The War with Irag - How do Â feel about it.

Earthfirst · 2003-02-25 22:00:20

The war with Irag is a big deal to many people, I would like to known how you feel about it.
What I think is that its about time that the mess from the first golf war was cleaned up. Poeple dont ofthen understand threasons why we dint take out saddom in the first place. The reason were polical, we had the support of arbia nation to go to war with irag only to free Quake. If we had gone all the way and toke out saddom we would of lost are support from the Arbia nations. Its one thing to free a nation from an invader, but it quit different if the us had started topping arbia governments.
If you say that the world against the US you are right and wrong. First you are right that the Irag government is against the war, terrist, anti American lefts, Markist rebals, commuity college drop outs, and Euro trash. You could say six million people came out to protest the us led war, but six million is only 1% of the world population. I dont remeber hering that billions were against it. Also France and Germany are against use, why? Because they sold the weapon tech. that irag uses for it weapons of mass desturtion. Also who cares what france thinks? they have not mattered much since 1803 when Neapoline was conquiring Europe. Germany I dont known what has happen to their sprit, not wanting to invade and conquire a weaker nation, it goes against thousdand of years of tradition. Why it was them that tore down the greast empire ever to exist the roman empire.
If it was not for america all of europe would under germany controll. I dont know mabe the french would be better off speaking germon, they certainly dont aperciate that live that america gave for their fredom, like England does.
WELL its just more oil for us. I think that we have to get rid of the threat that saddom is, before he give his weapons to sleeper cells in New york, and that will be the last thing we hire from the big apple. Anyways if you are what Carol Marks descirbe as a useful idedit than dont answer! I want poeple that can debt not spot the tired old sologons from the 60s. Please no Red dapper doper babes, as soon as you lrean how to think for your self please answer. Dont get me started on those Hollywood leftist, notice the older they get the more polical they get examples, Susan Surrandom, that west wing guy, and others. "Less attrative", saging careers.
Anys if you are proAmerican and hate the anti Americanism come form the left than join a group I started called antipeace. Its group for people that love America and want to fight back against the antiamericans.
The site is at

My Webpage
or email at
antipeace@yahoogroups.com
Thank you please check it out.
web adress http://groups.yahoo.com/group/antipeace

soph · 2003-02-25 22:09:39

it goes against thousdand of years of tradition. Why it was them that tore down the greast empire ever to exist the roman empire.

Er. no. It goes against a single war in history. A blip. Germany was weak before the 1850s, and weak after WW2.

Tribes that conquered the Romans were not Germans, they were Germanic, huge difference.

Josh Cryer · 2003-02-27 18:02:57

I voted for a UN resolution.

clark · 2003-02-27 18:38:45

I vote for the removal of the Iraq regime which poses a threat to not only our own personal security, but also for the greater good of the Iraq people and the western world.

All tyrants derive their power from the military that ensures their will. We unfortunetly must defeat any who wish to continue to support the despotic Iraq regime.

UN be damned, we have an inherent right to protect ourselves when we perceive an apparent threat, and barring that as a legitimate rationale, helping to oust Saddam Hussien only improves the lot of many oppresed Iraqi's.

AltToWar · 2003-02-27 23:39:58

Oh my GOD what Right-wing paramilitary compound in North Dekota just got signed up for the internet?

For society to work, and for humans to be able to peacefully co-exist, we must all come to understand that human life is the most valuable thing earth.

Then we must realise that human suffering is somthing we must all fight against.

And then we must realise that human dignity is somthing we should all be promoting.

Whenever I have to ask myself where i stand on an issue like this, i ask myself these two questions:

Does it ease suffering?
Does it increase human dignity?

The ideas of peace and freedom do not come naturally to this world. It took centuries of some of the greatest minds of the western world to bring these ideals about.

If our professed goal is the spread of democracy and peace through the world, need to teach those things first by example and second by helping them enacting them when they themselves desire them.

One who has his home bombed, has seen his family and neighbors dead and dieing, and facing an overwheling force rain hell on the only world he knew is not going to be someone who will easily be won over by the ideals of peace and democracy. It would take a lot of character such an individual to get through such a thing.

Unfortunately dignity and character is somthing that is not too prevelant in a large part of the world.

If you take this outlook and examine the situation in Iraq, examine it's history, look for and find credible sorces for information; you will see that there really is only one way to see this matter.

Josh Cryer · 2003-02-28 00:04:25

Hey AltToWar, where have ya been man? Hope things are good with you. Been missing your posts as of late.

soph · 2003-02-28 05:35:26

Yeah, now I know what's been missing, irrational anti-everything America does.

Our left-wing fanatic is back. Joy.

clark · 2003-02-28 10:45:59

For society to work, and for humans to be able to peacefully co-exist, we must all come to understand that human life is the most valuable thing earth.

No, for society to work, and for humans to be able to peacefully co-exsist, we must all raise our children the same.

As long as one crazy teaches their children to be the same kind of crazy as them, we will always have the world that we have.

If our professed goal is the spread of democracy and peace through the world, need to teach those things first by example and second by helping them enacting them when they themselves desire them.

Considering that Iraq has only known the rule of tyrants since its very inception, I might imagine that the only way for Iraq, and indeed the entire mideast, is going to achieve democracy and peace is if it is imposed upon them.

If you say it won't work, you may be right, but it did work after WW2. No need to go back and forth over history, but the fact remains that many people have suffered at the hands of the Iraq regime, and not all of them have been Iraq's. We do ourselves, and the world a favor by ridding Iraq of Saddam.

We can debate the rights and wrongs of forcing the change of leaders in other countries- that is acadademic and based on ideology. I find that no argument can be made for allowing Saddam to continue to rule.

In this instance, at this time, we are justified, and we are right, in removing Saddam from power in Iraq.

There is no justification for turning a blind eye to this situation.

Josh Cryer · 2003-02-28 14:30:11

Nice two sentence reply soph, I'm sure it's a joy for everyone to read them, also.

I mean, you might have been able to formulate a decent reply (which is actually questionable when one thinks of your posting history of short sentences), but nope, just an insult that only took maybe fifteen seconds to write. And an unwarrented one at that.

I need to start referring to you as A.J.

soph · 2003-02-28 14:33:07

Go ahead and have fun. It's not like it will affect me in any way.

You don't like me because I actually back up my points with sources, when you rant with endless assumptions.

You think it matters to me if some guy on the other side of a computer calls me AJ?

When I come up with a reply, you steamroll, or at least try poorly to, it with postulations. So why should I bother?

Josh Cryer · 2003-02-28 14:35:52

clark, two points, your first point is in line with AltToWar's, simply because for everyone to ?come to understand that human life is the most valuable thing earth? they would all have to be taught this (ie. raised the ?same?). Most teaching is on an ethic, racial or cultural basis. Indeed, America's hate for Cuba (which, yes, has lessened a lot over the last few years) is a good way to show how propaganda forms people.

And secondly, one can ?democritize? a nation without war (especially a secular one like Iraq). So this argument isn't a justification.

Josh Cryer · 2003-02-28 14:41:36

Oh, I was just kidding, anyway, I wouldn't actually call you A.J., I was just making a point that your approach is very much in line with A.J.'s

And no one said I didn't like you, you're quite entertaining, in fact, a point I believe I made to A.J., but the reason I compare you to him, is bacause you think insults are actually geniune contributions to discussions.

Well, my friend, they're not.

And whenever you say that I steamroll, you fail, in the very threads that I supposedly steamroll, to refute my arguments, so this is clearly just soph frustration.

soph · 2003-02-28 14:44:04

My reply was actually to your two sentence reply to Alt's post

Josh Cryer · 2003-02-28 14:51:53

My reply was actually to your two sentence reply to Alt's post

Yeah, and yet still completely unwarrented. And it was three sentences.

Josh Cryer · 2003-02-28 18:21:59

Hmm, looks like a majority on this forum is uneasy about a unilateral war, or so it seems by the votes.

Then again, maybe no one voted because they didn't know where Irag was.

soph · 2003-02-28 18:36:27

Looks like most people support the war, and an equal number fully support it as don't fully support it, or are against it.

Since you took some great joy over telling me that Saddam has obliged the UN in the latest round of sham charades.

AltToWar · 2003-02-28 19:27:17

Yeah, now I know what's been missing, irrational anti-everything America does.
Our left-wing fanatic is back. Joy.

Such kind words.

soph · 2003-02-28 19:28:09

I was only half serious. Don't take it too personally.

AltToWar · 2003-02-28 19:33:12

For society to work, and for humans to be able to peacefully co-exist, we must all come to understand that human life is the most valuable thing earth.
No, for society to work, and for humans to be able to peacefully co-exsist, we must all raise our children the same.
As long as one crazy teaches their children to be the same kind of crazy as them, we will always have the world that we have.
If our professed goal is the spread of democracy and peace through the world, need to teach those things first by example and second by helping them enacting them when they themselves desire them.
Considering that Iraq has only known the rule of tyrants since its very inception, I might imagine that the only way for Iraq, and indeed the entire mideast, is going to achieve democracy and peace is if it is imposed upon them.
If you say it won't work, you may be right, but it did work after WW2. No need to go back and forth over history, but the fact remains that many people have suffered at the hands of the Iraq regime, and not all of them have been Iraq's. We do ourselves, and the world a favor by ridding Iraq of Saddam.
We can debate the rights and wrongs of forcing the change of leaders in other countries- that is acadademic and based on ideology. I find that no argument can be made for allowing Saddam to continue to rule.
In this instance, at this time, we are justified, and we are right, in removing Saddam from power in Iraq.
There is no justification for turning a blind eye to this situation.

Nature teaches us that diversity is strength. Differing cultures an differing views are healthy in the long run.

Cobra Commander · 2003-02-28 20:06:23

Nature teaches us that diversity is strength. Differing cultures an differing views are healthy in the long run.

No one is saying that the various cultures of the Iraqi people should or would be supplanted in some way by American intervention. Removing Saddam Hussein and occupying the country is a far cry from re-engineering the culture of the Middle East.

That said, there is certainly strength in diversity, and different views are healthy in the long run. Part of the reason for that is due to periodic violent conflicts between those diverse cultures. Diversity implies inherent instability and the potential for conflict. This is good, stability is stagnation. Diversity is a good thing, but to think that real diversity can exist without periodic conflicts, violent at times, is living in a fantasy.

The Commander steps down from platform amid angry and appaled stares...

CalTech2010 · 2003-03-01 09:24:51

Wow... looks like the majority are 100% in support of a war. Maybe the world isn't going to hell after all!

Peace is a wonderful thing, but it cannot exist when the world must live in fear of the abuse of WMD's. Most of us have agreed that nuclear weapons, in the hands of superpowers, have been a strong deterrent; they have to be cautious because they play by MAD. But when they fall into the hands of rogue nations, who knows what kind of risks that nation may be willing to put on the line in exhange for a pot-shot at a Western city?

Will the US ever be able to have a strong foreign policy again if it constantly has to deal with the threat of a nuclear attack? Haven't we traditionally used our strong nuclear strength and foreign policy clout to protect fledgling democracies, instead of fighting "oil crusades"?

dicktice · 2003-03-01 09:56:16

I can't help wondering how you guys would get along on a slow trip to Mars and back. Think about it....

Palomar · 2003-03-01 15:16:40

I can't help wondering how you guys would get along on a slow trip to Mars and back. Think about it....

:laugh:

Maybe we should include low-potency sleeping pills on board...the taste of which is undetectable in coffee, tea and other liquids...

--Cindy

Josh Cryer · 2003-03-01 16:26:24

I can't help wondering how you guys would get along on a slow trip to Mars and back. Think about it....

Amen. But I demand a recount!

Cal, that fear you speak of, I'm sad to say, is probably exggerated.

I'm not afraid.

GDavid · 2003-03-04 17:41:17

Re: US and Iraq
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The other shoe drops. The final part of the puzzle looks to have been placed. As seen by this article the armor (tank) heavy parts of the Army, 1st Armor Division, 1st Cavalry Division, etc. have been notified of their deployment to the "Iraqi" theatre. These are the key elements needed for any offensive and the 'most expensive' to deploy. That the 'big punch' ground forces wise is now enroute suggests that the assault is near emminent.

http://www.msnbc.com/news/870749.asp

[footnote to those who may not know, my oldest son is with the 1st Cav, assigned to the Mechanized Infantry of 2-5 Cav.]

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#1 2003-02-25 22:00:20

Re: The War with Irag - How do Â feel about it.

#2 2003-02-25 22:09:39

Re: The War with Irag - How do Â feel about it.

#3 2003-02-27 18:02:57

Re: The War with Irag - How do Â feel about it.

#4 2003-02-27 18:38:45

Re: The War with Irag - How do Â feel about it.

#5 2003-02-27 23:39:58

Re: The War with Irag - How do Â feel about it.

#6 2003-02-28 00:04:25

Re: The War with Irag - How do Â feel about it.

#7 2003-02-28 05:35:26

Re: The War with Irag - How do Â feel about it.

#8 2003-02-28 10:45:59

Re: The War with Irag - How do Â feel about it.

#9 2003-02-28 14:30:11

Re: The War with Irag - How do Â feel about it.

#10 2003-02-28 14:33:07

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#11 2003-02-28 14:35:52

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#12 2003-02-28 14:41:36

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#13 2003-02-28 14:44:04

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#14 2003-02-28 14:51:53

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#15 2003-02-28 18:21:59

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#16 2003-02-28 18:36:27

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#17 2003-02-28 19:27:17

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#18 2003-02-28 19:28:09

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#19 2003-02-28 19:33:12

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#20 2003-02-28 20:06:23

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#21 2003-03-01 09:24:51

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#22 2003-03-01 09:56:16

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#23 2003-03-01 15:16:40

Re: The War with Irag - How do Â feel about it.

#24 2003-03-01 16:26:24

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#25 2003-03-04 17:41:17

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