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Just opening this thread for discussion of a lengthy paper by Kufel, Zampedri, Reiss and Friesch of Loyola Marymount University. Apparently it got a thumbs up from Elon Musk...
https://digitalcommons.lmu.edu/cgi/view … ntext=ulra
Page 7 "The Moon provides an ideal setting for ensuring our readiness for this. It is significantly closer to us than the red spherewith a travel time of a few days instead of months, and replicatesmany of the obstacles we will face on Mars."
Hmmm...yes, to a degree, but no to a more significant degree. It's an entirely different sort of celestial body with a totally different sort of day-night profile and no atmosphere. In many ways parts of Earth - eg dry rocky deserts - are a better model for what we face on Mars.
The moon does provide us with an opportunity to test potential crew members - maybe have them in zero G for a month and mayb e testing out cargo unloading on the Moon might be helpful.
Let's Go to Mars...Google on: Fast Track to Mars blogspot.com
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Page 7 - "throughout Phase 1, various reusable rocket flights to the Moon and back will take place to test our technologies and procedures in close cooperation with our main partner, SpaceX."
This is rather fascinating! Are they actually partnered with Space X then? All may yet be revealed...
Page 8 - "This [international lunar] outpost will serve as both a refueling station and a launch-pad to send our first supplies to Mars in 2033."
Not sure why you'd need the Moon for this purpose. They are proposing resource extraction on the Moon...but what can you find on the Moon that you can't find on Earth or Mars? I find this proposal unconvincing.
The seem to view the lunar outpost as a potentially lucrative source of materials for sale back on Earth (even with a cheap Starship, that ain't gonna work) as well as the perfect testing ground for a Mars Mission. They go on to say:
Page 12 - "In the long-term scope of our mission, with the resources we see necessary to bring with us to Mars, the Moon outpost will be a fruitful investment that will greatly help us lower down thetotal mission costs of making a Martian colony. The Moon not only offers cheaper launch costs, but also has plenty of natural resources we can strategically take advantage of. "
I am not convinced at all by this lunar outpost. It seems like a huge diversion of resources into doing things on the Moon which we can do on Mars. People on Earth have a proprietary feel about the Moon. You can't assume people are going to be happy with you digging up the lunar surface for commercial extraction. This seems a shaky and possibly fatal start to the Mission.
Lunar involvement in the Mars Mission should be kept to the absolute minimum - essentially testing out coms, habs and so on. A lot of testing can be done on Earth, just as all the testing for the Mars Rovers was done on Earth.
Let's Go to Mars...Google on: Fast Track to Mars blogspot.com
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It's worth reading through but I am getting the impression it must be the work of students. It seems rather jejune, naive.
The assumption that all countries on Earth will share their enthusiasm for turning Mars into a beacon of free enterprise is one such example. CCP China will want to dominate Mars as it seeks to dominate Earth. Powerful religions will want to project their religious dogmas on to Mars. Big Tech will want to make Mars a place safe for billionaires. They would be swimming with sharks, while thinking they are in a play pool!
I like the Marsha habs. But the idea that each crew member should have their own Marsha house as that will reduce crew fiction is very simplistic! Crew friction is more likely to arise I think if everyone does have their own place...status immediately becomes an issue.
I don't recall seeing the JAXA-Toyota rover design before. It does look like it has been designed for long range exploration, so interesting.
Some of it just doesn't make sense e.g. on the one hand they say the base will be in Arcadia Planitia with plenty of sub-surface ice around on the other, they seem to be talking terms of transporting water ice from the North Pole cap. There's is plenty of water ice at the boundary of Arcadia Planitia and Amazonis Planitia where JPL has identified suitable landing sites.
Let's Go to Mars...Google on: Fast Track to Mars blogspot.com
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One thing comes to mind for why the moon first as it requires less long term planning to survive the length of time for transit from earth to the moon but from there if we do not have a foot hold established we are in for a rough ride for either location in a mass exodus.
If there is no reason to leave quickly then we have a few more options from outposts to explore to full set up settlements, that range from Venus cloud cities, many of the asteroids and even a large planets moons for Jupiter or Saturn...
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