List of problems for colonization - of planets/moons in solar system

Mark · 2004-06-08 07:35:47

Basically, this topic is to point out all the problems for each planet or moon that would possibly feature human colony buildings, outposts or labs, etc.

Like for example

Mars

- very high pressure problems(very low pressure)
- radiation problems
- temperature problems(cold temperatures)
- gravity?

Titan

- very high temperature problems(extreme cold)
- gravity?

and so forth...

basically probably looking here at Mercury, Moon, Mars(and it's moons?), Callisto, Ganymede, Titan(and other Saturnian moons), moons of Uranus or Neptune, etc, etc

Could make for interesting topic.

Bill White · 2004-06-08 07:46:28

Of all the possible sites, isn't Mars the easiest?

GCNRevenger · 2004-06-08 08:25:19

Of all places to go that are within reach of our technology, only the Moon and Mars are practical, if for no other reason than the weight of rocket fuel needed to get anywhere else in a reasonable span of time becomes insane with any engine that can be built right now.

Palomar · 2004-06-08 08:38:39

*Just a comment (and I don't mean to take this off-topic): Why bother with all these moons? Why -not- space colonies? At least with space colonies you can move about, deploy probes, study phenomenon up-close, etc. Think how quickly that would aid our understanding of the Solar System.

About the only beneficial use I see for terraforming a lot of celestial bodies is getting good experience for when -- and if -- the human race moves out of the Solar System entirely.

Beyond that, Mars and maybe another celestial body or two is plenty.

I really don't understand the disinterest in space colonies, and I've been participating here for 2 years. Thanks, KSR.

Just my 2 cents' worth.

--Cindy

REB · 2004-06-08 10:14:45

Cindy, terraforming Mars and Venus will give us humans a wide range of technology and knowledge on how to terraform alien worlds. We will know how to deal with the extremes we will encounter as we spread out through the galaxy. Very rarely will we find Earth-like worlds. Most worlds will be too hot, too cold, too much atmosphere or to little. But we will have learned how to tame such environments here in our solar system. Sure, each world will have to be tacked differently.

And with each terraformed world or knowledge and technology grows.

I think that only Mars and Venus will be terraformed. By then we should be settled on worlds around the nearest stars.

Alexander Sheppard · 2004-06-08 11:46:43

I might stress that in all but a few cases (these perhaps being before our technology is advanced enough), terraforming is likely to be irrelevant because it will be much cheaper to colonize places by designing bodies which naturally inhabit them.

Then again, advanced civilizations may carry out such projects for fun

atitarev · 2004-06-08 21:15:13

*Just a comment (and I don't mean to take this off-topic): Why bother with all these moons? Why -not- space colonies? At least with space colonies you can move about, deploy probes, study phenomenon up-close, etc. Think how quickly that would aid our understanding of the Solar System.
About the only beneficial use I see for terraforming a lot of celestial bodies is getting good experience for when -- and if -- the human race moves out of the Solar System entirely.
Beyond that, Mars and maybe another celestial body or two is plenty.
I really don't understand the disinterest in space colonies, and I've been participating here for 2 years. Thanks, KSR.
Just my 2 cents' worth.
--Cindy

I think space colonies are a good idea ad they are not too hard or too expensive compared to planet terraforming. You can decide on the design, size, location, rotation, distance form the Sun, etc but it's more exciting and much more value in making the other worlds as homes. Space colonies will hardly ever become real homes to anyone. Even living on a ship is possible but boring. People will want to go home. Where is home? Only Earth, of course. I, personally, would prefer to live on a large domed asteroid than on a ship.

To other posters. Mars and the Moon are not the only colonizable/terraformable places, although they are the "easiest" and the closest - and this where we should IMHO start.

Mercury poles are ready to be colonized as they are. Someone suggested to live in Venus clouds - see Venus thread(50 km above the surface) - pressure - 1 bar, temperature - 0 to 50 C - nice! (Need some protection from acids). Titan is even more prepared. No pressurized suits required - 1.5 bar pressure. Very warm clothes (-180 C) (or some technology to keep warm) and energy sources required. Callisto and Ganymede are not worse than Mars and the Moon. Too cold but lots of frozen water ready for use.

karov · 2004-06-14 15:45:34

Basically, this topic is to point out all the problems for each planet or moon that would possibly feature human colony buildings, outposts or labs, etc.
Like for example
Mars
- very high pressure problems(very low pressure)
- radiation problems
- temperature problems(cold temperatures)
- gravity?

Titan
- very high temperature problems(extreme cold)
- gravity?

and so forth...
basically probably looking here at Mercury, Moon, Mars(and it's moons?), Callisto, Ganymede, Titan(and other Saturnian moons), moons of Uranus or Neptune, etc, etc
Could make for interesting topic.

Lets (as you noticed, may be, I always insist) give for our colonisation practical purposes the property of WORLD of every gravitationally round body except the Sun itself in the Solar system. (BTW, according to Paul Birch through suprastellar shells the stars could be terraformed, too, but this is another theme). The actual number of all major (classical) and minor planets in the system is unknown. More and more round frozen planetoids are found in the outer space of the Solar sphere of gravitational domination -- in the Kuipert belt and further out, so our inventorization should be limited on the named objects.
Instead to list those worlds one by one - a really boring task, we could group them by size, with featuring their destance from the Sun, and directly describing the absolutelly necesarry terraformation measures for each one. We could try to establish at least an outline of general formalisation (See "Terraforming Sedna" theme)-- this is necesarry because of the distinctions in the initial conditions of these celestial spheroids makind explanation of terraforming of only one more complex than the general view, but I think enough are several major points:
1. We can not tickle with gravity -- the surface acceleration remains on the natural level. We could increase it localy to 1 G with conical centrofuges or decrease it to 1 G with "mere"
lifting of the terraformable surface higher where the natural level is arround the earth one through supramundane habitats or complete shells.
2. We can modify the illumination - increase it with soletas (up to interstellar distances) or decrease it with soletas (down to just several solar radii).
3. We can introduce/reduce the atmosphere and process it to obtain the necesarry composition and presure and temperature...

karov · 2004-06-14 15:50:42

Of all places to go that are within reach of our technology, only the Moon and Mars are practical, if for no other reason than the weight of rocket fuel needed to get anywhere else in a reasonable span of time becomes insane with any engine that can be built right now.

"With any engine which can be built right now" is very inexact definition. If you mean the existing chemical rockets, we can`t comence the Mars and Moon colonisation, either. If you mean the 50-60`s style "Orion" nuclear-pulse rocket, if we forget the eareth`s environmental impacts -- than you are not right -- we have the muscles to move people and asteroids back and forth the entire system. Many others concepts for planet-to-orbit and interplanetary vehicles are close to the edges of the drawing boards - matter of financing.

karov · 2004-06-14 16:15:19

I`m sure that the terraforming is in NO way kinda priviledged colonisation method of the future mankind. The many times posted objections about "space colonies" or "altered human body design" vs. "terraforming" are equaly probable. Even unavoidable. The tech will give us evolutionary means and factors trillions of times faster and more capacitous than the natural "evolutionary radiation" of a single species. We shall be Dyson`s "Millions of human species". There are notions that even some will colonize in some software forms, pulsars turned into computronium capable of emulating environments more complex than the "natural" universe. The space of posthumanitarian possibilia is infinity. But even if infinitesimal fraction of this infinity remain in it`s original modern human form it will keep on colonizing, hence producing or modifying human-friendly environments. The most effective way are the space colonies -- rotating tube worlds, undoubtedly. They could have really huge sizes -- providing billions of times bigger and optimised than original earth-like habitable surface (spagetti-habitat with thousands of km diamater). Under 1 G and using lesser matterial than natural planet per sq.m.
But hardly ever the naturaly evolved after non-repeatable long istory, with distinct features, worlds would be sacrifised for building materials, when so much is in less complex and available form -- star`s plasma, interstellar gas/dust and little bodies - asteroids and comets... The preserving of the initial state of these unique worlds lies in the field of culture. The "Reds" will keep their homes close to their innitial condition, the "Greens" will ruthlessly transform them -- matter of money, aesthetics, intentions, needs, property rights, whatever.
--------------------------------------------
If in such little disscuision group there are so many oppinions, than imagine what would happen if we could actually do the job. The humans shall do everything that occured to us (and much more) simultaneously - one will terraform planets, other roof/ dome or cavitate/bubbleform asteroids, built little or huge tube worlds, shell gas giants or stars, redesign their bodies, merge with variety of technological bases...

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#1 2004-06-08 07:35:47

Re: List of problems for colonization - of planets/moons in solar system

#2 2004-06-08 07:46:28

Re: List of problems for colonization - of planets/moons in solar system

#3 2004-06-08 08:25:19

Re: List of problems for colonization - of planets/moons in solar system

#4 2004-06-08 08:38:39

Re: List of problems for colonization - of planets/moons in solar system

#5 2004-06-08 10:14:45

Re: List of problems for colonization - of planets/moons in solar system

#6 2004-06-08 11:46:43

Re: List of problems for colonization - of planets/moons in solar system

#7 2004-06-08 21:15:13

Re: List of problems for colonization - of planets/moons in solar system

#8 2004-06-14 15:45:34

Re: List of problems for colonization - of planets/moons in solar system

#9 2004-06-14 15:50:42

Re: List of problems for colonization - of planets/moons in solar system

#10 2004-06-14 16:15:19

Re: List of problems for colonization - of planets/moons in solar system

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