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karov

Member

From: Bulgaria

Registered: 2004-06-03

Posts: 953

Venus Deeps

http://www.nextbigfuture.com/2016/11/th … gfuture%29

It shouldn't be the case that the same ( at least few oceans-full of water in the mantle ) is not present inside Venus.

Regardless of the 'resurfacing' which happens every other few hundreds of millions of years.

So, together with the Outer system (slow), and plasma mining the Sun (requiring huge pan-SolSys mass-energy-momentum infra to be present), the Venus interior is also the third legitimate source of Hydrogen to look at.

Untapping it could be done by light. From the sun - 'uncooked' focused one, or solaser.

Void

Member

Registered: 2011-12-29

Posts: 7,820

Re: Venus Deeps

Some thinking is that Venus was habitable until 1 billion years ago, so perhaps yes.  Perhaps steam evolving from the deeps is the only reason Venus has any water vapor or Sulfuric Acid vapors by this time.

I am questioning the whole notion of how terrestrials form.  We are to believe that they form hot from dry rocks without water, and then comets from the asteroid belt brought in water.  And yet somehow Jupiter's moons formed icy (Except for IO which has grav. flex volcanism).

Io might actually have formed wet and icy as well, and then boiled it off.

What I am thinking is what is the difference between how Jupiter's moons formed, and how a proto Earth formed?  If the Earth was formed in an accretion disk, then it was shaded from the sun by the accretion disk during much of the formation process, and the materials that formed the Earth were also to a large degree shaded from the sun, until the ending of the process.  So, why would sunlight drive icy materials off from the materials forming the Earth?  Surely the proto-Earth was shedding heat to space in all directions except in the plane of the accretion disk.  So, why would that be so much hotter than the formation of Ganymede?

Water bearing minerals have been detected on the asteroid Vesta, and that has been attributed to collisions from water bearing asteroids.  But I question that.  The said difference between Vesta and Ceres, is that Vesta formed earlier, and so had radioactive materials which caused it to heat up and boil off it's water, and Ceres formed later with less radioactive materials or is actually a relocated outer solar system object.  But for the case of Vesta, if it ever had a layer of ice/water to boil off, can we be certain that it's interior is not still hydrated? When apparently the Earth has such a deep held layer of water?

And so similar questions then for other said "Dry" objects such as Mercury, and Mars.  Maybe lots of deep held water inside Mars also.

Karov quote:

Untapping it could be done by light. From the sun - 'uncooked' focused one, or solaser.

With these things in mind, I choose to suggest a terraform scheme, which would be a combination of things previously speculated on for Venus, and also an idea borrowed from Mars.

1) If possible an enclosed multi-floor global floating habitat.  a)Inside the "Floors" breathable atmospheres as a rule. b) The "Rooftop having the standard character of the Venus atmosphere CO2/N2 dominance, but it could sustain a garden/biosphere in the sunlight.

2) Using your lasers to extract more water, if that is possible, and as a side effect pumping more heat below the habitat, to expand and swell the atmosphere.  The habitat would periodically be expanded in surface area, to allow it to move higher in the expanding column of atmosphere.  In addition to adding heat by laser, using super greenhouse gasses in the atmosphere below the floating habitat, to both keep the habitat more isolated from the much hotter lower layers, and to help the lower layers hold in the greater heat.

3) Engage in supercritical CO2 mineral processing in the hot layers for economic benefits.

4) The surface of Venus would also heat up from geothermal heat from below, because the habitat and the super greenhouse gasses would cause hold the heat in.  So, perhaps the entire surface of Venus would begin to glow in the visible light range, and that particular spectrum could possibly be allowed to radiate up to the underside of the floating habitat, to stimulate solar cells for electricity.

5) And then a trick from Mars, perhaps.  (Waste not want not).  Even though the top of the Venus atmosphere had been lifted higher in the gravity well of Venus, I am not sure how much extra atmospheric loss this might cause.  The solar wind presently induces a magnetic field which limits atmospheric loss.  Even if you lifted up the atmosphere, the induced magnetic field may still fend off a lot of the loss.

But if the inhabitants of such a Venus floating habitat were to generate a lopsided planetary magnetic field, then perhaps like Mars, the solar wind would be able to pull bubbles of plasma off from the top of the atmosphere of Venus.  And what would be better than that would be if those "Bubbles" could be harvested.  Captured in orbit, condensed from plasma to gasses and solids. 

In order to protect .8 bars of Nitrogen, perhaps Nitrogen could be preferentially moved from above the floating habitat shell to below it, and then CO2 would be more preferentially removed from the atmosphere of Venus by this scheme.

So, then a method to immediately inhabit Venus with floating structure, but also a plan to reduce the magnitude of the atmosphere of Venus over a long period of time, and eventually perhaps making the surface habitable, if that is what the owners wanted.

In that case, if the inhabitants really wanted to make a pseudo-Earth, they might try to extract oceans of water from the deeps of Venus, if that is possible.

Last edited by Void (2016-11-27 14:20:28)

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Antius

Member

From: Cumbria, UK

Registered: 2007-05-22

Posts: 1,003

Re: Venus Deeps

I wonder how big a hydrogen bomb would need to be to blast open the planet's crust?  Maybe the same device could be used to create a nuclear winter effect blocking out the sun?

Martian volcanoes are apparently dormant.  Perhaps the same technique could be used to activate them?

Void

Member

Registered: 2011-12-29

Posts: 7,820

Re: Venus Deeps

I honestly don't have a proposal to bring the Hydrogen up from the deeps.  Hydrogen, Lasers, completely melted surface convecting?

One thing I have recorded is that it is thought that when the presumed oceans vaporized for Venus the temperature at the surface became thousands of degrees due to the greenhouse effect, and now cooled to what we have.  Therefore adding water vapor to the atmosphere of Venus without other technologies implemented will simply lead to a hotter Venus with a more swelled atmosphere.  And eventually the Hydrogen will escape, and the planet will cool to what it is now.

So, the solution needed for what we might want is more than to release water from the deeps, or to add it from afar.

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