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#26 2014-09-22 21:22:18

Midoshi
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From: Colorado
Registered: 2007-07-14
Posts: 155

Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

Thanks, guys!

We have already started collecting data with a few instruments, and hope to make a press release in the near future. The primary business this week is lowering the period of our 35 hour orbit capture to our nominal 4.5 hour science orbit. After that we'll deploy the booms and start running tests over the next few weeks. There will be a break in mid-October to make some special observations of Comet Siding Spring and its effect on Mars as it flys by. By early November we will start our nominal science operations and start getting back a constant stream of data on the upper Martian atmosphere.


"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." - Albert Einstein

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#27 2014-10-12 14:05:49

GW Johnson
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

Midoshi:

Any word on how it's going with MAVEN,  or with your colleagues from India?

GW


GW Johnson
McGregor,  Texas

"There is nothing as expensive as a dead crew,  especially one dead from a bad management decision"

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#28 2014-10-20 21:12:37

SpaceNut
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

All Three NASA Mars Orbiters Healthy After Comet Flyby

"All three NASA orbiters around Mars confirmed their healthy status Sunday after each took shelter behind Mars during a period of risk from dust released by a passing comet. Mars Odyssey, Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter and the Mars Atmosphere and Volatile Evolution (MAVEN) orbiter all are part of a campaign to study comet C/2013 A1 Siding Spring and possible effects on the Martian atmosphere from gases and dust released by the comet. The comet sped past Mars today much closer than any other know comet flyby of a planet."

- NASA's Mars Odyssey Orbiter Watches Comet Fly Near
- NASA's MAVEN Studies Passing Comet and Its Effects
- NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter Studies Comet Flyby

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#29 2014-11-11 20:01:11

SpaceNut
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

Mars Orbiter MAVEN Demonstrates Relay Prowess

a radio aboard the MAVEN orbiter custom-designed for data links with robots on the surface of Mars -- handled a copious 550 megabits during its first relay of real Mars data.

MAVEN's Electra UHF radio received the transmission from NASA's Curiosity Mars rover on Nov. 6, using an adaptive data rate as the orbiter passed through the sky over the rover.

Comet flyby of Mars changed chemistry of atmosphere

The resulting meteor shower likely lasted an hour or more, according to data from an orbiting NASA spacecraft called the Mars Atmosphere and Volatile Evolution Mission (MAVEN).

The comet released far more dust than NASA anticipated -- thousands of kilograms by preliminary estimates -- as it passed 87,000 miles from Mars.

Its scientific instruments also detected eight different types of metal ions, including sodium, magnesium and iron, marking the first such measurements of an Oort Cloud comet, which some experts likened to a snowball in space.

MAVEN "observed intense ultraviolet emission from magnesium and iron ions high in the atmosphere in the aftermath of the meteor shower," said the US space agency.

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#30 2014-12-16 22:26:01

SpaceNut
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

MAVEN Identifies Links in Chain Leading to Mars Atmospheric Loss

which entered its science phase on Nov. 16. The observations reveal a new process by which the solar wind can penetrate deep into a planetary atmosphere.

They include the first comprehensive measurements of the composition of Mars' upper atmosphere and electrically charged ionosphere. The results also offer an unprecedented view of ions as they gain the energy that will lead to their to escape from the atmosphere.

Within hours after being turned on at Mars, STATIC detected the "polar plume" of ions escaping from Mars. This measurement is important in determining the rate of atmospheric loss.

As the satellite dips down into the atmosphere, STATIC identifies the cold ionosphere at closest approach and subsequently measures the heating of this charged gas to escape velocities as MAVEN rises in altitude. The energized ions ultimately break free of the planet's gravity as they move along a plume that extends behind Mars.

On each orbit around Mars, MAVEN dips into the ionosphere - the layer of ions and electrons extending from about 75 to 300 miles above the surface. This layer serves as a kind of shield around the planet, deflecting the solar wind, an intense stream of hot, high-energy particles from the sun.

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#31 2015-02-03 22:04:40

SpaceNut
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#32 2015-02-10 23:41:25

Midoshi
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From: Colorado
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Posts: 155

Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

MAVEN has begun lowering its orbit as part of its first Deep Dip maneuver! Today we successfully performed a burn to reduce periapsis from 155 km to 133 km, and tomorrow we'll have another one to bring us down to 125 km. All the instruments are working well, and we should get some great data over the next week!

We'll be updating daily on Twitter and Facebook:
https://twitter.com/maven2mars
https://www.facebook.com/MAVEN2Mars


"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." - Albert Einstein

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#33 2015-02-11 19:05:15

SpaceNut
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

Thanks we have been waiting for the update and it sounds interesting...

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#34 2015-02-21 12:09:11

SpaceNut
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

MAVEN Completes First Deep Dip Campaign first of five deep-dip maneuvers designed to gather measurements closer to the lower end of the Martian upper atmosphere.

The first deep dip campaign ran from Feb. 10 to 18. The first three days of this campaign were used to lower the periapsis. Each of the five campaigns lasts for five days allowing the spacecraft to observe for roughly 20 orbits. Since the planet rotates under the spacecraft, the 20 orbits allow sampling of different longitudes spaced around the planet, providing close to global coverage.

"During normal science mapping, we make measurements between an altitude of about 150 km and 6,200 km (93 miles and 3,853 miles) above the surface,"
"During the deep-dip campaigns, we lower the lowest altitude in the orbit, known as periapsis, to about 125 km (78 miles) which allows us to take measurements throughout the entire upper atmosphere."

The 25 km (16 miles) altitude difference may not seem like much, but it allows scientists to make measurements down to the top of the lower atmosphere. At these lower altitudes, the atmospheric densities are more than ten times what they are at 150 km (93 miles).

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#35 2015-02-22 11:48:02

GW Johnson
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

This is an example of only one way (out of a gigantic plethora of ways) that ground truth can be so vastly different from expectations and remote sensing results.  Sometimes we shoot ourselves in the foot out of ignorance,  as described below.  Other times,  Mother Nature shoots us in the foot by refusing to conform to our expectations ,  measurements,  and theories.  Either way it happens all the time.  The smart mission planner takes this into account as a failure he assumes will happen.

GW

Copied off MSNBC news on the internet,  from their “Science” section:

Curiosity's experiments on Martian soil may be inadvertently eliminating traces of organics, British researchers reported this week. One of the compounds the rover is on the lookout for is jarosite, a mineral associated with conditions potentially suitable for life. Curiosity tests for jarosite and other interesting substances by flash-heating soil samples, watching for telltale signs of certain elements.

Tests conducted by a team at Imperial College London show that this heating process may cause the jarosite to break up and give off free oxygen — which can then destroy organic compounds in the soil. Essentially, the testing method could eliminate what it's looking for in the process.


GW Johnson
McGregor,  Texas

"There is nothing as expensive as a dead crew,  especially one dead from a bad management decision"

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#36 2015-02-22 13:11:35

RobertDyck
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

I did a quick Google, and found the paper that GW Johnson talked about. The original on the website for Imperial College London.
Scientists identify mineral that destroys organic compounds

This is highly important. When Opportunity examined Meridiani Planum, they found jarosite. That's important because it's a sedimentary mineral that only forms in mildly acidic water. Dr. Carol Stoker studied the possibility that life could have arisen there. So I looked at this myself. Scientists can trace how life evolved from simpler forms, and DNA could have evolved from RNA, but how did RNA first form? The steps to form RNA are complex, and some require conflicting conditions. Some require acid, others require alkali. But I pointed out jarosite demonstrates there was acidic water, and Meridiani Planum is surrounded by normal Mars dust, which is dominated by plagioclase feldspar, which is alkali. Wind would blow dust into the water, so this alkali dust could change the pH. Meridiani Planum has hematite concretions, which are the catalyst for fischer tropsch catalysis, which combines small simple hydrocarbons to form large complex ones. And sediment in some areas is finely layered clay, which is the catalyst to combine phosphate and ribose sugar with pyrimidine and purine to form nucleotides. Meridiani Planum has borite, which is the catalyst that preferentially forms ribose sugar. And phosphate is simple phosphorus oxide, which is present there. It's an evaporite plane, so changing solute concentration. Ribose sugar requires water without any nitrogen, but pyrimidine and purine require nitrogen. I could go on, but all the conditions for genesis of RNA world are (were) present at Meridiani Planum. And at the 2005 Lunar and Planetary Science Syposium, geologists reported an imbalance between bromine salts vs other salts. Dr. Carol Stoker pointed out astrobiologists like herself look for exactly that type of imbalance to indicate past action of single cell organisms.

Dr. Carol Stoker told me that the source of sulphur at Meridiani Planum is believed to be a hot spring. She was studying a hot spring at Rio Tinto in Spain as a comparison. Is there anything like that where Curiosity is located?

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#37 2015-02-22 14:48:23

SpaceNut
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

try number 2...

The rovers did go through a sulfur laiden location as the tracks from the rover did disturb the soil.

Mars Exploration Rovers (MER) on pg 16
Official MSL / Curiosity Rover Thread | Aug 5, 2012 10:31 p.m. PT on pg 9

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#38 2015-07-15 19:25:28

SpaceNut
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From: New Hampshire
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

It has been real wuite and its time to check in on Mars....

http://lasp.colorado.edu/home/maven/

http://lasp.colorado.edu/home/maven/fea … -the-news/

2015

June
Comet Metal Rained Down on Mars
news.discovery.com, Thurs., June 25, 2015

MAVEN Sheds New Light on Atmosphere of Mars
sci-news.com, Wed., June 24, 2015

Mars may have beautiful blue aurorae visible to the naked eye
washingtonpost.com, Mon., June 1, 2015

May

‘Tomorrowland’ Draws from NASA Past and Future
news.discovery.com, Fri., May 22, 2015

Arab Mars Probe May Resolve Red Planet’s Atmospheric Puzzles
forbes.com, Wed., May 13, 2015

Does the Red Planet Have Green Auroras?
universetoday.com, Wed., May 13, 2015

Auroras on Mars
science.nasa.gov, Mon., May 11, 2015

CU-Boulder joins United Arab Emirates in new mission to Mars
dailycamera.com, Thurs., May 7, 2015

April

Buried Martian glaciers could cover the planet in water
sen.com, Thurs., Apr. 9, 2015

What NASA’s MAVEN Probe Has Learned From 1,000 Mars Orbits
abcnews.go.com, Thurs., Apr. 9, 2015

March

MAVEN Spots Dust Cloud, Aurora on Mars
skyandtelescope.com, Tues., Mar. 24, 2015

Why Auroras Are Red on Mars
theatlantic.com, Tues., Mar. 24, 2015

Mystery dust cloud, glowing aurora spotted on Mars
cbsnews.com, Fri., Mar. 20, 2015

Mysterious Dust Cloud and Aurora Spotted on Mars
news.nationalgeographic.com, Wed., Mar. 18, 2015

Mystery dust cloud and aurora spotted on Mars
nature.com, Wed., Mar. 18, 2015

Mars is Wrapped in a Weird Dust Cloud
news.discovery.com, Wed., Mar. 18, 2015

MAVEN spotted a strange and unexpected aurora around Mars
washingtonpost.com, Wed., Mar. 18, 2015

Water, water everywhere in our solar system’s moons
csmonitor.com, Fri., Mar. 13, 2015

Mars once had an entire ocean—and then lost it, scientists say
latimes.com, Thurs., Mar. 5, 2015

February

MAVEN penetrates Mars’s inner atmosphere
skyatnightmagazine.com, Fri., Feb. 20, 2015

Wow so that is what Maven has been up to....

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#39 2019-02-12 20:49:00

SpaceNut
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From: New Hampshire
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

Crickets might be louder than the news coming from the satelite but we are now it would seem getting ready for the next phase of its mission.
NASA's MAVEN spacecraft shrinking its Mars orbit to prepare for Mars 2020 Rover

The operation will reduce the highest point of the MAVEN spacecraft's elliptical orbit from 3,850 to 2,800 miles (6,200 to 4,500 kilometers) above the surface and prepare it to take on additional responsibility as a data-relay satellite for NASA's Mars 2020 rover, which launches next year.

A strong telecommunications antenna signal is not the only benefit of a tighter orbit. Coming in nearly 1,000 miles (about 1,500 kilometers) closer also will allow the MAVEN orbiter to circle Mars more frequently - 6.8 orbits per Earth day versus 5.3 previously - and thus communicate with the Mars rovers more frequently. While not conducting relay communications, MAVEN will continue to study the structure and composition of the upper atmosphere of Mars. "We're planning a vigorous science mission far into the future," Jakosky said.

The MAVEN mission was designed to last two years in space, but the spacecraft is still operating normally. With the mission managing its fuel to last through 2030, NASA plans to use MAVEN's relay capability as long as possible.

Nice to see that we are going to get way more from Maven....

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#40 2019-02-21 18:58:28

SpaceNut
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

I hope that we will not wait 2 decades before in order to find ou the details of Mars Atmosphere as thats how long we have for Earths atmosphere stretches out to theMoon and beyond

soho-geocorona-earth-hg.jpg

ESA/NASA Solar and Heliospheric Observatory, SOHO, shows that the gaseous layer that wraps around Earth reaches up to 630 000 km away, or 50 times the diameter of our planet.

"The Moon flies through Earth's atmosphere,"

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#41 2019-02-21 20:33:41

Void
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

I also stumbled on that very interesting article Spacenut.

Here is another, and I will speak about my feelings about Mars and Venus as well.
https://dailygalaxy.com/2019/02/water-o … ture-base/
Quote:

“Water on the Moon” –NASA Scientists Find Natural Source for Future Base
Posted on Feb 21, 2019



“We think of water as this special, magical compound,” said William M. Farrell, a plasma physicist at NASA’s Goddard Space Flight Center, who helped develop the simulation. “But here’s what’s amazing: every rock has the potential to make water, especially after being irradiated by the solar wind.”
When a stream of charged particles known as the solar wind careens onto the Moon’s surface at 450 kilometers per second (or nearly 1 million miles per hour), they enrich the Moon’s surface in ingredients that could make water, NASA scientists have found.
Using a computer program, scientists simulated the chemistry that unfolds when the solar wind pelts the Moon’s surface. As the Sun streams protons to the Moon, they found, those particles interact with electrons in the lunar surface, making hydrogen (H) atoms. These atoms then migrate through the surface and latch onto the abundant oxygen (O) atoms bound in the silica (SiO2) and other oxygen-bearing molecules that make up the lunar soil, or regolith. Together, hydrogen and oxygen make the molecule hydroxyl (OH), a component of water, or H2O.
China Planning a Robotic Moon Station and Far-Side Radio Telescope –“An Unobstructed Window on the Cosmos” (VIDEO)



Understanding how much water — or its chemical components — is available on the Moon is critical to NASA’s goal of sending humans to establish a permanent presence there, said Orenthal James Tucker, a physicist at Goddard who spearheaded the simulation research.
“We’re trying to learn about the dynamics of transport of valuable resources like hydrogen around the lunar surface and throughout its exosphere, or very thin atmosphere, so we can know where to go to harvest those resources,” said Tucker, who recently described the simulation results in the journal JGR Planets.
The Daily Galaxy via NASA
Lunar Base image credit: ESA and Foster and Partners

A related article I read, indicated that we could perhaps look for water generated on other rocky bodies by the solar wind.  I agree.  Mercury seems to have ice at it's poles, source not proven yet though.

And I will say that for planets with atmospheres such as Venus and Mars, but no comprehensive magnetic field, we might also consider if water is generated.

Specifically for Mars, I understand that Hydrogen is released from water vapor during a dust storm.  But I suspect that there is also a way for Hydrogen to be included to water by the solar wind.  So, the solar wind may give and take Hydrogen for water.

To me this makes perhaps in error any evaluation of heavy water percentages for both Mars and Venus.

If you have an environment where Hydrogen is input into a planets atmosphere, and also taken away sometimes, then it would be natural for heavy Hydrogen to accumulate from the sun in preference to normal Hydrogen.  Not proven, but a strong suspicion.

Therefore any evaluation of water loss over 4.5 billions of years from Mars, may be in error if they are calculated by the ratio of heavy Hydrogen.  Maybe.

Another aspect of all of this is that it appears that some persons believe that there are an enormous number of rogue objects in the spaces between the dominance of any particular stars gravity well.  To me this opens the possibility that the object that could have formed our Moon was interstellar, or a more local rogue planet, and that it brought water with it to the Earth to be.

If this were so, then an alternative to assuming that Venus, Earth, and Mars started wet is that very large impacts imparted water to some of them, and the solar wind imparted water to others.  Not sure if the solar wind can impart water to the Earth.  I am not thinking so, or not as much in the same way.

Anyway some questions.

And by the way the impact notion of interstellar objects implies a reason that we can't find aliens.  We are just massively lucky not to have in interstellar extinction event for humans or for complex life in general.

Good reason to put humans elsewhere as well I should think.  We may be pressing our luck.

Done.

Last edited by Void (2019-02-21 20:46:43)


I like people who criticize angels dancing on a pinhead.  I also like it when angels dance on my pinhead.

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#42 2019-12-14 21:18:57

SpaceNut
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

Modishi, Is our resident scientist on this mission. We miss the reports but here is one that must follow any dust storm that cripples a mars rover. Its from MAVEN maps winds in upper atmosphere of Mars that mirror the terrain below and gives clues to climate as the nasa spacecraft collected data during the last two years to better understand the workings of the Martian climate, giving them a more accurate picture of its ancient past and its ongoing evolution.

martian-upper-atmosphere-computer-generated-visualization-of-the-orbital-paths-maven-data-hg.jpg

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#43 2019-12-15 08:32:08

SpaceNut
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Re: MAVEN Launch | Nov 18, 2013 1:28 p.m. EST

Scientists map a planet's global wind patterns for the first time, and it's not Earth

Mehdi Benna and his colleagues proposed to the Mars Atmosphere and Volatile EvolutioN (MAVEN) project team that they remotely reprogram the MAVEN spacecraft and its Natural Gas and Ion Mass Spectrometer (NGIMS) instrument to do a unique experiment.

martian-upper-atmosphere-computer-generated-visualization-mountain-air-flow-maven-data-hg.jpg

"The refreshing thing is that the patterns that we observed in the upper atmosphere match globally what one would predict from models," says Benna. "The physics works." One surprise came when the team analyzed the shorter-term variability of winds in the upper atmosphere, which was greater than anticipated. "On Mars, the average circulation is steady, but if you take a snapshot at any given time, the winds are highly variable," Benna says. More work is needed to determine why these contrasting patterns exist.

A second surprise was that the wind hundreds of kilometers above the planet's surface still contained information about landforms below, like mountains, canyons, and basins. As the air mass flows over those features, "it creates waves - ripple effects - that flow up to the upper atmosphere" and can be detected by MAVEN and NGIMS, Benna explains. "On Earth, we see the same kind of waves, but not at such high altitudes. That was the big surprise, that these can go up to 280 kilometers high."

This tells me that wind mills carefully placed will work on mars....

Research paper

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