New Mars Forums

Soyuz to launch from French Guiana, the Russian technicians have already visited European space launch base in French Guiana South America.  The Kliper could be in service in the 2010-2011 timeframe. Novosti has also quoted Perminov as saying that the Kliper can be launched from European as well as Russian spaceports. ESA had plans for the Hermes space plane but it fell through because of problems but ESA's Future Launchers Programme is important if they want to do space station work and go to Mars with Aurora.
Russian mission Phobos-Grunt has been given high priority, the Phobos-Grunt is a planned Russian sample return mission to Phobos, one of the moons of Mars. Phobos-Grunt will also study Mars and its environment, including atmosphere and dust storms, plasma and radiation. Electric jet propulsion is considered for this Russian mission. Phobos-Grunt is scheduled to be launched in 2009 on a Soyuz launcher.
The European Mars mission was launched with Soyuz/Fregat launcher at Baikonur, Kazakhstan while the Cluster satellites each were 2 Russian Soyuz rockets. The Venera-D landing craft will be delivered to Venus in the ballistic pattern used for the other past Russia missions to Venus, At present it is most likely that a Soyuz launcher will be used for the Venera-D spacecraft, as in previous Venus missions. Venera D is a planned Venus Mothership and Lander which is developed by Lavochkin,  about 1,300 kg of heavy Lander, which is to be able to survive over a longer time on the hellish surface "Venera D" is probably started by a Soyuz rocket and similarly as the first Venera probes directly, without a flyby stage, on the planet Venus to land. The landing is planned on the night side of the Venus and emphasis of the mission lies in the investigation of the lower atmosphere, in addition during the descent the surface in the infra-red light is photographed. Russia's future plans for Space, manned missions, Venus, the ISS and Mars.
http://www.novosti-kosmonavtiki.ru/cont … 6/02.shtml
http://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/ESA_Permane … ..._0.html

http://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/Launchers_A … ..._0.html
http://www.spacedaily.com/news/spacetra … l-05j.html
http://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/ESA_Permane … ..._0.html

http://aviapress.com/viewonekit.htm?NOK … NOK-200311
http://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/ESA_Permane … ..._0.html

http://sci2.esa.int/nextstep/RussianPro … rogram.pdf
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6623693/]ht … d/6623693/
Russia is about to return to development and launch of deep space probes due to better financial environment. Fobos-Grunt now scheduled for launch in 2009 is the obvious leader and it now may host an additional U.S. payload. The next one now being considered is a Venus lander Venera-D . Russian participation in European BepiColombo mission (2012) would also be quite significant: launch vehicles, the MSE lander and instruments on both MPO and MSE. The Ptaneta-A program envisages Russian instruments on NASA and ESA probes. Luna-Glob, Mars-Grunt and Aster projects are under consideration too.
An approximate list of the instruments could look in such a way: a panorama camera, a descent camera, a mass spectrometer, an alpha ray x-ray spectrometer, a gamma-ray spectrometer, a laser spectrometer, a nebula measuring instrument and a seismic detector. The costs of the mission are to amount to approximately 300 million euro, the development are 2006 to begin. During the Venera mission the composition and physical properties of the Venusian atmosphere would be measured at altitudes of up to 60 km above the surface. The dark-side landing would include IR imaging during descent, starting from 40-45 km altitudes. There are also plans to investigate the possible long-term operation of part of the science equipment on the planet's surface. Kliper was proposed in 2004 by the Russian Energia Corp, money that ESA could provide to the Russian space effort could easily pay for development of the Kliper and it would give the ESA a manned craft that may well be capable of being launched by Arianne or by a generation of Russian boosters from the ESA facility in french guyanna. Today the Russians and ESA work close and the European ESA is to pay Russia to build Soyuz pad at Kourou

NASA's website said

Quote:
During the STS-114 launch postponement press briefing, NASA managers said they're still analyzing the issue with the Engine Cut-Off sensor on Space Shuttle Discovery's External Tank. For the moment, no new launch date has been set.

Here's what they had said on it before

http://science.slashdot.org/article.pl? … ...rom=rss

http://www.marsdaily.com/2004/040114165 … 9ehsq.html

Mars at 2014 ?

some good sites on it

http://members.lycos.co.uk/spaceproject … gialv.html
http://www.k26.com/buran/]http://www.k26.com/buran/

Energia is currently only really working on big projects for the ISS

http://www.energia.ru/english/energia/i … s/iss.html

this could become important

Finish the ISS with current launchers and current technology ?

USA's great launches bring back the Saturn V 2-stage, there must be some in a museum or exhibition that can get dusted down. Skylab from USA was sent up by NASA on a Saturn V ( Apollo rocket ) and the Titan IV-B/Centaur launch vehicle can carrying  a large mass of into orbit, while Boeing and Lockheed have great launcher deisgns Big Delta launches and Large Atlas Launches are coming. USA can also do it with the STS-Shuttle, the Skylab and Shuttle are the largest payloads ever put into Space !! 

Russia and former Soviet ideas, Soyuz, Energia, Molniya, Zenit and Proton did very well. Zenit 3SL a Ukraine rocket could do big launches to LEO, Russian Progress-M is very helpful and Russian's already have great knowledge from MIR launches Mir Core had a Mass of about 21,000 kg and a lenght and diametre of 13 by 4 metres. Buran Space Shuttle but N-1 was able to lift 90 metric tonnes powered by 30 Kuznetzov NK15 engines but Energia fell into disuse with the collapse of the Soviet Union. Russia could help in other areas or maybe lift more American astronauts up from Baikonur and Soyuz ST are great Russia launches with other Salyut Space stations - Mass less than 20,000 Kgs. Russian technicians have already visited European space launch base in French Guiana and Europe is to pay Russia to build Soyuz pad at Kourou

China have good launches like the CZ-2C China has used the Long March rocket family, China eyeing new HL and the old CZ3B was a good rocket the new HL can put perhaps 25 tonnes or so in LEO. The USA however didn't welcome Chinese yet to the ISS idea, plus the China scientists anyway wanted to push Chinese space science up to speed and improve on their launcher technology

ESA have done good launches with Ariane-4, now Europe has the Large Ariane 5 launches and they are already paying Russia for setting up a Soyuz pad and they are looking at the Russian Klipper Spacecraft. The Anik F2 launch weighted about 5,950 kg ArianeV double can launch 10,000 Kg to 800 Km at 98 inclination, Europe is thinking of the Ariane-M for a Mars flight. Ariane 5 ECA, is designed to place payloads weighing up to 10 tonnes into geostationary transfer orbit, ES ATV version of the Ariane 5 has been designed to place ESA's Automated Transer Vehicle into Space with aPayload mass up to 21 tonnes, the European ATV will supply the ISS with pressurized cargo, water, oxygen and attitude control propellant it could also bring materials and reboost the ISS to a higher altitude . ESA Enhanced Ariane 5 demonstrated heavy-lift capability in 2005 Ariane ECA can carry up to ten tons of payload first ATV mission, Jules Verne will have a mass of 19,500 kg there is also an idea for a 20,900 kg ATV mass to launch

National Geographic with the NASA / JPL rover
http://www7.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/ … media.html
Mars rovers 3-D real videos of Spirit and Opportunity

more from the Cassini-Huygens mission

N00036767.jpg was taken on July 08, 2005 and received on Earth July 08, 2005. The camera was pointing toward SATURN-RINGS at approximately 2,314,031 kilometers away, and the image was taken using the CL1 and CL2 filters.
http://saturn.jpl.nasa.gov/multimedia/i … ...767.jpg

http://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/Cassini-Huy … QUD_0.html
This animation shows the journey, key events
http://huygens.esa.int/science-e/www/ar … fareaid=12
A NASA/ESA/ASI mission to explore the Saturnian system. The ESA component consists largely of the Huygens probe, which entered the atmosphere of Saturn's largest moon, Titan, and descended under parachute down to the surface. The Cassini spacecraft is currently undertaking a four year exploration of the Saturnian system

http://ciclops.org/media/dr/2005/1148_2 … 2732_1.jpg

http://ciclops.org/media/dr/2005/1148_2 … 2732_1.jpg

This movie sequence provides the record of Cassini’s first close brush with Hyperion, Saturn’s chaotically tumbling moon. As the spacecraft whizzes past, Hyperion’s unusual shape is most apparent. The jagged outlines are indicators of large impacts chipping away at Hyperion's shape as a sculptor does to marble.

Hyperion's irregular dimensions are 164 by 130 by 107 kilometers (102 by 81 by 66 miles).

These Cassini images are the best views yet of one of the large, low density objects that orbit Saturn. Hyperion is close to the size limit where, like a child compacting a snowball, internal pressure due to the moon's gravity will begin to crush weak materials like ice, closing pore spaces and eventually creating a more spherical shape.

:band:

However, this moon has a very irregular shape and preliminary estimates of its density show that it is only about 60 percent as dense as solid water ice. This suggests that much of its interior (40 percent or more) must be empty space.

The low density further suggests that Hyperion is mostly made of water ice, with a low rock and metal content. If the moon had significant higher density components, its implied porosity would be significantly higher than 50 percent. The dark material on the surface is therefore likely a minor component, possibly originating from impacts of dark material, as seen on Iapetus.

Hyperion’s elliptical orbit and irregular shape influence its chaotic tumbling. Further, because it is in a resonance orbit with the giant moon Titan, impact debris ejected with sufficient energy does not come to rest again on Hyperion. Instead, debris is tugged gravitationally into Titan’s orbit, where it impacts the large smoggy moon.

This series of 25 images was taken over a period of nearly two and a half days, between June 9 and June 11, 2005, as Cassini’s orbit took it close to Hyperion.

Cassini will have one close, targeted flyby of Hyperion on September 26, 2005.

At the beginning of the movie Cassini was approximately 815,000 kilometers (506,000 miles) from Hyperion; at the end, the spacecraft was 327,000 kilometers (203,000 miles) distant. The closest image was acquired from a distance of 168,000 kilometers (104,000 miles). The images were taken using the narrow angle camera and a spectral filter sensitive to ultraviolet wavelengths centered at 338 nanometers. Image scale ranges from 5 kilometers (3 miles) per pixel at most distant to 1 kilometer (0.6 mile) at best. The images have been enhanced to improve the visibility of surface features.

http://ciclops.org/media/ir/2005/1192_2 … 2791_0.gif
http://ciclops.org/media/ir/2005/1192_2 … 2791_1.gif

N00036832.jpg was taken on July 10, 2005 and received on Earth July 10, 2005. The camera was pointing toward SATURN-RINGS at approximately 1,927,057 kilometers away, and the image was taken using the CL1 and CL2 filters.
http://saturn.jpl.nasa.gov/multimedia/i … ...832.jpg

http://ciclops.org/media/ir/2005/1193_2 … 2793_1.jpg

N00036822.jpg was taken on July 10, 2005 and received on Earth July 10, 2005. The camera was pointing toward SATURN-RINGS at approximately 2,045,127 kilometers away, and the image was taken using the CL1 and CL2 filters.
http://saturn.jpl.nasa.gov/multimedia/i … ...822.jpg

As I said before some of the real dangers come form external economic for the USA, and world political problems having an effect on US industry. In 1970, NASA administrators said they were to be on Mars within 10 years. The new CEV craft is not yet done, in about 7 years the CEV will be absorbing maximum funding while X-prize is showing that reuseable spacecraft can and will be built. It is also going to create a broader market for space tourism. Dr. Zubrin maintains we can skip the Moon and get to Mars in ten years for $50 billion. NASA will spend over $229,000,000,000 ($229 thousand million, or nearly a quarter of a Trillion dollars) developing the capability to send astronauts to the moon
NASA has plans to build a shuttle2, will be new CEV be a better shuttle-IISome say NASA will try and build a CEV shuttle type craft to fly around the Moon and back in the future but danger in the CEV program right now is to expect too much from it ??

this new CEV craft is not yet done, in about 7 years the CEV will be absorbing maximum funding (operational vehicle or not)

some other designs
is the capsule idea better ?

http://boeingmedia.com/boeingmedia/img/ … /R42ls.jpg

http://www.abo.fi/~mlindroo/space60s/ro … ombus2.jpg

NASA has plans to build a shuttle2, will be new CEV be a better shuttle-II
Some say NASA will try and build a CEV shuttle type craft to fly around the Moon in the future but
danger in the CEV program right now is to expect too much from it.

that link is gone

there is another photo & description at the bottom of this French webpage
http://e4sweblog.canalblog.com/]http:// … lblog.com/

They have yet to do anything like the Voyagers, Viking Landers or Apollo to the Moon, some say Russia can't really compare to the great stuff by NASA

however there are those who think NASA has been going downhill lately, not just for the reasons of the projects but also because of external economic and world political issues