Katrina and New Orleans

srmeaney · 2005-09-22 17:28:25

Rita now category 5.

So much for the Oil port infrastructure at Huston. Both US Oil intake Ports destroyed. Bugger.

After Huston goes, California next with its oil intake systems. Then the US must live off strategic reserves at ten dollars a gallon for the two years needed to rebuild.

SpaceNut · 2005-09-22 19:18:17

Here is an article that covers what srmeaney is talking about to some degree.
Rita's threat pushes oil, gas prices up

The government reported Wednesday that 73.2% of Gulf oil production is closed because of Rita-related evacuations and leftover Katrina damage.
And 47.1% of Gulf natural gas production is down, according to the U.S. Minerals Management Service.
The Gulf supplies 29% of oil used in the USA and 21% of natural gas.
Twenty-one U.S. oil refineries that together account for 27.5% of the nation's refining capacity lie in the potential path of Hurricane Rita, the American Petroleum Institute said.

SpaceNut · 2005-09-23 09:53:03

[url=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9438536/]Rita causes more flooding in New Orleans
‘Our worst fears came true,’ official says as water pours into Ninth Ward[/url]

050923_newOrleans_hmed_9a.hmedium.jpg

Hurricane Rita’s steady rains sent water pouring over a patched levee

RobertDyck · 2005-09-23 22:11:30

This sounds like now is the time for me to seriously start several businesses that I've been talking about for years:
- hurricane proof houses with solar power roof and geothermal heat pump
- conversion kits for existing cars, from gasoline to hydrogen fuel cell
- carbon nanotube power lines for long distance electric power transmission

I already described the houses in detail. There are several objectives, not only hurricane proof. Energy independence means no worry if natural gas or fuel oil prices go up. It also means a power failure after hurricane would not affect these houses.

Gas prices are already insane and going to get worse. Now is the time for alternate fuel. I would make conversion kits that include in-wheel electric motors for all 4 wheels. That means full time 4-wheel-drive without a transmission or differential. In-wheel motors use high torque and relatively low speed for direct drive, one motor revolution per wheel revolution. No energy loss to gears and no crank case oil or transmission fluid. Differential is entirely electronic. Those motors could also act as regenerative brakes, generating electricity to recharge the battery as you brake. Rare earth magnets make electric motors stronger and lighter. Hydrogen fuel storage in a fibreglass tank with special polymer liner and carbon nanotube fill. The CNT fill binds hydrogen to store 3 times as much before the same pressure is reached. Fibreglass tank capacity is only limited by pressure.

Electricity can be exchanged between states (or provinces) but transmission over thousands of miles has significant losses to power lines. CNT are about 30 times as conductive as copper, reducing long distance power loss. Recently published work on CNT show how to make long ribbons (unlimited length) but they're stiff. I'll have to figure out how to make them flexible enough to practically deploy power cables. Published techniques can be readily scaled up for mass production with industrial synthetic fibre manufacturing techniques.

reddragon · 2005-09-24 08:59:36

Gas prices are already insane and going to get worse. Now is the time for alternate fuel. I would make conversion kits that include in-wheel electric motors for all 4 wheels. That means full time 4-wheel-drive without a transmission or differential. In-wheel motors use high torque and relatively low speed for direct drive, one motor revolution per wheel revolution. No energy loss to gears and no crank case oil or transmission fluid. Differential is entirely electronic. Those motors could also act as regenerative brakes, generating electricity to recharge the battery as you brake. Rare earth magnets make electric motors stronger and lighter. Hydrogen fuel storage in a fibreglass tank with special polymer liner and carbon nanotube fill. The CNT fill binds hydrogen to store 3 times as much before the same pressure is reached. Fibreglass tank capacity is only limited by pressure.

Although hydrogen could certainly be a good replacement fuel for cars, I wonder how many people would want to convert to hydrogen cars when there are no hydrogen stations yet. Could a car that recycles its hydrogen by capturing and electrolyzing the water it creates be made? I guess that would be essentially an electric car storing its energy in fuel cells instead of batteries; I 'm not sure if that would be better or worse than regular electric. Also creating hydrogen (by electrolyzing water) requires electricity generated usually by burning fossil fuels, making it an imperfect alternative. I think such technologies as V2G hybrids are the most likely near-term advances. Still nothing wrong with developing hydrogen cars, I guess.

Good luck if you start any of these businesses; all the techs you mention would be quite useful to the world I think.

RobertDyck · 2005-09-24 12:39:06

In the United States electricity is made by burning fossil fuel. It actually makes more sense to reform natural gas into hydrogen rather than burn natural gas to make electricity then electrolyse water. But there are many ways to make electricity, and I saw on TV one fuel station in California that does make hydrogen for cars by electrolysis of water.

Here in the province of Manitoba we make electricity by hydro electric dams and there are many locations that Manitoba Hydro identified that could have another dam. Those dams haven't been built simply because there's no customer. One dam on the Nelson River was going to sell power to Ontario but the deal with Ontario Hydro fell through so the dam wasn't built. They're in negotiations again, Ontario needs more power and since the inter-province deal fell through Ontario built some coal burning power plants. The environmental guys want those coal burning plants shut down. Actually Manitoba does have 2 small coal burning plants, originally built as back-up power stations for small cities but Hydro now runs them 24/7 to maximize power they sell to Minnesota. I would like another hydro dam built and those 2 coal plants shut down. According to the 19 August 2005 issue of Science, France gets 78% of its power from Nuclear.

I'm told the United States has the largest coal reserves in the world. Although coal is the dirtiest, most polluting form of power generation available today, it wouldn't have the cost oil. If the goal is reducing the cost of operating a car, using coal to generate electricity to run electrolysis units in every fuel station in the nation would work. It would also move pollution to the power plants rather than downtown streets. Although it would be a great to use alternative energy sources: hydro dams, wind farms, solar, and tidal harness (dam across a bay with high tides). Even nuclear would be better than coal.

Actually, it's more practical to carry hydrogen in a car and exhaust pure water from the fuel cell out the tail pipe. Fuel stations would use electricity and water from the water main.

RobertDyck · 2005-09-26 02:02:11

I just saw an article on CNN about one parish that's totally destroyed. Homes flattened to their concrete slab. I think this web story is the same one.

Along the state line, Louisiana's Cameron Parish was under as much as 15 feet of water, and thousands of homes were destroyed, said Freddie Richard, the head of emergency preparedness for the community of 10,000 residents.
About 45 miles south of nearby Lake Charles, every home was destroyed in the town of Holly Beach, Richard told CNN.
In the parish seat of Cameron, 90 percent of homes were destroyed, he said.
In Creole, 70 percent of residences were destroyed, with little more than the courthouse and an elementary school still standing, according to Richard.

This devastation is shocking. I would like to repeat my advice. Don't live in an evacuation zone, don't build a home below sea level, and when you live in a hurricane zone construct your house to withstand a direct hit by the worst hurricane possible. Where ever you build, construct your house to withstand the worst natural disasters that can occur at that location. This is true of earthquake, river flood, hail, tornado in Kansas, blizzard in the north, mud slide if you build on a hillside, or forest fire if you build in a forest. Looting happens in any evacuation zone, your home isn't safe if it's evacuated. You should build to weather storms, if you have to evacuate you didn't build it right.

I thought the hurricane doors of downtown Miami looked ugly, but they did their job during the hurricanes I lived through. A few trees down, some palm limbs on the ground, lots of mud on streets and sidewalks, but the city survived. The French Quarter of New Orleans had some damage but lived through it. One reason is the land isn't that far below sea level. The old houses standing today are the ones that survived multiple hurricanes; the weak ones are long gone. Look at how surviving builds are built. Sturdy construction, they may have some mud on the first floor and the plaster of the lower portion of walls will have to be replaced, but the buildings survive. Here in Winnipeg after the flood homes south of the Floodway got flooded. There was as much mud inside the homes as out. Drywall and fibreglass wall insulation had to be ripped out and replaced. Carpets torn out and thrown away. But homes survived. Actually the lesson according to most Winnipeggers is not to build outside the zone protected by the Floodway. In 1997 the Floodway was used to 10% over design capacity causing damage, but homes north of it were completely safe and city crews reparied the Floodway after it was over. We build homes with full basements up here because flat concrete pads get lifted by frozen ground in the winter; that lift is always uneven so it cracks walls. A crack that lets air through is particularly bad on the coldest nights in the depths of winter when the temperature gets below -30°C, once every couple years there's a night that gets down to -40°C (-40°F).

Louisiana doesn't need basements, the ground doesn't freeze solid in winter, but it does get hurricanes. Plan for them.

John Creighton · 2005-09-26 03:38:12

I just saw an article on CNN about one parish that's totally destroyed. Homes flattened to their concrete slab. I think this web story is the same one.
Along the state line, Louisiana's Cameron Parish was under as much as 15 feet of water, and thousands of homes were destroyed, said Freddie Richard, the head of emergency preparedness for the community of 10,000 residents.
About 45 miles south of nearby Lake Charles, every home was destroyed in the town of Holly Beach, Richard told CNN.
In the parish seat of Cameron, 90 percent of homes were destroyed, he said.
In Creole, 70 percent of residences were destroyed, with little more than the courthouse and an elementary school still standing, according to Richard.
This devastation is shocking. I would like to repeat my advice. Don't live in an evacuation zone, don't build a home below sea level, and when you live in a hurricane zone construct your house to withstand a direct hit by the worst hurricane possible. Where ever you build, construct your house to withstand the worst natural disasters that can occur at that location. This is true of earthquake, river flood, hail, tornado in Kansas, blizzard in the north, mud slide if you build on a hillside, or forest fire if you build in a forest. Looting happens in any evacuation zone, your home isn't safe if it's evacuated. You should build to weather storms, if you have to evacuate you didn't build it right.
I thought the hurricane doors of downtown Miami looked ugly, but they did their job during the hurricanes I lived through. A few trees down, some palm limbs on the ground, lots of mud on streets and sidewalks, but the city survived. The French Quarter of New Orleans had some damage but lived through it. One reason is the land isn't that far below sea level. The old houses standing today are the ones that survived multiple hurricanes; the weak ones are long gone. Look at how surviving builds are built. Sturdy construction, they may have some mud on the first floor and the plaster of the lower portion of walls will have to be replaced, but the buildings survive. Here in Winnipeg after the flood homes south of the Floodway got flooded. There was as much mud inside the homes as out. Drywall and fibreglass wall insulation had to be ripped out and replaced. Carpets torn out and thrown away. But homes survived. Actually the lesson according to most Winnipeggers is not to build outside the zone protected by the Floodway. In 1997 the Floodway was used to 10% over design capacity causing damage, but homes north of it were completely safe and city crews reparied the Floodway after it was over. We build homes with full basements up here because flat concrete pads get lifted by frozen ground in the winter; that lift is always uneven so it cracks walls. A crack that lets air through is particularly bad on the coldest nights in the depths of winter when the temperature gets below -30°C, once every couple years there's a night that gets down to -40°C (-40°F).
Louisiana doesn't need basements, the ground doesn't freeze solid in winter, but it does get hurricanes. Plan for them.

I agree that we should work on solutions to better cope with disasters but dumping more and more money into better structures on smaller pieces of land is not necessary the best option. The below sea level land in New Orleans has value because it is close to the city. Yes it can get destroyed but if you don’t have much money invested in the place then so what? I agree that building standards are required as poorly constructed buildings can create debris which can be a safety hazard and damage other buildings but lets not get carried away. I also agree it is a cost to evacuate a city and people in areas that are likely to be evacuated because of potential flooding should pay higher taxes to help pay for future evacuation costs.

So where does this leave us with building standards? I think that the property tax system should be adjusted so that you can reduce you taxes by meeting better building standards. I think that there should be a sales tax rebate for the construction costs of buildings that meet certain standards. Depending on the economics perhaps better buildings could be partially subsidized with extra tax revenue generated from homes and buildings that are bellow a certain standard. So basically we are trying to use the tax system to encourage people to build better buildings so we pay a greater cost up front but hopefully save the money later on in disaster relief.

RobertDyck · 2005-09-26 19:00:11

Great ideas. There are a number of simple things that can make a home hurricane proof. Considering what happened with hurricanes Katrina & Rita I think it's only reasonable to require 150mph roofing to get the tax breaks. Katrina was 140mph wind when it hit New Orleans, Rita was 120mph when it hit Cameron Parish. Roofing certified for 120mph would not survive Katrina and Rita was on the razor's edge of failure, probably some areas of Louisiana had winds above 120mph. Class H shingles are certified to 150mph, but there are other roofing products that can handle it: metal, slate, tile (clay and concrete), and roll roofing.

The advantage of asphault roll roofing is ease of installation. It's basically the same material as shingles but a roll covers the entire width of the roof in a single strip. Overlap strips from the roof bottom edge to the top the way you would with shingles. Unrolling a single strip takes a lot less labour than a row of shingles. Completing roof installation more quickly not only means your house is finished sooner, it means lower labour cost. With a shingles the labour can cost more than materials. It's available in many colours and has virtical lines printed that the manufacturer says are for alignment but make them look like standard shingles. You do have to be careful with roll roofing, because installation cost is so much cheaper the materials are often made cheap as well. Cheap quality roll roofing will only last 10 years and won't withstand hurricane force winds. Look for good quality.

Atlas Roofing sells roll roofing, but they don't provide any certification or technical information. I don't know if it'll handle hurricane force winds so I have to assume it doesn't. So I won't include a link.

Class codes for shingles:
D - 90 mph
G - 120 mph
H - 150 mph

SpaceNut · 2005-10-05 10:28:01

Hurricanes Destroyed 109 Oil Platforms: US Government

Hurricanes Katrina and Rita destroyed 109 oil platforms and five drilling rigs in the Gulf of Mexico, but only a small portion of production will be lost for good, the US government said Tuesday.
Rita destroyed 63 platforms and one drilling rig when it tore through the region on September 24, she said. Katrina destroyed 46 platforms and four drilling rigs when it hit the Gulf at the end of August.

SpaceNut · 2005-10-11 11:43:01

The aftermath and hardships still to be faced by those in the huricanes path now include those being ignore by FEMA bull S**T, all because you share a common phone number.

I think they used to call that a party line up here in NH during the late 60's.

[url=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9655113/]FEMA grants leave some behind
Many hurricane victims say they were unfairly denied emergency aid[/url]

SpaceNut · 2005-10-12 10:49:31

Another effect of stagnant budgeting...

[url=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9645908/]Hurricane Center hobbled by tight budget
‘It’s almost like we’re forecasting blind,’ one forecaster tells newspaper[/url]

Forecasters at the National Hurricane Center have struggled for more than a decade to issue accurate storm reports using broken equipment, an overbooked airplane fleet and tight budgets, a newspaper reported Sunday.
Key forecasting equipment used by the center has broken down or been unavailable for nearly half of the 45 hurricanes that have struck land since 1992, The Miami Herald found after an eight-month investigation.

Shakes head....

John Creighton · 2005-10-12 11:10:33

Another effect of stagnant budgeting...
[url=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9645908/]Hurricane Center hobbled by tight budget
‘It’s almost like we’re forecasting blind,’ one forecaster tells newspaper[/url]
Forecasters at the National Hurricane Center have struggled for more than a decade to issue accurate storm reports using broken equipment, an overbooked airplane fleet and tight budgets, a newspaper reported Sunday.
Key forecasting equipment used by the center has broken down or been unavailable for nearly half of the 45 hurricanes that have struck land since 1992, The Miami Herald found after an eight-month investigation.
Shakes head....

That's nuts!

RobertDyck · 2005-10-12 18:57:15

Another effect of stagnant budgeting...
[url=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9645908/]Hurricane Center hobbled by tight budget
‘It’s almost like we’re forecasting blind,’ one forecaster tells newspaper[/url]
Forecasters at the National Hurricane Center have struggled for more than a decade to issue accurate storm reports using broken equipment, an overbooked airplane fleet and tight budgets, a newspaper reported Sunday.
Key forecasting equipment used by the center has broken down or been unavailable for nearly half of the 45 hurricanes that have struck land since 1992, The Miami Herald found after an eight-month investigation.
Shakes head....

Be careful what you believe. I get very suspicious when someone claims they're working with broken or inadequate equipment right after a major disaster. It sounds like sensationalism to justify a budget increase. All companies and departments must work with limited resources. Failure to control budget results in extravagant spending on unnecessary or overpriced equipment. The military $600 hammer is one example. I don't think Canada has any dedicated hurricane planes; although Canada doesn't get as many hurricanes as the Gulf coast, the Canadian Atlantic coast does get them. They rely on satellite images and data, and military planes temporarily equipped with atmosphere sensors to measure the hurricane. Of course they also have usual weather sensors: ground stations, bouys, balloons, radar. If the US National Hurricane Center has a fleet of dedicated airplanes then they're already quite well equipped. Properly maintaining existing equipment is a management issue.

Grypd · 2005-10-16 15:59:35

There is a British Billionaire and he has decided to rebuild the town of Long Beach in Mississippi which was wrecked by Hurricane Katrina. Long Beach had a population of 17000 but was devastated by Katrina and insurers are refusing to pay for its rebuilding and goverment cash is not going there it having been earmarked for the more important city of New Orleans and other such large cities.

The Billionaire is Lakshmi Mittal a steel tycoon estimated to be worth about £14.8 Billion pounds and he described the effects of the hurricane as "heartbreaking" and he had been moved to get involved. "It will take years to rebuild the shattered communities".

It is expected to cost over £50 million pounds to repair the town of Long Beach but Mittal and his company will not just give a cheque and leave they plan to finish the job themselves and are already in the process of hiring labourers and moving materials to rebuild the town as was.

Palomar · 2005-10-20 14:44:44

Help out Gulf Coast astronomers & observatories!

*Link to more information is hosted in that very short article.

--Cindy

srmeaney · 2005-10-20 16:41:20

Third hurricane? Now this is just overkill.

Odds on that Florida will be destroyed. That will affect sugar cane production and push up the price of ethanol. Oh. Theres a small oil port in Florida.

What will it be? Record damage to NASA infrastructure in late 2005 causes the Cancellation of the Space Program. USA forced to commit itself to rebuilding infrastructure for the next twenty years.

SpaceNut · 2005-11-04 14:42:49

Everyone has there own unique story of survival from these great huricanes that have just leveled everything in there path. Her story is one of a double wammy but the discription of the efforts to help those there is just as important for all of us that are so far from the scenes.

FOR SOLDIER'S MOM, KATRINA'S IMPACT DIMINISHED

Living in the area:

Everybody has a Katrina story in the cities of Bay St. Louis and Waveland.
Most people are homeless, or at least forced into trailers or relatives' homes. They are frustrated by the endless red tape and anguished about an uncertain future in a region where recovery is measured by tons of debris moved, number of houses demolished and businesses back in business.
They are tired of FEMA trailers, tired of the bureaucracy, tired of the devastation, tired from worrying about money, their jobs and their children.
Elaine Oneto, who also lost her house, has a different perspective, wrought from another tragedy, one that, in her mind, has obliterated all the impact of the hurricane.

Palomar · 2005-11-07 15:04:41

Help out Gulf Coast astronomers & observatories!
Link to more information is hosted in that very short article.

*More info in S & T's most recent e-bulletin:

http://skyandtelescope.com/news/article_1621_1.asp

"Much astronomical infrastructure was lost there as a result of Katrina..."

--Cindy

SpaceNut · 2005-12-09 14:45:17

More after effects from Katrina:

[url=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10396130/]New Orleans chief says 60 officers fired
Disciplinary hearings continue for police who deserted the city after Katrina[/url]

MANY 'MISSING' DON'T WANT TO BE FOUND

SpaceNut · 2005-12-14 11:21:49

I thought it was bad when I heard the other day that trailers are parked on an air field vacant with no placement of them for people to use in sight by FEMA.

But now there are plans to return some property back to its original wet land state.

[url=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10465263/]Plan could shrink New Orleans footprint
Key commission member recommends returning some areas to wetland[/url]

If this is to be I would hope that thoses that did own the property are compensated for returning it. They have lost there homes and have paid many years worth of taxes, all of which is unfair if it is taken from them...

Then you have the other side of the coin where people do want to rebuild but a lack of contractors can and is making this difficult.

UNEMPLOYMENT CONUNDRUM

SpaceNut · 2005-12-30 08:57:33

Making it possible where Fema has failed AMBITIOUS PLAN FOR NEW HOMES though Habitat for Humanity.

An ambitious plan to replace some of the thousands of homes lost to Hurricane Katrina is quickly taking shape on computer screens, drawing boards and back roads here in Hancock County.
“We’re looking at upwards of 1,000 homes between Beaumont, Texas, and Mobile over the next 18 months,”

While giving places to these people in the areas that they have fled to is a good step some may still wish to return to what they once owned and will need this same help there..

EuroLauncher · 2006-02-15 07:51:33

This has potential to be a fabulous method of distributing aid. High marks from me for this idea Treb. . .
With computers and the scanners, the card could be restricted to buying food, water and the like.
Katrina's searing images -- linking nature's wrath and the nation's wrongs -- have fanned the smoldering resentments of the civil rights, Reaganomics and hip-hop eras all at once. Once a Presidential Disaster Declaration has been made, the Federal Emergency Management Agency assumes the role of coordinating federal agency support to meet state requests for assistance.

Report Slams Katrina Disaster Preparation
The deaths and suffering of thousands of Hurricane Katrina's victims might have been avoided if the government had heeded lessons from the 2001 terror attacks and taken a proactive stance toward disaster preparedness, a House inquiry concludes.
But from President Bush on down to local officials there was largely a reactive posture to the catastrophic Aug. 29 storm — even when faced with early warnings about its deadly potential.
http://soundroots.org/uploaded_images/b … 779638.jpg
A 520-page report, titled "A Failure of Initiative," was being released Wednesday as
Homeland Security Secretary
Michael Chertoff testifies before a Senate committee conducting a separate investigation of the government's Katrina response.
The Associated Press obtained a copy of the report Tuesday night.
"The preparation for and response to Hurricane Katrina should disturb all Americans," said the report, written by a Republican-dominated special House committee chaired by Rep. Tom Davis, R-Va.
http://soundroots.org/uploaded_images/b … 779638.jpg
"Passivity did the most damage," it said. "The failure of initiative cost lives, prolonged suffering, and left all Americans justifiably concerned our government is no better prepared to protect its people than it was before 9/11, even if we are."
The hard-hitting findings allocated blame to state and local authorities and concluded that the federal government's single largest failure was in not recognizing Katrina's likely consequences as it approached. That could have prompted a mobilization of federal assets for a post-storm evacuation of a flooded New Orleans, the report said, meaning aid "would have arrived several days earlier."
It also found that Bush could have speeded the response by becoming involved in the crisis earlier and says he was not receiving guidance from a disaster specialist who would have understood the scope of the storm's destruction.

Yang Liwei Rocket · 2006-03-16 00:56:36

Search For Katrinas Dead Stymied By Bureaucratic Wrangling
http://www.terradaily.com/reports/Searc … gling.html
by Allen Johnson
New Orleans (AFP) Mar 13, 2006
More than six months after Hurricane Katrina, the plodding search for the dead remains stymied by the same bureaucratic wrangling that has kept the rebuilding of New Orleans at a snail's pace.

SpaceNut · 2006-10-09 19:29:08

Authorities brace for Katrina home-repair fraud Homeowners get federal grant money, con artists expected to surface

Finding an honest, readily available contractor is a challenge these days on the Gulf Coast, where last year’s epic storm demolished tens of thousands of homes. With most reputable contractors booked for months, con artists are filling the void and preying on desperate homeowners, law enforcement officials say.
To date, home-repair rip-offs have accounted for only a modest share of the hundreds of millions of dollars in fraud that followed in Katrina’s wake. But authorities expect the problem to grow worse as billions in federal grant money starts to flow to homeowners in Mississippi and Louisiana.

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