New Mars Forums

Official discussion forum of The Mars Society and MarsNews.com

You are not logged in.

Announcement

Announcement: As a reader of NewMars forum, we have opportunities for you to assist with technical discussions in several initiatives underway. NewMars needs volunteers with appropriate education, skills, talent, motivation and generosity of spirit as a highly valued member. Write to newmarsmember * gmail.com to tell us about your ability's to help contribute to NewMars and become a registered member.

#1 2002-05-20 08:47:42

Mark S
Banned
Registered: 2002-04-11
Posts: 343

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

There is a plastic model from a company called Start of a rocket called "Hercules" (maybe Heracles.)  This rocket is allegedly the Soviet design for a Mars heavy lift launcher.  It has a stretched Energia core and six Energia strap-on boosters.  If anybody has more information on this speculative rocket, particularly in the way of drawing and specifications, I would greatly appreciate it.


"I'm not much of a 'hands-on' evil scientist."--Dr. Evil, "Goldmember"

Offline

#2 2002-06-05 21:43:19

Dayton3
Member
Registered: 2002-06-03
Posts: 137

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

This sounds like what some called "Energia II". 

Theoretically it was capable of lifting 400,000 lbs. into LEO.

Offline

#3 2003-10-01 04:52:02

alokmohan
Member
From: india
Registered: 2003-09-14
Posts: 169

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

Sorry to intervene in 2003.No data?

Offline

#4 2005-04-08 14:01:17

publiusr
Banned
From: Alabama
Registered: 2005-02-24
Posts: 682

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

Offline

#5 2005-04-15 15:38:34

publiusr
Banned
From: Alabama
Registered: 2005-02-24
Posts: 682

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

Offline

#7 2005-04-15 15:51:48

GCNRevenger
Member
From: Earth
Registered: 2003-10-14
Posts: 6,056

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

OH NO PUBLIUSR, LOOK OUT!!!

...A RUSSIAN EELV-derived launch vehicle. Angara is, after all, the Russian EELV.


[i]"The power of accurate observation is often called cynicism by those that do not have it." - George Bernard Shaw[/i]

[i]The glass is at 50% of capacity[/i]

Offline

#8 2005-04-15 15:55:27

publiusr
Banned
From: Alabama
Registered: 2005-02-24
Posts: 682

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

Look more closely. Angara -100 is closer to Energiya HLLV. If you will look at the side by side comparison, you will see the strap-ons are full-strength four barrel Zenit RD-170s, not the 1/4 strength or less RD-191 for the standard Angara EELV

You have made being dead wrong an art form. Now put a few more stars by your name so you can feel bigger than the rest of us.

Offline

#9 2005-04-15 16:37:36

GCNRevenger
Member
From: Earth
Registered: 2003-10-14
Posts: 6,056

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

Ahhh so its not really a derivitive rocket at all but an all-new rocket with an old name. How... expensive.


[i]"The power of accurate observation is often called cynicism by those that do not have it." - George Bernard Shaw[/i]

[i]The glass is at 50% of capacity[/i]

Offline

#10 2005-04-15 22:11:29

Ad Astra
Member
Registered: 2003-02-02
Posts: 584

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

I find it ironic that the "Angara 100" looks like a redux of Energia, except that it's an in-line launcher now, and it uses kerosene in the core (hydrogen fuel is only used in the upper stage.)

The design looks good on paper but it's highly unlikely to be built.  Even the baseline Angara, which was promised for flight by 2004, has been delayed to the 2008-9 time period and may never fly at all.


Who needs Michael Griffin when you can have Peter Griffin?  Catch "Family Guy" Sunday nights on FOX.

Offline

#11 2005-04-21 14:16:42

publiusr
Banned
From: Alabama
Registered: 2005-02-24
Posts: 682

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

Probably not. Here is to folks in Dubai and Brunei becoming HLLV fans.

Offline

#12 2005-04-21 15:42:55

Ad Astra
Member
Registered: 2003-02-02
Posts: 584

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

Angara's best hope is South Korea, as they have announced plans to license Angara technology for a domestic launcher.  Only time will tell if this ever gets off the drawing boards.


Who needs Michael Griffin when you can have Peter Griffin?  Catch "Family Guy" Sunday nights on FOX.

Offline

#13 2005-04-26 08:57:02

Nuno Cardoso
Banned
From: Portugal, Porto
Registered: 2005-04-26
Posts: 6

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

The South Korean deal will only go forward if the core technology of the angara project can be used by the military .

So the question is, can a SLV be of use against North Korea?

Nuno Martinho Da Cunha Cardoso

The Author of:"The Diagonal Method:An Alternative Approach To Arithmetics:"

Offline

#14 2005-04-26 14:53:51

GCNRevenger
Member
From: Earth
Registered: 2003-10-14
Posts: 6,056

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

Angara cores as theatre-scale ballistic missiles? No, the long lead time to launch and excessive payload would make Angara unsuitable.


[i]"The power of accurate observation is often called cynicism by those that do not have it." - George Bernard Shaw[/i]

[i]The glass is at 50% of capacity[/i]

Offline

#15 2005-04-27 03:40:37

Nuno Cardoso
Banned
From: Portugal, Porto
Registered: 2005-04-26
Posts: 6

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

I´m thinking on a little brother of Angara, borrowing the production methods of the SLV.

On the other hand, it doesn´t really matter if a TBM is unworkable, since the main function is political. Example the R-7.

Nuno Martinho Da Cunha Cardoso

The Author of:"The Diagonal Method:An Alternative Approach To Arithmetics."

Offline

#16 2005-04-27 05:35:23

GCNRevenger
Member
From: Earth
Registered: 2003-10-14
Posts: 6,056

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

But that doesn't make sense though. The North Koreans know a thing or two about missiles themselves, and won't be the least bit frightend of a TBM base that takes an hour to sortie their first shot... they'll just obliterate it first.

The whole concept of Angara is the opposit of what you want for a missile: LOX/Kerosene engines require too much time to prepare for flight.


[i]"The power of accurate observation is often called cynicism by those that do not have it." - George Bernard Shaw[/i]

[i]The glass is at 50% of capacity[/i]

Offline

#17 2005-04-27 18:20:47

Ad Astra
Member
Registered: 2003-02-02
Posts: 584

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

If you want to make a military missile, solid or storable liquid propellants are the way to go.  Angara just isn't practical for that mission, nor is it designed for it.  Besides, South Korea is a fairly peace-loving nation that wants to avoid "rocking the boat" with its nuclear-armed neighbor to the north.

It's pretty safe to say that South Korea, as a technologically advanced nation, is trying to claim its rightful place as a space-capable nation.  Is a manned program in the cards?  I don't see it happening in the next 20 years aside from perhaps suborbital space tourism.  The Angara-based launcher is an important step in the growth of South Korea's tech sector.


Who needs Michael Griffin when you can have Peter Griffin?  Catch "Family Guy" Sunday nights on FOX.

Offline

#18 2005-07-22 12:28:51

publiusr
Banned
From: Alabama
Registered: 2005-02-24
Posts: 682

Re: Hercules--Soviet Mars Rocket - Information needed

According to Mark Wade there is at least a possibility than even an Iranian missile could have a cryogenic upper stage.

Offline

Board footer

Powered by FluxBB