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#1 2017-05-11 15:30:02

Shashi Ranjan
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From: India
Registered: 2017-05-11
Posts: 2
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Terraformation through Asteroids & comets

I've read that they're thinking of terraforming  the mars by colliding it with an asteroid or comet, what might have started life here on earth.
What do you guys think, is this possible on this large scale like terraformation of whole planet??


Let's colonize Mars!

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#2 2017-05-11 15:31:15

Shashi Ranjan
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From: India
Registered: 2017-05-11
Posts: 2
Website

Re: Terraformation through Asteroids & comets

Please give your inputs. What do you think?


Let's colonize Mars!

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#3 2017-05-11 21:11:53

Tom Kalbfus
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Registered: 2006-08-16
Posts: 4,401

Re: Terraformation through Asteroids & comets

div%3E%3Cdiv%20class=
Easier to terraform the asteroid, with the asteroid, you can have Earth normal simulated gravity A Worldring with a  diameter the size of the Earth, can be rotated once every 90 minutes to produce Earth normal simulated gravity, and just make the walls at either end of the cylinder 300 miles tall and you can hold in atmosphere.
artificial_world_by_tomkalbfus-dalwhj2.png

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#4 2017-05-12 05:48:34

karov
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From: Bulgaria
Registered: 2004-06-03
Posts: 953

Re: Terraformation through Asteroids & comets

Tom,

Beautiful!

BUT, Earth radius? Show me it's possible in material strength, pls.

Why go at all over the proven diameters? - up to 5000km wide by using carbon.

Paul Birch.:

The maximum size of conventional rotating space colonies is determined largely by the strength of available
structural materials. The limit is about 250 km radius for quartz, 1000 km for sapphire, and 2500 km for
diamond.

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#5 2017-05-12 06:29:21

louis
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From: UK
Registered: 2008-03-24
Posts: 7,208

Re: Terraformation through Asteroids & comets

My understanding is asteroids and comets come in all shapes and sizes so I am sure we could do it to a limited extent now if we wished. 

However, I would think that orbiting solar reflectors to increase insolation on Mars would be a more effective method.  We could make it permanent "summer" on Mars and thus release huge amounts of CO2 gas into the atmosphere, which would help retain heat...eventually allowing water to melt...again leading to better heat retention. We could produce strong-effect greenhouse gases on Mars in factories and release them into the atmosphere, to further intensify the heating up of the planet.

A quick calculation suggests a Space X ITS transporter (cargo load 450 tonnes)  could deliver 180 sq.kms of reflector material to orbit. 840 such trips would put a million square kms of reflector material in place, over say a period of 40 years with 22 launches per annum.
The reflected solar radiation could be focussed on those parts of Mars with CO2 ice at the surface.



Shashi Ranjan wrote:

I've read that they're thinking of terraforming  the mars by colliding it with an asteroid or comet, what might have started life here on earth.
What do you guys think, is this possible on this large scale like terraformation of whole planet??


Let's Go to Mars...Google on: Fast Track to Mars blogspot.com

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#6 2017-05-12 10:20:23

Tom Kalbfus
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Registered: 2006-08-16
Posts: 4,401

Re: Terraformation through Asteroids & comets

karov wrote:

Tom,

Beautiful!

BUT, Earth radius? Show me it's possible in material strength, pls.

Why go at all over the proven diameters? - up to 5000km wide by using carbon.

Paul Birch.:

The maximum size of conventional rotating space colonies is determined largely by the strength of available
structural materials. The limit is about 250 km radius for quartz, 1000 km for sapphire, and 2500 km for
diamond.

What is the material strength of say Tungsten carbide? It is 15.6 grams per cubic centimeter therefore 15.6 tons per cubic meter. Diamond by contrast is 3.53 grams per cubic cm or 3.53 tons per cubic meter.

Tungstein has a tensile strength of 344 MPa
Carbon nanotubes have been measured to have a tensile strength of 63 gigapascals. But carbon nanotubes have a density of 1.4 grams per cubic centimeter or 1.4 tons per cubic meter. Within the same volume of carbon nanotubes, you could have 11.14 times as much Tungstein carbide. This gives tungstein carbide about 3.833 gigapascals if it has the same cross sections a nanotube cable. Give the Tungsein carbide cable 16.4 times are area cross section as the carbon nanotube cable, and that Tungstein carbide cable will have the same tensile strength as the nanotube cable, this also means a given length of Tungstein carbide cable will have 182.696 times the mass as an equivalent nanotube cable of the same strength, but does the mass of the Tungstein carbide matter? Lets say you wanted a Tungstein carbide cable with 100 times the tensile strength of carbon nanotubes, increase the cross sectional area to  1640 times the cross sectional area of carbon nanotubes, and you would get a tensile strength of 6300 gigapascals, by thickening the Tungstein Carbide cables, you can get as much tensile strength as you want for whatever purpose you want. The trick is not to rotate the Tungstein carbide cables with the rest of the structure. Have you ever heard of Magnetic Levitation?

With magnetic levitation, you could have tungstein carbide cables as thick as you please, and you would magnetically levitate the rotating structure off of the nonrotating tungstein carbide cables, and you make the tungstein carbide cables strong enough to support the rotational weight of the rotating structure. You want to cables as dense as you can get it to create the maximum amount of tensile strength with the minimum amount of wrap around rotational structure. You could put these tungstein carbide cables wherever you need them, they just need a circular path in a vacuum for them not to rotate in as the rest of the structure rotates while wrapped around them. You could have tungstein carbide cables within the walls of the structure to retain atmosphere, you could have them supporting the floors, you could even have them supporting structures above the ground within their own separate evacuated tubes inside the cylinder, say for the purpose of lighting and ceiling panels if you want them. I'm not sure if tungstein would be the best material for this, but I use it as an example, no doubt steel could be used also, it would just require thicker cables. Steel and tungstein is easier to make than carbon nanotubes, so there might be a good reason to use these materials as an alternative to carbon nanotubes.

Last edited by Tom Kalbfus (2017-05-12 10:27:16)

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#7 2017-05-12 11:27:26

Antius
Member
From: Cumbria, UK
Registered: 2007-05-22
Posts: 1,003

Re: Terraformation through Asteroids & comets

Would tend to agree with Louis on this one.  Moving asteroids is a difficult and dangerous thing to do.  But if orbital mirrors and greenhouse gases can raise Martian atmospheric pressure above 150mb, humans could work on the surface without spacesuits.  They would need warm clothing and protection against dust, but those are relatively easy problems to solve.  In addition, an atmosphere that thick would shield out cosmic rays.  This would be a huge boost to habitability and it can be accomplished relatively easily.

On the other hand, the thin Martian atmosphere does offer some advantages that would be lost if the atmosphere were thicker.

Last edited by Antius (2017-05-12 11:31:09)

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#8 2017-05-14 05:48:21

karov
Member
From: Bulgaria
Registered: 2004-06-03
Posts: 953

Re: Terraformation through Asteroids & comets

Tom,

Please, show the masses, thickness etc. of the proposed by you rotating-into-notnrotating desing. How many tonnes per sq.m. etc.

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#9 2022-07-27 14:39:41

Mars_B4_Moon
Member
Registered: 2006-03-23
Posts: 4,782

Re: Terraformation through Asteroids & comets

'Should we hit Mars with The Behemoth Comet?'

https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/s … t.1017110/

link to an animated video The Infographics Show

playing cards or video games?
Terraforming Mars: Turmoil Review
https://www.tabletopgaming.co.uk/Review … oil-review
The Terraforming Mars card game is as good as we’d hoped it would be
https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2022/07/ … ccessible/

Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2022-07-27 14:47:50)

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