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SpaceNut

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From: New Hampshire

Registered: 2004-07-22

Posts: 29,433

Power of Earths Oceans

Measure for the claim being discussed in another topic.

why are we not using the planets oceans to produce power?

This metric, called wave power, has been increasing in direct association with historical warming of the ocean surface. The upper ocean warming, measured as a rising trend in sea-surface temperatures, has influenced wind patterns globally, and this, in turn, is making ocean waves stronger. Ocean Warming is Making Waves Much More Powerful University of California researchers found wave power increased globally by 0.4% every year since 1948.

Global warming is fueling stronger ocean waves

28% increase in wave power?  That sounds counter intuitive. Even if it has increased 28%, it's had virtually no effect on the European coastline. Indeed parts of the mainland e.g. in the Netherlands have expanded since 1948.

Here's the link to the paper itself, rather than the article published from UPI:

A recent increase in global wave power as a consequence of oceanic warming

Of course wave power is one of the missing pieces in the jigsaw.  Wave power was once seen in the UK as something that had more potential than wind energy but various schemes got nowhere. But we know the energy is there and is more consistent that local wind. However, currently it really isn't economic as far as anyone can tell.

Not sure about the missing jigsaw puzzle but why did we not get more energy from the oceans?

SpaceNut

Administrator

From: New Hampshire

Registered: 2004-07-22

Posts: 29,433

Re: Power of Earths Oceans

So what is the energy, what conditions must be the limits for it to work....

Whats the research thats been done and why have we not done it yet?

Wave power is the capture of energy of wind waves to do useful work – for example, electricity generation, water desalination, or pumping water. A machine that exploits wave power is a wave energy converter.

Ocean Wave Energy Resource. Wave power varies considerably in different parts of the world. Areas of the world with abundant wave power resource include the western coasts of Scotland, northern Canada, southern Africa, Australia, and the northwestern coast of the United States, particularly Alaska.

elderflower

Member

Registered: 2016-06-19

Posts: 1,262

Re: Power of Earths Oceans

Ocean waves are wind driven. They only transmit wind energy from source to coasts.

SpaceNut

Administrator

From: New Hampshire

Registered: 2004-07-22

Posts: 29,433

Re: Power of Earths Oceans

I did indicate that but maybe it was not as clear as it could have been.

Getting only half of the winds power as its not being caught by a windmill means that there is lots of power still yet to get from the wave that is wind pushed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wave_power

https://inhabitat.com/wave-energy-aquab … generator/

http://www.alternative-energy-news.info … ve-energy/

http://www.reuk.co.uk/wordpress/wave/ma … generator/

Tidal power farms sustainably harnass renewable energy generated by lunar cycles, wave power parks take advantage of the natural repetitive motion of the surface of water and hydroelectic power plants harvest the kinetic energy produced by gravitation from changes in water levels.

https://www.momtastic.com/webecoist/200 … dal-power/

SpaceNut

Administrator

From: New Hampshire

Registered: 2004-07-22

Posts: 29,433

Re: Power of Earths Oceans

Wow this has been sitting idle for quite some time.

These Floaters Turns Ocean Waves Into Renewable Energy

hydraulic system accumulation of wave movement.

Void

Member

Registered: 2011-12-29

Posts: 7,830

Re: Power of Earths Oceans

Good.

This is another one: https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottsnowd … 791d7f8c14

If Europe does not decay entirely from the current economic mess, then they may do great things and North American and others will be able to as well.

A thing about a knowledge accumulating culture(s) is that over time it becomes more likely that they will make it all work.  Even the recycling of solar panels and wind turbines.

Breaking down plastics to materials to remake plastics seems to be in reach.  Before, plastics were this thing you had to put into land fill.

Done

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kbd512

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Registered: 2015-01-02

Posts: 7,858

Re: Power of Earths Oceans

Void,

When you refrain form building things that don't last very long, with intermittent and marginal total output, that can only be recycled with great difficulty, then it tends to have the knock-on effect of making all the other more pressing problems easier to resolve.  To wit, if Germany had not blown mad money on wind and solar, they could've built enough nuclear reactors to not care about what the Russians did with their oil and gas.  France decided a long time ago that burning coal was not a sustainable way to generate electricity.  They have far more "energy independence" than Germany does right now, but they didn't do it by blowing money on wind turbines and photovoltaics.

Void

Member

Registered: 2011-12-29

Posts: 7,830

Re: Power of Earths Oceans

Hello kdb512.

It looks to me that my post is true, and so is yours.

The example of Germany is a cherry pick (-).  A very hard case.  And what you have said, could easily be sustained, in the current now as rather true.

But now let me cherry pick as well:
Texas (+) Solar and Wind.
Australia (+) Solar.
UK {+) Wind.

I am sure I have missed some.

If "Necessity is the mother of invention.", then we have a real "Mother" situation going on now.

Even if renewables only ever occupy a small amount of world energy, what I posted is true.  And if fossil fuels at a competitive price run out, it becomes even more true.  Nuclear?  Well, yes, "Smoke-em if you got-em".

How Germany got to this situation is its own thing.  They had no strong thinking among their power elites, that this was the deal they would get.  We only now have this brutal awakening.  Otherwise, although some "Donld Trump", gave counsel about it, he was mocked.

And we cannot know, it is possible that the Elites knew this was a possibility.   But some people think that the suffering of the people can be a good thing.  And if you are an Elite, you probably think you are going to be in the "In" crowd anyway and will be just fine and maybe even get into a "Money&Power" move of some kind.

I think a lot of people don't really understand the above mentality.  If you were a NAZI, really the hatred of an ethnic group was simply a useful political move.  Your real goal was to set groups against each other, as this would use a Darwinist tool to bring your genius creation, a "Superman", all you have to do is arrange the killing off of the weak, with conflicts.

But I am getting off topic.  I was adding the above to make it possible to understand how it can be that a nation can be led to a bad circumstance with seeming bad decisions.  In part it is lack of understanding by many, and in part it is possibly those who from an Elite position can possibly even secretly practice a cruel guidance method, thinking they are doing a holy thing.

Is this the case of Germany now?  Probably only some of the Elites would feel that way, most would not.  But it is good to be aware of this possibility in the energy situation.  The lazy version of this would be "Well, if we can get energy from Russia, fine, we will do a different plan if that supply is cut".

From a common person's point of view as we can expect that here in the USA we have some of those as well, we should want to anticipate that some Elites in power simply consider a social disruption an adventure, and very entertaining, and an opportunity to gain a power&money move(s).

Therefore, public utilities as well as public transportation can be more easily disrupted.  So, things from Elon Musk may be good for private citizens to perhaps partially escape the top-down control moves.

If I have a Tesla solar installation on my house, it only would provide some percent of my needs, and perhaps in some time periods little to nothing.  But in a social disruption engineered by psychopathic Elites, you would still have some power some of the time.

And if you had an electric car as well, you could perhaps charge it for several days, and then drive somewhere for things needed.

So, in the USA, that would apply in many areas, but not so much for Germany as far as the solar goes.

So, in terms of energy it is not just "Man against Nature", it is also "Man against Man".  We do have psychopaths, and some of them get to positions of power.

If you look at the events of WWII, think it another way as a trial run.  You think you are of a genius class.  The lower classes look inferior as they may not dress as well, and may also be less clean, as they may have to do work.  You, being a complete idiot, think that you can do a brilliant thing and eliminate the weaklings, producing a superior race(s).

On the surface you tell the main portion of the population that a minority needs to be put down as they have been causing the problems.  You also tell them that they are a superior race.  Then you chase down the minority, and act against the common ones you can catch.  You then send your supposed superior race to war in hopes of plunder and revenge.

On the battlefield, you kill off the weak on your side and the other sides.  You kill off most of the minority that you have chosen to persecute.

So, actually they think they have done a brilliant thing, as they have purified both the majority group and also even though most people don't see it, you have also purified the minority group.  Survival of the fit.  And all the time you have been at to top, running things, and having a rather good sadistic time.

Just to be sure it is understood where I stand on this, I think that the above process damages the human race, as it only cultivates them for certain features, and the policy of identifying the "Inferiors", and eliminating them reduces future options to develop new skills and features in the population.  Lots of mutations are illness prone, but it is that pathway that may lead to the "New".

And so, I return to the value of individual solar installations, and electric cars.

As far as recycling, given enough junk of that kind, that problem will likely be solved over time.

Done.

Last edited by Void (2022-11-21 09:08:51)

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SpaceNut

Administrator

From: New Hampshire

Registered: 2004-07-22

Posts: 29,433

Re: Power of Earths Oceans

Those green systems are about collecting the energy for use and does nothing to abate the ever rising need to have more than what we produce. Industrial nations waste more energy than they need to in the process of making goods. In the same note the goods are also another energy need that when we look at do we need or just desire we would find that we are again wasting money needlessly on them.

The image I posted about the hydraulic system is interesting in that mother nature is supplying the energy to make the float move and with that the piston displaces the fluid but since I do not have a total working knowledge of the turbines and accumulators is hard to see how much is really being collected.

As far as nuclear seem there is a strong desire to keep what we have running rather than turning them off currently and will post that in another topic.

Void

Member

Registered: 2011-12-29

Posts: 7,830

Re: Power of Earths Oceans

Yes, that seems reasonable as a "Goal", Spacenut.  So long as we don't go the Neopaegan route, and start think that a kill off of people would really be best for the planet.

Done.

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SpaceNut

Administrator

From: New Hampshire

Registered: 2004-07-22

Posts: 29,433

Re: Power of Earths Oceans

Ocean City wind farm controversy grows ahead of 2024 construction

SpaceNut

Administrator

From: New Hampshire

Registered: 2004-07-22

Posts: 29,433

Re: Power of Earths Oceans

How do you capture the ocean’s energy? Peek under the hood of a startup’s ‘anti-boat’ power device

The larger Triton will ultimately be its utility-scale product, capable of generating 1 megawatt of power and designed for installing in arrays, while the Triton-C is suited for electrifying remote communities or sites such as aquaculture facilities, ocean observation platforms and naval bases.