North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

Palomar · 2004-12-10 09:12:11

*If the Santa Claus tradition is carried over to Mars, what will we tell the kids?

--Cindy :;):

Cobra Commander · 2004-12-10 09:34:09

*If the Santa Claus tradition is carried over to Mars, what will we tell the kids?

Lies upon lies!

Prepare them for Martian democracy.

Palomar · 2004-12-10 10:35:26

*You raise a good point, Cobra...one I forgot in my "Spirit of the Holiday" enthusiasm. Even though it didn't make me distrust my parents later nor ruin my life when I found out there was no Santa Claus, you have a point (even though I know you were simply responding with your own unique sense of humor). I should have rephrased it in the context of letting the kids know this is pretend -- a fun fantasy. I don't have children myself (yet), so you made me rethink how to handle this.

Certainly children shouldn't be deceived in any way.

Now back to the fun fantasy...

--Cindy

GraemeSkinner · 2004-12-10 14:31:57

Claim a time difference between Earth/Mars that requires christmas to be on another day (or have a Martian calendar) then Santa can get round Mars on a different day - give him a day off before he travels in his space going sleigh.

Graeme

GraemeSkinner · 2004-12-16 03:34:29

The first Martian snowman?

We should have sent Spirit and Opportunity some decorations since they'll be spending Christmas working.

Graeme

In my defence the image was not what I'd planned doing this morning but, lack of sleep (been working nights), a picture of Mars from Spirit, and 3D software, its never a good combination.

Palomar · 2004-12-16 08:41:35

The first Martian snowman?
We should have sent Spirit and Opportunity some decorations since they'll be spending Christmas working.
Graeme
In my defence the image was not what I'd planned doing this morning but, lack of sleep (been working nights), a picture of Mars from Spirit, and 3D software, its never a good combination.

*Nice! Yep...no decorations for the MERs as they weren't expected to live this long. :-\ We should have sent them along with a blue broom, red scarf and black tophat with a bright (green/red) berry bow for your snowman. And a big orange carrot for the nose. I should have offered to ship along a quart of my homemade eggnog for each MER, too.

--Cindy

Leifur · 2004-12-16 10:19:43

As living close to the Earths North pole, I can vouch that Saint Niculaus (Santa Claus) does not live here anywhere close by. But there is newer mentioned wich North Pole, maybe he lives on Mars North Pole We should maybe contact him asking about the secreet of challenging gravity and travelling in sky and even space.

C M Edwards · 2004-12-16 15:28:08

We should maybe contact him asking about the secreet of challenging gravity and travelling in sky and even space.

Hmm... That might provide an interesting motivation for inquisitive children.

Santa Claus could help promote childhood learning for Martian Children.

"You've been such a bright boy this year, Leif! Look what Santa gave you for making A's in geology!"

ERRORIST · 2004-12-16 19:37:27

I think Santa will hitch a ride in the carbon nano tube pipeline to space and will be across the universe in an instant to give gifts to all the different life forms that dwell within this wonderfull universe that God created. It is written in Genisis 2.

"THUS THE HEAVANS AND THE EARTH WERE FINISHED AND ALL THE HOST OF THEM".

John Creighton · 2004-12-20 23:00:25

Mars orbits the sun every 1.8808 years. Say mars had two christmas's every Martian year then the christmas holliday will only be on the same day about every 10 years.

http://www.nineplanets.org/data.html]ht … /data.html

GraemeSkinner · 2004-12-20 23:06:58

Mars orbits the sun every 1.8808 years. Say mars had two christmas's every Martian year then the christmas holliday will only be on the same day about every 10 years.
http://www.nineplanets.org/data.html]ht … /data.html

Start a new martian calendar and time system the day we land the first crew that will live on Mars, and set the date for Christmas to be the closest to its winter solstice (from the location the crew land on Mars).

Graeme

clark · 2004-12-22 09:09:30

Santa in a bright red space suit!

Even through the thin air, his jolly Ho-Ho-Ho rings like christmas bells!

He loves a plate of soy cookies and soy milk.

Christmas Eve is the only day of the year where the outside airlock is left open so Santa can get into the hab.

Everyone of course, on Mars, knows the story of How the Martians saved Christmas! Maybe I will tell you some time.

GraemeSkinner · 2004-12-22 10:33:14

Everyone of course, on Mars, knows the story of How the Martians saved Christmas! Maybe I will tell you some time.

Tell it by Christmas Eve then, just to get us in the christmas mood.

Graeme

Trebuchet · 2004-12-31 23:41:45

Holidays on Mars (or elsewhere) is an interesting problem I was thinking about before. It gets much more messy if you consider that we probably won't stop at Mars in the long run... oh well.

I suppose that, given the transit times between planets, multiple calendars will be used. However, that's really a discussion for a different thread.

My proposal is as follows: whatever the Martian calendar is, "rewind" the calendar back 2004 earth years and see what Martian day December 25th of year 1 was. Then just use that day as "Martian Christmas", once every Martian year. Same with other anniversaries. Actually, I'd zero (or rather, since we never had a 'year zero' on earth, 'one') all years on all worlds to the same standard, with the first day of the first year corresponding to January 1, 1 AD

RobS · 2005-01-01 08:13:47

I'm sorry I didn't see this thread earlier; I would have put my Santa Claus on Mars story here, rather than in my novel thread!

I suppose we could use whatever day December 25, 1 A.D. fell on, in whatever Martian calendar we use. I like Zubrin's calendar proposal; it's simple and scientific (it uses the twelve constellations of the zodiac for months and begins the year with the northern spring equinox). But I suspect for a long time an "Areo-Gregorian" calendar will have at least some use. People will want to know when Dec. 25 falls on Earth because they have to order Christmas presents over the web for terrestrial relatives. They'll still have to pay U.S. income taxes on April 15th of every year if they are US citizens. They'll still have to videomail their mother on her birthday. Etc. Since the Martian sol is slightly longer than the terrestrial day, there are 355 sols per terrestrial year instead of 365 days. If one drops the 31st of each month that has one, that eliminates a day from the Martian calendar every January, March, May, July, August, October, and December. If one then eliminated the 30th as well from April and either September or November, one would then have a Martian calendar that stayed in pace with the terrestrial calendar. Perhaps one would also have to drop the 29th of December every few years as well, if one needed to drop a day every now and then. April 15th would be the same within hours. December 25 would be the same. You'd always be celebrating Christmas at the same time as everyone on Earth.

The date December 25 is not biblical; it was chosen for Jesus's birth in the 200s or 300s to help Christianity compete against Mithraism, because Mithras's birth was very popular. It was on the winter solstice, which with the slight changes in the calendar fell on Dec. 25. The biblical text is not reliable or helpful in determining the date of Christ's birth. If the information that it occurred during the reign of Herod the Great is correct--and it likely is--then he had to have been born before 4 B.C., because that's the year Herod died. Most scholars place his birth as some time in 4 B.C. The information that he was born in Bethlehem because his parents were sent there for a census is definitely incorrect, because the Romans conducted censuses for tax purposes and wanted to count people where they LIVED, not where they were born. Jesus is called "the Nazarene" because that's where he was from; that's almost certainly where he was born. Bethlehem was chosen by Christian tradition because of Old Testament references to the place that then became prophecies.

I know something about this subject because in reallife I am a professor of religious studies, among other things! (I have a Master's in Planetary Geology and am a life-long science fiction fan, but I don't earn a living that way.)

-- RobS

Ian Flint · 2005-01-01 21:41:50

A little late but here's my theory...

Earth's Santa has evolved to a high degree and can therefore give presents to the higher life forms like people.

Mars' Santa has followed a Martian evolutionary course...
We call him Archea-Santa. As you can guess he only visits the native bacteria. Perhaps he will adopt the Earthly bacteria that has been transported there, but humans, he just doesn't know you exist!

So settlers, you'll either have to wait eons until he evolves, or you can try to splice some of his genes into one of your less fortunate buddies and see what happens. :;):

el scorcho · 2005-01-03 17:16:20

Mars' Santa has followed a Martian evolutionary course...
We call him Archea-Santa. As you can guess he only visits the native bacteria. Perhaps he will adopt the Earthly bacteria that has been transported there, but humans, he just doesn't know you exist!

Hahaha!!

Maybe this inquiry belongs in a new thread, but I was wondering how the tradition of Christmas trees will evolve in the Martian frontier? There will obviously be no conifers at first (at least not outside greenhouses), and further in the future, annual decimation of plant life may irk would-be terraformers. And I would imagine that artificial trees will be fairly low on the supply list for a colony ship with a finite amount of cargo room that will be needed for personal keepsakes and vital life support systems.

So what will the colonists do? Will they find some way around it, or abandon the tree symbol altogether?

*Ponders*...

Trebuchet · 2005-01-03 20:10:23

The seeds don't weigh much. You *grow* your own tree, and let it continue to grow over the next few years. Eventually, you grow a new one and use the other for the wood (very valuable) and pine tar (for martian baseball bats... and probably a hundred better uses)

Leifur · 2005-01-04 03:18:06

When the first colonists will settle down on their transport, shortly before midnight local planetary time and open the hatch and step into the martian soil for first time, human history on Mars will begin, and the time will be 00:00 on day 0 (or the first day), martian year 0. As the martian solar day (whats its name in english) is slightly longer than earths, the hour will either have a few more minutes each, or the minutes slightly more seconds, or each second taking slightly longer time, or as Kim Stanley Robinsson suggests in RED, GREEN, BLUE Mars, having nearly 40 minutes pass between 00:00 and 00:01 each day (or was it 23:59 to 00:00?). Than could account for the difference between expected landing time and real landing time.

But although a new calender will be erected on Mars, people will still use the calenders of their respected cultures and religions also,thus Christmas will be on different times of the martian year, and on different seasons, similarly as Ramadan, holy monthe of Muslims and the last days of it, Eid, is here on earth as the Islamic calender is not scientifically correct. But that does not bother them, many muslim countries have two kinds of calenders, the western (Christian) calender as an official one, and the muslim calender as religious one, and that is how it will be on Mars.

Official Martian calender, and then various calenders for and within various cultural and religious communities, thus the religious holidays will be the same as here on earth, but special martian holidays, like Landing day, and or (hopefully will that be the same day) Independence day (national holiday) and such things will be once every Martian year.

Martian Republic · 2005-01-04 18:12:04

Do I see a revival of pet rocks as the standard gift?

Low up keep, but just the idea that you care.

I wonder if Santa Claus is going to have to have anti-radar detection gear when he has to break the speed limit when he has to enter or leave the Earth? I'm sure there some police officer somewhere waiting for him that grinch.

Worse yet, maybe he will need stealth technology so he can avoid NORAD detection and not be shot at or dogged by fighter U.S. Fighter. Oh my, Santa Claus my fly through a no fly zone and be put on the terrorist list and/or have his slay impounded and have to walk.

Americans and people of the world, don't let this happen to Santa Claus. Call 1-800-242-XXXX and for those inside the United States call 1-800-666-XXXX and tell them that you support Santa Claus and a free fly zone on Christmas Night for Santa Claus.

Signed by your Pro-Santa Advocates Group: Let Santa Fly Christmas Night.

Larry,

Zusayan · 2005-02-07 19:07:30

Martian winter-solstice celebrations will be a time of feasting and merry-making and decorations held at the Martian solstice.

'Christmas' will thus be an optional festival that mirrors Martian solstice 'Marsmas'.

srmeaney · 2005-04-17 17:17:22

1. Mrs claus runs everything anyway, Santa is just there for the heavy lifting.

2. Santa's North Pole is sitting in Hyperspace and therefore is directly north of anywhere he cares to deliver.

Palomar · 2005-04-17 20:19:11

1. Mrs claus runs everything anyway, Santa is just there for the heavy lifting.

*Hmmmmm...I thought it was up to Santa's elves to do all the heavy lifting (besides the reindeer during the actual flying). Ah well, Santa does still get to eat all those delicious cookies left out for him during deliveries. :;): A plate of assorted homemade cookies washed down with fresh eggnog...this line of thinking is -not- helping my diet. :bars3:

--Cindy

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#1 2004-12-10 09:12:11

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#2 2004-12-10 09:34:09

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#3 2004-12-10 10:35:26

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#4 2004-12-10 14:31:57

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#5 2004-12-16 03:34:29

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#6 2004-12-16 08:41:35

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#7 2004-12-16 10:19:43

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#8 2004-12-16 15:28:08

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#9 2004-12-16 19:37:27

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#10 2004-12-20 23:00:25

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#11 2004-12-20 23:06:58

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#12 2004-12-22 09:09:30

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#13 2004-12-22 10:33:14

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#14 2004-12-31 23:41:45

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#15 2005-01-01 08:13:47

Re: North Pole Holiday Considerations - (or...What Will Santa Do?)

#16 2005-01-01 21:41:50

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#17 2005-01-03 17:16:20

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#18 2005-01-03 20:10:23

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#19 2005-01-04 03:18:06

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#20 2005-01-04 18:12:04

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#21 2005-02-07 19:07:30

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#22 2005-04-17 17:17:22

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