X-37 Goes to Mars

Dave_Duca · 2017-05-21 07:27:55

Now, wouldn't make for an exciting Headlines in the News?
Even the Title sounds like it comes from a 50s B-Rated Sci-Fi Movie.

One of the most high-tech-ish, state-of-the-art, humans-peering-on-humans; Rocket Plane
cleverly designed by the most sophisticated Military Air Force on the planet.

This OTV version of the ex-X-40 Boeing has more autonomy than a Las Vegas Casino.

Can you imagine how accurately effective this already made package would be
if flicked to descend from Martian Orbit?

Change out the Landing Wheels for an upper deployed Glider Chute and
have it land just like the Sky Crane performed for the MSL Curiosity.
And then, land itself Vertically and start the ISRU Process for the Return Trip.
Or, just do something.

But, it already proves the point - on how our "Current State of the Art"
is the current state of the art to use.

SpaceNut · 2017-05-21 07:56:20

Here is a list of topics to which we have talked a bit in the form of using the x-37 to land on mars with.
Landing on Mars
Coherent Mars plan
Orbital Space Plane by 2008 - Faster, Cheaper, Better?
OSP: Capsule v. Wings - if you had to choose right now
Crew vehicles discussion
SpacePlane
X-37

To which I see I have some topic clean up to do for the shifting and articles to make them readable. When I find the other topic that I remember it shall be posted as well...

The main issue for wings for mars is the thin atmospher which means a larger wing size which adds mass to the craft doing the landing...

Dave_Duca · 2017-05-21 08:36:29

Yeah, the wing things are understood.
The package is already ready for ablating for braking.
Yes, I did say "Glider Chute"
And modded to maneuver to the ground like the Sky Crane.

And, I ended with: "Current State of the Art"
is the current state of the art to use.

Nice to have things come to surface after 8 to 12 years.
But, the older posts "spoke of it" not "what to modify and use right now"

The Title still sounds so cool.

Last edited by Dave_Duca (2017-05-21 08:38:42)

SpaceNut · 2017-05-21 10:41:01

Found them Earth Re-entry, Moon or Mars Lander and - return vehicle. One do all, part of CEV?

Reuseable Mars Lander, surface to orbit and back

Mars Scout-11

Airplanes on Mars

2007 mars Scout missions

OSP: Capsule v. Wings - if you had to choose right now

The thin amtosphere is being talked about in many of the topics and are with ways to make a plane possible more so in a few of them.

Dave_Duca · 2017-05-21 19:19:21

Excellent... thank you !

louis · 2017-05-21 19:37:53

A launch mass of 5 tonnes off the back of a big rocket and then landing using Earth's much denser atmosphere ? How is that relevant to Mars?

SpaceNut · 2017-05-21 21:34:36

Yup

SpaceNut wrote:

The main issue for wings for mars is the thin atmospher which means a larger wing size which adds mass to the craft doing the landing...
The thin amtosphere is being talked about in many of the topics and are with ways to make a plane possible more so in a few of them.

To which the solution was given as a fabric wing that inflates with an epoxy hardener to make the wing ridgid. The new heat shield fabric would be used on the sides which see heat on re-entry. The real problem thou starts with the landing as there are no runways and a rocket retro propulsion is to heavy for such a fabric winged plane to support....

Mars_B4_Moon · 2022-08-07 05:22:35

As of ~3 hours ago, it looks like our little Chinese friend the reusable experimental spacecraft/plane was still going...
(and has gained as Medium (0.1m2 – 1m2) RCS value from our dear friends at 18SDS)
https://twitter.com/DutchSpace/status/1 … 6593759233

I don't really know what these things are classed as these days, some call them Space Force type aircraft others call them X-planes or Shuttles, there have been experiments by India and Europe and Japan. Shenlong lit. 'divine dragon' I think was the name given to a Chinese reusable spaceplane in development, there was also a name 'Reusable Experimental Spacecraft'; CSSHQ
https://spaceflightnow.com/2020/09/08/c … pacecraft/
,
https://www.wsj.com/articles/china-laun … 1599217896

McDowell speculated that the very high speeds the spaceplane underwent during re-entry might help the Chinese in their development of hypersonic missiles. He added the Chinese may have thought, "If the Americans have one of those, there's got to be a good reason for it, so we better get one too."
https://www.npr.org/2020/09/09/91111335 … e-suggests

The X-37B Space Plane: Is It Really A Weapon?
https://www.19fortyfive.com/2022/07/the … -a-weapon/

US military's mysterious X-37B space plane sets new spaceflight record
https://www.space.com/x-37b-space-plane … ion-record

Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2022-08-07 05:29:34)

tahanson43206 · 2024-05-29 06:48:38

The X-37b unmanned test vehicle has flown a total of 7 times, as of December 2023.

In the most recent flignt, the Space Force hired SpaceX to provide a Falcon Heavy.

The two outer boosters returned safely to the launch site. However, the center booster was discarded.

Thus, the X-37b does not yet qualify as an FR-TSTO vehicle.

To the best of my knowledge (in May of 2024) no such vehicles exist, but the X-37b flight shows that we are very close to having our first.

(th)

GW Johnson · 2024-05-30 09:12:03

If by FR-TSTO you mean a "fully-reusable two-stage-to-orbit", I agree, when using Falcon Heavy instead of Atlas-5 for X-37b. Two first stage cores of 3 used, get re-used. The second stage is not re-used. But the payload spacecraft is re-used. By that same reasoning, Falcon-9 with Dragon-2 is also almost fully reusable, and has been for a long time. Only the second stage is not re-used.

To become a truly fully-reusable TSTO, you have the make the second stage a fully entry-capable spacecraft that can land in some way. And THAT is the basic idea behind Superheavy/Starship. No one else has yet attempted that. But SpaceX is trying, as we all know. They hid the payload inside that spacecraft-as-second-stage.

That may not be the only way to accomplish it, but so far it looks like the best we have seen.

GW

SpaceNut · 2024-06-02 10:25:53

The other version of a space plane.

NASA's X-34 Spaceplane: A High-Speed Vision Grounded by Reality

In the 1990s, NASA embarked on an ambitious project to develop a low-cost, reusable spaceplane capable of reaching hypersonic speeds. The X-34 spaceplane was designed to achieve Mach 8 and an orbit at 50 miles altitude, featuring advanced technology like GPS navigation, reusable fuel tanks, and automatic landing systems. Despite successful ground tests and captive carry flights, a series of technical issues and cost overruns led to the program’s cancellation in 2001. The X-34 could have revolutionized space access with flights priced at $500,000 each and a payload cost of $1,000 per pound, a stark contrast to the Space Shuttle’s $10,000 per pound.
NASA’s Marshall Space Flight Center initiated the X-34 program in 1996, aiming to frequent space more often and inexpensively than the Space Shuttle. The unmanned spaceplane was 58 feet long with a 28-feet wingspan and carried by a Lockheed L-1011 mothership. However, by 2000, it was clear the X-34 was not meeting its ambitious timeline and cost projections. The X-34 faced avionics and auto-landing system challenges, and program reviews indicated significant risks and potential cost overruns.
The two built X-34 prototypes, and the uncompleted third, ended up in increasingly unfortunate circumstances. Initially stored at Edwards Air Force Base’s North Base, they were left in dilapidated hangars exposed to the elements. There were fleeting glimpses of hope for their utilization, such as potential use by the Sierra Nevada Corporation for engine testbeds or display in a museum.
The X-34s briefly found themselves as laser designation practice targets for the Air Force and were later moved around various installations, including Mojave Air and Space Port and NASA’s Armstrong Flight Research Center. Ownership passed from NASA to the Air Force, and in a strange twist, the vehicles eventually landed in a backyard in Lancaster, California.

SpaceNut · 2024-06-02 11:27:18

Here is another X-40A: Experimental Space Plane That Helped Create the X-37B

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Summary and Key Points: The X-40A was an unmanned space maneuver vehicle, serving as the precursor to the X-37B spaceplane.
-Developed by Boeing's Phantom Works, it was 80-90% the size of the X-37B and was designed to test guidance, control, and landing systems.
-The X-40A conducted several drop tests from a helicopter, starting in 1998, to study its descent and horizontal landing capabilities.
-This testing provided valuable data for the development of the X-37B, which can orbit the Earth for extended periods and return autonomously.
-The X-40A is now displayed at the National Museum of the United States Air Force.
Meet the X-40A
After the space shuttle retired, it looked like it was the end of the line for vertically-launched and horizontally-landed reusable spacecraft. But the United States actually has an unmanned “mini-space shuttle” called the X-37B that can orbit the earth for up to 780 days. What was the precursor to that spaceplane?
The X-40A provided the impetus for guidance and control during autonomous flight and gliding landings. This allowed the Americans to gain insight and flight experience to optimize the craft that would become the X-37B.
What Was the X-40A’s Mission?
The unmanned X-40A space maneuver vehicle was 80 to 90 percent the size of the X-37B. The craft was tiny – only 22-feet long and 2,600 pounds. It was dropped from a Chinook helicopter at 15,000 feet and then started its descent to land horizontally at Edwards Air Force Base. The X-40A had no engines – it was an aircraft created to study how the software and other internal systems would react to a 75-second free-flight descent and landing.
The craft was built at Boeing’s Phantom Works at Seal Beach, California known for “black projects” and experimental aircraft. The first flight was in 1998 at Holloman Air Force Base in New Mexico. The X-40A, made of graphite-epoxy and aluminum, had to learn to land with wind gusts and make sure it didn’t do a face plant on touchdown. It conducted seven other landings under the guidance of NASA starting in 2001.
What Was the X-40A Used For?
The idea behind the X-40A program was to help the United States someday create a spacecraft (the X-37B) that could send out satellites and perform surveillance and logistic duties. The X-40A cost around $1 million to build and the program had $5 million invested in it.
The Difficulty with Reusable Space Planes
The difficult part of a reusable space plane is the size of the cargo payload. It is desirable to cut launch costs so, for example, NASA could spend just $1,000 per pound of cargo instead of $10,000 per pound of cargo. Both the X-40A and X-37B are small crafts. The X-40A had a small payload bay and did not have a capture arm like the Space Shuttle - so that reduced its capabilities.
x-38B
Also, the X-40A, having only a limited glide mission, could not prepare engineers for what would await the X-37B in space. Would it be cost-effective? Could it be turned around quickly for new flights without having to replace tiles? How flexible and responsive was the X-37B going to be?
All of these questions would come from lessons learned flying the X-37B, but the X-40A had an important role in developing a testbed for gliding and free-falling to land horizontally – the main aspect of having a reusable spaceplane.
You can see the X-40A now at the National Museum of the United States Air Force at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base.

GW Johnson · 2024-06-02 15:58:23

I had honestly forgotten about the X-40. Thanks.

GW

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#1 2017-05-21 07:27:55

X-37 Goes to Mars

#2 2017-05-21 07:56:20

Re: X-37 Goes to Mars

#3 2017-05-21 08:36:29

Re: X-37 Goes to Mars

#4 2017-05-21 10:41:01

Re: X-37 Goes to Mars

#5 2017-05-21 19:19:21

Re: X-37 Goes to Mars

#6 2017-05-21 19:37:53

Re: X-37 Goes to Mars

#7 2017-05-21 21:34:36

Re: X-37 Goes to Mars

#8 2022-08-07 05:22:35

Re: X-37 Goes to Mars

#9 2024-05-29 06:48:38

Re: X-37 Goes to Mars

#10 2024-05-30 09:12:03

Re: X-37 Goes to Mars

#11 2024-06-02 10:25:53

Re: X-37 Goes to Mars

#12 2024-06-02 11:27:18

Re: X-37 Goes to Mars

#13 2024-06-02 15:58:23

Re: X-37 Goes to Mars

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