Power to Ammonia for Energy Storage

SpaceNut · 2020-09-27 10:34:20

Just saw that Saudi Arabia was sending that blue ammonia to Japan. Sounds interesting.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets … li=BBnbfcL

Quite a large amount to be used in power production.

For Mars .at first will be a low use as nitrogen is not plentiful but is worth looking at for long term storage.

tahanson43206 · 2020-09-27 10:53:57

Following up with SpaceNut re #26

Thanks for the reminder nitrogen is in short supply on Mars.

It definitely would need to be supplemented from outside sources to support significant growth of the Martian economy.

This is a business opportunity for those who can manage the challenges of setting up a complex process to operate in free space. There are many materials that should be of value to future Martians, and the free traders are sure to be present as the Solar System economy grows.

(th)

tahanson43206 · 2020-11-06 06:07:10

Here is an update on the theme of using Ammonia as an energy storage medium ...

In this case, serious (ie, well funded) research is under way to establish feasibility of powering large ocean going vessels with Ammonia.

There is a useful charge showing energy content of various fuels (per liter) ... I hope it shows up here ...

By early 2024, Man Energy Solutions plans to install an ammonia-ready engine on a ship. The first models will be dual-fuel, able to run on traditional marine gas oil as well.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/foul-smellin … 28485.html

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Calliban · 2020-11-06 15:36:52

The problem with using ammonia as fuel is that we must first use electricity to carry out electrolysis of water, yielding hydrogen. We must then combine the hydrogen with gaseous nitrogen and heat it to 500C in a chemical reactor (Haber-Bosch process). Both steps consume energy. In order to assess the practicality of ammonia as fuel, someone would need to crack the numbers for net efficiency (from first electricity to final mechanical power) of storing energy this way.

On the plus side, it is liquid at low pressures at typical Martian temperatures.

Last edited by Calliban (2020-11-06 15:45:56)

SpaceNut · 2020-11-07 14:08:33

The cold of mars seems a good fit for the use of ammonia as a working fuel storage method other nitrogen uses....

kbd512 · 2020-11-08 00:06:28

Calliban,

Whereas Lithium-ion batteries are 350Wh/L, LNH3 is 3,500Wh/L. LNH3 doesn't decompose as rapidly as gasoline or diesel or kerosene and the chemical constituents are easily recyclable, unlike Lithium-ion batteries. LNH3 is much easier to store than LH2 or LNG, and a regenerative fuel cell can be used to both create Hydrogen and consume it, so long as it can be stored indefinitely, as LNH3 can.

SpaceNut · 2020-11-30 18:15:02

tahanson43206 wrote:

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/scot … 51696.html
Scottish homes will use 100-percent green hydrogen in world first
I was glad to see this report of a trial in 300 homes for four years.
It seems to me this is a much more practical way of heating homes on Mars than traditional methane would be.
The efficiency of production of hydrogen from Martian water would be superior to the net efficiency of trying to make methane.
The output of the consumption of hydrogen in Martian homes would be water vaper, which would be desirable in any case.
Wind power is not in the cards for Mars, but nuclear and PV power seem like reasonable options.
(th)

64896520-32fe-11eb-bada-8189e507c1e7

The only difference is decomposition where the energy for electrolysis comes in with the remaining system still the same.

tahanson43206 · 2021-06-09 13:43:11

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/100- … 00278.html

How A 100 Year Old Science Experiment Helped Create The Fuel Of The Future
Editor OilPrice.com
Tue, June 8, 2021, 7:00 PM

The article at the link above is about Ammonia.

It ** should ** be similar in outlook to some of the posts of kbd512 on the subject.

(th)

Calliban · 2021-06-09 16:19:54

On Earth, wind power is at least a better technological option for producing hydrogen than is solar power. Compared to thermal plants (coal and nuclear), a MWh of wind electricity, requires rough ten times more steel. For solar PV the factor is closer to 100 tines more. And wind turbines have capacity factor of 20-40%, dependent upon siting. That has strong cost impacts, because the capacity factor of the electrolysis stack is an important cost driver. To make ammonia from hydrogen, process heat is needed ~500°C in the presence of an iron oxide catalyst.

tahanson43206 · 2021-07-18 13:37:39

https://www.intelligentliving.co/ammoni … he-future/

Experts Hail Ammonia As The Fuel of The Future
by Andrea D. SteffenJune 24, 2021
SHARE2
A lot of the clean energy movement’s early attention was focused on lithium-ion batteries because of the electric vehicle markets. However, lithium alone might not provide enough power to support a complete transition of heavier industries.
But all sectors need to convert to clean and sustainable energy sources if the world is to meet zero carbon goals. So, that’s why many of the heavy industries (like shipping and maritime) are searching for alternatives to lithium-ion batteries.

This is a general-public level article, but I thought it might be worth adding to the mix at NewMars.

The link came from FriendOfQuark1, who checks in from time to time to see what the forum is up to.

(th)

Mars_B4_Moon · 2022-10-09 16:51:30

NH3 carrier with NH3 propulsion

DSME receives Approval in Principle for an 86K NH3 Carrier with NH3 Propulsion
https://www.tankeroperator.com/news/dsm … 13305.aspx
Bureau Veritas has delivered an Approval in Principle to Daewoo Shipbuilding & Marine Engineering Co., Ltd. for design and development

Calliban · 2022-10-09 17:27:31

Mars_B4_Moon wrote:

NH3 carrier with NH3 propulsion
DSME receives Approval in Principle for an 86K NH3 Carrier with NH3 Propulsion
https://www.tankeroperator.com/news/dsm … 13305.aspx
Bureau Veritas has delivered an Approval in Principle to Daewoo Shipbuilding & Marine Engineering Co., Ltd. for design and development

The link doesn't seem to be working. But this is an interesting development. Given that LNG is a cryogenic liquid, there may be better economics for converting natural gas into ammonia, rather than cooling it to -160°C. Anhydrous ammonia is a liquid when chilled to -33°C. And the very high heat of evaporation of ammonia will tend to keep it liquid within large tanks. There is already a huge market for ammonia around the world. It is a fertiliser and is the starting material for production of nitric acid. Another interesting fact that I learned recently is that it can be blended with petrol and diesel to produce a fuel that will burn in existing ICEs.

The problem with ammonia as a replacement fuel, is that most of the world no longer has really cheap natural gas. Usually, the hydrogen needed to synthesise ammonia is derived from steam reforming of methane. For electricity to provide the hydrogen needed at a comparable cost, it would need to be very cheap. Kbd512 has discussed the establishment of solar powered fuel factories in other threads. Ammonia is one possible product. As it is a storable liquid, we could put solar fuel factories whereever there is sufficient sunlight and a coastal area capable of receiving tankers. If ammonia is synthesised, we do not need CO2 extraction from sea water. We need modest amounts of water to supply the electrolysis stacks. The nitrogen is extracted directly from the air. The same unit that extracts N2 could also seperate other air products, like noble gases.

Last edited by Calliban (2022-10-09 17:34:45)

SpaceNut · 2022-10-09 18:02:26

here is the bit that matters

The main characteristics and dimensions of the vessel are approximately 230m in overall length, 36.6m in breadth, and a depth of 22.5m. It will be equipped with four (4) prismatic-type cargo tanks with a total capacity of approximately 86,000 cubic meters.

Calliban · 2022-10-11 01:17:34

There has been some discussion on this board recently on the topics of compressed air and liquid air energy storage. When considered as vehicle energy sources, both work better as part of a hybrid ICE concept than they do as standalone energy sources. One idea that interests me is an ICE that is fed with compressed air or oxygen from a LOX tank. This eliminates the pumping losses in the engine associated with compression. A small gas turbine burning ammonia and pure oxygen from a LOX tank, would be extremely compact as it wouldn't need a compressor. There would be no parasitic energy losses from a compressor, so fuel economy would be greatly increased.

There has been much discussion in media of electric aeroplanes. The problem that limits applicability of battery electric to this application is the poor mass energy density of electrochemical energy sources, with are typically no more than 2% the energy density of diesel. A better idea for aircraft propulsion is synthetic chemical fuels. Ammonia would be a good option, as it is a storable liquid and is emission free, producing water vapour and nitrogen gas on combustion. One option that could be considered for short to medium range flights, is engines fuelled with aqueous ammonia and liquid oxygen. Whilst the O2 required would be considerably heavier than the fuel, using it eliminates compressor work from the gas turbines. The engines can be sleek, with lower air resistance and would achieve roughly double the propulsive of conventional engines per unit fuel consumption. The turbines would drive turbo-props, which have superior propulsive efficiency to jet engines. The aircraft could be propelled by a single pusher turboprop built into the tail of the aircraft.

Last edited by Calliban (2022-10-11 01:20:15)

SpaceNut · 2022-10-11 11:01:24

It's another form of a hybrid to make use of the exhaust heat to cause air or other gasses to expand through a turbine that can be used to aid in battery charging or for direct drive much as an air gun would happen.

Calliban · 2022-10-17 04:38:15

Ammonia is a surfactant.
https://chemistry.stackexchange.com/que … a-and-oils

Presumably, if an affordable supply of ammonia can be produced, it can be mixed with heavy oils, like Canadian tar and used to produce a less viscous liquid than can be burned in engines. This might provide a useful option for extending liquid fuel supplies.

Bio oils from pyrolsis of biomass have the problem of high oxygen content, which causes them to polmerise. I wonder if ammonia can solve this problem as well?

This site is dedicated to the use of ammonia as fuel.
https://www.nh3fuelassociation.org/

Last edited by Calliban (2022-10-17 05:02:33)

tahanson43206 · 2023-05-08 17:22:29

Thanks to kbd512 for providing this topic!

Here is an update that seems a close fit...

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/y-co … 42587.html

Ammopnia appears to be a key factor in this design ...

Benzinga
Y-Combinator Backed Airthium's Breakthrough Engine Aims to Replace Fossil Fuels and Decarbonize Industrial Heat and Power Generation
Caleb Naysmith
Mon, May 8, 2023 at 4:19 PM EDT
Airthium, a clean technology company based in Austin, Texas, has developed an innovative heat engine designed to replace fossil fuels and decarbonize industrial heat and power generation. The company has plans to deploy its technology to address a $138 billion per year business opportunity in the clean energy sector. The company is currently raising from retail investors to help scale the solution, and seeing substantial traction.

Led by a team of six PhDs and advised by the CEO of General Electric Company Renewable Energy, Airthium has developed an award-winning clean energy engine that delivers record efficiency, low costs, and zero carbon emissions. The company’s goal is to first decarbonize industrial heat between 160 and 500°C (3% of global CO2 emissions) and then electric power generation (30% of global CO2 emissions) using the same heat engine technology.
Airthium’s heat engine offers a game-changing solution for industrial heat and power generation, as it can efficiently convert electricity to heat and vice versa at temperatures of up to 550°C. The company plans to first target the $13 billion per year industrial heat market, followed by the $125 billion per year seasonal storage market, by providing a clean, low-cost alternative to fossil fuels.
To stay updated with top startup news & investments, sign up for Benzinga's Startup Investing & Equity Crowdfunding Newsletter
The company’s initial focus will be on industries with significant demand for heat in the 160-550°C segment, such as paper, food and beverage, chemicals, and automotive. Airthium has identified its heat pump technology as a viable solution to replace gas-fired boilers and dryers, leading to significant CO2 emission reductions.
In the long term, Airthium aims to provide 100% clean electric power at scale by using its heat engine as the core of a seasonal energy storage system. This storage system, which combines CO2-free synthetic ammonia combustion and pumped heat energy storage (PHES) in molten salt or sand, offers a storage capital cost 100 times lower than lithium-ion batteries and thousands of hours of storage duration.
This revolutionary seasonal energy storage system has the potential to fully replace fossil fuels as a backup power source, eliminating the majority of CO2 emissions produced by fossil-fired power generation. With the widespread deployment of Airthium’s technology, solar and wind energy can become the dominant electricity sources by 2050, despite the rise in electricity generation due to electrification.
Airthium’s experienced team, backed by investors and industry support, is currently working on building the first 550°C (1022 °F) prototype, set to be completed in 2023. The company plans to commercialize its heat engine technology and partner with leading industrial companies to make a significant impact on the global clean energy market and fight against climate change.
See more on startup investing from Benzinga.

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Calliban · 2023-06-09 02:09:01

The world's first ammonia powered semi-truck tested.
https://www.nextbigfuture.com/2023/06/a … truck.html

To synthesise ammonia cheaply enough to displace diesel, we need cheap electricity driving electrolysis, an air seperation plant producing pure nitrogen and a Haber-Bosch reactor. All of this equipment has high capital cost and is intolerant of thermal gradients. So it really needs to run at full capacity 24/7. Scale economies are important for driving down marginal capital and operating costs, which is why most chemical synthesis plants tend to be large. This sort of thing doesn't work with a fluctuating power supply. It will need low cost and reliable 24/7 power. So this isn't likely to be something that can be rolled out small scale, at the edge of some wind farm providing it with occasional bursts of power. More likely, it will be built adjacent to a multi-GW nuclear powerplant.

tahanson43206 · 2023-06-09 06:06:07

For Calliban re #43

Thanks for this update!

It would be interesting to know who has invested in the technology reported here.

If someone in the forum has time to investigate, a report would be welcome.

June 8, 2023 by Brian Wang
Amogy Inc., a pioneer of emission-free, energy-dense ammonia power solutions, announced today the successful testing of the first-ever ammonia-powered, zero-emission semi truck. Amogy has received $150 million in funding.

The article shows examples of ammonia use in boats.

Brian Wang is a Futurist Thought Leader and a popular Science blogger with 1 million readers per month. His blog Nextbigfuture.com is ranked #1 Science News Blog. It covers many disruptive technology and trends including Space, Robotics, Artificial Intelligence, Medicine, Anti-aging Biotechnology, and Nanotechnology.
Known for identifying cutting edge technologies, he is currently a Co-Founder of a startup and fundraiser for high potential early-stage companies. He is the Head of Research for Allocations for deep technology investments and an Angel Investor at Space Angels.

(th)

SpaceNut · 2024-04-08 12:31:00

Researchers use nitrogen-based compounds as new high-performance energy storage materials

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High-energy density materials (HEDMs) Nitrogen-bearing compounds are among the most effective choices for HEDMs. Nitrogen's ability to form various stable and energetically favorable bonds of different order, single N-N, double N=N, or triple N≡N, allows for the synthesis of a wide range of compounds with tailored properties.

https://dx.doi.org/10.1038/s41467-024-46313-9

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#26 2020-09-27 10:34:20

Re: Power to Ammonia for Energy Storage

#27 2020-09-27 10:53:57

Re: Power to Ammonia for Energy Storage

#28 2020-11-06 06:07:10

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#29 2020-11-06 15:36:52

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#30 2020-11-07 14:08:33

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#31 2020-11-08 00:06:28

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#32 2020-11-30 18:15:02

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#33 2021-06-09 13:43:11

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#34 2021-06-09 16:19:54

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#35 2021-07-18 13:37:39

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#36 2022-10-09 16:51:30

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#37 2022-10-09 17:27:31

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#38 2022-10-09 18:02:26

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#39 2022-10-11 01:17:34

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#40 2022-10-11 11:01:24

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#41 2022-10-17 04:38:15

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#42 2023-05-08 17:22:29

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#43 2023-06-09 02:09:01

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#44 2023-06-09 06:06:07

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#45 2024-04-08 12:31:00

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