Mars One Choose Lockheed

louis · 2013-12-24 14:55:10

Have people seen this?

http://www.mars-one.com/news/press-rele … ssion-to-m

Seems to add credibility to Mars One.

All they need now is a billionaire backer!

GW Johnson · 2013-12-24 19:32:45

Hi Louis:

First time I'd seen it, thanks. Any manned settlement Mars One establishes is going to need a large supply of water (locally as ice). They need to develop some ground truth about buried glacial deposits of ice at all the sites they are considering. I've never seen a lander or an orbiter equipped to do that. Saw nothing in the article about that, either.

Water content in the Martian soil suffers from two really serious problems: (1) 1-2% ice-in-soil is an awfully diffuse resource to recover, and (2) an awful lot of that soil-bound ice seems to be far too salty for human or agricultural use without some sort of chemical cleanup.

In contrast, a buried glacier would very likely be real freshwater. Especially if it once was pack ice from a vanished ocean.

To find out what's really down there, and how much there really is, takes a drill rig capable of drilling as much as a kilometer down. Based on the probe designs I've seen, we'll not get data like that until men go, and even then only if their rover has the drill rig on it. Needs a digging blade, too. Basically, we need a backhoe/front-end loader, but with a drill rig on it.

I surely would hate to see people settled onto a site that turns out to be a dry hole. Because then we'd have to watch them all die without realistic hope of rescue. Commercial or governmental, doesn't matter; there is nothing as expensive as a dead crew. That's been the history of it, going back to the first manned flights in the 1960's.

GW

louis · 2013-12-24 20:51:25

GW Johnson wrote:

Hi Louis:
First time I'd seen it, thanks. Any manned settlement Mars One establishes is going to need a large supply of water (locally as ice). They need to develop some ground truth about buried glacial deposits of ice at all the sites they are considering. I've never seen a lander or an orbiter equipped to do that. Saw nothing in the article about that, either.
Water content in the Martian soil suffers from two really serious problems: (1) 1-2% ice-in-soil is an awfully diffuse resource to recover, and (2) an awful lot of that soil-bound ice seems to be far too salty for human or agricultural use without some sort of chemical cleanup.
In contrast, a buried glacier would very likely be real freshwater. Especially if it once was pack ice from a vanished ocean.
To find out what's really down there, and how much there really is, takes a drill rig capable of drilling as much as a kilometer down. Based on the probe designs I've seen, we'll not get data like that until men go, and even then only if their rover has the drill rig on it. Needs a digging blade, too. Basically, we need a backhoe/front-end loader, but with a drill rig on it.
I surely would hate to see people settled onto a site that turns out to be a dry hole. Because then we'd have to watch them all die without realistic hope of rescue. Commercial or governmental, doesn't matter; there is nothing as expensive as a dead crew. That's been the history of it, going back to the first manned flights in the 1960's.
GW

Mars One does build in a number of pre-lander flights. A ton of water landed from Earth would probably be good enough for a couple of people to survive on for an extended period (I mean years) , given the potential for recycling.

That said, I agree with you that the ideal water source is an ancient glacier.

SpaceNut · 2013-12-24 21:33:34

Mars One plans unmanned 2018 mission in deal with Lockheed Martin and satellite company

Private Mars Lander Launching in 2018 Will Build on NASA Legacy

Quaoar · 2013-12-25 04:58:44

GW Johnson wrote:

Hi Louis:
First time I'd seen it, thanks. Any manned settlement Mars One establishes is going to need a large supply of water (locally as ice). They need to develop some ground truth about buried glacial deposits of ice at all the sites they are considering. I've never seen a lander or an orbiter equipped to do that. Saw nothing in the article about that, either.
Water content in the Martian soil suffers from two really serious problems: (1) 1-2% ice-in-soil is an awfully diffuse resource to recover, and (2) an awful lot of that soil-bound ice seems to be far too salty for human or agricultural use without some sort of chemical cleanup.
In contrast, a buried glacier would very likely be real freshwater. Especially if it once was pack ice from a vanished ocean.
To find out what's really down there, and how much there really is, takes a drill rig capable of drilling as much as a kilometer down. Based on the probe designs I've seen, we'll not get data like that until men go, and even then only if their rover has the drill rig on it. Needs a digging blade, too. Basically, we need a backhoe/front-end loader, but with a drill rig on it.
I surely would hate to see people settled onto a site that turns out to be a dry hole. Because then we'd have to watch them all die without realistic hope of rescue. Commercial or governmental, doesn't matter; there is nothing as expensive as a dead crew. That's been the history of it, going back to the first manned flights in the 1960's.
GW

This place must be very good, because we are sure there is water. http://www.space.com/1371-ice-lake-mars.html

It's in Vastitas Borealis and in winter it may be too cold, but we can built a mobile habitat that stay near the lake in spring, summer and autumn, acumulate a water reserve and move south in winter.

Marry Xmas to all!

Last edited by Quaoar (2013-12-26 12:49:33)

JoshNH4H · 2013-12-25 13:00:24

I would think that they would want to go to one of the more equatorial regions, perhaps those where large underground seas/glaciers have been found. I would expect that water from these would locally migrate up to the surface, at a slow rate.

SpaceNut · 2013-12-25 15:19:20

Mars One mission: one way ticket to new life
The applicants 200,000 people from 140 countries have applied for a one-way ticket to Mars and agreed to stay on the Red Planet for the rest of their lives.

Quaoar · 2013-12-26 04:22:39

JoshNH4H wrote:

I would think that they would want to go to one of the more equatorial regions, perhaps those where large underground seas/glaciers have been found. I would expect that water from these would locally migrate up to the surface, at a slow rate.

It's important to perform first an unmanned prospection mission to know exactly how deep is the water pack.
How much deep can we drill, with the hardware that can be realistically stowed in a lander?

JoshNH4H · 2013-12-26 06:45:46

I know that Insight plans to drill down two meters, but I think I better answer is that it depends on what your drilling technology is.

louis · 2013-12-26 10:10:59

Quaoar wrote:

JoshNH4H wrote:
I would think that they would want to go to one of the more equatorial regions, perhaps those where large underground seas/glaciers have been found. I would expect that water from these would locally migrate up to the surface, at a slow rate.
It's important to perform first an unmanned prospection mission to know exactly how deep is the water pack.
How much deep can we drill, with the hardware that can be realistically stowed in a lander?

I think a digger would be better. You can get down deep with a digger but I think the technology is easier. A mini digger can weigh less than one tonne. Using advanced lightweight materials you could probably get it down to 500 kgs. Hook it up to a solar array and it could do its work during the day.

SpaceNut · 2013-12-26 23:38:14

Dutch entrepreneur Bas Lansdorp, Mars One founder and CEO, told reporters the foundation has signed contracts with two major aerospace firms, Lockheed Martin and Surrey Satellite Technology, to develop mission concept studies, a first step toward eventual construction and launch.

Lockheed Martin contract was valued at slightly more than $250,000 while the Surrey agreement came to about $60,000.
NASA's next Mars lander, the $425 million Phoenix-derived Insight mission scheduled for launch in 2016.

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#1 2013-12-24 14:55:10

Mars One Choose Lockheed

#2 2013-12-24 19:32:45

Re: Mars One Choose Lockheed

#3 2013-12-24 20:51:25

Re: Mars One Choose Lockheed

#4 2013-12-24 21:33:34

Re: Mars One Choose Lockheed

#5 2013-12-25 04:58:44

Re: Mars One Choose Lockheed

#6 2013-12-25 13:00:24

Re: Mars One Choose Lockheed

#7 2013-12-25 15:19:20

Re: Mars One Choose Lockheed

#8 2013-12-26 04:22:39

Re: Mars One Choose Lockheed

#9 2013-12-26 06:45:46

Re: Mars One Choose Lockheed

#10 2013-12-26 10:10:59

Re: Mars One Choose Lockheed

#11 2013-12-26 23:38:14

Re: Mars One Choose Lockheed

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