Crater colony

zhar2 · 2008-03-18 09:02:07

Hi my name its felipe, im new to the forum although ive checked it out a few times before, i dont know if i should have introduced my self somewhere else in the forum before o if this is the right place for this topic.

But anyway, for a long while ive been interested in martian and other space colonisation.
Recently ive been working on a design that involves covering the top of a small crater on mars with a polymer layer embeded with a electrostatic shield, thereby creting an area inside the crater that could be filled with an earthlike atmosphere and biosphere.

The settlement itself would dug into the crater wall on both sides, the settlement structures on the outher side of the crater would be connected by a network of tunnels with the inside settlement and the structures inside the crater, the the crater it self would be used for agricultural purpuses.

Im not sure on the integrity of a smal craters wall structure but i would imagine that they may be composed from a compacted loose assosiation of rock brought up by the impact, if so digging into it would be easier than if it where solid rock, and any solid rock bed would be used latter for more colonisation.

I would like to know your opinion and to become a part of the forum if you would permit me

felipe.

zhar2 · 2008-03-18 09:25:52

Oh and ive been making some sketchup models of the colony if you are interested in seein it.

JoshNH4H · 2008-03-18 14:00:41

Welcome to newmars, felipe

yes, the crater colony has been discussed many times before here. What size craters are you talking about?

Generally the problem with domes is air retaining, and low protection from radiation. And I am very interested in seeing your drawings.

And this thread would be better located herehttp://newmars.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=8

Martian Republic · 2008-03-18 17:19:37

Welcome to the New Mars Forum rhar2.

We have also discussed different size crater colonies too along with build several craters at different temperature zones. Then hook the whole thing together with a train system.

Larry,

zhar2 · 2008-03-18 17:27:26

Thank you all for the welcome.

The crater colony would be in asteroids no more than a km across or so, i guess the idea was to obvious to come only come to me hehe, but my thinking was that pre-fabricated colony kits could be sold to groups on earth (eg: religious groups, small ethnic groups and stuff) so they only had to find a crater and settle, i dunno it may be a way to make colonisation profitable.

i will post some pics of the model, right now im doing tunnels within the crater walls, i got another more completed design of a subterranian colony nealy 300 meters deep (originally started as "the hive" base from sid meiers alpha centaury) the file is quite large though.

louis · 2008-03-26 21:04:26

Yes, it's an interesting idea on which I've also mused.

I was wondering about some many layered (maybe 100 say) polymer cover with differential pressure chambers, so that there would be "natural" release of pressure. This would require the interior to be replenished with air but it would mean that there would not need to be the heavy materials used to construct the sealed cover.

If such a polypressure cover could be devised then many craters could be covered in this way with maybe just a central support for the cover.

I imagine seals at the crater side would be a problem.

zhar2 · 2008-03-27 03:08:52

Well here are some pics:

This one shows the membrane to conatain its atmosphere (although i still gotta work out the seal at the edges, below the terraces, tree farm and water tanks can be seen.

louis · 2008-03-27 07:36:22

Lovely graphics Zhar.

You make it look v. beautiful.

Have you really addressed the pressure problem though? My understanding is that the pressure differential is huge and therefore the structure must be sturdy. Yours looks graceful but not sturdy.

For the side seal, how about clear a smooth flat edge several metres wide round the top of the crater and then dump back the regolith on top of the cover's edges over that width of several metres. Could maybe hold it if the cover was turned upwards like a cake liner and perhaps cross-attached with cables to the other side of the crater.

zhar2 · 2008-03-27 07:49:47

Well i was thinking that the edges of the membrane might be atached to a supporting frame dugged into a trench a few metters deep (about 3 or ontop of a bed rock) at the craters rim, then the trench could be filled with concrete or some type of cement made from martian soil.

After the concrete is set the space bellow would be filled with earth like air (about 2/3 sea level pressure or less), the pressure difference will help support the membrane in the long run, mean while an electrostaric mesh/grid is placed above the membrane and connected to a power supply (reduce radiation) which would consist of two layers of small sphere or circular pattern cables, one layer is positive and the other negative.

The membrane it self would need to be made of a kevlar like material with an embeded reflective aluminum strip radial patter, with a cross section like this \ \ \ \, to help light pass through but less radiation.

I will make a diagram about the whole thing.

louis · 2008-03-27 17:52:55

I suggested something similar regarding magnets on Red Colony but a respondent suggested that type of magnetism would not ward off radiation in the way the earth's magnetic field does. I've no idea whether or not that is true.

JoshNH4H · 2008-03-31 14:50:07

I don't think that that is how magnetism works, or at least magnetic fields, but I'm not sure.

There are basically 3 types of radiation to shield from:

1. UV/ X-ray- from the sun, they can be shielded with rocks/ plastics?/ sunscreen-like materials(theoretical, my theory)/heavy metals

2. The solar wind- a stream of protons coming from the sun, plastics/ aluminum/glass are good shields

3. Cosmic rays- it is virtually impossible to shield from these. These are fast moving (GeV energies) ions up to Fe-56 or so.

To shield from the first two, I would suggest layers of kelvar with a clear liquid compound of a heavy element

to shield from cosmic rays, you would need such a strong magnetic field that it would probably interfere with our everyday funcioning.

zhar2 · 2008-03-31 15:20:38

Well im not intending to use a magnetic field in the design, instead a modified system to nasas electrostatic shield

http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2005 … tatics.htm

The balls are in tended to be smaller and networked in a double (+,-) mesh to cover on top the gas membrane but would still allow light into the crater.

redhorizons · 2008-04-01 14:31:24

Just had a thought. They are looking into cold plasma magnetic shielding for shielding space craft from radiation. Would this same technolgy work on a planatary level, not the entire planet, but on the planet? Like over a crater.
I have no idea, just asking.

Also, with the dome you are talking about here. I remember reading that article on the electrostatic "shield" when it came out and I had a similar idea come to mind as you--though your drawings almost bring it to life. Question for you though. Could you use areo-gel between the membranes? It would allow light, and radient heat, to pass through but would keep the cold out. Or over that big of an area, would the addittion of it be too heavy?

JoshNH4H · 2008-04-01 14:37:55

That's very interesting, but it will probably be very finicky, and not very useful. I would suggest a mix of the two (physical and electrostatic) to shield your colony.

zhar2 · 2008-04-02 02:51:32

Just had a thought. They are looking into cold plasma magnetic shielding for shielding space craft from radiation. Would this same technolgy work on a planatary level, not the entire planet, but on the planet?
Also, with the dome you are talking about here. I remember reading that article on the electrostatic "shield" when it came out and I had a similar idea come to mind as you--though your drawings almost bring it to life. Question for you though. Could you use areo-gel between the membranes? It would allow light, and radient heat, to pass through but would keep the cold out. Or over that big of an area, would the addittion of it be too heavy?

It can work over the whole planet if you where to add a sphere like network with the planet within (it works in the vaccum).

Second question, i think a gel would be far to heavy, the thin aluminium strips (foil like) would be lighter over all.

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