New Mars Forums

I have to contend with bad light pollution myself.  Everytime I go outside to try to find something with binoculars I suddenly start fantasizing about grabbing a pellet gun and systematically blowing away every streetlight within three blocks.  I just know I'm going to eventually find myself sitting in some room with a single hanging lightbulb dangling overhead and no windows answering questions like "where does all this aggression come from?"

I've tried learning the constellations by fiat out of a book like that but I just can't remember the patterns when I actually look into the sky.  So needless to say I'm jealous that you were able to learn them like that.    I find the only way the constellations stick in my mind is if I take a planisphere (a new toy I've had for about a month) and compare the skies immediately with the stars on the planisphere.   Oh hey, you remember those cards you mentioned awhile back that have all kinds of astro-info on them?  I think I found something similiar at the Sky and Telescope webstore.  I'll post a link to them the next time I get on.

Preach it Shaun!  I think we might have to replace some of those creaking boards in your soapbox!  I totally agree that sample return missions are pointless.  Considering their complexity and cost we'd be better off just using the funds earmarked for those missions to do the pre-requisite R&D needed for a human mission.

Why limit ourselves to just one option?  If we're interested in survival of the species we should do all of the above! Some can go underground and other above it!

You say that even if we discover life on another planet it still won't constitute good evidence that there is abundant life out there.   It would be an interesting exercise to deduce the probability of only two planets in the entire universe giving rise to life.  Lets see here, we know there are billions of stars in our own galaxy.  We know that there are about as many galaxies out there as there are stars in our Milky Way, galaxies which themselves have billions and trillions of stars.  We know that it relatively common for stars to have planets so there's billions of galaxies out there hosting trillions of stars that likely cling to quadrillions of planets.  And the basic building blocks of life as we know them, water and carbon, are very common throughout the universe so we can't make any claims that we're made of highly rare materials like plutonium.  Care to run the statistical odds of only two planets in the entire universe independantly giving rise to life using those numbers?  Even if only one star per billion gives rise to a civilization, it'd still take you many lifetimes to count them all one by one.  The fact itself that we exist puts the statistical odds of life existing in the universe above zero.  If the odds aren't zero in our neck of the woods, then going on the idea that the universe obeys the same set of physical laws throughout, the odds are above zero throughout the universe.  I don't remember what the probability that statisticians and scientists have agreed on that constitutes an impossible event, but if our planet is truly the only place in the universe with life, that statistical threshold has probably been either exceeded or comes very close to it.

Tis good to be back!    And it's amazing how Cindy knows where all those stars are.  Arcturus, Alderan, etc.  Are any of those double stars?  I actually broke down and bought an 8" (forgive my hypocrisy for using those units) aperture telescope recently but naturally the clouds always roll in around 4pm!  I doubt if I'd be able to find anything with it anyway.  The clouds give me an excuse to cover up my glaring ignorance when it comes to finding things.

I also subscribe to the idea that if life arose on Earth it probably did other places to.  The universe has proven again and again that it likes redundancy when it comes to physical processes and form.  Just recall all those people who not very long ago thought that stars having planets was a rare occurence in the universe.  A lot of people are eating their words as we speak.  And since planets appear to be common entities around stars it's probably not far fetched to think that a number of those planets are home to life.

I have to cower in shame and fess up that Shaun's right, I'm long on rhetoric but short on cash. Apparently one should be very careful what they tell Shaun since he obviously has a very long memory!   *waits for more skeletons to come out of the closet*

Does this mean I can go hiking on Europa now?   I wish they would have given more information on the fabric.  I would like to know how thick and heavy it would be when designed to block everything not to mention what the fabric is made of but I guess you can't give away all of your trade secrets.

The next time I go camping or visit a very dark site I'm going to make a point to observe the zodiacal light.   I kept my eyes peeled for the aurora borealis when it was putting on a good show unusually southward but never saw it even though a lot of Texans apparently got a good view of it.

What's an M2P2 mission?  And with a name like Hypercronus I think Ur, uh, that planet after Saturn would become my favorite planet!  It sounds a little cyberpunkish.  There has to be someway of getting a planet's name changed.  Maybe we should put it up on the next ballot and after it wins, have a Supreme Court judge force the name change in much the same way that tomatoes were determined to be vegetables and not fruits.

Actually, I think Constantinople would make a good name for a Martian settlement.  For me at least, it does bring up cosmpolitan images of abundance and progress.

LOL, I think the last phrase fits perfectly "EELV=Enormously Expensive Lift Vehicle."  Reminds of that WWII ship that was abbreviated the SEV.  The sailors decoded it as "sinkable expendable vehicle."