don't currently have the infrastructure to do it anyway and it would take maybe twenty years to build that infrastructure to do it. The best you can hope for, for Mars is a foot and flag number for a few month or possibly for a year or two with the present technology and infrastructure we have today. The problem is, that we can't just send people out there and dump them off on Mars and setup a colony. We also have to be able to live off the land on Mars and to do that we need to invest in large infrastructural projects to utilize those resources. Just make a list of items that we would need and it will become obvious real quick.

Like we need a habitat, Mars Rover, Mars Shuttle, Green House, Mining equipment for water, helium, hydrogen, Iron, etc., etc., then refining equipment and manufacturing equipment, etc., etc. We either send the equipment to live off the land or we have to send the resources for that colony from the Earth.

Mars Direct is out, because it too light weight and even the NASA Semi-Direct is too light weight too. To get anywhere close to being able to get enough resources to make a viable colony possible would have to exclude eight or more heavy rockets with a large payload on it and that would be just for starters to get the colony going. Then every launch window to Mars for the next ten to twenty years would need another three or four heavy rockets to re-supply and add capacity to your Martian colony to attempt to reach a somewhat self-sustaining colony.

Larry,

Martin_Tristar · 2005-03-20 19:28:16

srmeaney and
Martian Republic:

I can see the point of MR about the infrastructure required to maintain a mars outpost serviced from earth space. We need to send (tourist) class missions first while we build a large outpost taskforce of ships to bring in one load or two loads the requirements for 1 or 2 outposts that will enventually turned into the cities of Mars Colonization.

The first stage of making the space a viable industrial environment requires a viable industrial sector between earth - orbit - and moon be productive, through space personnel movement into orbit increasing size of space stations and platforms in orbit and bases on the moon, new products from space, and large contracts like satellite manufacturing and recycling. The we can move with some certainity onwards to mars and beyond because we have the required human infrastructure in earth space.

Mars Explorer (Tourist) Missions could be up to 5 in different parts of the Planet surveying the best drop points for cargo and outpost personnel. Then the Outpost Transporters would turn up and drop cargo from orbit to the surface locations including multiple habitats, industrial modules, argo modules and general supplies for each outpost. The personnel would arrive via RLVs ( reusable landing vehicles ) in groups s of 4-6 humans with 4 to 5 RLVs per outpost and making sure that human transporters have up to 8-10 personnel max. per vessel to share and limit the risk to the overall mission.

Martian Republic · 2005-03-20 20:22:14

srmeaney and
Martian Republic:
I can see the point of MR about the infrastructure required to maintain a mars outpost serviced from earth space. We need to send (tourist) class missions first while we build a large outpost taskforce of ships to bring in one load or two loads the requirements for 1 or 2 outposts that will enventually turned into the cities of Mars Colonization.
The first stage of making the space a viable industrial environment requires a viable industrial sector between earth - orbit - and moon be productive, through space personnel movement into orbit increasing size of space stations and platforms in orbit and bases on the moon, new products from space, and large contracts like satellite manufacturing and recycling. The we can move with some certainity onwards to mars and beyond because we have the required human infrastructure in earth space.

Mars Explorer (Tourist) Missions could be up to 5 in different parts of the Planet surveying the best drop points for cargo and outpost personnel. Then the Outpost Transporters would turn up and drop cargo from orbit to the surface locations including multiple habitats, industrial modules, argo modules and general supplies for each outpost. The personnel would arrive via RLVs ( reusable landing vehicles ) in groups s of 4-6 humans with 4 to 5 RLVs per outpost and making sure that human transporters have up to 8-10 personnel max. per vessel to share and limit the risk to the overall mission.

Martin_Tristar, with a launch window of 26 month to get to Mars and be able to get back to earth with present technologies, there will be "NO TOURIST INDUSTRY TO MARS"! You can get that idea out of your head right now! We will either have a Glorified Apollo Mission to Mars or we will have a long term government project to colonize Mars and the Apollo project was also a government project. In either case, it will be a government project that does it.

Larry,

dicktice · 2005-03-20 21:17:24

I've had a fantasy over the years, of a Mars expedition that finds it impossible to return, which stimulates a huge effort to launch a cost-is-no-object rescue Mission, which succeeds, and finds the new "Martians" not only have survived, but never intended to return.

Michael Bloxham · 2005-03-20 22:04:08

Well you've just crossed yourself off the list for potential crew, haven't you?

Martin_Tristar · 2005-03-20 23:37:45

MR,

I mean to send a small crew for only a "lunar landing style " mission land then return is a "TOURIST" mission to me and many other people. Outposts are permanently manned and expand positions on the surface of Mars.

quasar777 · 2005-03-22 00:47:06

actually i think 1way may be the only way to Mars w/ our present tech. & i think 1way wouldn`t hafta mean stuck on Mars 4ever, what about a Lunar flyby from Mars?. when people will be that far away from mission control, things like mutinies will happen.

Shaun Barrett · 2005-03-22 01:35:40

Martian Republic's right - this has been discussed before at some length. But SRM couldn't know that without scouring the extensive library of posts at new Mars.

Let's not forget the physiological effects of a stay on Mars. As it is, the favoured Conjunction Mission will have humans on the surface for 500 days.
I think any astronauts left on the surface for "a few years", will be there for good anyhow - unable to return to Earth because the gravity would cripple or even kill them.

SpaceNut · 2005-03-22 08:24:56

There are many ongoing studies on the effects of the duration, gravity and the body at this time. One is the WISE by ESA and the Russian's are also doing a long duration enclosure experiment as well. Lets not forget the Mars society research facilities as well.

So the problem is more that Nasa is not part of any of these so they will have to do it all for themselves just to be happy with the results.

srmeaney · 2005-03-22 08:36:24

All right, Say the Galactic Commonwealth was shot down in flames because one or more nations decided They want the opportunity to take control of Mars. The UN decides to introduce Mars as a UN Colony for the "good of all Earthlings" and uses fifty million billion per annum to fund heavy lift projects, Terraforming, Food production contracts to bring third world countries into modern agriculture techniques. Basicly the Galactic Commonwealth ruled by the Security Council. What Next?

Cobra Commander · 2005-03-22 09:03:43

The UN decides to introduce Mars as a UN Colony for the "good of all Earthlings" and uses fifty million billion per annum to fund heavy lift projects, Terraforming, Food production contracts to bring third world countries into modern agriculture techniques. Basicly the Galactic Commonwealth ruled by the Security Council. What Next?

Widespread corruption and mismanagement ensues, people die and the entire debacle crashes in on itself. China and the United States pick up the pieces, the EU trailing behind.

SpaceNut · 2005-03-22 11:46:17

Russia is celebrating the ten-year anniversary of the longest space mission in history.

According to Belakovsky, Polyakov'sflight was just about as long as the projected Martian mission. His return to Earth is particularly important in this context.
"Polyakov, who spent 15 months in orbit, unfailingly followed all sorts of recommendations that had been suggested by doctors and experts and he quickly adapted to the force of gravity on Earth," Belkovsky said.
According to Belakovsky, the results of Polyakov's research and experiments are now being used to train cosmonauts and will also make it possible to train future space crews. The research has also found practical application in general medicine.

With that said when is the next trial on duration for the ISS to start to conclude if the prevention activities would stop the bodies natural decay of abilities due to 0G

New Mars Forums

Announcement

#1 2005-03-19 23:08:24

Re: Colonizing mars one way trip vs short stay - would you go to stay?

#2 2005-03-20 09:47:40

Re: Colonizing mars one way trip vs short stay - would you go to stay?

#3 2005-03-20 19:28:16

Re: Colonizing mars one way trip vs short stay - would you go to stay?

#4 2005-03-20 20:22:14

Re: Colonizing mars one way trip vs short stay - would you go to stay?

#5 2005-03-20 21:17:24

Re: Colonizing mars one way trip vs short stay - would you go to stay?

#6 2005-03-20 22:04:08

Re: Colonizing mars one way trip vs short stay - would you go to stay?

#7 2005-03-20 23:37:45

Re: Colonizing mars one way trip vs short stay - would you go to stay?

#8 2005-03-22 00:47:06

Re: Colonizing mars one way trip vs short stay - would you go to stay?

#9 2005-03-22 01:35:40

Re: Colonizing mars one way trip vs short stay - would you go to stay?

#10 2005-03-22 08:24:56

Re: Colonizing mars one way trip vs short stay - would you go to stay?

#11 2005-03-22 08:36:24

Re: Colonizing mars one way trip vs short stay - would you go to stay?

#12 2005-03-22 09:03:43

Re: Colonizing mars one way trip vs short stay - would you go to stay?

#13 2005-03-22 11:46:17

Re: Colonizing mars one way trip vs short stay - would you go to stay?

Board footer