Mars on the cheap - Let's use what we've already got

beauanderson · 2004-05-12 10:17:04

OK...maybe I'm not a rocket scientist, but it seems to me that we already have most of the things you need to do a mars trip. This list is a bit simplistic, but here's a few of the basics we need to get to Mars:

1. A Space Habitat that can support a crew for up to 2 years.
2. Something that can enter Mars' atmosphere and land on the surface. This has to be big enough to hold a vehicle to launch back to the space habitat.
3. Engines big enough to loft the habitat to Mars.
4. Enough fuel to get to mars, launch from Mars' surface, and return to Earth.
5. Some place the provides radioactive shielding where a crew can live.
6. A launch vehicle to get off of Mars' surface.
7. A few other odds and ends I may be omiting.

We already have a couple of trivial items that can fill some of the gaps here.

1. Space Habitat: Tie a lasso around the ISS and tow it to Mars and back. We'll put it back in Earth orbit when we're done.

2. Mars Entry Vehicle: Tie the other end of the lasso to two of our old decrepid space shuttles. The Opportunity Rover has found a place flat enough to land them on Mars...no problem. Leave them on the surface of Mars when we're finished there...we're scrapping them in a few years anyways...right?

3. Big Engines: The space shuttles have big engines don't they...they just need more fuel to break Earth orbit.

4. Lots of fuel....yeah....gotta get that.

5. Some place that provides radioactive shielding where the crew can live...like maybe a Space Shuttle.

6. Mars Launch Vehicle: Store it in the Space Shuttle Cargo Hold.

So, there you go...a complete mission plan to Mars. Throw a couple of Hummers in the back of the shuttle and maybe a powered parachute (it can fit in a small box and fly for hours on one tank of gas, but you have to watch out for power lines), and you're cruzin Mars. It couldn't be simpler. Am I missing any details?

Dook · 2004-05-12 10:54:36

I think the space shuttle needs an atmosphere to glide through to land, like the earth has. On mars it would fall like a rock and you still couldn't land the space shuttle anywhere on mars, even some flat part. One hill and you rip the landing gear off and the shuttle cartwheels. It needs a runway, a very long runway. Might be possible to redesign it so it has some kind of retro rockets so it could land vertically but that would just be like designing a whole new craft and there are already a number of designs for that. Better ones too.

I'm not sure if the space shuttle alone has enough power to rocket itself away from mars if there was a runway there.

How are you going to get the Hummers out of the back of the shuttle and how are they going to work on mars when it has no air?

Engine powered parachute would again need an atmosphere to fly in.

You should read Zubrin's book "The Case for Mars". It details what many of us think is the best way to go there.

RobS · 2004-05-12 10:56:58

Well, perhaps a few details, like ISS masses about ten times more than a crew to Mars should have and can't support a crew for two years anyway because it doesn't have closed-cycle life support systems; and there's no way to get a space shuttle on the surface of Mars without crashing it into a million pieces (with those little wings, it would have to land on a perfect landing strip at about 3,000 miles per hour). . .and the fuel to get ISS and a shuttle to Mars would cost several tens of billions of dollars at current costs if it could be launched on puny little rockets at all. . . there are ideas and elements we can use in the current equipment, but we really need to design a whole new generation of equipment to do this at all, let alone safely.

-- RobS

beauanderson · 2004-05-12 11:05:01

Now, you don't have to go spoiling a perfectly good plan with logic.

First, I said the first time that the shuttles stay on the surface and you use something else to launch back to the ISS.

Second, To get the Hummers out of the cargo hold...you use that darn arm thingey on the shuttle...if it's only for space, then build a better one or borrow a crane from a local shop.

Third, if the landing gear sucks, then put on some of those cool skis that we saw on the movie Armegeddon...if those worked on the asteroid, they will definitely work on Mars.

Fourth, If you can't design an internal combustion engine that can work in Mars' atmosphere, then build a fuel cell or something...building an engine for Mars exploration isn't exactly the hardest hurdle in the plan.

Fifth, to land the shuttle without much of an atmosphere...hire better pilots...those Mercury astronauts would have found a way, and some of them are still alive...just pack more Arthritis medicine and they'll get the shuttles down safely.

Ian Flint · 2004-05-12 12:35:49

I like your spunk beauanderson!

The fact is this -- the ISS and the Shuttles are barely able to operate in Earth orbit. The ISS needs continuous resupply and the shuttle needs a runway. Don't even get me started on Armegeddon! And, they're just to darn heavy.

The most valuable thing they have given us is experience. We must take the knowledge and expertise that our 40 years of spaceflight has given us and put it to proper use for a Mars mission. The spare parts will be helpful but not in their current forms.

Dook · 2004-05-12 16:25:14

Sigh...Read the book!

Euler · 2004-05-12 16:39:49

More problems:

-How does the ISS get back to Earth?

-No surface habitat, where do the astronauts stay while they are on Mars? Do they land and then immediately leave again?

-It is not really a repeatable mission architecture, so no sustained presence on Mars.

beauanderson · 2004-05-13 10:38:05

Repeatable?...who said anything about repeatable...right now they're talking decades before we walk in the rover tracks.

Where do we stay on Mars? well...we've got two shuttles...either they can carry some habitat, or the crew can live in the cargo hold for a while.

How does the ISS get back to earth?...I think you missed my lasso idea...only coming back we don't have shuttles, so pack an extra motor.

As far as the ISS being too heavy for the mission...just break a couple of the less usefull pieces off before you leave Earth orbit...besides...we've got two shuttles, just use the ISS for a big storage locker and have the crews sleep in the shuttles...and don't tell me that the crews wouldn't do it...I'm betting that any of them would live in cramped quarters it if it meant walking on Mars.

OK...I'll concede that I am missing a couple of small mission details...but I have to leave something for the rocket scientists so they can take all the credit for getting to Mars even though I've done all the work thinking it up. jk

idiom · 2004-05-13 15:21:52

Have a look at the "Clunking to Mars" thread.

It got a bit buried... all the way on Human missions page three at the mo...

http://www.newmars.com/forums/viewtopic … 8]Clunking To Mars

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#1 2004-05-12 10:17:04

Re: Mars on the cheap - Let's use what we've already got

#2 2004-05-12 10:54:36

Re: Mars on the cheap - Let's use what we've already got

#3 2004-05-12 10:56:58

Re: Mars on the cheap - Let's use what we've already got

#4 2004-05-12 11:05:01

Re: Mars on the cheap - Let's use what we've already got

#5 2004-05-12 12:35:49

Re: Mars on the cheap - Let's use what we've already got

#6 2004-05-12 16:25:14

Re: Mars on the cheap - Let's use what we've already got

#7 2004-05-12 16:39:49

Re: Mars on the cheap - Let's use what we've already got

#8 2004-05-13 10:38:05

Re: Mars on the cheap - Let's use what we've already got

#9 2004-05-13 15:21:52

Re: Mars on the cheap - Let's use what we've already got

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