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#226 2008-04-01 14:20:13

louis
Member
From: UK
Registered: 2008-03-24
Posts: 7,208

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

I don't know of anything in principle that says suspended animation is not possible. Once it is a practical proposition then indeed it would be useful for space flights (you could then just pop the bodies in ice or water tanks to be protected from radiation.


Let's Go to Mars...Google on: Fast Track to Mars blogspot.com

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#227 2008-04-01 14:38:26

JoshNH4H
Member
From: Pullman, WA
Registered: 2007-07-15
Posts: 2,556
Website

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

I'm not sure of that, just wondering.


-Josh

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#228 2008-04-05 08:29:06

Terraformer
Member
From: Ceres
Registered: 2007-08-27
Posts: 3,845
Website

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

The big unknown is will Mars gravity be sufficient to restore the astronauts to full health after their six month outward transit. If the recovery process is too slow, they will be extremely weak for their 18 month stay and unable to explore. Even worse, the return journey may kill them.

After leaving LEO, all astronauts have many people to help them and full medical facilities on Earth, on Mars they will have to manage by themselves with their basic medical equipment. It's absolutely vital that we know before they leave that they can survive the whole voyage.

Which is why we need to go back to the moon first.


Use what is abundant and build to last

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#229 2008-04-05 11:31:10

louis
Member
From: UK
Registered: 2008-03-24
Posts: 7,208

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

This is pure instinct on my part but 1/6th gravity doesn't seem enough. Whereas over one third, nearly 40% does. However, we could experiment on the moon with joint weights for the human body to simulate 1G.


Let's Go to Mars...Google on: Fast Track to Mars blogspot.com

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#230 2008-04-05 12:26:00

Terraformer
Member
From: Ceres
Registered: 2007-08-27
Posts: 3,845
Website

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

But going to the moon would be a (safer) place to experiment, as we can practically discount the zero-g effect (which have enough studies) and study the effect of reduced gravity. As it's closer, instant communication is possible and we can get injured and diseased crew back. No need for a massive medical facility.


Use what is abundant and build to last

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#231 2008-04-05 12:49:23

louis
Member
From: UK
Registered: 2008-03-24
Posts: 7,208

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

Yes, we certainly need to experiment there but I am concerned that results obtained at 17% gravity won't be applicable to 38% gravity. I suppose I am concerned about negative results which won't be applicable to Mars. I suspect that  at 38% gravity a lot of physiological effects on animals and plants will be replicated on Mars. I'm not so sure about on the Moon.  This is purely a hunch.

However the moon is certainly a good place to test ISRU, habitats and artificial hydroponic cultivation.


Let's Go to Mars...Google on: Fast Track to Mars blogspot.com

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#232 2008-04-06 07:41:54

Terraformer
Member
From: Ceres
Registered: 2007-08-27
Posts: 3,845
Website

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

Who wants to try formulating a Moon Direct mission plan and work out its cost?  lol


Use what is abundant and build to last

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#233 2008-04-06 09:11:18

louis
Member
From: UK
Registered: 2008-03-24
Posts: 7,208

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

OK - why not start a thread.

But aren't all moon missions direct?


Let's Go to Mars...Google on: Fast Track to Mars blogspot.com

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#234 2008-04-06 11:15:28

Terraformer
Member
From: Ceres
Registered: 2007-08-27
Posts: 3,845
Website

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

I was thinking more along the lines of Mars Direct - IRSU Fuel Production, that sort of thing. Or The Moon - One Way.

There's a thread around here somewhere called 'the need for a Moon Direct .. continue here'


Use what is abundant and build to last

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#235 2008-04-15 08:11:53

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 29,300

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

Report: Managing Space Radiation Risk in the New Era of Space Exploration

Space exploration is a risky enterprise. Rockets launch astronauts at enormous speeds into a harsh, unforgiving environment. Spacecraft must withstand the bitter cold of space and the blistering heat of reentry. Their skin must be strong enough to keep the inside comfortably pressurized and tough enough to resist damage from micrometeoroids. Spacecraft meant for lunar or planetary landings must survive the jar of landing, tolerate dust, and be able to take off again. For astronauts, however, there is one danger in space that does not end when they step out of their spacecraft. The radiation that permeates space-- unattenuated by Earth's atmosphere and magnetosphere--may damage or kill cells within astronauts' bodies, resulting in cancer or other health consequences years after a mission ends.

I think this is the link I gave earlier in the week. http://books.nap.edu/catalog.php?record_id=12045


Drug protects mice, monkeys from radiation damage

in a finding that may lead to less toxic cancer treatments or an emergency treatment for radiation exposure.

They said the drug protected animals' bone marrow and cells in the gut from being destroyed by radiation without interfering with radiation therapy's ability to fight cancer.

"These tissues fail because these cells choose to commit suicide. Our idea was to block these suicidal intentions," said Andrei Gudkov of the Roswell Park Cancer Institute in Buffalo, New York, whose study was published in the journal Science.



An Agonist of Toll-Like Receptor 5 Has Radioprotective Activity in Mouse and Primate Models

We studied CBLB502, a polypeptide drug derived from Salmonella flagellin that binds to Toll-like receptor 5 (TLR5) and activates nuclear factor–B signaling. A single injection of CBLB502 before lethal total-body irradiation protected mice from both gastrointestinal and hematopoietic acute radiation syndromes and resulted in improved survival. CBLB502 injected after irradiation also enhanced survival, but at lower radiation doses.

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#236 2008-04-15 13:53:41

JoshNH4H
Member
From: Pullman, WA
Registered: 2007-07-15
Posts: 2,556
Website

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

about the gravity thing, we can't be sure about mars g if the effects of moon g are bad, but if the moon is OK, then we know mars will be.


-Josh

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#237 2008-04-16 01:33:11

naitsabes
Banned
From: Tallinn
Registered: 2007-11-11
Posts: 18

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

Long Space Missions Risk Cancer and Premature Aging

http://www.space.com/missionlaunches/08 … -risk.html

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#238 2008-04-16 05:35:58

Terraformer
Member
From: Ceres
Registered: 2007-08-27
Posts: 3,845
Website

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

"Nine months in a spaceship heading out to Mars takes a lot of oxygen to burn, food and water to consume, and produces a lot of waste [carbon dioxide]," said Zapol, who is on the Institute of Medicine's Committee on Aerospace Medicine and the Medicine of Extreme Environments.

Theoretically, cutting metabolism would reduce the need for consumables and produce less waste, enabling spacecraft to travel lighter and faster.

"Wouldn't it be nice to arrest metabolism safely for long periods of time and reverse it when you wanted to?" Zapol said.

Nine months! NINE months! Venus only takes five.


Use what is abundant and build to last

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#239 2008-04-16 06:59:43

dicktice
Member
From: Nova Scotia, Canada
Registered: 2002-11-01
Posts: 1,764

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

I like to think that vegetable gardening will be a fascinating and diverting, as well as time-consuming, crew activity aboard spacecraft bound for Mars.

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#240 2008-04-17 07:23:31

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 29,300

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

I was reminded earlier in the week that when man first made its attempts to travel into space that Russia used a dog while the US used chimps. Many would consider this appauling or cruel to the animals but if you looked at it from a human testing as being the guinea pig it could be view as one of a risk taker, a hero but if death occurs then some would fell that it crosses the line.

Mans first journey to mars could be just a short round trip of 6 months out and 6 months back. Should this be the first step with a crew?

Russia tests monkeys for Mars trip

_44560014_bion226body.jpg


Why would we want to do this?

"People and monkeys have approximately identical sensitivity to small and large radiation doses,"

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#241 2022-03-18 07:53:49

Mars_B4_Moon
Member
Registered: 2006-03-23
Posts: 9,774

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

Ancient Magnetic Fields On the Moon Could Be Protecting Precious Ice

https://science.slashdot.org/story/22/0 … e#comments

Colonizing Mars may require humanity to tweak its DNA
https://www.space.com/mars-colony-human … rades.html
2020 article

Genetic engineering may be a big part of our future on Mars


Tiny laser-propelled spaceships could travel to the far reaches of the solar system and beyond

https://www.space.com/laser-propelled-s … xploration

Brain-Computer Interfaces: Separating Fact From Fiction On Musk’s Brain Implant Claims

https://hackaday.com/2019/07/24/brain-c … nt-claims/

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#242 2022-09-21 11:37:09

Mars_B4_Moon
Member
Registered: 2006-03-23
Posts: 9,774

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

Valery Polyakov death: Cosmonaut holding record for longest-ever trip to space dies aged 80

https://www.independent.co.uk/space/val … 70876.html

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#243 2023-05-26 11:01:38

Mars_B4_Moon
Member
Registered: 2006-03-23
Posts: 9,774

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

The politics of ISS today could put it in a 'Woes to Mars' thread. Different to the days of Salyut stations, Skylab, MIR and ideas from Bigelow

Gateway will come next and the Private sector and perhaps stations from other nations, Gateway is the first planned extraterrestrial space station, it will be placed in lunar orbit. Crewed flights to the Gateway are expected to use Orion and SLS.  Apollo 11 astronaut Buzz Aldrin stated that he is "quite opposed to the Gateway" and that "using the Gateway as a staging area for robotic or human missions to the lunar surface is absurd".

The ISS will continue until 2030

NASA proposes “hybrid” contract approach for space station deorbit vehicle
https://spacenews.com/nasa-proposals-hy … t-vehicle/

NASA is currently planning to operate the ISS to 2030. The other partners have also agreed to that timeline with the exception of Russia, which recently announced it would remain on the station to 2028.

quote from the Artificial Gravity thread


Study Investigates How Men and Women Adapt Differently to Spaceflight
https://www.nasa.gov/content/men-women- … adaptation

summary of the Sex & Gender work groups' major findings is listed below:

    Orthostatic Intolerance, or the inability to stand without fainting for protracted periods, is more prevalent upon landing in female astronauts than in their male counterparts. One possible reason for this observed difference in orthostatic intolerance between the sexes is reduced leg vascular compliance, which was demonstrated in bed-rest studies – which is a ground analog for spaceflight.
    Women have greater loss of blood plasma volume than men during spaceflight, and women’s stress response characteristically includes a heart rate increase while men respond with an increase in vascular resistance. Still, these Earth observations require further study in space.
    The VIIP syndrome (visual impairment / intracranial pressure) manifests with anatomical ocular changes, ranging from mild to clinically significant, with a range of corresponding changes in visual function. Currently 82% of male astronauts vs. 62% of women astronauts (who have flown in space) are affected. However, all clinically significant cases so far have occurred in male astronauts.
    Changes in function and concentration of key constituents of the immune system related to spaceflight have been reported. However, differences between male and female immune responses have not been observed in space.  On the ground, women mount a more potent immune response than men, which makes them more resistant to viral and bacterial infections; once infected, women mount an even more potent response. This response, however, makes women more susceptible to autoimmune diseases. It is not clear if these changes on the ground will occur during longer space missions, or missions that involve planetary exploration (exposure to gravity).
    Radiation presents a major hazard for space travel. It has been reported that female subjects are more susceptible to radiation-induced cancer than their male counterparts; hence radiation permissible exposure levels are lower for women than men astronauts.
    Upon transition to microgravity after arriving at the International Space Station (ISS), female astronauts reported a slightly higher incidence of space motion sickness (SMS) compared with men. Conversely, more men experience motion-sickness symptoms upon return to Earth. These data were however not statistically significant, due both to the relatively small sample sizes and small differences in the incidence of SMS reported by the men and women astronauts.
    Hearing sensitivity, when measured at several frequencies, declines with age much more rapidly in male astronauts than it does in female astronauts. No evidence suggests that the sex-based hearing differences in the astronaut population are related to microgravity exposure.
    The human musculoskeletal response to gravity unloading is highly variable among individuals and a sex-based difference was not observed.
    Urinary tract infections in space are more common in women and have been successfully treated with antibiotics.
    There is no evidence of sex differences in terms of behavioral or psychological responses to spaceflight. Analysis of ISS astronauts’ neurobehavioral performance and sleep measures showed no sex or gender differences using the Psychomotor Vigilance Test (PVT) of alertness and Visual Analog Scales of workload, stress, and sleep quality. Since all all astronaut candidates undergo a robust process of psychological screening and selection,  the likelihood of an adverse behavioral health condition or psychiatric disorder is greatly diminished.

Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2023-05-26 11:03:40)

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#244 2023-06-08 16:24:26

Mars_B4_Moon
Member
Registered: 2006-03-23
Posts: 9,774

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

Frequent lengthy space travel takes a toll on astronauts' brains, study shows

https://phys.org/news/2023-06-frequent- … nauts.html

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#245 2023-06-14 10:59:07

Mars_B4_Moon
Member
Registered: 2006-03-23
Posts: 9,774

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

A space radiation biology exposure experiment payload, containing 12 separate samples of seeds, microorganisms and "small animals," has been installed to an external experiment adapter outside the Mengtian module of China's Tiangong space station.

https://twitter.com/AJ_FI/status/1668869524488085507

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#246 2023-06-18 02:21:38

Mars_B4_Moon
Member
Registered: 2006-03-23
Posts: 9,774

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

Space radiation biological device being moved from interior to exterior of Tiangong Space Station (CSS). This move marks the beginning of a long-term radiation experiment set to continue until 2028.

https://twitter.com/CNSAWatcher/status/ … 0407772160

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#247 2023-06-23 05:31:07

Mars_B4_Moon
Member
Registered: 2006-03-23
Posts: 9,774

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

Study reveals how immune system of astronauts breaks down

https://www.reuters.com/technology/spac … 023-06-22/

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#248 2023-08-04 18:08:18

Mars_B4_Moon
Member
Registered: 2006-03-23
Posts: 9,774

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

A Massive Solar Storm was Detected on Earth, Mars, and the Moon

https://www.universetoday.com/162643/a- … -the-moon/

A coronal mass ejection erupted from the Sun on October 28th, 2021, spreading solar energetic particles (SEPs) across a volume of space measuring more than 250 million km (155.34 million mi) wide. This means that the event was felt on Earth, Mars, and the Moon, which was on the opposite side of the Sun at the time. It was also the first time that a solar event was measured simultaneously by robotic probes on Earth, Mars, and the Moon, which included ESA’s ExoMars Trace Gas Orbiter (TGO) and Eu:CROPIS orbiter, NASA’s Curiosity rover and Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter (LRO), and China’s Chang’e-4 lander.

The ESA’s Solar Orbiter, Solar and Heliospheric Observatory (SOHO), and BepiColombo missions were also caught by the outburst and provided additional measurements of this solar event. The study of Solar Particle Events (SPE) – aka. solar flares – and “space weather” phenomena are vital to missions operating in Low Earth Orbit (LEO) – for example, crews living and working on the International Space Station (ISS). But it is especially vital for missions destined for locations beyond LEO and cislunar space, including Project Artemis and the many proposals for sending astronauts to the Moon and Mars in the coming years.

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#249 2023-08-24 06:06:31

Mars_B4_Moon
Member
Registered: 2006-03-23
Posts: 9,774

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

Space travel depletes red blood cells and bone, but fats may help

https://www.spacedaily.com/reports/Spac … p_999.html

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#250 2024-03-05 10:59:41

Mars_B4_Moon
Member
Registered: 2006-03-23
Posts: 9,774

Re: Long duration Human space missions - Can we survive them?

Today at 08:30:08 UTC Oleg Kononenko broke the world record for the most time spent in space which previously was held by Gennady Padalka, who scored a total of 878 days, 11 hours over five space flights. Oleg is expected to gain a total of 1000 days in space on June 5, 2024.
https://twitter.com/katlinegrey/status/ … 7336195387

pdf
THE CENTRIFUGAL SPACE STATION COMES FULL CIRCLE
https://www.nasa.gov/wp-content/uploads … e86e1af65a

Science gave the centrifugal space station a fair attempt. Even though the centrifugal space station is no longer in NASA’s
foreseeable future, von Braun’s original attempts to kick-start a legitimate scientific proposal have nevertheless come full circle
with the return of the centrifuge to popular culture. Centrifugal artificial gravity makes its iconic appearance in Stanley Kubrick’s
1968 film, 2001: A Space Odyssey, which itself inspired more recent films like Neill Blomkamp’s Elysium (2013) with its orbital
habitat; Christopher Nolan’s Interstellar (2014); and Andy Weir’s book and subsequent film, The Martian (2015).

Whether or not the concept of the centrifuge arose because of the direct influence of popular culture, perhaps even at the behest of Wernher von Braun, is yet to be determined. But the cycle of fiction inspiring science—which in turn inspires fiction—continues, leaving almost a century of individuals whose imaginations
were captured by the idea. Who can say where those minds may
take us next?

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