Terraforming Venus - methods anyone?

REB · 2004-04-12 06:54:04

Chat, I see two ways we could build at the atomic level using the resources of a planet, asteroid or moon.

The first way is to follow the examples of a plant. A plant starts out as a seed. This seed digs roots into the ground. The root find and transport the right atoms to build a plant. A mature apple tree knows how to take atoms out of the ground to build an apple. This is all encoded on its DNA. Imagine sending seeds (Mechanical or biological) to an asteroid. This seed sends roots throughout the asteroid and starts making whatever we have programmed it to make.

The second way works a little differently to achieve the same results. Let’s build an apple, but we are not going to use DNA to tell us how to build it. Let’s map out every atom in the apple in a 3-D map. We’ll note the location and type of every atom in the apple. Then we’ll collect the atoms we need to build an exact copy (Using mechanical roots or nanobots). All that is left is to put each atom in its correct location, following the atomic map, and we have an exact copy of the atom.

To be able to send a seed to a planet, moon, or asteroid, and have it build, say a fully stocked base (or whatever we wanted) would be a tremendous step for the human race. To be able to map and build things at the atomic level would be an even greater step. Space exploration, colonization and terraforming would become so much easier.

Earthfirst · 2004-04-13 13:24:41

A good source of H2 is the sun, the sun is a lot closer to venus than to uranus. Sure it hot if you cant stand the heat get out of the Sun. The solar wind close to the sun is a lot thicker than when it gets to the earth. A large ship with a eletro magnetic ramjet close to the sun could easy get lots of H protons to bring back to venus.
Do you just dump the H2 into venus atmosphere or do you have machines convert the co2 into H2O. To convert 80 bars of co2 into water you would need lots of H2 right? I would think that you would get a lot more water than 10 to 12% water for venus from that much atmosphere.
Good idea that with water coments, and a sun shade could make venus more nice.
One thing though once you shade the planet and it cools on its night side. Because the pressure is so great CO2 would become a ligued and from sea on the surface. This raining out of Co2 would lower the pressure on venus very much. CO2 sea now thats alien. With the lower temp and the water from the H2 and water coments water would rain out too creating soda water seas. But as the pressure gets lower more co2 would go back to the gas form. Increasing the pressure.
But the water would surcb the co2 out turning it into a weak acid, that would react with the volcanic rocks to form carbonate rocks. This process would be the main way to get rid of all those bars of co2. This is what happen to most of the earths Co2, with plate techonics to recycle it back. I think on mars its ocean surcb co2 out too, but no plate techonics to rycle back in. that with the loss of it magnintic flied made it into the cold thin air place it is too day. I think most of the mars Co2 is in carbonate rocks on the old oncean basins of mars. Dint rover find evidense of water.
On earth this process kept co2 from buliding up too much, venus loss its oceans and had the run away greenhouse.
I am surpriszed that you people over look this very important process of co2 srubing. I think that it will be the main way to terraform venus. Not blasting it away, just cooling it with a sun shade, add some water, and most of the work is done for you, Once thing are nice add algea with a little sun light and you get an N2 and O2 atomsphere. Since venus lacks a magnetic flied a much thicker 3 bar atomsphere sould be used there is lots of N2 there. As far as water like 80 to 90% should be water covered, to moderate the climate, and prevent it from getting too hot again.

chat · 2004-04-14 05:21:13

Reb,

Getting machines to build everything from the ground up seems like a good idea.

Start from virtually nothing, just a few small seed machines that do most of the work.
Almost like life does.

On mars that is a great idea, but on Venus with its nasty environment it might be something that helps only when its hospitable enough.

I believe we only have 2 places that are realistic to teraform, mars and Venus.

A few other candidates do exist but are so hostile i don't belive any technology will make them nice places for humans to live.

Mars will be the first place to try, but i bet the colonist wont allow it, or will want to control all the processes that happen on it, if they allow anything.

Venus i think will be the first place we make attempts to teraform.
Its not beyond the realms of technology we have now.
All the tools for teraforming Venus are here now in some sense.
The will do such a thing on the other hand seems far behind the technology.

I think you are right, we will need machines, bacteria,sun shades and hydrogen collection to make an impact on the current Venus conditions.
And if we expect to teraform Venus in a few hundred years we are probably going to be disappointed at the results after a few hundred years.

I also believe once the teraforming gets going well and the first rain starts, it will never stop raining.
A permanent sun shield is also a must to stop that.

On earth with 1.4 x the solar radiation it would rain here 24/7 everywhere.

Earthfirst,

I agree with you, not many people are thinking about the co2 scrub that comes from the planet itself.
Just cooling the place might be 90% of the teraform work.

After it is cooled.
The co2 rains out, the o2 atmosphere ignites with the added hydrogen.
The products are water, carbon soot and a gigantic drop in atmospheric pressure and co2.
Add bacteria and stir.

I love the idea of a sea of soda water, i hadn't thought about that happening.
Dean martin would love the place

Its an awful thought to think that after teraforming all we get is permanent rain.

About the hydrogen collection at the sun.
I think collecting it near the sun is by far the cheapest way to get it to Venus, and the closest.

On another forum topic i suggested that a magnetic collector be use to add energy to mars from the solar wind, along with the waste hydrogen that solar flares belch out all the time.
After mars was warmed it was turned around and became a radiation shield.

Near Venus this sort of system might be able to get the needed hydrogen without getting to close to the sun, and without trying to go pickup water asteroids or ferry hydrogen form the gas giants.

I wonder how much hydrogen Venus gets from the solar wind and flares. ?
And would 10x that number start to make an impact?

Maybe a combination sun block/magnet particle lens for Venus?
Keep the light out, but add multiples of charged particles and hydrogen?

Earthfirst · 2004-04-14 11:16:01

Thanks chat, it is nice to have some one here reveiw your post here. Most people just go on with their own ideas.
As for mars I think that the people there will want some kind of terraforming to make the place more pleasent to what extent depends on them not us. If mars got its ocean back they would be soda water too untile mars got a oxygen in the air. As for scrubing CO2 out of venus I think that it will be the main way to lower its pressure, but you first need the place cool enough and the water to do it. Hiting venus with a big rock to get rid of its atmosphere is a waste of resources and is silly, you can always get the co2 back from the rocks to use, you cant if it is in space!
As for mars I think that most of its old atmosphere is lock up in carbonate rock where the old sea were. If there is not enough co2 in the pole and dirt burn these rocks to get the co2 out could save a terraforming effort. I bet if the earths ocean dint exist we would have an equaly thick as venus. On earth there are limestone deposites thousand of feet thick, just look at the grand canyon.
Limestone could be thrick in getting rid of venus pressure, and freeing mars old atmosphere.

John Creighton · 2004-04-14 11:24:38

Has anyone mentioned the 90 bar atmosphere of nearly pure oxygen once the CO2 is removed. I wonder if a 90 bar pure atmosphere plus the heat of all the volcanic activity is enough to burn up limestone.

RobertDyck · 2004-04-14 13:27:58

I believe Venus surface pressure today is 92 bars. Carl Segan once calculated that if you convert all the CO2 to oxygen and graphite, the pressure would be 86 bars. That pressure of pure oxygen at Venus surface temperature would cause the graphite (or surface carbon of whatever form) to spontaneously combust. It would burn back into CO2, undoing all your work. Just converting CO2 into O2 and carbon would have worked when Venus was thought to have a 6 bar surface pressure, but at 92 bars it requires something more sophisticated.

Creating a strong planetary magnetosphere would capture solar wind over an area several times greater than the planet's diameter. This would trap hydrogen as plasma, creating Van Allen belts. The spinning charged plasma is an important part of the magnetosphere, and what extends it to such a large volume. The magnetic field pinches down to the planet at the poles, so the radiation belts will leak into the poles creating aurora. Acceleration of plasma as it falls down the magnetic field lines into the planet makes it strike the planet's atmosphere at several times the speed of solar wind. This is enough to cause hydrogen to burn, we just need an oxygen atmosphere for it to burn with.

So how do we create a strong enough planetary magnetic field to initiate a magnetosphere? Venus certainly has a liquid core; evidence of surface volcanism is so great that some people think at one point in its past a continent subsided into the mantle and melted. But Venus doesn't have a moon shepherding its rotation and maintaining a crust rotation slower than its core. The high surface temperature will decrease mantle convection currents; you need a high difference between core and surface temperature to drive a strong convection current. Is there enough of a temperature differential to sustain a core dynamo from convection alone? How do we induce a planetary magnetic field? Can strong magnetic fields on the surface or low orbit induce electric and/or magnetic flux currents in the core that can be organized into a dynamo?

kippy · 2004-04-14 14:37:12

Actually, if I'm not mistaken, hydrogen will react with CO2 directly. Venus' pressure and temperature are in the right area for it too. The trick is getting enough H2 to Venus to do the trick. My math shows it's something like 3x10^19 kg of H2 to convert the whole atmosphere to water and carbon. It seems like getting that much in a magnetic trap is going to be slow going at best.

Creating an honest to God magnetosphere might be on the order of difficulty of building the whole world from scratch. The best solution I can think of is to put a big electromagnet or web of them at the L1 point to act as a shield for the incoming solar wind. It would trap particles which I guess you could use but I think the quantity is going to be pretty low.

chat · 2004-04-14 14:59:59

RobertDyck,

I came to the same conclusion.
Without water all that happens is a lot of bacteria action, and at some point combustion and back to what it was.

Without the water at Venus it is hopeless.
But if you can lock away enough of the o2 with hydrogen, then the combustion has a totally different effect.

A big impactor could create a moon, and create a magnetic field for Venus, and add water.
But the price for doing that might be 5000 years of planetary detestation.
And the final product might be even worse than what you started with.

I don't believe the co2 is the big problem.
I think the 92 bars is, the co2 is secondary.

With a man made magnetic field we could collect a vast quantity of hydrogen directed to Venus.
Each hydrogen atom locks away 2 oxygen atoms, so we need the equivalent of maybe 35-40 bars of hydrogen.

It sounds like a lot, but if we could get the sun to deliver it to Venus with little effort on our part then its a possible teraform for Venus.

I also think a permanent sun block of some sort for Venus is needed, or you will end up with permanent rain or steam that starts the runaway again.

John,

I believe its 92 but close enough to make the point
As far as is know little to no volcanic activity happens on Venus right now.
Probably the lack of water is the reason, so something to think about when you start delivering hydrogen to the planet.

Once you have open water will it reactivate the planet?

Earthfirst,

Your welcome.
I agree its great fun to post ideas here, but more fun to get the feedback and input that help you create new ideas.
Life should probably be like that. *lol*

I agree, enemy no 1 on Venus is the pressure.
Once you start getting it under control the planet itself will probably start to deal with the co2.

Dean wont be happy, but you cant please everyone when your teraforming

I feel you are on the right track about getting the hydrogen from the sun to Venus, the sun throws away so much all the time.

Getting it from water asteroids or going to the gas giants for collection is something that could be done to get hydrogen to Venus.
But why go for pickup when they deliver
And the sun delivers, we just need to know how to collect.

I guess for mars the people that go will be true lovers of the new frontier.
My bet is they love what they make of the place.
If they do teraform i think it will be a - by mars for Martians effort, with only assistance from earth.

At some point we will probably be ready for a serious attempt to teraform mars, but the biggest obstacle to doing that might be the Martians.

Earthfirst · 2004-04-14 17:05:11

There would never be a atmosphere of 80 bars of O2, my point was that water would turn the co2 into carbonate rock.
Also if all the co2 on venus was removed there would be a 3 bars of N2 and traces of other gases left. My point is that at the most there would be 20% O2 and 75 N2 in a terraformed venus. Lots of N2 would be turned into nitrates rock too lowering the pressure of that gas. On my venus I would have a 2 to 3 bar atmosphere, The other 87 bars would have been turned into rock by water action, lighting.
You over look the fact that lot of the pressure that there now would turn into rock, not all converted into O2 by plants. thats on top of the Co2 that not turn into water by H2 import, and any water from coments.
I think that the best way to get rid of the 90 bars of co2 is to turn a lot into rock, water with H2, and a final 20% O2 of how many bars the final atmosphere has made by plants.
If the mars people dont want to terraform mars we could just send a few NH3 comets to mars, kill them with the impact, and let NH3 warm the place up. Silly Mars people dont piss off the terrians with all the gun, nukes, and orbital debre. Better do what we tell them to do!

atitarev · 2004-04-14 17:46:30

... So far, the biggest problem is the 243 Terran day rotation, but we could fix that.

FYI, Venusian "light day" is much shorter than its rotational day. That is, it takes 243 days to rotate around its own axis but its mean solar day is 116.74 Earth days - 58 days of light and 58 days of darkness. It is still a lot but much shorter than many people think. Maybe with the right atmosphere and climate on Venus the rotational period could be left alone, if it becomes too difficult to change.

One of the sources:
[http://www.ursa.fi/~mpi/astro/venus.html]Venus data

chat · 2004-04-14 18:15:45

Earthfirst,

Its tough to say what the chemistry on Venus would do.
I think educated guess is the best we could hope for.

That surface temperate on Venus is one of the real problems for forming rocks of any sort from the atmosphere.

Lots of options for a cold Venus open up that cant be done on the present Venus, and lots of familiar chemistry.

I do agree that if you alter Venus in small ways you might get big effects later on.
Double the pressure of here on earth would be pretty comfortable for everything.

Even x5 that of earth will be comfie for most things.
With all that free c02, nitrates, warm water and sunlight for 4 months i bet bacteria and plants would grow at a ferocious rate on Venus day side.
Quite unlike they do here on earth.

I get the feeling your right though, cool Venus first and the planet will move to a direction we want will little help.
We do the fine tuning later, and add hydrogen all the time.

The easiest teraform of Venus is a total sun block.
Do nothing else to the planet other than wait for the temperature to drop, the bulk of a cold atmosphere is locked up by the planet.
Don't attempt to make earth 2, but make a livable place that is alien.
Once humans in space suits can walk on the surface, then we take the 5000 year tera form process and no rush.
A similar path to a mars colony.

*lol* Love the mars solution.
Send em a few ice asteroids and see if that alters the thinking

Kippy,

I think your correct about co2 direct reaction with hydrogen.

That question of how much hydrogen the lens gets.
It seems to be the unknown math for the lens to work or not.
If it takes 100,000 years to collect the needed hydrogen from the sun around Venus then its not much good.
But a few hundred would be nice.

If its a 500 years or more we may as well go collect it our selfs from the outer solar system.

Guess we are both waiting for a solar wind scientist to stumble onto the idea and blast a bunch of holes into it *lol*

I've been thinking how we might use that magnetic lens to make a sun block between the magnets.
It would be great to do both things at once.
With a little tweaking of the magnetic fields we should be able to keep something between the planet and sun, and let the hydrogen pass through.

Not sure if the solar wind would just blast the charged particles trapped between the magnets though, but a thought for a easy to create sun block of sorts.

chat · 2004-04-15 04:44:27

atitarev,

It makes for a long work day, but real nice weekends

Making the planet turn faster is something that could be done in a few ways.

All the ideas I've seen would takes ages though.
Probably none of them were realistic other than speeding it up with asteroid collisions.
The price for doing that though is a devastated planet for many eons.

Let the earthlings have that tiny 24 hr day, we Venetians love our weekend parties.

kippy · 2004-04-15 14:07:32

I just had a thought about using some kind of ramscoop or lens to collect solar hydrogen. Since Venus lacks a magnetosphere, it is already receiving solar hydrogen over a surface area of over a hundred million square kilometers. Apparently that's not enough to start converting the atmosphere otherwise we'd be settling there now.

If we want to double that amount, we'd need just as big of a hydrogen trap. If we want to get a hundred times as much we get into sizes to big they are laughable.

Does this make sense? I don't think getting hydrogen from incoming solar wind will supply enough to do anything but supply a small orbital outpost or something.

RobertDyck · 2004-04-15 14:37:25

A planet is really big. I think it's easier to create a magnetosphere to collect hydrogen. Venus has the problem that solar wind impacts the upper atmosphere directly, breaking up water and accelerating hydrogen to escape velocity. That is causing a net loss of hydrogen. We need something to trap that in. A magnetosphere would do that as well as extending the collection area.

I think there are other ways to create a magnetic field other than impacting a giant asteroid. Build a nuclear reactor powering a super-conducting magnet the size of a cyclotron at each pole. Rotate the magnetic field to manipulate electric currents in the core. Direct the currents so that magma convection will provide the primary power, and organize the currents into a dynamo.

Genetically engineered archaea in the atmosphere can convert CO2 into a solid that will precipitate out as dust. (Yes, I still think it can be done.) The initial terraforming archaea will be anaerobic and live on existing water in the clouds. Time the whole thing so the magnetosphere will generate significant influx of hydrogen when cyanobacteria is introduced to generate oxygen. Oxygen will poison the anaerobic archaea, stopping the process of sequestering CO2.

chat · 2004-04-15 16:42:20

kippy,

I couldn't make sense of why the incoming hydrogen over a few billion years hasn't tera formed Venus either.

Even if it is a small amount why hasn't it altered Venus over billions of years.

Then i read Robert post about the escape velocity without a magnetic field, and wooola it was oh to simple.

The lack of magnetic field is the reason Venus looses its water and hydrogen.

I think Robert is really onto something with the idea of putting huge magnets on the poles and attracting the hydrogen in mass quantity, and altering the way hydrogen impacts the atmosphere.

Maybe the ultimate solution is cool Venus.
When we can move semi safe on the surface place one very large magnet on each pole and change that hydrogen loss cycle.

Solar wind scientist needed...please apply

Robert,
Excellent idea.
One of the best I've seen so far.

Cool Venus just enough so we can work there, then make the magnetic collectors on the poles that also acts as a shied from some of the nasty radiation.

This idea uses the planet as the collector, makes a safer planet as soon as you turn it on, alters how the solar wind reacts with Venus and allows you to alter the collecting rate of hydrogen with how much power you apply to the magnets.

Now all that is needed is a way to block the sunlight without using a vast quantity of fabric in space that the solar wind will play havoc with.

The best idea i have for that is still the 2 small impactors running into each other in Venus orbit.
At a distant orbit a collision of 2 deimos size objects should do the tricks for blocking sunlight for a very long time period.
A few dangers exist for stray impacts in the inner solar system with this idea though.

Another good one is a dust creating satellite.
Its job is to turn a small asteroid into fine dust that it spits out in high orbit.

It would take a few of those satellites in different orbits to start having an impact though.

atitarev · 2004-04-15 16:59:41

atitarev,
It makes for a long work day, but real nice weekends
Making the planet turn faster is something that could be done in a few ways.
All the ideas I've seen would takes ages though.
Probably none of them were realistic other than speeding it up with asteroid collisions.
The price for doing that though is a devastated planet for many eons.
Let the earthlings have that tiny 24 hr day, we Venetians love our weekend parties.

Seriously, I don't think that this what's going to happen. The planets are too big for shifting and spinning up. We'll have to work with what we've got.

The main problem with Venus is not the rotation but its thick poisonous atmosphere. If the Venusian atmosphere could be made earthlike, then life could be adjusted somehow to long days and nights or people will have to live in domes or caves forever. Large amounts of water, clouds and winds would soften largely the temperature differences.

chat · 2004-04-15 18:17:54

atitarev,

Agreed, the cost of trying to speed up the spin of a planet is just to high.
Not a realistic effort in my mind, and a better reason is the one you stated. (why bother trying)
If things are tolerable for the life on Venus then just get used to it.
People, animals, plants and bacteria are used to long days and nights in the arctic on earth, so i don't see a problem if its just day length.

The climate will probably swing a bit more than it does here on earth, but if it isn't awful then no big worry.

If the day length is to long then pull the curtains closed.
If night is to long then turn the lights on.
If its to hot above ground with the day length, then turn up the air conditioning, or go underground.
If its to cold at night turn up the heater.

All low tech solutions if the swings are not to awful.

atitarev · 2004-04-15 21:52:07

Chat,

The hardest bit is to get rid of that atmosphere and to get the water in. Other guys have already discussed this.

I agree with you (from a previous post) that Venus could have much thicker atmosphere than Earth. Thick, mostly nitrogen atmosphere (with some oxygen) would soften the climate (thick atmospheres are good at that - like today's Venus). Water should be abundant (70% or more) and evenly spread (not hard on a relatively flat planet like Venus). Water clouds could protect from the heat of the long day and salty liquid water will keep temperatures warmer during the long night (at least for some time). I read that simulations showed Venus would have an average of 25 degrees Celsius with the terran atmosphere. Polar and subpolar regions would be quite comfortable. Would be good to simulate weather programmatically knowing the diurnal period, albedo, the solar energy (1.9 of Earth's) and the different versions of atmosphere to find out what we could expect. If the results are promising, there would be much more people interested in terraforming Venus. If I knew the formula, I would write a program to find out what we can get on the terraformed Venus.

I would use the excess CO2 from Venus to give some airless or almost airless planets/moons some atmosphere - Mercury, the Moon, Ganymede and Callisto. It could be shipped with huge shuttles (hollowed out asteroids ?). The Moon could use about a bar of CO2. We could use parachutes and airplanes on the Moon! It would be a foundation for terraforming them. The low gravity planets would lose some atmosphere gradually but it could be topped up - plenty of volatiles in the solar system. Maybe Mars could use some of CO2 from Venus too.

RobertDyck · 2004-04-15 22:39:50

I would control temperature with clouds, not any sunshade or impactors creating planetary rings.

According to [http://www-das.uwyo.edu/~geerts/cwx/not … ossow.html]this web page clouds have a net cooling effect on Earth. They reflect sunlight cooling the Earth by 12ºC, but trap radiant heat warming the Earth by 7ºC. The net cools the Earth by 5ºC. On Venus clouds could reflect sunlight from the "day" side, while trapping radiant heat on the "night" side. The result would moderate temperature. But this is an average of Earth clouds. Different types of clouds have different cooling/warming effects, resulting in different net cooling. Engineering the climate on Venus would involve creating the required clouds to maintain suitable surface temperatures for humans and crops.

Earthfirst · 2004-04-16 09:52:05

Venus is all ready covered in clouds of sulfic acid, thats why venus is so bright in the night sky, it already reflicts most of the light it gets. I think the key is stoping the light on the day side before it get into the atmosphere and warms it, there should be no sun shade on the nightside so the heat can exscap into space. Maybe burn off the clouds no the night side and keep them on the day side to reflict.

RobertDyck · 2004-04-16 09:59:10

CO2 is a greenhouse gas; it absorbs infrared (IR) light, which is radiant heat. Venus may have more total mass of nitrogen in its atmosphere than Earth, but it is swamped in CO2. 96% is CO2. Cooling Venus means getting rid of the CO2.

kippy · 2004-04-16 09:59:27

Does anyone have any idea how long it would take to cool the planet with a sun shade? It seems to me that if you cut off all the incoming sunlight, it wouldn't take too long for the temperature to drop to something livable. Maybe a couple decades tops.

That's just a wild guess but is there any merit to it? What about partial shading? If we were able to just erect a shield to cover the center of the planet would that do the trick? Just so that the only light that hits the surface is on the morning, evening and polar regions.

Perhaps we wouldn't need to make a shade the size of the planet but rather the size of the moon. That's still freaking huge but a good deal more attainable.

If cooling the planet that way is quick, what are the real bottlenecks? In my crazy scheme of hydrogen importation from the gas giants, the importation process seems like the bottleneck.

If we can cool the planet quickly and figure some way to get a lot of hydrogen fast, the time span might not be the 1000-5000 years that a lot of people assume.

REB · 2004-04-16 10:27:04

Kippy, I have not done the math (Not sure if I even know the calculations ) but my gut feeling is that if Venus sunlight was cut 100% it wouldn't take long, maybe a year or two. The darkness of space is cold.

kippy · 2004-04-16 10:30:01

If it is quick like that, we might be able to display a little optimism for "quick" terraforming. Any thermodynamic buffs reading this?

chat · 2004-04-16 10:47:41

Robert,

The clouds are a good idea, but the same old problem arises.
How do you get the initial machines or bacteria to help the process with the surface temperature on Venus.
The machines even resembling tanks wont last, and the bacteria processes in the clouds that sink to the surface will probably be
recycled back to the atmosphere.
Even the Russian Venus lander that resembled a tank only lasted 58 minutes or so on the surface.

I think you need some form of planet cooling before you can start any work.
Making an atmosphere that reflects more light and has a net heat loss is quite possible with bacteria.

That 1.9 x solar radiation i think will be the killer for Venus tera forming.
If earth received 1.9x its current solar radiation with its current atmosphere, we get warm rain always everywhere and a thickening atmosphere.
On Venus even if we could make the atmosphere only 2x earths, i believe we are looking at very hot rain all the time, or a steam cycle that never quite forms puddles on the surface.
That much free h20 in the atmosphere will cause a runaway greenhouse on Venus.
It probably would on earth also.

atitarev

I think the thicker atmosphere will actually be a plus for Venus.
Not the current one though
A thicker atmosphere will be less likely to swing in temperature to much.
Maybe 2x earth would be something desired for the final teraform.

Moving that excess co2 is such a painful procedure.
Mars does need it, but what a huge project to get it from Venus to mars.

It would benefit both planets for sure.
Tera forming wont be a short process, so it might be the way to do both planets at once.

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