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#1 2004-12-02 03:27:07

MarsDog
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From: vancouver canada
Registered: 2004-03-24
Posts: 852

Re: Risk Reduction - Redundancy or Death ?

There are so many options, and the minimalist option has the most risk.

I would build 2 spaceships. Unmanned and in Earth orbit, the astronauts would come later to check things our before
committing to Mars.

Enroute to Mars, if one spaceship broke down, the other would be nearby for support.

Near Mars, one would go into orbit, while the other one
descended. On return, one spaceship would be left behind, in orbit, around Mars, for future use.

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#2 2004-12-02 05:44:39

SpaceNut
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From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 29,436

Re: Risk Reduction - Redundancy or Death ?

One trouble would be the amount of supplies would double to each ship containing the complete amount for the entire mission. At that point adding another ship only increases the amount of safety and rather than each ship having full mission supplies they could then be equally divided onto each having one stay in orbit and two ships landing. But how close will they land together needs to be worked out.
IMO the amount of supplies for a ship should be the journey to the planet plus its stay, then divide by 2 this is the best amount per ship to pack. If need be the last ship could also land and the stay could then be extended.

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#3 2004-12-02 08:48:50

John Creighton
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From: Nova Scotia, Canada
Registered: 2001-09-04
Posts: 2,401
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Re: Risk Reduction - Redundancy or Death ?

I think the http://mars.caltech.edu/cmsm2.html]Caltech Mars Society Mission used a backup ship during the transit.


Dig into the [url=http://child-civilization.blogspot.com/2006/12/political-grab-bag.html]political grab bag[/url] at [url=http://child-civilization.blogspot.com/]Child Civilization[/url]

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#4 2004-12-02 09:14:03

SpaceNut
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From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 29,436

Re: Risk Reduction - Redundancy or Death ?

Thanks Jonh, I also was wondering about the fuels for use on the Mars ascent Vehicle, If the relaunch of it is intended to use insitu derived fuels such as methane, then how would one compensate the engines for the different fuel change over from Lox and H to this new combination. And where are we getting the lox for the return trip.

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#5 2004-12-05 02:18:32

MarsDog
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From: vancouver canada
Registered: 2004-03-24
Posts: 852

Re: Risk Reduction - Redundancy or Death ?

The link provided by John Creighton;

http://mars.caltech.edu/ppt/cmsm2july20 … .htm]...to reduce the cost and risk of a human Mars mission
emphasizes safety by redundancy.

The 2 shuttle disasters and numerous unmanned failures were human related.
To reduce the errors, the astronauts need to be more involved in the design and construction. It would make a good survival TV show - someone missed a potential disaster before launch - "you are fired".

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#6 2004-12-05 07:18:29

Dook
Banned
From: USA
Registered: 2004-01-09
Posts: 1,409

Re: Risk Reduction - Redundancy or Death ?

Your idea increases the level of risk not just for the crew but also for mission failure, in my opinion. 

When have we ever built a spaceship in orbit?  Joining space station modules is not the same thing and you want to build two of them?  If it proves too difficult and costs rise the mission fails.

When one has a problem how are these two ships supposed to join up with each other in space?  Why not just connect them before they leave earth orbit?  Each can still have it's own independant power supply and life support.  A better idea is to build redundancy into a single ship.  Two fuel cell powered electrical systems with solar as an emergency backup.  Two independant life support systems with CO2 removal canisters and portable oxygen bottles for emergencies.  Two radio's and two antenna's.

Taking two is like saying "We need to get there at all costs" but it's not a military mission.

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