Phobos Grunt - RKA sample return mission to Phobos

cIclops · 2006-09-25 06:12:00

Hmm looks like this mission is really going ahead according to this newpaper story

MOSCOW, September 19 (RIA Novosti) - Russia will launch a spacecraft to Phobos, the larger of Mars' two moons, in 2009, which will return to Earth with a sample of its soil, a project developer said Tuesday.
Dr. Efraim Akim, of the M.V. Keldysh Institute of Applied Mechanics, said the craft will be launched from a platform deployed in an intermediary near-earth orbit.
He said there will be no need to use heavy carrier rockets, which make such launches very expensive.
The launch window for the voyage to Phobos is October 2009, and the journey will take 10-11 months. The spacecraft will begin its return journey to earth in 2011, which will take another 10-11 months.

Mission details on this ESA page

Mars...Let's Go! · 2006-09-25 11:23:44

I am excited about this mission. I think checking out Phobos is a really good idea. I've always been a big fan of Mar's moons.

RedStreak · 2006-09-30 10:55:05

I think checking out Phobos is a really good idea. I've always been a big fan of Mar's moons.

Me too. I think there's alot more to these moons than scientists think. I think there might be a good chance, as assumed, that the pair have origins with the asteroid belt but their orbits suggest something else.

I'd like to confirm if there's carbon and water/hydrates in their surface material. If so then there's alot of applications these moons have to the VSE.

cIclops · 2006-11-16 09:37:32

This looks like an outline of the mission trajectory - a translation would be helpful!

SpaceNut · 2006-11-16 11:13:55

yup maybe serj would ablige...
Sure would seem like a worth while project.

On an off note NASA Studies Manned Asteroid Mission

Space agency teams are looking into use of Constellation hardware for a human Near-Earth Object (NEO) mission—an effort underway at NASA’s Ames Research.
Another study is delving into use of Constellation components to support an automated Mars sample return mission. That study is led by NASA’s Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena, California.

Maybe some day we will use it for a mission to Phobos as well.

RedStreak · 2006-11-18 11:03:02

Looking at that diagram it looks like they might be using solar electric judging from that module with the blatantly huge solar arrays. It looks like it is jettisoned around MOI...kinda a waste but is that an atmospheric entry capsule near Mars? That makes me ponder if a lander is being considered, either Russian or perhaps Chinese (if the later no doubt an effort to boost their space ratings).

Beyond what I noted above looks like the usual for a SRM ala Stardust, Genesis, and Haybuskia (the Japanese asteroid mission): a main bus landing and then delivering a capsule for reentry & landing on Earth.

I hope well for this Russian(/Chinese) mission, and that more details about it will be revealed soon.

cIclops · 2006-11-22 02:29:22

China to participate in Russian mission sending probe to Mars' moon

MOSCOW: China will join Russia's project to send a probe to Mars' moon, Phobos, to take soil samples and deliver them back to Earth, a top Russian space official said Tuesday, news agencies reported.
Federal Space Agency deputy chief Yuri Nosenko said that it was planned that the Chinese would supply a device that would collect the soil samples as well as a satellite that would be put into a Martian orbit, the RIA-Novosti and ITAR-Tass news agencies reported.
The mission is set for 2009. Nosenko said a formal agreement on the use of the Chinese satellite would be ready soon for signing.

Mars_B4_Moon · 2007-02-17 02:54:38

Here is the wiki entry

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phobos-Grunt

cIclops · 2007-03-28 23:04:53

China And Russia Plan Mars Mission

by Peter Harmsen
Beijing (AFP) March 28, 2007
China announced Wednesday it will launch a joint mission with Russia to Mars in 2009, marking "an important milestone" in space cooperation between the two countries.
A small Chinese satellite will take off on a Russian rocket, according to the agreement signed Monday between the China National Space Administration and the Russian Federal Space Agency, the Chinese space body said.
The agreement, signed during an ongoing three-day visit to Russia by Chinese President Hu Jintao, follows pledges by Moscow in recent months to work closely with Beijing on exploration of both Mars and the moon.
"This is an important milestone in Sino-Russian space cooperation," the Chinese space administration said as it unveiled the details of the Mars mission in a statement posted on its website.
According to the agreement, a small satellite developed by China would be launched along with "Phobos Explorer," a Russian spacecraft, probably in October 2009, the administration reported.
After entering Mars' orbit -- 10 to 11 months later -- the Chinese satellite would be detached from the spacecraft and probe the Martian space environment, it said.
The "Phobos Explorer," carrying equipment partly developed by the Hong Kong Polytechnic University, would land on Phobos, a Martian moon, and return to Earth with soil samples, according to the administration.

SpaceNut · 2007-05-28 19:25:32

Martian missions in Asia

Launch Vehicle (LV)…………………………………...Soyuz-2/1b
Launch site………………………………….................Baikonur Cosmodrome
Launch date…………………………………...........….October, 2009
Interplanetary Earth – Mars cruise time………..….10 – 11.5 months
Launch from Phobos………………………………….July –August, 2011
Interplanetary Mars – Earth cruise time..................10.5 – 11.5 months
Return to Earth …….………….…………………........June – July, 2012
Mission total time…………………………………....~ 33-34 months
SC mass………………………..………………………...8,120 kg
Scientific equipment mass……………………………50 kg
Phobos soil samples mass……..……………….……0.2 kg

cIclops · 2007-05-29 01:38:56

Ripped from Swedish Institute of Space Physics powerpoint presentation

Nice find SpaceNut! The soil sampling device is that vertical rod on the left hand side, let's hope it can also core rock.

cIclops · 2007-09-13 03:26:23

Project Phobos-Grunt - (YouTube video 10:38 mins) - 2006

Commentary in Russian but plenty of animations and graphics. Also shows robot arm for selecting samples for onboard analysis. Sample return capsule makes a direct reentry and lands like the Genesis mission!

cIclops · 2007-12-03 18:04:56

Launch of Mars probe set for 2009

By Xin Dingding (China Daily)
2007-12-04 06:51
China's first Mars probe will be launched atop a Russian launch vehicle in October 2009, a senior scientist has said.
Yinghuo-1 will reach the preset circling orbit and send back the first images of the red planet in September 2010, said Chen Changya, a researcher with the Shanghai Institute of Satellite Engineering.
The micro-satellite will lead the country one big step further in its deep space exploration.
The probe's prototype is now being subject to a series of experiments, and next May, its compatibility with the Russian spacecraft will be tested, Chen - who is in charge of the project developing the Mars probe - told a forum on aerospace technology in Shanghai on Sunday.
He said that the probe will travel 350 million km in 11 months before entering planet's orbit.
In comparison, lunar orbiter Chang'e I traveled 380,000 km before circling around the moon. The distance between Mars and Earth is between 56.7 million km and 400 million km, depending on their orbital positions.
The 110-kg Mars probe will circle around the planet for one year, though it has a designed life of two years.
It will conduct scientific exploration tasks, including exploring the Martian space environment, and relay back the first Mars images taken by a Chinese satellite, Chen said.
An official with the Shanghai Aerospace Bureau, surnamed Zhen, confirmed the Mars project but added that the probe's final name has yet to be decided.
The mission is the result of close cooperation with Russia, and represents a "milestone" in the history of space cooperation between the two neighbors, the China National Space Administration (CNSA) said in a statement in March.
Earlier reports said the probe would be launched along with "Phobos Explorer", a Russian spacecraft, atop a Russian rocket.
After entering Mars' orbit, Yinghuo-1 will be detached from the Russian spacecraft, which will land on the Martian moon and return to Earth with soil samples.

cIclops · 2007-12-31 02:03:41

Mission profile from Phobos Sample Return Mission (PDF 3MB) - November 2007

Earth - Mars time line is given as: 7.10.2009 - 29.8.2010

Grypd · 2011-11-24 04:26:24

Thread Necromancy love it....

A quick Update for those unaware (unlikely as it is on this site) about the Phobos-Grunt mission

Phobos-Grunt is a mission to land a probe on Mars's Moon Phobos and to return a sample to Earth, it was also to deliver the Chinese satelite Yinghuo-1 into Mars orbit.

It was launched on November the 9th from Baikonur.

It immediately became obvious that something had gone wrong as they lost all contact with the Probe and that its huge cruise stage did not fire leading to the mission to slowly start falling back to Earth.

Roscosmos have tried to get communications back but had upto Monday failed and ESA took over from ESOC in Germany. They adapted there 15metre dish outside Perth Australia to try to listen into the Mission. And the good news is they have X band transmissions from the craft.

What happens next is depending on what is wrong with the craft. The best hope is that it is a software fault and sending a patch could resolve the issue. If it is hardware and no alternative is available then the mission could still be lost. It should also be noted that the Mission has missed its best transfer window to Mars and that could lead to severe mission difficulties unless the problem is fixed fast.

Glandu · 2011-11-24 04:44:48

And there is no more space shuttle to go there & repair the thing on orbit. I didn't like them, but I already miss them.

Grypd · 2011-11-24 05:17:10

Sorry Glandu.

The Space Shuttle would not have been launched to fix this probe it only cost £170 million. The launch costs of the Shuttle tended to be in the excess of $500 million.

There is also the slight issue that it is a Russian/Chinese mission and it would take literally years to plan out.

So lets hope Roscosmos can fix it and send it on its way but to be really honest it does not look good and the curse of Mars has claimed another mission.

PS welcome to New Mars.

Last edited by Grypd (2011-11-24 05:18:11)

Glandu · 2011-11-24 05:56:22

Well, my remark is more general. For this specific case, the cost would have stopped any action. I said about the Shutlle because it"s the only device ever built that could do that. And the price you state underlines the overkill of the Shuttle for that purpose.

What we lack is a way to make maintenance in LEO, at least low-level maintenance. Some kind of tugs(even unmanned) that would refuel sats & put back some screws would be very valuable in many ways. It would reduce the cost of operating sats, improve the economic interest of space in general, and the tech research in space. More related to this forum, it could help the assembly of a "beyond" spaceship in LEO - if this option was choosen.

Phobos Grunt is not far, maybe a few hundred of kilometers. Its damage seems not big, maybe just an antenna to tighten a little bit. Yet, we don't have anything to repair it, or whatever else. being unable to repair it once stuck on Phobos, well, that's beyond our reach for now. But just here, in LEO? We must be missing something.

SpaceNut · 2011-11-24 14:45:20

I recall work to save the Hubble was along the lines of Dexter the robonaut and a booster stage when the shuttle was considered unsafe as a single launch vehicle when no safe haven or rescue mission was sitting on the launch pad. Maybe time to resurect the design work....

JoshNH4H · 2011-11-24 15:09:03

Glandu, you're very right about LEO tugs, those are potentially quite helpful. I would envision an either nuclear or solar powered (nuclear if we will be allowed to launch it, solar if not) tug with a VASIMR engine (as that appears to be the best available or nearly available form of high Isp propulsion) and a few robotic instruments to manipulate satellites. It could also conceivably be used to deal with the space debris problem. Perhaps you could add in some number of soar sail-type sheets that instead of being used for propulsion could be used for spreading in the tenuous upper atmosphere.

Grypd · 2011-11-24 16:01:16

Space tugs in LEO are one of the most essential parts of an infrastructure policy to push us further out.

I tend towards using magnetised tethers as tugs as they will use little if any fuel and of course this leads to long onstation times.

JoshNH4H · 2011-11-24 18:57:44

That sounds a very good idea. However, I think that electric fields are potentially more useful in terms of manipulating the tether given that they would seem to require less power. Even a fraction of a newton of force could be sufficient in this case.

Grypd · 2011-11-27 13:13:53

The Mission has gone silent again. This is not looking good at all.

JoshNH4H · 2011-11-27 14:35:03

No. It's a real shame, given that a sample from phobos would answer quite a lot of questions; different questions, even, than a surface probe could answer given that phobos may be a captured asteroid.

Midoshi · 2011-11-27 17:58:52

At the DPS meeting I talked to some people who study Phobos, and there is an emerging consensus that Phobos and Deimos are most likely generated from Martian material. This mission really would have been key to affirming (or disproving) that theory.

At this point with Phobos-Grunt, I'm just hoping they figure out what went wrong and gain sufficient communication to make a controlled reentry. I realize that's aiming low (no pun intended), but I think it's what's realistic.

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#1 2006-09-25 06:12:00

Re: Phobos Grunt - RKA sample return mission to Phobos

#2 2006-09-25 11:23:44

Re: Phobos Grunt - RKA sample return mission to Phobos

#3 2006-09-30 10:55:05

Re: Phobos Grunt - RKA sample return mission to Phobos

#4 2006-11-16 09:37:32

Re: Phobos Grunt - RKA sample return mission to Phobos

#5 2006-11-16 11:13:55

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#6 2006-11-18 11:03:02

Re: Phobos Grunt - RKA sample return mission to Phobos

#7 2006-11-22 02:29:22

Re: Phobos Grunt - RKA sample return mission to Phobos

#8 2007-02-17 02:54:38

Re: Phobos Grunt - RKA sample return mission to Phobos

#9 2007-03-28 23:04:53

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#10 2007-05-28 19:25:32

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#11 2007-05-29 01:38:56

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#12 2007-09-13 03:26:23

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#13 2007-12-03 18:04:56

Re: Phobos Grunt - RKA sample return mission to Phobos

#14 2007-12-31 02:03:41

Re: Phobos Grunt - RKA sample return mission to Phobos

#15 2011-11-24 04:26:24

Re: Phobos Grunt - RKA sample return mission to Phobos

#16 2011-11-24 04:44:48

Re: Phobos Grunt - RKA sample return mission to Phobos

#17 2011-11-24 05:17:10

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#18 2011-11-24 05:56:22

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#19 2011-11-24 14:45:20

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#20 2011-11-24 15:09:03

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#21 2011-11-24 16:01:16

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#22 2011-11-24 18:57:44

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#23 2011-11-27 13:13:53

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#24 2011-11-27 14:35:03

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