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#651 Re: Interplanetary transportation » A new HLLV essay » 2005-02-09 23:13:27
It's true I would not count on seeing the folks from Brazil or China to catch up very soon, I mean they have a lot of work to do and how can they go up against the experience and technology and skill of NASA or the Russians, but both nations are gorwing India is doing well and Chinese growing fast. Then they will move forward more and perhaps someday they will do something very good indeed. Well what are the rockets nowdays compared to the Saturn V capacity which can lift up massive loads to LEO, launching up over 100 metric tonnes. Now I've seen books and papers which look at Western rockets refer to a launch that is Super-Heavy when it does a 5.5 t to GTO orbit. A big problem is failures, looking at smaller rockets and when you look at larger heavy the Russian launches, the payloads for NASA and the rockets for Europe like Ariane, the rates of accomplishments this will become important. I recall that most rockets that have gone in the past had a very high success rate well above 90% for lauches but there have been failures like Russian lifts, USA's Taurus, and I recall one of the European rockets failed after a software problem. Russians had good costs for launch, $35 million for dedicated GEO while the ESA did a $40-50 million for 1,600 kg lift with Ariane-4 but they later improved costs with newer rockets. The Delta IV could be upgraded for a stronger capacity, perhaps even send over 20,000 pounds to the Moon and in this time of small payloads and miniture equipment in space-probes, this is something that one shouldn't turn your nose up at. The Europeans are now working to get their Ariane-5 ECA moving, but as far as I understand they are also working on smaller rockets for buisness and commerical commsat launches but also looking into more powerful rockets of the future such as the Ariane-5ECS-B plus stuff written on Ariane6, this type of rocket would be more powerful again like the design for improvements in Delta or upgraded Russian Angara-5 , this time as I understood it the Ariane would put large loads beyond Leo into GeostationaryTransfer Orbits with lifts of perhaps 14,300 Kg to GTO or a payload of almost 15.0 tonnes from Kourou in Europe's South American port. I suspect there are 3 main factors in problems for Europe, one perhaps they are a type of divided nations so they don't put a lot of money into space or have much pride like Russia and the USA did, two the Europeans don't have big ambitions for manned missions so they usually only do stuff for discovery in science and new findings in astronomy like the planet Saturn/Titan mission with Cassini, and three the Europeans seem to be in it for the money why else do they focus so much on buisness satellite and commercial launches. The nation who invests in European rockets can get good combacks but there is much to loose, German scientists, UK business people, engineers from France, Holland will have much that can vanish if a new Ariane fails, and without the backing of a high percentage of sucessful launches nobody will stand behind the next generation of rocket. If you want to look at one of the most powerful rockets even built then perhaps it is the Russian Soveit Energia from the designers that worked in USSR, put on extra 8 boosters and you'll get way more than 100,500 Kg up there but look at the record of flight, it was only launched twice in the past twenty years ! Perhaps the most promising design from European space agency's is something called a ArianeM for the possible Mars mission of the future but it lacks backing and the green light for production. Perhaps this could do a 50t to a trans martian injection route, and maybe 100t to LEO orbits. There is a Pdf file for read on this, of course it isn't a reality just a kind of specualition and study concept but could become reality someday ?
http://www.marssociety.de/emc/proceedin … /Ferra.pdf
Some of it looks like it could do it, with MPS engines, main core LOX tank and Upper stage tank like the LH2 tank.
Everyone needs the USA and NASA to keep moving forward, the Russians need them for partnerships and work on the ISS, the Chinese want links to the US space for political gain and joint efforts and the Europeans seem to have a history of strong connections to NASA with things like Ulysses, the Hubble and the ESA/NASA Soho study of our Sun. Now there is the question on how to finsh the space science and with the focus on the return for shuttle, will NASA ask the Europeans or perhaps the Russians to help out more. How can you push the shuttle so much to perhaps go up and down and push the shuttle forward so much, perhaps 25 times for NASA's share of the huge up-cargo and down-cargo demands of the finished ISS ? Could the USA now go for the purchase of Soyuz flights, or maybe they need the Euros to help out some more. Much is to do on the ISS it is meant to be a kind of launch pad for other missions, it is supposed to start measuring 356 feet ( 109 M ) by 291 feet ( 89 metres ) in lenght , science, physics and bio-labs need to go up and without the spacesation many future missions will not go ahead. Should NASA ask Europe to help some more, they could but up some ATV cargo flights from Europe pads ? Is it time to get Europe to send up a person to help out on the ISS work and perhaps push the Spacestaion crew to do extra EVA work the next time equipment is launched up ? Although Russians can offer the best price for launch they ahve a problem in being not to humble, like US have their Eagle and stars n' stripes ....Russia they are the Bear nation and have a proud history with their mother Russia and sometimes the old communist ways means Russia isn't as open or connected to other space industry like Europe or USA's NASA. As for the current improvement on an upgrade launch for Ariane there are now new problems, the lauch window was to open on the evening of 11th of February but this will be gone. Launch of Euros new rocket has been postponed for hours, an anomaly appeared on a ground equipment. So if there is so much work needed, then what can be done to help out space projects move better in the near future ?
#652 Re: Unmanned probes » Cassini-Huygens III - Continued from previous » 2005-02-09 11:21:39
By the way, ESA has announced a major news release on January 21. :up:
I'm hoping I can catch that one live, should be off that morning
The website does not go into too much detail about the news release, but the panel is made up from a lot of atmospheric specialists and only one(?) surface guy. Perhaps they've got something from the descent phase thats worthy of a news release on its own, before they get down to the surface data - or they only need the one guy to say "it's life Jim but not as we know it" :;):
:blues: :band:
Graeme
Radio Telescopes Salvage Titan Wind
U.S. and European researchers are lauding the effectiveness of a network of ground-based telescopes that has apparently salvaged a wind experiment feared lost
By combining Doppler shift data from the Green Bank Telescope and other radio instruments, astronomers now know that while Titan’s winds are relatively weak at the moon’s surface, they reach nearly 270 miles (434 kilometer) an hour at an altitude of about 75 miles (120 kilometers). At an altitude of about 37 miles (59 kilometers), Huygens found highly variable winds that may be a region of vertical wind shear, mission scientists said.
“I’ve never felt such exhilarating highs and dispiriting lows than those experienced when we first detected the signal from the GBT, indicating ‘all’s well’ and then discovering that we had no signal at the operations center, indicating ‘all’s lost,’” said Doppler wind experiment principal investigator Michael Bird, of Germany’s University of Bonn, in a written statement. “The truth, as we have now determined, lies somewhat closer to the former than the latter.”
Ground-based observations of the Huygens probe’s descent gave astronomers a glimpse at the north-south attributes of Titan’s winds, but it was the Cassini spacecraft that was expected to return data on the moon’s east-west wind patterns. While that data is lost, Huygens researchers say the ground data was able to track the spacecraft’s Titan descent to within three-quarters of a mile (one kilometer) and ultimately yield a three-dimensional picture of the probe’s landing.
“It’s sort of an awakening of sorts,” Brisken said. “Now that we have the technology to do this so easily, it might be a more normal thing in the future.”
http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/h … 50209.html
Technical coup rescues Titan wind experiment
NewScientist.com news service
Stephen Battersby
In a remarkable technical coup, astronomers working from Earth have measured the winds of Saturn's moon, Titan.
They listened in to a faint radio signal emitted by the European Space Agency's Huygens probe as it descended through Titan's atmosphere on 14 January. Analysing tiny shifts in the signal's frequency betrayed the probe's motion.
#653 Re: Human missions » Post central for information on CEV III - Continued from previous » 2005-02-09 05:13:19
One would hope that some standardization of parts used for what ever configuration of the CEV would be in the process.
That each would not be different and that the partners in the explorationof beyound LEO would also have the same componentary to make use of.http://www.spacedaily.com/news/rocketsc … tml]Russia Suggests Spaceship Standardization
Well I don't really know what Russians are up to, maybe the want more say in space matters and a better foothold in ISS plans ? As for Economics and safety for the NASA shuttle the news is always up and down, NASA budget is 2.4 % up but still faces bad news, about $500 million less than what the agency had been expecting. Many say 'NASA fared better than many federal agencies in U.S. President George W. Bush's 2006 budget request' but NASA also has trimmed its request for Project Constellation, which is intended to develop a Crew Exploration Vehicle that can transport astronauts to the Moon.
#654 Re: Interplanetary transportation » A new HLLV essay » 2005-02-09 01:27:11
It's hard to know where we are going, the Russians had plans for a kind of copy but different approach on the various alternative shuttle designs by NASA, I know the ESA are working on new stuff and so is NASA, plus China also looks to a new Heavy Launcher. Now the new European Ariane 5 ECA prepares for launch, the launch window opens on the evening of 11 February at 16:49 (20:49 CET) and will extend until 18:10 (22:10 CET).
Ariane-5 ECA will be able to place heavy payloads of up to 10 tonnes into geostationary. The Ariane5 rocket could use some more successes. Ariane4 engine used has a very good record, so this new one might also be good. Could be an important rocket as some of their past ones already were, 12 years Ariane 1 to 4 had launched over half of the commercial satellites in the world. The more powerful Ariane 5 has now taken over, with the objective of confirming European dominance in the civil launch market, in spite of stiff competition from the US, Russia, China, Japan and now Brazil & India.
#655 Re: Human missions » Return to flight slipping » 2005-02-06 03:02:47
http://www.aviationnow.com/avnow/news/c … 234wna.xml
Shuttle Mile stones for return:
*Orbiter Boom Sensor System (OBSS): MD Robotics in Canada is making steady progress on the shuttle's new OBSS to be used starting with the RTF mission to allow crew to inspect earlier inaccessible areas for damage. The OBSS development schedule earlier looked like it could not support a first flight as early as May 14, but is now coming in line with orbiter schedules, Parsons said. Its shipment to Kennedy for Integration with Discovery is planned for this month.
The unit is a 40-ft. extension to the existing 50-ft. Canadian-built arm designed to position a laser dynamic range sensor and laser camera to view the wing leading edges and complete belly area. At least one of the two laser sensors should make the STS-114 flight. In space, the standard arm will mate with the new extension. The OBSS is also being designed for use by the station's arm to further its reach for orbital wing and belly inspections.
*Kennedy milestones: The three Boeing/Rocketdyne space shuttle main engines to be used on the RTF mission were installed in the orbiter Discovery late last week in Bay 3 of the Kennedy Orbiter Processing Facility (OPF). In the Vehicle Assembly Building (VAB) the stacking of Discovery's two solid rocket boosters is two-thirds complete on the spacecraft's mobile launcher platform and is expected to be finished this month by United Space Alliance technicians.
*External tank arrival: Discovery's external tank with insulation and other modifications is to be shipped by barge from its Lockheed Martin assembly facility in Michoud, La., by Dec. 31 and arrive here by Jan. 6. It is to be attached to the solid rocket boosters in the VAB by the second week of January. Under the current schedule, Discovery would be mated to the tank in early March and rolled to Launch Pad 39B by mid-March for tests leading to a mid-May liftoff.
The new external tank is being shipped to Kennedy with more work needed to prevent ice buildup on the liquid oxygen feed line bellows near where the oxygen umbilical enters the orbiter belly. The task is to be completed here and involves an engineering issue that has been under test for some time (AW&ST Oct. 4, p. 57).
This one is the safe haven rescue plan:
*Atlantis power-up: While Kennedy is accelerating Discovery processing for the first post-accident mission, it is also moving forward with preparation of Atlantis as the ready backup for retrieval of the STS-114 crew at the ISS within 40 days of Discovery's launch in an extreme emergency.
seems to be a lto fo work to do
laying off workers is where the shuttle budget savings will come from, also Jeffery Bell has this thing down as one of NASA's next big failures but his work is ofetn prone to dramatics rather than real scientific facts. There already has been some info made public, two years after the Columbia disaster, some NASA managers fear that cost-cutting measures and pressure to resume shuttle launches are jeopardizing critical safety reforms. Quote:
Confidential interviews with shuttle officials, as well as internal NASA documents and e-mails said to be obtained by the Orlando Sentinel, portray a program rushing to fly again despite serious money problems and growing concerns about meeting an ambitious schedule. How about someting happening in Space, can we launch a Shuttle2 to recuse them, use the ISS for protection or perhaps send 'em home in a Soyuz. Is a rescue Shuttle is the only option to save the crews in time with some safety margin and perhaps without the ISS as safe haven, then there isn't any margin at all ? a calculated risk, but they need to. Go ahead and use it to complete the ISS and then ditch it, it may fail again, but the odds are somewhat on NASA's side that it won't before it's terminated in 2009.
It's time to take some risks in finishing up the ISS and then move on to the moon using the CEV...? New tests show that the new space shuttle is more vulnerable than NASA thought. return to flight is slipping back. Already pushed back to March 2005, it may be delayed further into 2006 if they can't fix the rudder actuator problem. The shuttle is so vulnerable to hits from debris that even the post-Columbia changes may not be enough to protect the shuttle, WESH NewsChannel 2 reported.
Recently, NASA rolled out a new space shuttle fuel tank designed to avoid the failure that brought down Columbia. A piece of foam insulation weighing almost 2 pounds made a hole in Columbia's wing. The new tank was designed to lose pieces no larger than about 1/3 of an ounce.
Steve Lindsey is preparing for a mission he hopes will never launch: the rescue of other astronauts in orbit. If a crisis arises during shuttle Discovery's planned return to flight in May, Lindsey and a crew of three could be called upon to lift off aboard sister ship Atlantis on an emergency mission that would be the first in the history of human space exploration. Rescue flights were hotly debated at NASA. According to Bush's proposal, once the shuttle fleet has returned to flight, it will be used to complete construction of the International Space port. Hubble missions have been scrapped, NASA's argument is that the 19-35 ISS missions are acceptably safe, but the 2 Hubble missions are not. Buzz Aldrin has already talked about the possible need for using the ISS as a shield for shuttle where it would provide assistance like a lifeboat, the astronauts may also have to fly in Russian made rockets. There are other complications like maybe needing more ideas like Soviet Progress and European ATV supply ships, and a possible flaw between 2006 and 2010 in which no ISS lifeboat is planned.
Engineers have been trying to determine just how much damage 1/3 of an ounce can do to a shuttle. Engineers used a long air-powered cannon to find that out, and they concluded -- to their surprise -- that a chunk weighing about 2/3 of an ounce can make a crack in the shuttle's wing.
Further tests, using the 3,000 degree heat and high pressure a shuttle gets on the way down, revealed that even that small crack is enough to make the wing fail and cause a repeat of the Columbia accident.
However the Spacestation chief is wary of haven plan, One of Russia's most experienced cosmonauts, who will take over command of the international space station this spring, said he has concerns over NASA's plans to use the orbiting outpost as an emergency shelter for a damaged shuttle. Cosmonaut Sergei Krikalev said NASA's emergency plan for the crew of a damaged space shuttle to take refuge on the orbiting station until a rescue ship could be sent raised safety issues and he had pressed managers on the issue. "We need to prepare a backup plan for this backup scenario," said Krikalev, 46, a veteran of three long-duration
space flights and two shuttle missions. "It's going to be difficult. The station cannot stay in this configuration for a long time," he said during a news conference at Houston's Johnson Space Centre. 8 unfinished items had included the toughest technological challenges made in the recommendations -- preventing the shedding of debris, strengthening the reinforced carbon panels, hardening the orbiter and repairing thermal protection tiles, according to the report by the Return to Flight Task Group.
According to Spaceref NASA is once again facing budget pressures - pressures that are being translated into changes in its work force. This is not the first time that this has happened. In previous years, such pressures were either the result of overall attempts across the federal government to reduce the workforce, or due to cuts in NASA's budget. This year, these changes come in the wake of an overall budget increase for the agency - one spurred on by a major new space policy issued by the White House. So many news agency ask how can NASA get around this, do flights in Russian Rockets, get the Europeans to help out more like using their ATV supply ships or trying to off load launches that are borderline as to the need of a shuttle and making sure that we launch each shuttle 3 times each year and get the shuttle to retire as soon as possible ? Twenty five shuttle flights for a cost of between two billion to two and a half billion a year, so it looks like the cuts will come and NASA is preparing to eliminate 100 contractor processing jobs at Kennedy Space Center under a 2005 operating plan approved by the shuttle program's manager, Congress might cut all but $10 million from the planned Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter mission. Can NASA be able to launch six missions per year again, depend so much on shuttle and push the shuttle workers and astronauts to the max to catch up on the science that has fallen behind and to the work needed on the ISS, can they do the plan is for two orbiters to be in service and one in overhaul at all times ? Do all this and still keep the Space work going well, make things profitable and keeping the best checks on the health of astronauts and keeping their commitment to safety ?
lets hope NASA can do it, and we will see manned flight soon again
#656 Re: Interplanetary transportation » Just Cancel The Shuttle Program - Not in five years, do it right now. » 2005-02-05 16:25:29
Cost, good designs and safety are highly important as SpaceNut says:
If Nasa was a business it would have never been allowed to act that way nor would the funding for such continue
here's another quote
a calculated risk, but they need to. Go ahead and use it to complete the ISS and then ditch it, it may fail again, but the odds are somewhat on NASA's side that it won't before it's terminated in 2009.
It's time to take some risks in finishing up the ISS and then move on to the moon using the CEV...?New tests show that the new space shuttle is more vulnerable than NASA thought. return to flight is slipping back. Already pushed back to March 2005, it may be delayed further into 2006 if they can't fix the rudder actuator problem. The shuttle is so vulnerable to hits from debris that even the post-Columbia changes may not be enough to protect the shuttle, WESH NewsChannel 2 reported.
Recently, NASA rolled out a new space shuttle fuel tank designed to avoid the failure that brought down Columbia. A piece of foam insulation weighing almost 2 pounds made a hole in Columbia's wing. The new tank was designed to lose pieces no larger than about 1/3 of an ounce.Steve Lindsey is preparing for a mission he hopes will never launch: the rescue of other astronauts in orbit. If a crisis arises during shuttle Discovery's planned return to flight in May, Lindsey and a crew of three could be called upon to lift off aboard sister ship Atlantis on an emergency mission that would be the first in the history of human space exploration. Rescue flights were hotly debated at NASA. According to Bush's proposal, once the shuttle fleet has returned to flight, it will be used to complete construction of the International Space
Hubble missions have been scrapped, NASA's argument is that the 20-35 ISS missions are acceptably safe, but the 2 Hubble missions are not. Buzz Aldrin has already talked about the possible need for using the ISS as a shield for shuttle where it would provide assistance like a lifeboat, the astronauts may also have to fly in Russian made rockets. There are other complications like maybe needing more ideas like Soviet Progress and European ATV supply ships, and a possible flaw between 2006 and 2010 in which no ISS lifeboat is planned.
Engineers have been trying to determine just how much damage 1/3 of an ounce can do to a shuttle. Engineers used a long air-powered cannon to find that out, and they concluded -- to their surprise -- that a chunk weighing about 2/3 of an ounce can make a crack in the shuttle's wing.
Further tests, using the 3,000 degree heat and high pressure a shuttle gets on the way down, revealed that even that small crack is enough to make the wing fail and cause a repeat of the Columbia accident.However the Spacestation chief is wary of haven plan, One of Russia's most experienced cosmonauts, who will take over command of the international space station this spring, said he has concerns over NASA's plans to use the orbiting outpost as an emergency shelter for a damaged shuttle. Cosmonaut Sergei Krikalev said NASA's emergency plan for the crew of a damaged space shuttle to take refuge on the orbiting station until a rescue ship could be sent raised safety issues and he had pressed managers on the issue. "We need to prepare a backup plan for this backup scenario," said Krikalev, 46, a veteran of three long-duration
space flights and two shuttle missions. "It's going to be difficult. The station cannot stay in this configuration for a long time," he said during a news
conference at Houston's Johnson Space Centre.
let's hope they can move ahead
#657 Re: Unmanned probes » Jeffrey Bell's take on Genesis - The New Editorial » 2005-02-04 23:50:20
Do you know what really disturbs me about Mr Bells absolutly straight hatred with all space programs except his beloved telescopes. People read his forum who dont know better and when as is now it seems to be a DOOM scenario they get it into there heads and these people think negative about future space missions or even worse become frightened about space exploration without all the facts. It annoys that he airs these thoughts and we have to spend so much time saying the man is a blithering idiot and ignore the reference to a 70s B movie. Of course it could be that he does this as he wants all space programs except his beloved telescope stopped and he is looking for ways to put all space missions down. But I would have thought he would have been happy for an unmanned probe to have been used he has harked on about cancelling manned flight for years. But I think we will just have to get used to Mr Bell coming out with these comments for years to come, certainly it seems he has loads to say to down any space program.
Jeff Bell is so angry
what is his problem ?
:angry:
such writing
The Stardust Project similar idea to Genesis, it now utilizes the same g-force devices, has them installed right side up engineering drawings show it to be so
http://stardust.jpl.nasa.gov/mission/de … tails.html
#658 Re: Unmanned probes » Mars Express (MEX) - ESA orbiter » 2005-01-29 11:50:33
oh - I LOVE the MEX stuff coming down in colour and 3D - I wish they'd release it as vrmls or DEMs with textures - as I really want to spin around and roatate around these things
Doug
largest postcard?
http://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/Mars_Expres … ESD_0.html
covering 380 000 square kilometres,
larger than Arizona, a great size than NewMexico
an area bigger than Germany
http://www.marsgeo.com/videos.html]http … ideos.html
Mars Express video plus you can get the NASA rover vids and Pathfinder Rover
some Mars Express PDFs
Mars Advanced Radar for Subsurface and Ionosphere Sounding
http://sci.esa.int/science-e/www/object … ctid=35544
USA Participation in Mars Express
http://sci.esa.int/science-e/www/object … ctid=34884
Analyser of Space Plasmas and Energetic Atoms
http://sci.esa.int/science-e/www/object … ctid=34920
Nightglow in the Upper Atmosphere of Mars and Implications for Atmospheric Transport
We detected light emissions in the nightside Martian atmosphere with the SPICAM ultraviolet (UV) spectrometer on board Mars Express. The UV spectrum of this nightglow is composed of hydrogen Lyman a emission (121.6 nanometres) and the g and d bands of nitric oxide (NO) (190 to 270 nanometres) produced when N and O atoms combine to produce the NO molecule. N and O atoms are produced by electron UV photodissociation of O2, CO2 , and N2 in the dayside upper atmosphere and transported to the night side. The NO emission is brightest in the winter south polar night because of continuous downward transport of air in this region at night during winter and because of freezing at ground level....
....The SPICAM instrument on board Mars Express is a UV-infrared dual spectrometer dedicated primarily to the study of the atmosphere and ionosphere of Mars but also capable of providing important results on the surface albedo of Mars. A UV imaging spectrometer (118 to 320 nm, spectral resolution of 1.5 nm, intensified charge coupled device) is dedicated to nadir viewing, limb viewing, and atmospheric vertical profiling by stellar and solar occultations.
http://sci.esa.int/science-e-media/img/ … sults2.jpg
http://sci.esa.int/science-e-media/img/ … sults1.jpg
#659 Re: Unmanned probes » SMART-1 - ESA lunar orbiter » 2005-01-26 18:45:42
The Moon's craters and landscape really is pretty in its own weird way, despite being so danged stark and devoid (and actually I think it's precisely that devoid starkness which creates the peculiar beauty). What's fun is looking at the craters/landscape through a telescope when the Luna is 1/4 or 1/2 full, and seeing that razor-sharp shadow line "cutting a crater in half." Don't want to get too far off-topic, though; just thought I'd mention it.
some news items here
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/01/26 … on_europe/
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6871021/]http:/ … d/6871021/
Among AMIE's tasks is to settle a longstanding debate over whether there are significant deposits of water ice ....SMART-1 will also map the moon in infrared, helping scientists better grasp the distribution of minerals
SMART-1 will scan the lunar surface for resources, particularly water, for future, manned, missions to the moon.
Pin-pointing Lunar water-ice and minerals could be important. Looks like we may not be too far away from being able to build our first Lunar Colony and a site with humans working and studying on the Moon. They say we might be able to get some of that water-ice which is trapped inside those dark craters at the Moons North and South poles.
:up:
#660 Re: Unmanned probes » SMART-1 - ESA lunar orbiter » 2005-01-26 10:01:09
ESA did plan to actually put out a lot more images as Smart starts its main mission in February. Still with the savings in fuel that Smart 1 made in arriving it probably means it will be able to go very low over the Moon and give really good closeups in photos and allow the science to be improved.
Heres hoping for some really good closeups especially around the poles
more good info
http://sci.esa.int/science-e-media/img/ … 05-400.jpg
http://esamultimedia.esa.int/images/spc … 50125c.jpg
http://esamultimedia.esa.int/images/spc … 50125c.jpg
The first four days after being captured by the lunar gravity were very critical. There had been the risk, being in an 'unstable' trajectory, of escaping the Moon's orbit or crashing onto the surface. Because of this, the electric propulsion system (or 'ion engine') started a thrust to stabilise the capture.
The ion engine was switched on until 29 December, allowing SMART-1 to make ever-decreasing loops around the Moon. The engine was switched off between 29 December and 3 January 2005 to allow scientists to start observations. At this point, the AMIE camera took the close-up lunar images. The engine was switched off again to optimise fuel consumption on 12 January, and SMART-1 will spend until 9 February making a medium resolution survey of the Moon, taking advantage of the favourable illumination conditions.
ESA's SMART-1 Project Scientist Bernard Foing said "A sequence of test lunar observations was done in January at distances between 1000 and 5000 kilometres altitude, when the electric propulsion was paused. We are conducting more survey test observations until the electric propulsion resumes from 9 February to spiral down further towards the Moon. SMART-1 will arrive on 28 February at the initial orbit with altitudes between 300 and 3000 kilometres to perform the first phase of nominal science observations for five months."
:up:
http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMY5JO3E4E_in … dex_0.html
http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewsr.htm … ?pid=15191
:laugh:
#661 Re: Human missions » China The Dominant Superpower In 20 Years..... - What does this mean for US? » 2005-01-22 16:21:44
I aleady posted this but no one seemed to see it:
Behind the mask
Mar 18th 2004
From The Economist print edition
No, we saw that so-called peice of economic writing, but the economist has always been one for give'n out pisspoor advice, they've been sprouting that crap since the 90s and they're still getting it wrong, too bad those Dorks couldn't see Worldcom, Enron and the costs of Iraq coming...
...fact is the Chinese Economy has a lot of problems, its a massive workforce, coming from poverty, still crime, jobless....a population of 1.3 billion and a huge workforce
...but over all the Chinese economy is doing fine, industrial gorwth, the techonlogy up, manufacturing sector doing fine, and the GDP increases each year
Those economic dorks should put efforts into their own Economy and stop crying about China, they look like a bunch of sore losers :sleep:
#662 Re: Unmanned probes » Cassini-Huygens III - Continued from previous » 2005-01-21 05:53:58
Have you seen this pic
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/dr … 1398_1.jpg
very strange indeed, a view of Saturn - north polar region
More on the Cassini Huygens Lander
DISR
Surface ridge around 100m tall
Channels are evidence of rain
Dark material are photochemical smog deposits
Ridges made of frozen hard water ice
Some evidence for fluid flow in the form of methane
Evidence for Earth like processes such as precipitation, but with different materials
Possibility of rainfall relatively recently
GCMS
Gases like Argon are not present on Titan
Methane present because of the low temperature
Oxygen is tied up in frozen water preventing formation of carbon dioxide
Methane atmosphere is a very primative atmosphere, comparably to the Earth in its very early history
Methane must condense on the surface due to the low temperatures
Must be a methane source on Titan to keep replenishing the atmosphere
In upper atmosphere nitrogen is dominant gas and in lower atmosphere methane is present in higher abundances (this change is similar to the change in water vapour in the Earth's atmosphere)
On surface nitrogen levels remained constant
Methane levels changes over time on the surface implying a release of methane. The origin is probably liquid methane located just below the surface....
http://sci.esa.int/science-e/www/object … ctid=36396
details on the observations and data from other instruments
#663 Re: Unmanned probes » Mars Express (MEX) - ESA orbiter » 2005-01-20 13:13:30
nice story by Universe today
I think the 3-D effect is great
#664 Re: Not So Free Chat » A New World Order - Balance of Power? » 2005-01-20 13:10:00
Ted Kennedy was brought in to write much of the education bill, Senate committee control was shared despite a slim Republican majority (of one, Cheney)
Ha ! and now they tell us that the current admin actually gives a damn about those folks in Africa, I hear Mr Apartheid ( Cheney ) wasn't too happy when he heard the old regime had to go, plus Mr Apartheid ( VP Dick ) wanted Mandela back in jail. But the funniest has to be GW who comes up with a new Bushism when he sometimes tries to be too PC or clever and refers to the folks on that continent as 'African-Americans'
True we see now the growth of Europe as an Economic superpower with the Euro and the Chinese are improving their technology and the China industrial output is growing rapidly.
Roll on the next 4 years...cos the next admin bet it Republican or Democrat surely can't be worse than the current one in the Whitehouse...more jobs lost since the days of the Great Depression :down:
#665 Re: Pictures of Mars » Favorite Sci-Fi Movie? - Blade Runner for me. . . » 2005-01-20 07:11:29
Battle star Galactica has been remade as a TV show plus Speilberg and Cruise will be doing War of the Worlds
#666 Re: Unmanned probes » Cassini-Huygens III - Continued from previous » 2005-01-20 06:00:27
new info on the 21st should be good, giving more details on the Cassini-Huygens Lander. So check out the http://television.esa.int
& NASA-TV For details, see: http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/] … ia/nasatv/
Cassini's closest look yet at bright, icy Enceladus (499 kilometers, 310 miles across) was captured in this view, centered on the moon's trailing hemisphere. It shows some of the linear features in the terrain of the Diyar Planitia region.
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/dr … 1292_1.jpg
#667 Re: Not So Free Chat » A New World Order - Balance of Power? » 2005-01-20 04:00:38
The Japanese Naval Self-Defense Forces are still capable of defeating the PLAN in a conventional battle, and they are getting rid of the pacifist restrictions in their constitution. However, in the long term they will not be able to keep up with China's military might unless we back them up, and possibly not even then. I don't think we need to worry about a defection any time soon though; there is a great deal of enmity between the two countries right now.
It so strange really, China and the USA were friends during World War 2, Chinese gave the Americans strategic support, helped in logistics, sent troops over seas in support with the stats and China helped the US aircraft when they flew over Japan and rescued many downed US airforce pilots that had landed in China.
The USA made a mess in Asia, it responded well and bravely after the sneak cowardly attack of Pearl Harbor, but at the end of thew war their conduct was wrong firstly instead of NOT killing that scumbag Emperor the USA used atomic weapons on the people of Hiroshima, then unlike Europe after the war which had warmer relations, less wars, and saw the downfall of the Soviet Communism. So what does USA do after the war, it turns its back on a wartime ally, the Chinese and goes to bed with the enemy, Imperial Japan. Meanwhile they start protecting evil war-criminals that experimented and tortured people and prisioners of war, many of which were from Australia, S.Korea, Canada, India, China and America. Unlike Germany few of the Japanese war criminals were caught, and today the Japan minister goes to a Shrine to pray and worship, a Shrine that holds A class war criminals. Could you imagine the Germans going to put a Cathedral that enshries war criminals like Dietl, Hitler, Himmler and Mussolini ?
But there are some upcoming radicals in Japan that may hurt the USA again. Shintaro Ishihara who has already won many elections and is tipped to become the next Prime-Minsiter has said If things continue as they are, Japan and the other nations of East Asia will be nothing more than financial slaves to the U.S. When Japan was rich in the 70s and 80s it bought heavy into US property and the US dollar, Shintaro says Japan could be much better off using the trillions in US government bonds it holds for something else, Ishihara has spotted some weak points in the USA, vunerable-points in America and said if the US puts any outside pressure on Japan it can dump the American bonds at a weak levels and destroy the American Economy. Here are some stuff he said TIME: How should Japan assert itself? Ishihara: The American economy is supported by Japanese money. Japan is buying the highest percentage of government bonds. America is imposing a super-low interest-rate policy and money flows out of Japan, forced to buy American financial products. There are several steps that Japan can take, like selling American government bonds...TIME: What will happen to the two countries' economies? Ishihara: The U.S. economy will collapse.....but he isn't the only right-winger in the Japan house, Kajiyama Seiroku said Koreans wanted to be kidnapped, they wanted to be raped and forced into slavery. They welcomed it for the money ! Kanagawa governor Matsuzawa said "All Chinese are scum, they are sneaky thieves" Nakasone commented Americans are weak because Blacks lower the IQ, Yasuo Fukuda, suggested women who are beaten/raped are "asking for it" by the way they dress, but few compare to Ishihara Shinatro - Calls Chinese / Koreans Sangokujin (an old word which is offensive to Chinese and koreans meaning people of three of kingdoms which is equal to saying N*gga and also is a high-offensive remark about Tiawanese ), the Tokyo gov Promised to stop Yakuza, corruption and crime but instead helped them open gambling joints, Called old women a pack of b!tches and said they don't deserve to live after reproduction age, Supports Ring-Winger Uyoku Terrorism, enjoys other groups getting harrased and threatened and he voiced support for the placement of a Terrorist time-bomb outside the home of Minister Hitoshi Tanaka. Ishihara loves the Yasukuni, Kamikaze fighters and all that nonsense....you think I'm making this stuff up ? Well it ain't so because these nutters are the top dogs in Japan.
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/06/ … ...ck=true
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific … 058189.stm
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/09/ … 1280.shtml
Let me assure you folks first that unlike Japan or USA , China does not have a strike first policy. Japan has already changed their constitution and used their troops with the forces in occuptaion of Iraq. The Japanese may bark all they want be the fact is this, if the Japanese radicals start something with the Chinese then about 5 minutes later Japan will be a nothing more than smoking crater at the bottom of the Pacific Ocean. Let's see if Ishihara will be running the show in Japan next year ? A problem with the USA and its position in Asia is that the US is always butt-kissing the Japanese, and Japan has no respected for this...for how can you have respect for someone who constantly kisses your ar'se ?
#668 Re: Not So Free Chat » A New World Order - Balance of Power? » 2005-01-19 13:48:52
The "problem" being China upsetting the current order and sending ripples through the current geopolitical scene.
The ripples were already in Asia, its now that China grows strong through trade, technology, militarymight, space-designs and economics that much of those ripples have started to bounce-back & and hit the nations that are causing trouble in the frist place
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-p … 750529.stm
http://www.littlespeck.com/region/CFore … 030712.htm
http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common … ...00.html
China is quiet now and somewhat happy, but if Japan or some of its racial ministers start trouble then Chinese might respond
#669 Re: Not So Free Chat » A New World Order - Balance of Power? » 2005-01-19 13:17:12
*Euler* You just mentioned the magic words oil fields
Graeme
Stupid oil Islands should be bombed, somebody would maybe be smart like the UN and USA if they went in and burnt off all this oil or dumped it into the Ocean.
You have a few radicals in Asia, and China was long ago under a horrible communist rule, the people of China were ruled with an Iron fist in the commie system, many idiots are now trying to claim these islands and now Japan has had its radicals grow, the Tokyo governor refers to other Asians as animals and calls Chinese n$*ggers, Japan also claims ownership of islands that perhaps belong to other nations aswell like Vietnam, Russian isles, S.Korea and the Phillippines ! People from outside have caused problems with China. It would be stupid to start trouble with China today, because the Chinese military is far more powerful today, many submarines, aircraft, missiles, nukes, battleships....these oil islands are a stupid problem I hope the issue doesn't grow
#670 Re: Unmanned probes » Interesting MOC pictures - Place to post interesting MOC pictures » 2005-01-19 13:04:19
I find it interesting that from above, the view is similar to the cratered surface on the moon. But at the MER’s level, I don’t see moonlike craters, just hollows. The view from MER looks very Earthlike.
its quiet a picture , very good mission
#671 Re: Unmanned probes » Rosetta - ESA comet orbiter and lander » 2005-01-19 13:02:19
At the end of the last New Norcia pass in the reporting period (DOY 324) Rosetta was at 49.8 million kilometres from the Earth. The one-way signal travel time was 2 minutes 46 seconds.
http://www.esa.int/]http://www.esa.int/
small Trajectory Correction Manoeuver of about 9 cms-1 on 25 November
Rosetta continues to fly in cruise mode which it entered 17 October. The AOCS gyro-less estimator was activated on 4 November and has been running since, outside the control loop for validation. This activity required an AOCMS patch in RAM to prevent incorrect use of gyro-less estimator output by the FDIR when the gyro-less and gyro-stellar estimators are ON in parallel. So far, the performance of the gyro-less estimator is good.
http://www.esa.int/export/esaMI/Rosetta … I/Rosetta/
flash animation of its journey
seems to be very close to Mars in Dec 2006 and Jan 2007
#672 Re: Unmanned probes » Russia plans to launch probe - Mars's moon Phobos in 2009 » 2005-01-19 12:56:34
space co-operation with Russia ?
#673 Re: Unmanned probes » Venus Express - ESA orbiter » 2005-01-19 12:54:13
it look like this could be a good mission indeed
http://sci.esa.int/science-e-media/img/ … eyaOgq.jpg
During the approximately 150 day flight to Venus, the spacecraft will make small adjustments to the trajectory using its thrusters. On arrival at Venus, the spacecraft will use its main engine to slow down so that it can be captured by Venus's gravity.
The launcher will place the spacecraft into a transfer orbit to Venus. It will travel through space for 153 days and once it is captured by Venusian gravity, it will take five days to manoeuvre into its operational orbit
#674 Re: Unmanned probes » Cassini-Huygens III - Continued from previous » 2005-01-19 06:53:23
By the way, ESA has announced a major news release on January 21. :up:
I'm hoping I can catch that one live, should be off that morning
:blues: :band:
Graeme
the news release on the 21st should be good
the Cassini-Huygens lander has been getting image of the day on a number of sites, like space dot com and the Apod sites
http://www.phy.ncku.edu.tw/~astrolab/mi … ...ens.jpg
http://www.space.com/imageoftheday/imag … 50119.html
http://www.phy.ncku.edu.tw/~astrolab/mi … 50115.html
http://www.phy.ncku.edu.tw/~astrolab/mi … 50119.html
Nasa has the Descent on their website
#675 Re: Unmanned probes » SMART-1 - ESA lunar orbiter » 2005-01-18 17:15:40
Some folks have said :
Smart-1 might be able to see the sites on the Moon, well not the flag but maybe the Landers or the scorched marks on the Moon's surface I'm not sure but I've heard some others talk about ESA's smart-one ( ion-drive European craft ) and say it might be able to see the Apollo sites. SMART-1 will not land on the Moons soil, but will work from above at varying distance going from 200 km and 4,000 km because it has a wide curved orbit. The camera maybe has a res of 27 meters per pixel at an altitude of 300 KM, I'll have to check this up and confirm if its right or wrong but it might be able to spot Apollo
some on the cameras in some of the ESA craft
http://www.space-x.ch/microcamera.htm]h … camera.htm
another photo from the craft, this time its our Earth, waning in shadow almost looking just like the Lunar phases
http://smart.esa.int/science-e-media/im … ...410.JPG
