New Mars Forums

"A horrible realization has just occured to me: with the exception of chicory, all major agricultural sources of caffeine are from tropical plants, which will be very hard to grow on Mars (it being at best equivalent to the terrestrial northern/mountain growing regions here on Earth). "

I don't think you need to panic.   If we can build greenhouses to grow 'temperate' crops such as corn, lettuce, etc, on Mars, it wouldn't take much more effort to raise the greenhouse temperature the extra 5 or 10 degrees C to grow tropical crops.  Actually, coffee is a 'cool tropical' plant, it'll do quite nicely at 15-20 degrees C or so.  The lower ambient light levels may present a bit of a problem, but I think it could be remedied by placing reflectors around the greenhouses, along the sides of a crater, for example.

Byron

Here's a new topic I think deserves discussion...Religion.

I'm not too keen on religion myself, but I know it's unreasonable to think that it won't be a big influence in early Martian settlement, especially since it'll be one of the few things they will be able to bring from Earth without limit...religious belief doesn't have mass..lol. 

Seriously, however, what do you think will happen as Mars is settled by the early pioneers?  Will one religion predominate over the others and be a part of "common society," (like Christianity in the U.S.) or will it be a personal, private thing, with no churches or public facilities present in the community at large?

I've always thought that the Mormons would make great early Mars settlers, due to their "beehive" mentality.  They have a very tightly-knit society, they help all those in need, the common good supercedes individual desires...all the qualities that would be needed to make a Mars pioneering settlement succeed and thrive. 

Let me know what you think....

I read something not too long ago about using "algae mats" to produce cellulose material that could be spun into cloth or a whole number of other uses, and this would be far superior than using valuable greenhouse space for non-food crops such as cotton.  If a non-food crop is grown in the greenhouses, it would most likely be hemp, as it's among the most versitile crops known to man, including edible uses (oil, for instance.)

As for the initial astronauts making the first trip to Mars, I'd think they would have a limited set of clothes to wear, only washing them (sonic cleaning, maybe??) perhaps after a week of continuous wear.  I know it sounds yucky, but mass will be at a premium for the first voyage, and having an extensive wardrobe or smelling fresh every day will be at the bottom of the Mars crew's minds. 

I seriously doubt the early settlers will have time for things like making quilts and the like...they'll probably have some sort of machine that can produce most items of clothing mechanically while the settlers concern themselves with building adequate shelters, growing crops, etc.

I think this illustrates how dangerous being out on the Martian surface really would be...Mars will not be a merciful planet at all for people that chose to go there in the future. 

For reasons of safety, rovers will probably travel in pairs on exploration missions; if one wrecks and is disabled, the other would be there to assist.  The idea of the bubbles is just to buy a bit of time in case of sudden depressurization...sure you may be not be able to do anything, but at least you're still alive to be rescued.  The other alternative is to wear a full-fledged pressure suit at all times, ready to snap the visor down at the first sign of trouble...but they'd be quite uncomfortable and difficult to work in.  Of course, if you're alone and get into trouble a 1000 klicks from any help...you'd be **** out of luck regardless what kind of emergency systems you might have on the rover...

While we're on this subject of atheletic activities, I was wondering about the effects of Martian gee on running.  I read an article a while back that a person walking on Mars would go 60% as fast on Earth, with half the calories burned, due to the slower pendular movement of a person's legs in the lower gravity.

Running, on the other hand, I haven't heard anyone speculate about.  Since the low gravity prevents one from taking 'fast' steps, I would think that a different style of human locomotion would have to come about, adapting the long bounding leaps of a kangaroo, for instance.  In that case, I imagine one could tavel much faster than a runner here on Earth, up to twice the speed, maybe??  Certainly, running, like walking would involve less energy on Mars; running a full marathon wouldn't be that big of a deal for the average person..(unless you were trying to run it in a bulky pressure suit..lol)

Hey,

A thought came to me when I made a post about swimming pools on Mars, namely how diving could be very popular on Mars.  Just imagine performing human aerobatics from a 12-meter high-dive in the .38 gee, having all that time before hitting the water. :0   I do think that water-related sports would predominate on Mars, as pools could be dug out in underground caverns, etc, and it would have tremedous appeal among the settlers.

Traditional sports like basketball, football, and baseball would most likely be inpractical on Mars, due to the low gee and the vast amount of space you'd need just to play.  I imagine things like wrestling and gymnastics (especially gymnastics--even a klutz like me would be able to do it!..lol) would be popular, perhaps a modified form of tennis or racquetball as well. 

The idea of playing golf out in the open in suits, or even outdoor rock climbing (think of a suit tear 1500 meters up the side of Olympus ??? )  I just don't see happening, although it's interesting to think about it. 

Anyone out there who might've thought of what sports might be like on the Red Planet, I'd love to hear from you...   I do recall reading a short story by KSR about baseball (on a very large field) on Mars, however this was after terraformation and people didn't have to bother with suits at that point.

I second Phobos' comment...I spent summers on a dairy farm when I was a kid...cows are MESSY animals, and yes they like to stampede.  They need a great deal of space, and LOTS of food.  Raising livestock is a very ineffecient way to make food anyhow, as you need to raise a great deal of food to keep them fed, so it'd be much more sensible to stick with a veggie diet on Mars, with the exception of fish and maybe those hens Zubrin mentioned. (They don't eat much, and you get the benefit of eggs in addition to the meat)

As for the psychological aspects of having animals around, having 'traditional' pets such as dogs and cats should fit the bill nicely, I think, along with the stocked fish ponds. (would fishing be allowed? 

I saw a TV series on PBS recently called the "Frontier House," in which three families were selected to spend five months on a frontier 'homestead' in 19th Century Montana as an experiment to see how well 21st Century people would adapt to being pioneers in the old American West.  The biggest issue with these people was food, of course, as they had to survive off the land, etc.  Meat was a rare treat (even fish,) and the day-to-day diet was quite monotonous.  Everyone was constantly complaining about the food; about how they were starving and so forth, although the docs told them they were getting adequate nutrition and calories. 

I think the life of the Martian pioneers would be quite similar to the American ones, at least in the beginning.  Of course, once Mars is terraformed and 'civilized,' we can expect a McDonald's to be on every street corner, and the Martians will dealing with an obesity epidemic.  ???

Byron

Hey,

Maybe this will clear things up a bit     Mass is a constant; i.e., one cubic meter of water always has the same mass, whether it be on Earth or Mars.  This something that astronants have to contend with in microgravity (like building the ISS.)  Objects may not have any weight in space, but they still have the same mass and the same inertia, so it still takes effort to move large and heavy objects around.  Same thing on Mars, less weight, but the mass stays the same.

As for the swimming pool idea, it certainly sounds like fun, as the water would be much more "wavy" and "bouncy" than a pool here on Earth.  The sides would probably have to be a lot higher to prevent all the water from splashing out..lol.

Hi everyone,

I've just joined the Mars Society and have signed up for the Convention in Boulder this August.  I'd like to hear from others who's planning to go or have been to one in the past, news, what it's like, etc.  Can't wait to mingle with all the other Mars enthusiasts!