Elon Musk plans unmanned mission to the red planet, by 2018

Tom Kalbfus · 2016-04-28 07:44:07

Elon Musk plans unmanned mission to the red planet, by 2018
By ALYSSA NEWCOMB
10 hours ago

Good Morning America

Elon Musk plans unmanned mission to the red planet, by 2018 (ABC News)

SpaceX CEO Elon Musk wants to send an unmanned mission to Mars by 2018.

The privately held space company announced today it plans to send one of its Dragon spacecraft on a test flight to the Red Planet, where it could yield valuable information about landing large payloads on the surface. The findings could help Musk one day fulfill his goal of colonizing Mars.

NASA has estimated a trip to Mars could take eight months via rocket. Musk tweeted that although his Dragon 2 rocket is designed to land anywhere in the solar system, it would be a less-than-ideal vessel for the journey to Mars since it offers about as much space as an SUV.

Last year, SpaceX showed off an animation of its Falcon Heavy rocket, which is so powerful it can blast off carrying a payload as heavy as a commercial jetliner packed with hundreds of passengers, luggage and fuel.

While space aficionados will have to wait for more details on the Mars launch plans, the company is set for another rocket launch and landing attempt next month.

The company's next satellite launch is scheduled for May 3, a company representative told ABC News today. While SpaceX will once again try to land its Falcon 9 booster at sea after sending the payload into orbit, the particular rocket used in this launch won't be the one SpaceX landed on a ship during the historic April 8 mission.

That rocket is undergoing testing and once it's certified for re-use, could fly again as early as June, according to Musk.
https://gma.yahoo.com/elon-musk-could-s … c_src=copy

Tom Kalbfus · 2016-04-28 07:52:00

One question is what would he put in the capsule? What would he put on the capsule? What would power the capsule? What could be kept alive in the capsule. I was thinking perhaps a plant experiment, an onboard robot might grow plants in a tray next to a window. See how they grow under Martian gravity with light through he window.

Last edited by Tom Kalbfus (2016-04-28 07:57:58)

RobS · 2016-04-28 08:31:01

This is the best and most complete article I have seen so far: https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2016/04 … s-mission/

Chris Bergin posted it very quickly, too; he must have had sources. NASA will be placing some instruments on the Dragon, but which ones are still unspecified. NASA will provide communications and navigational support; Space X will provide a free ride for their instruments; all NASA data will be released to the public; Space X will provide NASA all EDL data; no exchange of funds will occur. The launch window is May 2018. It's a great example of cooperation.

GW Johnson · 2016-04-28 09:36:12

I really look forward to this mission. It will demo the nearest-term most certain method of multi-ton delivery to Mars: the retropropulsive landing. The same propulsive landing is "prime" for crewed Dragons returning to Earth; the chutes are but an emergency back-up.

GW

Tom Kalbfus · 2016-04-28 11:00:41

Maybe they could be used to preposition supplies for a future manned Mars mission, say for instance a rover traverse.

Excelsior · 2016-04-28 13:37:18

Supplies sure, but your limited to a meter sized hole in the top to get it out.

louis · 2016-04-28 15:00:43

Brilliant news! I think we can be sure Musk will be thinking out of the box, so there will be surprises along the way. He may be looking to land his greenhouse experiment which was why he got interested in Mars in the first place. I wouldn't be surprised if Musk will also seek to improve on the sort of visual data that gets sent back...I wonder whether that is technically feasible. I hope so. I am sure Musk realises how he could really get the public on side if he can send back some stunning video of the planet!

SpaceNut · 2016-04-28 20:23:51

I sort of get bugged by the duplicate topic creation and here are a couple more on the Red Dragon Capsule....

http://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=6078
http://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=6171
http://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=6802
http://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=7106
http://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=7336

GW Johnson · 2016-04-29 08:41:11

This pretty much the same Red Dragon one-way probe mission that NASA ignored for a long time. I'm glad to see NASA is finally enthusiastic about this. It's about time.

Red Dragon is Dragon v2 re-rigged without seats or life support. The original proposal included a potential sample return. This thing has a side hatch as well as a nose docking hatch, don't forget. There was supposed to be a sample arm or tiny rover getting samples back to a small ascent rocket somehow built into the capsule.

Among the returns from such a mission is a demo of high-velocity entry heat protection, followed by propulsive landing without chutes, of what was originally supposed to be 1 or at most 2 tons of scientific equipment on Mars. The propulsive landing makes site elevation and "air" density irrelevant. It can be landed anywhere on the planet. Recent stories up the deliverable mass to the 2-4 ton range. We'll see.

Such a thing is inherently one-way: all the propellant is used just to land. There is no taking off. Even if refueled, there would be insufficient delta-vee to come close to making orbit. But, a manned version could be a bailout abort cabin for a larger lander vehicle, something I noticed a couple of years ago. And THAT is a very intriguing possibility, is it not?

GW

Tom Kalbfus · 2016-04-29 11:32:31

It might be interesting if it could bring something alive to Mars, just to test out the life support of the capsule. Maybe a robot inside the capsule, an airlock, and have the robot go outside just to test it out. But I think capsule usually completely depressurize, killing whatever was inside that wasn't wearing a spacesuit. Maybe a small airlock so something could go outside., like the Sojourner rover.

SpaceNut · 2016-04-29 19:34:15

I was reading the comments over on Nasawatch and came across this image of a lunar lander or for that fact a mars lander....

original.jpg?w=600&h

Specifically, 3.71 m/s^2 of gravity, a 3.7 m diameter, 6000 kg, and an atmospheric density of 6e-3 kg/m^2 (all rough numbers, but good enough for a back of the envelope estimate) gives me a terminal velocity of 590 m/s.
The Dragon 2 uses 8 SuperDracos, at 73 kN each, for an acceleration of 97 m/s^2 on a 6000 kg spacecraft. Less Mars gravity, that's a 6 second burn to slow from terminal velocity to zero. At a specific impulse of 240 s, that would use about 1500 kg of fuel and oxidizer. So it all seems to fit quite well.

louis · 2016-04-29 19:54:55

I think this is going to be the breakthrough mission! Musk is going to take us into the post-NASA, post-Rover era. It is going to be incredibly interesting. He is going to crack the landing problem spectacularly. He is going to send back way more data about the surface. He is going to surprise us with a whole series of novel experiments including greenhousing. It's going to be great!

By his actions, he will demonstrate that Mars is a new human stage, just waiting for people to walk in from the wings.

SpaceNut · 2016-06-12 11:06:45

Here is a bit more on the Red Dragon and Planetary Exploration

How Flexible is the Interplanetary Dragon Lander?

IceDragon concept

Conceptual design for the IceDragon version of the Red Dragon capsule that could be sent to sample the icy plains of Mars' arctic regions. Human figure shown for scale.

I know of two proposals for scientific missions that would use the Red Dragon spacecraft. One—IceBreaker, led by NASA’s Chris McKay—would return to the northern polar plains of Mars to further investigate the subsurface ices found there for habitability and signs of life. The appeal of the Dragon spacecraft appears to have been its expected low cost. McKay has also proposed the IceBreaker mission using a near copy of the much smaller NASA Phoenix and InSight landers. The instruments would have weighed a few tens of kilograms, barely taking advantage of the payload that the Red Dragon could deliver. The Dragon lander (dubbed the IceDragon for this concept), however, could have carried a much larger drill than the Phoenix-derived lander, allowing samples to be collected from much further below the surface. (The one published abstract for the IceDragon mission from several years ago proposed a 2 meter drill. Technology development since then might allow much deeper drilling.)

MAV and ERV

Conceptual design for the Red Dragon used to carry a Mars Ascent Vehicle (MAV) and an Earth Return Vehicle (ERV).

GW Johnson · 2016-06-13 18:14:22

Well, it has a bit under 1 km/s delta-vee capability. That's 1200 kg of NTO-MMH (or similar). All the hydrazine mods and blends have similar performance. I'm showing about 0.9 to 1 km/s delta-vee needed for retropropulsive landing on Mars, as soon as the entry hypersonics end at local Mach 3, without any chutes.

GW

Last edited by GW Johnson (2016-06-13 18:16:12)

SpaceNut · 2016-06-13 19:30:47

All the more reason to give it a try and if we win or loss or draw we will have a good show to prove out what is needed to make the necessary changes to make it happen.....on the next.....

SpaceNut · 2020-02-21 20:14:23

The post 9 happens to have the 2 versions of mission science that we really need to go to mars in the future.

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#1 2016-04-28 07:44:07

Elon Musk plans unmanned mission to the red planet, by 2018

#2 2016-04-28 07:52:00

Re: Elon Musk plans unmanned mission to the red planet, by 2018

#3 2016-04-28 08:31:01

Re: Elon Musk plans unmanned mission to the red planet, by 2018

#4 2016-04-28 09:36:12

Re: Elon Musk plans unmanned mission to the red planet, by 2018

#5 2016-04-28 11:00:41

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#6 2016-04-28 13:37:18

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#7 2016-04-28 15:00:43

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#8 2016-04-28 20:23:51

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#9 2016-04-29 08:41:11

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#10 2016-04-29 11:32:31

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#11 2016-04-29 19:34:15

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#12 2016-04-29 19:54:55

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#13 2016-06-12 11:06:45

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#14 2016-06-13 18:14:22

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#15 2016-06-13 19:30:47

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