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#1 2003-01-25 06:45:43

soph
Member
Registered: 2002-11-24
Posts: 1,492

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

http://www.spacedaily.com/news/mars-general-03a.html

Apparently, we're way off on the ages of regions of mars.  We also don't know how volcanically active.  The new findings show that its either very active or everything's shut down.

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#2 2003-05-15 19:32:15

LilMartiandude23
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Registered: 2003-05-15
Posts: 2

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

I think it is not active. if our computers show they are active right now, why isn't the lave hanging in the air. I know there isn't zero gravity, but if something goes up there it will stay for a while. :angry:

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#3 2003-06-27 18:19:47

dickbill
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Registered: 2002-09-28
Posts: 749

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

Last MGS picture of the day (friday 27th):
ttp://www.spaceref.com/redirecth.html?id=0&url=http://www.msss.com/
it looks like bubbles making a splotch when they reach the surface.
The bubbles seem aligned, maybe the gas came from leaks of underground lava tunnels. Maybe it wasn't gaz, but some lighter substance wich reach the surface through a soft material (dust accumulation ?)

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#4 2003-07-07 05:46:21

Shaun Barrett
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From: Cairns, Queensland, Australia
Registered: 2001-12-28
Posts: 2,843

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

I think LilMartiandude23 is underestimating the gravitational acceleration on Mars.

LMd23 writes:-

... why isn't the lave hanging in the air. I know there isn't zero gravity, but if something goes up there it will stay for a while. :angry:

    Here on Earth, when you drop something it accelerates downwards - gaining 9.81 m/s every second.
    On Mars, the corresponding acceleration is 3.73 m/s every second. Still a very respectable figure.

    Using the volcanic scenario to illustrate the point, what happens on Earth and on Mars if a volcano blasts a hunk of lava 100 metres (328 ft) into the air?
    On Earth, the lava (ignoring air resistance) will fall to the ground in about 4.5 seconds and will be travelling at about 159 kms/hr (99 mph) when it hits.
    On Mars, lava falling from the same height will take about 7.3 seconds to reach the surface and be travelling at about 98 kms/hr (61 mph) when it hits.

    As you can see, LilMartiandude23, there's no chance of Martian lava hanging about in the air. Martian gravity is really quite effective and astronauts will have to be just as careful when climbing or traversing dangerous terrain as any explorer here on Earth. A fall could be just as lethal.
                                           ???


The word 'aerobics' came about when the gym instructors got together and said: If we're going to charge $10 an hour, we can't call it Jumping Up and Down.   - Rita Rudner

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#5 2003-07-07 17:55:19

RobS
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From: South Bend, IN
Registered: 2002-01-15
Posts: 1,701
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Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

The bigger question is, if a volcano on Mars is erupting today, could we figure it out? Maybe infrared sensors would detect the heat, but only if they happened to look at the few square kilometers out of 125,000,000 square kilometers on the surface that were heated up. Many volcanoes are enshrouded in clouds right now because of their height.

      -- RobS

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#6 2003-07-07 18:48:21

Shaun Barrett
Member
From: Cairns, Queensland, Australia
Registered: 2001-12-28
Posts: 2,843

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

This is a good point and one I hadn't considered. I have to admit, I've always envisaged a spectacular explosion of dust, gas and lava from one of the Tharsis peaks, which would be obvious.
    I suppose a slower, less explosive eruption could conceivably evade detection despite MGS and Odyssey.
    We really need good, long-term, sensitive atmospheric analysis down on the ground. Perhaps then we might pick up changes in the air indicative of volcanic activity ... and, who knows, indicative of biological activity too (! ).
                                         cool


The word 'aerobics' came about when the gym instructors got together and said: If we're going to charge $10 an hour, we can't call it Jumping Up and Down.   - Rita Rudner

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#7 2003-07-10 20:04:50

Ranger_2833
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From: My secret bunker in Wyoming (o
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Posts: 55
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Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

The new findings show that its either very active or everything's shut down.

:laugh: Really? How much money to find out that Mars does/does not have active volcanoes?  "Scientists have discovered that orange juice may or may not cause cancer."  Sorry, I just had to poke fun at the wording...

But seriously, if Mars is inactive, what about using the lava tubes as habitats for Mars colonies?  I know it has been propsed for the Moon.  Bassically, one would just need to apply a sealing layer to the lava tube walls (much like a tunnel) and then develop the interior of this semi-natural capsule.  I would imagine that using the tubes would also provide shielding from radiation for the colonists and provide better insulation against the harsh climate (think earth-berm housing to the extreme).  If recent predictions are true about there being water only a few meters below the surface in some places, perhaps we can find a tube with a nice lake.


Just another American pissed off with the morons in charge...

Motto:  Ex logicus, intellegentia... Ex intellegentia, veritas.

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#8 2003-07-26 01:58:43

space_psibrain
Member
Registered: 2002-02-15
Posts: 83

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

Ah...so you propose putting a colony into a lava tube, or a ravine such as Noctis Labyrinthe...

I would be a good idea, provided that you can find a suitable lava tube.

Hmm...there may be volcanic activity, but i wouldn't count on it at the moment

Visited by moderator 2022/01/28


"What you don't realize about peace, is that is cannot be achieved by yielding to an enemy. Rather, peace is something that must be fought for, and if it is necessary for a war to be fought to preserve the peace, then I would more than willingly give my life for the cause of peace."

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#9 2003-07-26 06:27:50

Josh Cryer
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Registered: 2001-09-29
Posts: 3,830

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

I see this on /. this morning and I had to find a computer and get here and post.

Martian warm spots could be towers of ice

Unusual warm spots on Mars might represent "ice towers" similar to those seen in Antarctica, say researchers. They could even harbour life, Nick Hoffman of Melbourne University told a conference on Thursday.

Hoffman detected warm spots in the Hellas Basin after scrutinising infrared images taken with THEMIS, the heat-sensing camera on the Mars Odyssey orbiter. The spots are between 20 and 40 degrees warmer than their surroundings both night and day, and irrespective of whether they are being hit by sunlight.

The simplest explanation, claims Hoffman, is that the warm spots are caused by some kind of geothermal activity causing the release of water vapour. If so, they could resemble the ice towers found on Mount Erebus, an active volcano on Ross Island in Antarctica, where the conditions are almost as cold and dry as on Mars.

The Mount Erebus towers are 10-metre tall chimneys of ice and are found nowhere else on Earth. They are created when the steam from volcanic vents hits the intense cold of the Antarctic air and condenses directly into ice, says to Hoffman's colleague Phil Kyle of New Mexico Tech in Socorro.

Source: http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99993986

Remember how before that I didn't think there was evidence that there was surface visible geothermal activity on Mars? Well, now I don't think that anymore. Conspiracy people happy? smile

This is actually quite intriguing, but I didn't know where to post this and this volcano thread had been pushed.


Some useful links while MER are active. [url=http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/home/index.html]Offical site[/url] [url=http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/MM_NTV_Web.html]NASA TV[/url] [url=http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/mer2004/]JPL MER2004[/url] [url=http://www.spaceflightnow.com/mars/mera/statustextonly.html]Text feed[/url]
--------
The amount of solar radiation reaching the surface of the earth totals some 3.9 million exajoules a year.

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#10 2003-07-26 20:21:55

Josh Cryer
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Registered: 2001-09-29
Posts: 3,830

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

Until MOC can get a very high-res picture of the area, we will be getting reports that it's some secret base or whatever. smile

It does look like a very large hot spot, though. And it's very hot, if you look at the night image. But I don't think it's too large to be an ice tower.

Unfortunately I've been unable to find the actual products. I browsed the THEMIS search engine thingy for a bit now, and I figure I should give up.

Perhaps a conspiracy site would have it.


Some useful links while MER are active. [url=http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/home/index.html]Offical site[/url] [url=http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/MM_NTV_Web.html]NASA TV[/url] [url=http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/mer2004/]JPL MER2004[/url] [url=http://www.spaceflightnow.com/mars/mera/statustextonly.html]Text feed[/url]
--------
The amount of solar radiation reaching the surface of the earth totals some 3.9 million exajoules a year.

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#11 2003-07-26 22:07:16

Shaun Barrett
Member
From: Cairns, Queensland, Australia
Registered: 2001-12-28
Posts: 2,843

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

This is indeed very good news for those of us who've been pushing the 'recent volcanism wheelbarrow'!   smile

    As I've been trying to point out elsewhere at New Mars, there's evidence for enormous flows of lava on Mars rather similar in appearance to the large outflows responsible for the Deccan and Siberian traps here on Earth. The scientists who discovered these Martian lava fields have estimated them to be quite young - possibly as recent as a few million years, or less!

    It's particularly encouraging for me, as an Australian, to find that Dr. Hoffman is considering the prospect that these hotspots may be ice towers. As you will recall, Nick Hoffman has put forward the hypothesis that Mars has always been bitterly cold and that the purported evidence for a warm wet past is, in fact, due to the action of liquid CO2 not water.
    I know he states that he sees no contradiction between this announcement and his earlier observations, but I can't help but feel this may be the 'first crack in his CO2 edifice'!! He may be paving the way for a change of heart ... who knows?!

    This notion is backed up by the release of an amazing map of the distribution of sub-surface water on Mars. For a look at this map, click here (Click on the little thumbnail for a larger picture.)
    It seems there is water ice in the top 1 metre of almost all of Mars - only the percentage varies. Even in the equatorial regions, there is at least a few percent water by weight, and above latitude 50-60 degrees the percentage can reach 50%, as reported months ago.
    (Be careful when you look at this new map. Pay attention to the colour code for water percentage. Intuitively, we tend to associate blue with water but, in this case, the bluer areas are those with less water.)

    I feel it must be getting harder for Dr. Hoffman to adhere to his 'White Mars' scenario when the evidence for vast quantities of water there just keeps mounting and mounting.

    Incidentally, it looks like the Mariner Valley chasms also contain at least a few percent of water ice in the shallow sub-surface regolith. This is increasingly difficult to reconcile with Dr. Christensen's discovery of the mineral olivine in Ganges Chasma just lately. Olivine, as you will remember, is fragile in the presence of water (even water ice) and should only exist where no water has been. Very strange!  ???

    In any event, I'm hanging out for high-resolution pictures of those Hellas hot spots. I can hardly wait to see what's there!!    tongue


The word 'aerobics' came about when the gym instructors got together and said: If we're going to charge $10 an hour, we can't call it Jumping Up and Down.   - Rita Rudner

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#12 2003-07-26 23:22:48

Josh Cryer
Moderator
Registered: 2001-09-29
Posts: 3,830

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

Good link Shaun, I went to the LANL site to get higher res versions (would make a good backdrop): http://www.lanl.gov/worldview/news/photos/mars.shtml

Personally, I just don't find the olivine argument convincing enough (and I can't really say why other than that I think that those deposits could've been exposed quite long after the whole planet had frozen into a nice ball of ice), but perhaps we ought to take it to another thread! smile


Some useful links while MER are active. [url=http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/home/index.html]Offical site[/url] [url=http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/MM_NTV_Web.html]NASA TV[/url] [url=http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/mer2004/]JPL MER2004[/url] [url=http://www.spaceflightnow.com/mars/mera/statustextonly.html]Text feed[/url]
--------
The amount of solar radiation reaching the surface of the earth totals some 3.9 million exajoules a year.

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#13 2003-08-07 13:03:40

dickbill
Member
Registered: 2002-09-28
Posts: 749

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/sixthm … f/3105.pdf

The pictures of the hot spot in the hellas bassin are striking. How a so small area in Hellas, probably 30 meters or so, can be 10/20 degres warmer than the surrounding, day and night, irrespective of the light orientation, if not by some sort of internal heating process.
The fact that this is in Hellas, one of the lowest area on MArs is also interesting. Is it a coincidence ? maybe not.

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#14 2003-10-06 03:13:45

alokmohan
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From: india
Registered: 2003-09-14
Posts: 169

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

This is a matterr of serious reasearch.

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#15 2003-10-06 03:27:25

sethmckiness
Banned
From: Iowa
Registered: 2002-09-20
Posts: 230

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

How a so small area in Hellas, probably 30 meters or so, can be 10/20 degres warmer than the surrounding

Actually, the IR camera used by THEMIS has a resolution of 100m / pixel. I think that the hot spot has a diameter of 10 pixels or 1 kilometre

What as the actual size of the area.  While, I won't say Mars is volcanicly active, I am of the opinion it is not, until scientific evidence is shown to prove that it is.  I do not believe we can do so tell we get a very hi resolution camera.  KH-11 resolution if you will. That will require some highspeed infrastructure in place.  Maybe two relay satellites in geo-synch orbit. 

Realistically an underground hotsprings or some form of volcanic activity underground would create a warm spot of 10-20 degrees.

An actual eruption or volcanic outbreak would be much much warmer.  I would expect discrepancies of over 200-300 degrees different.


We are only limited by our Will and our Imagination.

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#16 2003-10-07 05:01:32

alokmohan
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From: india
Registered: 2003-09-14
Posts: 169

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

Extremophiles can live in a volcano. At least extreophiles may be there at mars.

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#17 2015-02-26 20:44:04

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 29,310

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

Wow such an old topic...
The Search For Volcanic Eruptions On Mars Reaches The Next Level

tharsis-montes-olympus-mons-mars-orbiter-altimeter-lg.jpg

On Earth, for example, volcanoes recycle carbon dioxide, which plants use, and also spew out plant-friendly ash. Hot springs are also a common feature of nearby volcanoes, and they form when heated rocks underground interact with groundwater. Despite the tough environment of hot springs - the high temperature and acidity, for example - certain organisms, such as extremophiles, live in this habitat. NOMAD will also hunt for a plethora of biologically and geologically relevant molecules, with a diverse mix of sulfur, chlorine, oxygen and nitrogen atoms.
Evidence of organic species on Mars is still under investigation, yet the Curiosity rover has recently reported definitive signs of organics on the surface of Mars, and also confirmed the existence of methane plumes in the atmosphere.

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#18 2022-09-03 12:26:32

Mars_B4_Moon
Member
Registered: 2006-03-23
Posts: 9,774

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

With the Russian invasion of Ukraine old ideas explored once again to find new forms of energy

Italy PM gives go-ahead for 10-MW binary geothermal power plant in Tuscany
https://www.thinkgeoenergy.com/italy-pm … n-tuscany/

Japanese geothermal: can Japan really scale subterranean power?
https://www.power-technology.com/analys … s-nuclear/

New surprises from Mars: Volcanic rock, more signs of water in the past
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne … 821807.cms

some other new mars discussion

Monster Earthquake on Mars
https://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=10251

Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2022-09-03 12:35:44)

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#19 2022-12-05 13:26:27

Calliban
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From: Northern England, UK
Registered: 2019-08-18
Posts: 3,572

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

MarsB4Moon used to report discoveries like this.  Does anyone know what happened to him?  Is he OK?
***

Scientists discover a giant mantle plume beneath the Elysium region on Mars.  This is proof that the planet is still volcanically active.  It also makes the presence of liquid ground water highly likely beneath the Elysium crust.  Until recently, Mars was expected to be seismically inactive.  This magma plume is larger than anythihg existing on Earth.  It also originated within the past 100 million years, suggesting that volcanic activity has actually increased in recent geological history.

https://www.space.com/mars-recent-volca … ntle-plume

If you want liquid water, geothermal power, or scientific evidence of extant life, the Elysium region is the place to set up base.


"Plan and prepare for every possibility, and you will never act. It is nobler to have courage as we stumble into half the things we fear than to analyse every possible obstacle and begin nothing. Great things are achieved by embracing great dangers."

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#20 2022-12-05 13:42:05

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 18,142

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

For Calliban re Mars_B4_Moon ....

Mars_B4_Moon said he is taking some time off.

You should be able to find his post easily.

Just ask FluxBB for all his posts by clicking on the Users button.

The posts will extend over many pages ...
happily, his taking-leave post is first in 191 pages.

(th)

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#21 2022-12-05 19:55:36

Void
Member
Registered: 2011-12-29
Posts: 7,394

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

It was hard to sort through some of his stuff (th) but he did bring some good things.

Calliban:  Really interesting news.  I wonder if the poles were tilted so that it snowed at the equator in the last 100 million years.  If so, then aquifers might have been filled.  That is quite an energy target?  I think maybe some of it will be reachable?

Done.

Last edited by Void (2022-12-05 19:57:55)


Done.

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#22 2022-12-05 21:53:54

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 29,310

Re: Volcanic activity on Mars - and its age

Insight did detect quite a bit of quaking and some of this could be the rumbling from deep down inside mars but its got to get what seems to be lots hotter to make it to the surface. Other than seasonal methane clouds we have not seen any volcanic activity.

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