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RedStreak

Banned

From: Illinois

Registered: 2006-05-12

Posts: 541

Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

There have been so many attempts at just designing the Europa Orbiter - 3 that I can identify offhand:
2000 - Europa Orbiter - Part of the "Fire And Ice" missions the included visiting the Sun, Europa, and Pluto.
2004 - Jupiter Icy Moons Orbiter - Flagship Nuclear Reactor Orbiter that would have visited each of the outermost 3 of the Galilean Satellites.
2009 - Europa Jupiter System Mission - Joint orbiters to Europa and Ganymede by a joint NASA/ESA effort but sadly NASA canceled and doubtful ESA will pull this off solo.

It seems there have been some studies to split the Europa Orbiter into 2 halves: one focusing on close-in mapping with cameras, altimeters, and magnetometers, and the other doing Galileo-style fly-bys doing chemistry with spectrometers and sporadic ice-penetrating-radar.  The second seems quite feasible but is little more than a revamped Galileo, and if anything the lack of Plutonium for power is the limiting factor.

There are 2 Achilles Heels in creating a decent Europa Orbiter: radiation and mass.  Europa and Io rest in the deadly heart of Jupiter's radiation belts, apparently strong enough to overwhelm Juno-style electronics and solar arrarys - a month or 2 seems to be the average guess at the lifespan of a hypothetical orbiter.  Mass is ramped up by propellant loads - not just one but two orbit insersion maneuvers even with gravity assists from the other moons, and this seems to force the orbiter to sizes as large or larger than Cassini.

Could it be possible to bypass these issues?  Juno and a proposed Io Observer seem to adopt polar orbits around Jupiter, going through the 'eye' Jupiter forms in the radiation storm about itself.  One would think a similar approach could allow safer Europa fly-bys (whereas Galileo took an equitorial approach that plowed through it).  As for reducing mass, asteroid-explorer Dawn used solar-electric to gently encircle Vesta - considering a solar powered Jupiter-craft will surely have massive arrays with ample electricity, at least within Jupiter orbit, could electric propulsion ease an orbiter around Jupiter?  On top of that, could rendevousing with the Jovian LaGrange points be of use too with or without electric propulsion?  If those problems could be addressed, it should be possible to scale a Europa Orbiter down to something akin to Mars Reconissance Orbiter.

Anyone capable of guestimating a few things for Europa Orbiter's challenges?

SpaceNut

Administrator

From: New Hampshire

Registered: 2004-07-22

Posts: 29,431

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

Thanks for the mission reminder....
There are many threads on the subject Europa,
Europa Exploration, Juno - Jupiter Polar Orbiter, Jupiter in a year for Europa orbiter?, and JIMO - Jupiter Icy Moons Orbiter all talking to the creeping design that was discussed from nasa and other joint mission partners along the way during this last decade.

Title says it all Europa Mission: Lost In NASA Budget is a bit dated but that

In June of last year NASA announced that a mission to fly to Jupiter will proceed to a preliminary design phase. That program is called Juno, and it is the second in NASA's New Frontiers Program - of which the now en route New Horizons mission to Pluto is the first in this category. JUNO would conduct a first-time, in-depth study of the planet Jupiter. It must be ready for launch no later than June 30, 2010, within a mission cost cap of $700 million.

I am afraid that it did not happen....

This is where we are now very far to the right....
One Mission, Two Flight Systems Jupiter Europa Orbiter (JEO) Jupiter Ganymede Orbiter (JGO)

RedStreak

Banned

From: Illinois

Registered: 2006-05-12

Posts: 541

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

Read the past articles, but I am wondering if there are ways to slim down and focus the mission into a more manageable spacecraft.  Outside of the Prometheus mega-nuke-ship concept it has been a reiteration of the same needs, designs, and loads.

Is it possible, for instance, to enter orbit around a planet more gradually instead of with a jerky and sudden insersion maneuver?  If the Jupiter Orbiter Insersion cut be cut out the probe's weight would drop almost in half and to a size range akin to standard satellites and inner solar system probes.

SpaceNut

Administrator

From: New Hampshire

Registered: 2004-07-22

Posts: 29,431

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

Here comes the slim chance to none but it comes with a hefty price tag...

NASA's big new rocket, built to send humans to Mars, may start with robotic probes

President Barack Obama included $30 million in NASA's 2016 budget for a major robotic mission to Europa, a moon of Jupiter thought to harbor vast oceans of water and possibly life, it marked a significant shift in agency planning.
Congress has long wanted to send a probe to Europa, and has, in recent years, added money to NASA's final budget to begin planning for such a mission.

SpaceNut

Administrator

From: New Hampshire

Registered: 2004-07-22

Posts: 29,431

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

Now that the others are cleaned up here is what I was going to post...

SpaceX could send NASA to Jupiter's potentially habitable moon Europa

A draft of a congressional appropriations bill released Tuesday opens the door for Elon Musk's rocket company, or even a competitor like Jeff Bezos' Blue Origin, to provide the ride that'll send an orbiter to the Jovian system by 2025 and a lander to Europa by 2027.  The bill also provides over $400 million for NASA to build the Europa orbiter.

The SLS will not be ready in time for a launch so its off to plan B...

Dayton3

Member

Registered: 2002-06-03

Posts: 137

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

Why does anything think there is the slightest chance Europa is habitable given the radiation there?    Why not spend more effort on exploring Callisto?

SpaceNut

Administrator

From: New Hampshire

Registered: 2004-07-22

Posts: 29,431

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

Well looking at the orbit location it sure would see less radiation from Jupiter...
https://solarsystem.nasa.gov/moons/jupi … /in-depth/

https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/big … ystem.html

Thats still a big moon as earths is only #5 on the chart....

Mars_B4_Moon

Member

Registered: 2006-03-23

Posts: 9,776

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

Jupiter spacecraft enters crucial testing phase
https://www.theguardian.com/science/202 … ting-phase

The previous canceled Europa Jupiter System Mission – Laplace (EJSM-Laplace) was a proposed joint NASA/ESA uncrewed robotic space mission slated to launch around 2020

The European replacement JUICE, the JUpiter ICy moons Explorer ESA

the mission carries many Science instruments from Japan and the United States. The craft will have encounters with three planets and the Moon before arriving at Jupiter.
http://sci.esa.int/juice/51417-esa-choo … -explorer/

Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2021-05-23 03:12:43)

Mars_B4_Moon

Member

Registered: 2006-03-23

Posts: 9,776

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

Europe's Space Agency Prepares to Solve 5 Mysteries of Jupiter
https://www.cnet.com/science/space/euro … f-jupiter/
The Juice mission's task list goes all the way from studying magnetic fields to searching for alien life.

Mars_B4_Moon

Member

Registered: 2006-03-23

Posts: 9,776

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

Will Europa finally answer, ‘Are we alone?’

https://www.universetoday.com/157060/wi … -we-alone/

Mars_B4_Moon

Member

Registered: 2006-03-23

Posts: 9,776

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

Europe's JUICE mission will get us closer to searching for life inside other worlds
https://www.cbc.ca/radio/quirks/europe- … -1.6810509

Our Europa Ultraviolet Spectrograph (Europa-UVS) instrument also has a twin on Juice. These devices will help us answer questions like, Does Europa's ocean spew into space? What materials other than ice are on Europa’s surface?
https://twitter.com/EuropaClipper/statu … 6862409728

Europa Imaging System Narrow-Angle Camera Delivered to JPL
https://europa.nasa.gov/mission-updates … ed-to-jpl/

NASA Europa Clipper mission to Jupiter with Robert Pappalardo
https://youtu.be/8ZMZuiiaAmQ

Robert Pappalardo (JHU/APL) gave an online seminar on the NASA Europa Clipper mission to Jupiter's moon. Prof. Pappalardo's lecture was organized in the context of the ISSI-BJ "On Things to Come" series that addresses ongoing as well as future space missions by inviting renowned scientists from different countries, institutes, and space agencies.

Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2023-04-14 14:19:05)

Mars_B4_Moon

Member

Registered: 2006-03-23

Posts: 9,776

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

Work continues to deploy Juice RIME antenna
https://www.spacedaily.com/reports/Work … a_999.html

Every day the RIME antenna shows more signs of movement, visible in images from the Juice Monitoring Camera on board the spacecraft with a partial view of the radar and its mount. Now partially extended but still stowed away, the radar is roughly a third of its full intended length.

'Juice is otherwise performing excellently and with two months of planned commissioning, there is plenty of time to work on any issues.'

https://twitter.com/ESA_JUICE/status/16 … 6921807877

Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2023-05-01 08:58:19)

Mars_B4_Moon

Member

Registered: 2006-03-23

Posts: 9,776

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

Juice’s RIME antenna breaks free

https://www.esa.int/Science_Exploration … reaks_free

More than three weeks after efforts began to deploy Juice’s ice-penetrating Radar for Icy Moons Exploration (RIME) antenna, the 16-metre-long boom has finally escaped its mounting bracket.

tahanson43206

Moderator

Registered: 2018-04-27

Posts: 19,365

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

For Mars_B4_Moon re #13

Thanks for posting this ** very ** good news!

(th)

Mars_B4_Moon

Member

Registered: 2006-03-23

Posts: 9,776

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

Jupiter's ocean moon Europa may not have a fully formed core

https://www.space.com/jupiter-ocean-moo … ormed-core

Mars_B4_Moon

Member

Registered: 2006-03-23

Posts: 9,776

Re: Europa Orbiter - Possible In What Form?

In a future a robot might live stream a news clip from Europa or Ganymede or Callisto and people might have trouble telling the difference between it and a real person. What exactly do I mean?

Take for example this video

A British media channel and a 16 min vid 'ESA JUICE Icy Moons Explorer'

The Juice Mission

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsF6wygnxKU

This I believe is a real media channel by a real person but he did not show his face.

In the CHATGPT artificial BARD topic we started to discuss AI making science content video
soon A.I might produce videos like this, I think a real person made these videos...or at least I hope I can tell if a real person makes these videos.

Perhaps the reason I feel something is off about the vid is not that he hides his face but the somewhat incorrect use of the wrong spacecraft images from previous missions or cancelled missions. However if you are producing content, you probably are limited to pulling what ever sound clips or illustrations are already out there in the public.
If AI makes such videos. Will you be able to tell the difference between a human content producer that wishes to remain anonymous and any other chatbot out there which claims to be a person?

The video speculates Europa may have a unique Alien Ecosystem.

Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2023-06-19 03:52:29)