Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

tahanson43206 · 2021-03-25 11:19:41

For SpaceNut ... there was no pre-existing topic with the word "tunnel" in Planetary Transportation ....

This new topic will open with discussion of Elon Musk's underground transport system. The topic would be a good place for competitive designs to appear.

This should work well on Mars, where transit would necessarily be underground.

Miami mayor wants Musk-built mass transit

By Rob Wile
Miami Herald
Miami Mayor Francis Suarez
believes Elon Musk’s Boring
Company tunnel-makers
could build a new mass transit
system in Miami’s urban core
— a considerably larger vision
than the original Brickell
Avenue tunnel Musk initially
proposed.
Suarez and other Miami
officials visited Musk’s tunnel
system under Las Vegas last
week. In a Monday press
conference outside city hall,
Suarez said the visit helped
clarify — and expand — how
exactly the tunnels could be
used in Miami.
Suarez’s new vision involves
a pedestrian transportation
system connecting commuters from Brickell to as far north
as Little Haiti, with multiple
stops between. According
to Suarez, the system would
utilize adapted electric SUVs,
like Teslas, that transport
up to five passengers each
through the tunnel system at
high speeds. Private passenger
vehicles would not be allowed.
Musk also owns car maker
Tesla.
“You get in a car, and you
go through a tunnel,” Suarez
said.
The system, with an estimated price tag of $10 million
per mile, could potentially be
paid for entirely by Boring
Co. and financed by riders on
a user-fee model, Suarez said.
That is the model Las Vegas
has used, and he said Miami
could even “piggyback” off of
Las Vegas’ procurement bid,
which came with a guaranteed
maximum price.
Suarez noted the carrying
capacity of Boring’s system
could be as high as 60,000
per hour — higher than the
Metrorail’s 50,000 people
a day. Further savings stem
from Musk’s tunnels being
narrower than other common
municipal tunnels built for
handling auto traffic.
Musk, who spoke personally by phone with Suarez last
month, has seen mixed results
getting approval for his tunnel
projects. Chicago Mayor Lori
Lightfoot has dismissed a
plan by her predecessor Rahm
Emanuel to build a privately
financed tunnel system from
the commercial Loop district to O’Hare Airport as a
“fantasy.”
But Las Vegas has come
to embrace the systems.The
tunnel system connects guests
from one end of that city’s
sprawling convention center
to another at under a mile in
distance.

The article was collected from the local paper ...

(th)

SpaceNut · 2021-03-25 18:04:17

Hyperloop is the term for the subway like under growing boring that elon musk has been doing.

tahanson43206 · 2021-03-26 11:27:02

For SpaceNut re #2

Thanks for giving this new topic a running (if that's the right term) start!

As you have pointed out, hyperloop and the simple Las Vegas (now Miami) people mover are quite different. The people mover is a completely new concept, which does ** not ** run in evacuated tubes like Hyperloop, but instead, operates at normal air pressure in narrow tunnels, just wide enough for one Tesla to purr quietly from one transit stop to the next. This concept is a replacement for traditional subway trains, which operate on rails and require hundreds of passengers to pay for themselves.

The new concept, now (apparently finished) installed in / under Las Vegas, uses Teslas fitted with little guide wheels to self-steer along a simple concrete track. There is no need to run electricity along the track (except for lighting) because the Teslas are battery powered.

Elon Musk
Elon Musk Shows off the Mega-Tunnel He Built in Las Vegas and Promises Themed Opening Party
The Boring Company, founded by Elon Musk, was in charge of the Vegas Loop project, a large underground tunnel that will streamline tourist transport in the city.

Again, thank you for clarifying the concept for future readers of this new topic.

I expect this inexpensive alternative to traditional subway systems to become popular around the world.

(th)

SpaceNut · 2021-04-14 16:53:52

There is a Boring topic for Elon's tunnels also but this will do and in the same methods of creation you build, blow it up and keep trying to perfect the craft...

https://www.msn.com/en-us/travel/news/e … d=msedgdhp

https://www.autoweek.com/news/technolog … ar-tunnel/
with every prototype test of Boring Company tunnels and Hyperloop, each test that inches closer to the desired vision tends to reveal the expensive and narrow nature of the concept

So long there is cash he will keep trying.....

SpaceNut · 2022-05-08 20:03:50

Here is another Hyperloops, HighSpeed rail, Maglevs, Capsule Pipelines for Mars.

for lunar tunnels.

Mars_B4_Moon · 2022-07-05 08:08:54

Hyperloop: What is Elon Musk’s vision for vacuum tube train – and will it actually happen?
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/hyperloo … 58829.html

old news item

Take A Look At The Hyperloop Competition Entries
https://hackaday.com/2017/01/29/take-a- … n-entries/

With a couple of exceptions from a commercial entry and a high school, all of the entrants are backed by universities. They hail from all over the world, as far away as the Netherlands, Japan, and Australia, and their craft will compete in timed runs over a three-quarter mile scaled-down Hyperloop tube constructed on the highway outside the SpaceX lot. It is interesting to note the different design strategies taken, such as the choice of magnetic or pneumatic levitation, or even in some cases riding on conventional wheels.

Dead image link but the article was archived
https://web.archive.org/web/20180222104 … md-loop-14

SpaceNut · 2022-07-05 08:46:59

So far, no real specifics in the size of the tunnels or of the depth that they would be bored at. This is important as it effects the mass and energy requirements to perform the task.

Mars_B4_Moon · 2022-07-09 05:41:49

Switzerland Moves Ahead With Underground Autonomous Cargo Delivery: After half a decade of study, Cargo Sous Terrain is ready to start on its first tunnel.

https://spectrum.ieee.org/cargo-sous-terrain

Like so many concepts of this kind, six years ago it seemed like it was highly unlikely to ever happen. However, this past December, the Swiss parliament passed the necessary legal framework to enable underground freight transportation, meaning that the CST project can commence on August 1st.

Cargo sous terrain follows a similar principle to that of an automatic conveyor system. Automated, driverless transport vehicles which are able to pick up and deposit loads automatically from the designated ramps and lifts travel around the clock in the tunnels.

The vehicles, which travel on wheels and have an electric drive with induction rails, operate in three-track tunnels with a constant speed of around 30 kilometers per hour.

The goods are transported on pallets or in modified containers. Thanks to refrigeration-compatible transport vehicles, the transport of fresh and chilled goods is also possible. Attached to the roof of the tunnel is a rapid overhead track for smaller goods packages.

It will for the first time be economically viable to transport small volumes on individual pallets or containers on an ongoing basis. The continuous flow of small-component goods obviates the need for waiting times at transfer stations.

tahanson43206 · 2022-07-09 06:08:14

For Mars_B4_Moon re #8

Thank you for this ** very nice ** addition to the topic!

It seems to me (at first reading of your post) that this is a model for flow of goods between habitat clusters on Mars. Everything will be underground on Mars, except for power plant radiators and the occasional radiation tolerant green house.

(th)

Void · 2022-07-09 16:45:28

I am pretty close in view to you.

One item that I care to note is that when dealing with freight and robots, it may be that speed is not so much a value.

Speed increases friction and so energy use, and requires a greater fitness of the machinery, that may have a cost.

Of course, people don't want to have their time wasted at slow speeds.

I feel the same thing can be true on Mars, and also in transit through the solar system.

Speed has value in the transport of people, but not so much in the transport of bulk freight, provided people don't run out of materials essential to continuous survival provisions.

Done.

Mars_B4_Moon · 2023-11-29 08:50:25

I wonder if expansion would happen as other past nations have expanded by rail and tunnel subway systems, the growth and decline of the Argentine railways are tied heavily with the history of the country, its towns and cities and economy as a whole. As the trains expanded so did its economic routes and housing expanded along these routes.

A collapsed Mars lava chamber seen from space
https://phys.org/news/2023-11-collapsed … space.html

but on the surface of maybe radiation from a Solar Storm and Mars extreme temperature fluctuations, ranging from 20°C to -152°C

In Argentina
A valued resource was discovered, boomtowns pop up in a far away region or in remote parts of the country.

In high density populated cities they come up with new solutions

Seoul to trial seatless subway carriages to cut rush-hour congestion
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/ … congestion

Why Seoul Metro and Taipei MRT Are Two of the Top Subway Systems in Asia
https://wanderwisdom.com/transportation … Taipei-MTR

Australia, South East Sydney Transport Strategy of the New South Wales government envisions a metro line starting from the CBD with stations at Green Square, Randwick, two at Maroubra, Malabar and La Perouse built by 2041, as well as another one from Randwick to Eastlakes and, via the Domestic and International terminals of Sydney Airport, further on to Brighton-Le-Sands and then Kogarah by 2056
https://web.archive.org/web/20201101064 … rategy.pdf

In Greek news the Greek newspaper Ta Nea reported that the Greek government was considering a circular line from Ano Ilisia to Faros, via Dafni and Eleonas, as part of a "100 km (62 mi)" network
https://web.archive.org/web/20221004201 … iliometrwn

Canada Quebec mayor of Laval, Gilles Vaillancourt, with the ridership success of the current Laval extension, announced his wish to loop the Orange Line from Montmorency to Côte-Vertu stations with the addition of six (or possibly seven) new stations (three in Laval and another three in Montreal). He proposed that Transports Quebec, the provincial transport department, set aside $100 million annually to fund the project, which is expected to cost upwards of $1.5 billion
https://web.archive.org/web/20201101064 … rategy.pdf

The trains in Norway, Oslo Metro operates in all fifteen boroughs of Oslo, as well as reaching a bit inside the neighbouring municipality of Bærum. There are five lines, numbered 1 to 5, each colour-coded. They all pass through the Common Tunnel, serving eight branch lines. In addition two lines operate to the Ring Line. Two branches are served by two lines each: the Grorud branch is served by both lines 4 and 5, while the Lambertseter branch has full-time service by line 4 and limited service by line 1
https://web.archive.org/web/20160416042 … 042016.pdf

‘I lived in a beautiful European city where the public transport is a work of art’
https://www.express.co.uk/travel/articl … -exclusive

Other ideas On Earth

'Could You Live in a Train'?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9W2nA75zhSk

Mars_B4_Moon · 2023-11-29 15:36:38

Chinese researchers are studying the possibility of setting up a safe, stable and long-term shelter in lunar lava tubes.
https://www.australiannews.net/news/273 … on-shelter

what we make on Earth and what we discard and leave behind and do not use

Argentina
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAOCSZxJlgw

Sydney Metro train completes first journey
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IE-iLJ9ZSUY

Tunnels are still in use as living space on Earth today but they sometimes are not normal humans and might be homeless or people with other issues and using them as shelter.

Soviet Underground city in Ukraine

https://www.bitchute.com/video/aGJaVlUXnhqM/

Abandoned Railroad Tunnel + Lehigh Gorge State Park - South Lehigh Gorge Dr Jim Thorpe PA
https://rumble.com/v12w6vu-abandoned-ra … r-jim.html

Some might seem Almost like the Catacombs of Paris but those tunnels have millions left from plague and other chaotic times

Okuma abandoned place because of the Earthquake and disaster at Fukushima, in 2010, the town had a population of 11,515. However, the town was totally evacuated in the aftermath of the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear disaster, the populations near by have many abandoned hotels, schools, care homes, clinics, car dealerships, video game pinball pachinko arcades and other underground facility. Due to concerns about possible radiation exposure, Japanese government officials established an 18-mile no-fly zone around the facility, and the land area within a radius of 12.5 miles (20 km) around the plant, covering an area of 230 square miles (600 square km), was evacuated. In a third area that extended to a radius of 30 km around the plant, residents were asked to remain indoors. Ultimately, nearly 165,000 people left their homes and the area

On Mars people may go underground during a solar storm.

Fukushima’s Nuclear Exclusion Zone
https://medium.com/social-innovation-ja … 1998a1d560

“Caution: High-dose radiation area. Please pass through as quickly as possible.”

Since the road reopened in 2014, cars can pass through without special permission, but bicycles, motorcycles, and pedestrians are prohibited due to higher risk of radiation exposure.You need special permission to turn off the highway and enter residential areas.
QUOTE - This screenshot shows just how close the road gets to to the site of the crippled Fukushima Daichi Nuclear Power Plant.
“Ghost Towns” No More
Towns near the plant that were once empty are being gradually re-opened, slowly coming back to life.

'Fukushima's abandoned & frozen in time department store'
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRwLS54I8ig

When places are left abandoned the wildlife of wild Cats, wild Dogs and monkey takes over just as Wildlife had expanded in the exclusion zones of Chernobyl before the current war.

On Mars I don't know if an event like this would cause everyone to have dropped everything and left it for such a long time, perhaps material would already be recycled for re-use
Earthquakes on Mars will also be a rare event

on Earth perfectly dug tunnels left abandoned?

London different abandoned transport lines
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SF24CPX3wuw

2 miles Abandoned hidden away, Cincinnati metropolitan region Midwestern United States

https://youtube.com/watch?v=MFA_dnFeFqA

Tunnels beneath Boston

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFIo-dBlmjs

On Earth you could build a production facility at the South Pole but it won't happen, you could manufacture near the tops of the Himalaya Mountains and make use of these abandoned tunnels but it is not done.

However on Mars it might be a necessity to turn any place not very habitable on Earth and almost uninviting on Earth and turn it around on Mars and maybe it economically workable and turn such places into resources and improve the lives of Martian colonists.

Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2023-11-29 18:08:24)

Mars_B4_Moon · 2024-03-03 10:24:18

Here’s what it’s like to dig tunnels at Elon Musk’s Boring Company
https://www.aol.com/finance/dig-tunnels … 45725.html

Armenia Itinerary
https://wander-lush.org/ultimate-armenia-itinerary/

Montreal's Metro will be open all night for Nuit Blanche
https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/montreal-s- … -1.6784022

Riding the Rails in Argentina
https://www.railsouthamerica.com/blog-p … -argentina

Just how reliable is public transport in Norway?
https://www.thelocal.no/20240209/how-re … -in-norway
In bigger cities like Oslo and Bergen, the public transport systems, including trams, metro lines, and city buses, are well-integrated, making urban travel relatively straightforward and reliable

Hanoi's second metro line prepares for launch with French safety guide
https://e.vnexpress.net/news/news/traff … 17071.html

Meralco injects P280M to provide reliable power for Metro Manila subway project
https://mb.com.ph/2024/2/19/meralco-inj … ay-project

Outrage as Sydney train lines closed on Mardi Gras weekend: 'Unbelievable'
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl … vable.html

China is building a train that’s faster than a plane – but will it work?
https://www.independent.co.uk/tech/chin … 04794.html

Sweden, Stockholm, subway ride from Skanstull to Medborgarplatsen
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_7ofhlxGKo

PM Modi Set To Inaugurate India's First Underwater Metro Tunnel In Kolkata
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6s_HwdD2s-g

SpaceNut · 2024-11-24 18:12:45

Happened on a movie that shows the high speed transit that links cities in Genesis II video on tube

https://youtu.be/67qGuYOpSZE?si=Yg9dZg4p6vMWlfHa

tahanson43206 · 2024-11-24 18:18:22

For SpaceNut re #14

Thanks for the tip and the link!

I asked Google about Genesis II, and it came back with quite a collection of snippets:

The GE Genesis is a series of locomotives that have been used by Amtrak for over 20 years. The Genesis was originally known as the AMD-103, but was later renamed the P40DC. The Genesis has been used for both intercity high-speed corridors and long-distance passenger trains.
Here are some other high-speed trains:
Engines of Amtrak - GE Genesis [REMAKE] - YouTube
Jan 11, 2023 — General Electric was chosen to manufacture a replacement. It went under the name AMD-103, but would later better be kn...
YouTube ·
AmtrakGuy365
California High-Speed Rail - Wikipedia
Plans, construction and project status. ... The project is split into two major phases: Phase 1 is to connect from San Francisco v...
Wikipedia
Generative AI is experimental.

I deleted a lot that didn't seem related to the subject.

(th)

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#1 2021-03-25 11:19:41

Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

#2 2021-03-25 18:04:17

Re: Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

#3 2021-03-26 11:27:02

Re: Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

#4 2021-04-14 16:53:52

Re: Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

#5 2022-05-08 20:03:50

Re: Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

#6 2022-07-05 08:08:54

Re: Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

#7 2022-07-05 08:46:59

Re: Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

#8 2022-07-09 05:41:49

Re: Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

#9 2022-07-09 06:08:14

Re: Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

#10 2022-07-09 16:45:28

Re: Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

#11 2023-11-29 08:50:25

Re: Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

#12 2023-11-29 15:36:38

Re: Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

#13 2024-03-03 10:24:18

Re: Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

#14 2024-11-24 18:12:45

Re: Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

#15 2024-11-24 18:18:22

Re: Tunnel Transportation on Earth, Mars or Luna

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