New Mars Forums

Dave_Duca

Member

From: Oconto, WI usa

Registered: 2017-03-15

Posts: 92

Uncharted

The Mariners, Viking Orbiters, MRO, MGS, and Mars Express
have afforded us the total Geodesic Picture of the Martian World.

Feb. 2007, ESA boasted "the first hiking maps of mars", according to
Gerhard Neukum, of Freie Universität Berlin.
Since then, no fruition nor availability has occurred.

In view of the Analog Stations, no high resolution maps
have been presented to the Society for future missions.
With emphasis placed on "Sharing for Others to Follow".

Thus... the High Resolution Detail of Mars is literally: UNCHARTED
That, is a problem.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Hiking Maps are the simplest way for determining Orientation & Guidance at a glance.
These maps can also be part of the EVA Suit's Heads Up Display.

Without getting too technical with the Easting, Northing, This-ing, That-ing detail,
the hiking map take less time to get oriented.
Time that might be vital during an EVA episode while under duress.
Contour overlays Topographic Maps are what make a hiking map simple & enjoyable.

The next problem is: the Demographics of "scale".

When on Mars, you "think" earth mile or kilometers, or whatever.
On red soil, your distance is less, but almost similar.

It is an unusual coincidence that "The Martian Mile" is nearly our Kilometer.
There are 21,600 minutes of arc to a full circle. Mars circumference is 21,344 km
Thus, a Martian (km) = 21,344 km/21,600 arc min = 988.15 meters.

Interesting, yes?
This is the closest assimilation to our human perception being adopted, off world.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Therefore, with the geodesics of MOLA, High Resolution Photogrammetrics, and Contours,
our Hiking Maps can be comfortably realized.

SpaceNut

Administrator

From: New Hampshire

Registered: 2004-07-22

Posts: 29,431

Re: Uncharted

I am reminded of a movie scene that happens early in the Red Planet where the would be Janitor and crew after bouncing to a stop must solve for there bearings to which they pull out a 3D viewing screen that allows them to navigator to the inital crew that they were going to check on.

Could google satelite maps work for this down link function to allow a crew to display terrain that they would use when they are a mission senerio...

The time of a mars day is also close enough for man to adapt to as well....

Dave_Duca

Member

From: Oconto, WI usa

Registered: 2017-03-15

Posts: 92

Re: Uncharted

You made me watch the movie again.  lol

Now, if only the MDRS peeple can stop hoarding their mapping & Mission Info and
present their findings to the world.
Or, is this the way it's going to be on mars?

Last edited by Dave_Duca (2017-05-16 06:11:45)

SpaceNut

Administrator

From: New Hampshire

Registered: 2004-07-22

Posts: 29,431

Re: Uncharted

I agree with you that the Analog Teams could attend their missions more like a mission, rather than a 2 week space camp. With a to do list of activities but they are lacking when it comes to the reports to which I have read a few and they are lacking in the pure science of what they're doing being full of the details of what they have done.
Such as how much water is in the tanks, how much power is being generated ect....
What was the science of exploration that was accomplished when they took there hike in there suits...what did they expect to achieve by going? Was it a mineral search, was it for precious stones.....

RobertDyck

Moderator

From: Winnipeg, Canada

Registered: 2002-08-20

Posts: 7,929

Website

Re: Uncharted

The Mars Relay antenna on MGS, Odyssey, MRO, MAVEN, and Mars Express provide range data. Rather than using triangulation, this allows for intersecting spheres. It still gives global positioning in 3D, however it isn't nearly as quick or accurate is GPS on Earth. GPS requires 24 to 32 satellites in medium Earth orbit. Nothing is transmitted to satellites, the hand-held device or smartphone only requires a receiver. But MGS stopped working, which leaves only 4 satellites. You can determine position with just one satellite, but it requires multiple observations so would require hours for a single measurement. With only 4 working satellites, chances are you won't have the minimum 3 in view at one time. So that requires waiting for a 3rd to rise above the horizon. And again, the Mars Relay won't give nearly as good precision as GPS. To do what you saw in the movie would require a constellation of 24 new satellites around Mars.

Dave_Duca

Member

From: Oconto, WI usa

Registered: 2017-03-15

Posts: 92

Re: Uncharted

This is about the production of highly effective "Hiking Maps of Mars"
And using the Kilometer as a standard for "The Martian Mile".

Raytheon Corporation made the E.P.L.R.S. from the early 90s.
( Enhanced Position Location Reporting System )
Used when GPS is Jammed with ECM.

I would fancy less debris orbiting Mars than our own.

We already have positional accuracy of Mars' geographic landscape.
But are lacking the representation of topographic relief "with contours" to
be used by explorers.

Last edited by Dave_Duca (2017-05-16 07:41:58)

Oldfart1939

Member

Registered: 2016-11-26

Posts: 2,451

Re: Uncharted

Finally! Something that NASA probably COULD do! A constellation of 24-36 Mars GPS satellites would probably excite someone within the entrenched bureaucracy. That's almost an absolute requirement for any real landing precision as well. Mars GPS plus ground based transponders would enable a landing accuracy of meters, not hundreds of kilometers.

SpaceNut

Administrator

From: New Hampshire

Registered: 2004-07-22

Posts: 29,431

Re: Uncharted

I can see that we do not need huge satelites for just a GPS beacon system to which I think a cube sat design would work nicely as its small, cheap and mostly free by the university system as class projects in engineering programs.

Only bureacracy then is for the launcher to send them to Mars....