New Mars Forums

Ecrasez, do you know the name of that student? I wanna know because I have received 3 personal letters of Mr. Sitchin....

(for some reason he doesn't want to use computer or internet just like a Russian ex-member of Russian Space Agency I know, who is forbidden to talk about certain issues by e-mail)
                    ....and in spite of many important things he has written, unfortunately I think he's wrong in others. There's a guy named Michael Heiser who wrote this against Sitchin:

http://www.facadenovel.com/sitchinerror … errors.htm

The guy is not denying everything said by Sitchin but some big misunderstanding. Yet he writes an open letter but complains Sitchin doesn't reply to him. In the same way I complain Mr. Heiser hasn't answered my contra-arguments against what he calls "concilium" of gods and 3 specific texts in Genesis akcknowledging the plural of the elohim using a plural verb and not in singular; I complain he jumped the texts getting out of Genesis to make his statement with the exegesis of a horse piece in chess but without mentioning the MAIN ones in Genesis even if it was a case of majestic plural or plural of excellence used in Hebrew in Ezra times.
There's always an argument & contra-argument. :realllymad:

What I meant when I said "microscopical" organism is that although the "engines" and gears could represent technology it can also represent something microscopical. I'm setting the example of the huge spider design in Nazca although the creature is microscopic and before I set examples of T4 bacteriophage virus looking like lunar lander. It doesn't alter an inch the presence of a crater nearby. Or do you need satelite photographs of human civilization near a crater?

Yap. I read that, Spiritwalker...

Good thing that you now "see" Spiritwalker. These are just echoes , material shadows of the invisible hyperdimension hybrid entities.
For example, the guy who examines the spider in Frass meteorite explicitly says the form maybe something in between . That's exactly the case of the spider golden devices found in the tomb of Lord of Sipan, Moche culture of Peru and the spider design in Nazca line which is from Amazon specie Ricinulei though the REPRODUCTIVE ORGAN is not like that spider, it's emphasizing the fertility aspect and to explain the association with this facts with the Solar magnetism will make do these people's homework. I already explained 1000 different things here (probably they never heard in their 34 or who knows how many years) but few will understand....or care to understand.
:up:  for you, you are not among the cattle, Canterville ghost people, walking zombie numbers.

The gears on Mars is here:
http://www.cyberspaceorbit.com/frontpag … feb01.html
Ahh! I forgot to say, in Ica and Nazca or Lima museums in Peru I personally saw these skulls which do have some anomalies not explained by "artificial" deformation:

http://www.world-mysteries.com/sar_6.ht … /sar_6.htm
http://www.starchildproject.com/analysi … is-01.html
http://www.starchildproject.com/starchi … unding.htm
Some where found close to Nazca lines:
http://crystalinks.com/nasca.html]http: … nasca.html

Good, that's why is important you discuss these items at the level you understand it. I agree with the person who says people don't have to agree with anybody. I'm just using the forum to arrive the same conclusion of Mr. R. who responded to someone else "your opinion is as good as mine". Yet I always try to back up my comments with a lot of information trying to make the people think, even when I now many readers "jump" information and only 1% is gonna read the whole links or digest the information.
The position of the light is important in artificial monuments because they knew and gave attention to specific days like eclipses, solstices, equinoxes for reasons I have not described in detail here, but if you wanna check up the links again (specially in Marcahuasi plateau, 14.000 feet upon sea level) where the "eroded" face changes from childhood profile to 80 years old woman while the Sun "moves" until sunset you will understand the importance of this. Unfortunately this is not your area of work and seems your knowledge about cryptography is not something you are interested. You should in first place because if you don't know the difference between a natural design and artificial design on Earth you are gonna be blind looking at Martian photographs!!!! Lemme help you:
http://www.fortunecity.com/roswell/bara … ...ca.html
http://marsartifacts.tripod.com/art.htm … m/art.html
http://www.crystalinks.com/nazca.html]h … nazca.html

Did you see the spider in Nazca line there? Now please check this on Mars surface which is not a "hoax" by Hoagland but from Nasa files:
http://www.cyberspaceorbit.com/frontpag … _nazca.jpg

Now, if you tell me the following photo is "natural" you maybe blind or lunatic, but anyway it's your option:

http://www.cyberspaceorbit.com/frontpag … /frontpage

Those "gears" could well appear in a microorganism animal or vegetal.
The Inca City in Mars has always been accepted as "natural" yet the new photographs add more to the controversy and AGAIN it's not an invention of Hoagland or the other guys, can you see the circular aspect we didn't see before?:

http://www.msss.com/mars_images/moc/8_2 … ...ex.html

Talking about the
spider maybe you are aware not only the spider appears in that photograph (you can file the photo and use zoom after) but Nasa decided to use vision sensors like spider eyes in their Mars rovers:
http://www.spacedaily.com/news/mars-gen … l-01d.html

What gave them the idea? Could it be a Martian spider actually found in Frass meteorite? I don't know, but please check these:
http://www.marslife.com/marsmeteorite]h … smeteorite
http://www.marslife.com/oldmarslife/spi … spidy.html

Or what about this?:
http://www.orreman7.com/NazcaResolved.h … olved.html
http://www.orreman7.com/MessageFromMars … mMars.html
http://www.orreman7.com/TheSunSpeaks.ht … peaks.html
http://www.orreman7.com/CropCirclesReve … ealed.html
http://www.orreman7.com/CropCircles2.ht … cles2.html
The very statement that the position of the Sun doesn't mater reveals, Mr. R, in your 34 years old you need to study more things about Earth before daring to discuss deeper issues....with all do respect.
Anyway, your commentaries are always welcome. Perhaps you -wisely- prefered to DODGE the issue about Nazca lines or artificial designs on Earth for good reasons. But I really would enjoy reading your views about these. After all what we are discussing here is if we can "see" artificial patterns on Mars. You can't do that if you can't see the difference between something artificial or natural erosion on Earth whether using photos or staring the thing with your own eyes. Since the second option is not yet possible cos there are no human astronauts on Mars, we depend on the first options.
Perhaps you want to discuss Nasa tampering data:
http://www.enterprisemission.com/images … finger.jpg
Maybe you want to discuss the fact Nasa itself has admited they are using RED FILTERS to make the planet more reddish than it actually is and see the sample of the 2048 resolution or check this:
http://xfacts.com/spirit2004]http://xfa … spirit2004
Someone was overlooking the photos revealing Mars. May I say it's been used high resolution pictures showing details AS SMALL AS 10 FEET ACROSS, 10 times better than the best Viking images? Perhaps you wanna ask questions to Mark Carlotto or the address of the Analytic Sciences Corporation or -who knows- National Space Science Data Center for additional background info. Do you want or are you satisfied with your incredible knowledge in your field? Hmmm? Just curious. ???

Rxke: I don't mind you posted 1591 times this far with comments like that, it doesn't matter if I already wrote other group of people arriving at the same conclusions examining the subject according to their point of view if their distintitive speciality. Why bothering about YOUR opinion at all? If you had a scientific mind you would have to try to be in touch with those fellows and tell them the scientific approach of you that "invalid" their statement, not your Italian bravata which is just a personal statement. I have personally received many times answers of authors who got fame and fortune whether by e-mail or personal letter. You're showing a disposition already evident in your "scientific" approach sort of message.
Nor in this forum neither in any other the purpose was, ir or will ever be trying to convince anyone. That's just a form of expression. Nothing convinces anybody about anything. The only thing we can do is just trying to share what we know.

Some to add about the theme rather than your personal skepticism? Specific data, perhaps?
Nop?
It figures....

In these petroglyphs sometimes there depictions of the odd entities beyond what we see with our eyes. Picasso and Dali used Cubism and Surrealism but they were inspired by the concepts of physic hyperdimensions. Cubism is a word comng from the idea of Hypercubes, did you see the film Cube II, Hypercube?
You know already these photos Spiritwalker, but probably these gentlemen would like to stare DOUBLE HEADED-CATS or cats with "wings" (Feline Cutaneous Asthenia), 138 reported sightings and 28 documented:

http://www.messybeast.com/winged-cats.h … d-cats.htm
http://www.messybeast.com/freak-face.ht … k-face.htm
http://www.messybeast.com/freak-conjoin … joined.htm
Now, tell me. If these monstruosities are not hoax because they also appear in books of mutations (I have read them) but these intelligent fellows DON'T HAVE THE SLIGHTEST CLUE ABOUT SUCH THINGS existing in the observable universe we live in...do you think it would be easy to convince them about invisible realms and hyperdimensional creatures with 4 faces in a single head and wings like having "eyes" (a peacock-symbol of Devil too), etc?
Sitchin and Däniken can imagine Ezekiel's vision like Nasa engineer Joseph Blumrich, a quadruple helicopter with propeller system under the bell shape techno UFO:

http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepage … 5/ufo4.htm

They won't (they can't) see the techno is just an image of reality although that's like an invisible "lunar lander" shape of a bacteriophagea virus:

http://www.virology.net/Big_Virology/BV … NAmyo.html

:down:

Sumerian depictions show these hybrid creatures. Author Sitchin interprets this was genetic engineering (I don't wanna discuss the thing here, afford & against), but one thing I know. Somehow mankind is going to accept.... (by the will of our powerful governments symbolized with the American eagle, Russian bear, two-headed eagles in Germany, tigers & Tex-dragon China, etc,etc)... the use of transgenic animal DNA into your body...

(something already forbidden in Leviticus law for the same entity who said the circumsition gotta be made in the 8th day of the baby born...the exact day when protrombine & K vitamine is higher than any other day to dodge bloodshed)

Why? Is there an invisible hyperdimensional force behind the madness of the world? Would he transform -like hybrid cherub- like light as it says the Bible in 2 Corinthians 11:14?
The text uses the Greek word "phosphorous" for light. The word "phosphenous" is taken from Greek regarding something in your brain and linked to language. The very same chapter says in 11:3 Satan (Samael, the cherub) deceived Eve in HER MIND FACULTIES.
Wow! That's prety interesting because millions of Christians perhaps doubt if that 'a Freudian symbol or reveals something for real. Like the investigations of anthropologist here:

http://www.jornalinfinito.com.br/series … asp?cod=81
http://www.jornalinfinito.com.br/series … asp?cod=80
http://www.dhushara.com/book/consum/con … onsum1.htm
http://www.dhushara.com/book/wass/wasso … asson3.htm
http://www.umsl.edu/~rkeel/180/hallucin … lucin.html
http://www.peyote.com]http://www.peyote.com
http://www.montana.edu/wwwai/imsd/rezme … ansmit.htm
http://www.montana.edu/wwwai/imsd/rezme … emente.htm

You see the same thing and trees of knowledge in Assyria, Babylon, Sumer with the snake. China didn't import Christian or Judaism dogmas, why would they have to accept the same Genesis "fable" of Eve being deceived by the "tempter" in one of 2 trees, a woman who was "coveting" the fruit of one of those 2 trees:
http://www.creationism.org/chinese2.jpg … inese2.jpg
http://www.creationism.org/csshs/v06n2p … 6n2p04.htm
The very word spiritism is taken from Greek "pharmakya" meaning drugstore because it was the MEDIUM to be in contact with that hyperdimension. And you have heard million times in the news the parents murdering their own babies after they got stone with cocaine, etc.... Hearing voices. And the near death experiences after you get the anesthesic... what the HECK you know about the mind and the hollographic universe or hyperdmensions. We are completely ignorant.

Bob & Cobra: First I agree we need to be skeptical, but between that and being cynical is not a big leap. Being a traveller myself and knowing the history of my country (Peru) I never gave importance at all until I have to be there. The photographs deceive. When I was in Egypt myself I could understand the magnitude of watching a stone building with th height of 45 floor skyscraper. The sphinx is not in front or close to the pyramid as we see in every book or magazine but looks like this cos the Pyramid is too huge!!!
It's big enough to see from satelite photograph. I just want to remnd you not to overlook , turn blind eye on or disregard orbit photographs when we're dealing with 2 pairs of Martian pyramids that are higher than 800 meters and 3 km in their sides. The Egyptian face is 144 meters tall (almost the size of Gizah Great Pyramid) and the proportions are pretty much like the film Mission Mars though that stylized face, not leontocephalic-hominid-falcon-bull face.
I have seen also the recent "stones" shown by Nasa and they are odd too. Not only some of them look like jigsaw puzzle but one of them has a total square hole inside. Presence of water, methane, possible bacteria in a meteorite (today Nasa found another rock from Mars in Antartic area), all of these doesn't impress me. There are many things invisible here, right now, that our science doesn't even have the interest to analyze (with exception of few scientists). That's why in my perspective we don't have to limit our vision as dense and material as writers like Zecharia Sitchin, Däniken or J.J.Benítez. Of course, I will have to extend myself in a different conversation that doesn't fit in this thread.
Atheism is a private conclusion, there are no atheistic town, community or country in history. Mostly because in Western doctrine the struggle is against moral or the anthropomorphous God idea and the argument is a bit like Xenophanes...which is inverted (as I discussed in Michio Kaku's physicist forum). The whole idea has a twist if we are deimorphous or teomorphous rather than confusing reality with the reflection in the mirror. But how can we discuss this just with ideas instead of objective realities like being stone with substances that have the same chemical structure than the serotonine or endorphines in the brain....which is -according to humble experts in neurocerebral surgery- as enigmatic as the hollographic universe?
I don't wanna enter in detail about these but I have discussed these ideas with the very people who have presented these in magazines & books, including Jew physicist from Jerusalem University, Jacob Bekenstein , etc, etc, etc.
Just think about it.
Also, Bob, one thing is shooting simple photos and other is using MOLA photos, or infrared, termographic, enhacing images in 3D, spin them 180 degrees and then proyecting light from every possible angle to provoke shadows, analyzing negative photographs. That's important indeed. An example is the Turin Shroud. It doesn't matter if that was or not the Messiah's shroud (in fact the very Biblical evidence contradicts that though is another theme), what is important is the fact we know the details of the image mainly because it was discovered by that negative photo.
That's what I say, when ancient monuments show something hidden is because there are more oddities than the thing there, the answer to the question : why was placed in that particular way in first place?
Regarding Maya pyramids, the FACT is the basis is almost exactly the basis of Gizah. Neither this or the fact the smaller pyramids were built upon a higher place to reach the same height of the higher pyramid, nor the use of the angle 43,5 degrees both in Egypt and Mexico or the similarities of the inner corridors is funny coincidence either. Unfortunately I don't have your personal e-mail to send you interesting photos, Cobra...

http://www.world-mysteries.com/mpl_2.ht … /mpl_2.htm

http://greatpyramid.org/aip/gr-pyr1.htm … r-pyr1.htm

Not base of evidence, but when coincidences file up again and again and again....you study more and more and more and in fact, sometimes -like myself- take the decision of going there and see by yourself and keep on studying. It must be an act of courage to present yourself and expose yourself to ridiculous as Egyptologist Anthony West (whom I have a chat once and then) :

http://www.aulis.com/twothirds.htm]http … thirds.htm
http://www.mactonnies.com/imperative32. … ive32.html
http://www.ecclesia.org/truth/pyramid_p … _pics.html
http://mars-earth.com/cydonia_eygpt]htt … onia_eygpt
http://www.enterprisemission.com/images … /mtm10.JPG
http://www.planetarymysteries.com/mars/ … ASA2f.html

Nop, to find a tetramoulon is not rare at all.

Ooops! I forgot, Bob. Please read in history books the link between Tyrus (Phoenicia) and Sidon (Cydonia).

Bob, you're far off course. First of all, the name was baptized Cydonia by Freemason members of IAU, the name was approved in 1958 and with the collaboration of the Freemasons at Nasa. The name is not the Greek Khania neither Crete at all. The name deals with the cherub known by Freemason in the Bible in Ezekiel 28:11 to verse 20 inclusive. If you allow yourself a bit of culture, you can check the cherub description is like a sphinx in chapter 1 (like the winged bulls in Assyria, Sumer, Babylon, the hybrid creatures from all myths around the world). In chapter 28 the arrogant procedure of the king of Tyrus is compared with the rebel cherub in Eden . In Jewish myths that entity is Satan or Samael,  the entity in charge of Mars. In fact Tyrus itself was Mars and the Phoenicians called themselves Cydonians. In Tyre Melkart god was Mars and the Chaldean name gets back to Mavor later on worshipped by Romans as Mars Quirinus, the god of the fortress...as in Mars.
The text in Ezekiel indicates the cherub was expelled from mountain of God, in Sumerian language that was a house-mountain, a pyramid or ziguratt. The word is "ekur" in case you are interested. And the Hebrew words "stones of fire" mentioned in the verse 14 can represent orbit planets and is linked to the evil procedure of that cherub. The cherub in Ezekiel has 4 faces in a single head. The verse 20 specifically says "turn your FACE against SIDON (Cydonia)".
This is interestng since the face was always mentioned as the "sphinx" maybe because the proximity of the Martian pyramids the official books like  "Uncovering the Secrets of the Red Planet" CUT OFF in the page 210 and set the worst and blurred photo available (out of 11) of the face.
Can you tell us WHY? It's pretty obvious. Nasa wanted to hide information for the readers and they didn't show us the zoom image of the another complete sphinx in front of a pyramid peak in page 146 (though the color and 3D effect is impresive indeed). It's the same photo shown in Hoagland's site.
Now, lemme say something to you cos as good geologist but awful historian maybe you forgot:
Sphinx was called Hor-em-Akhet in Egyptian language, meaning the falcon Horus in the horizon. Not only that the falcon face appears as discovered by Robert Morningstar in that very Martian eroded face but it's not a coincidence the name of that falcon in Egypt comes from the word heru. Do you have any idea what's the meaning of that word or are you a linguist?
I tell you: it means "face". This is a knowledge Freemasons at Nasa know for sure and the astronauts themselves do perform their Freemason rituals about Isis , etc, giving attention to coordinates they know, special attention to Sirius and number 33. BTW, the tethraedrum angle in Cydonia is 3333....but a geologist is not someone whom we can talk about these things, do we?
It's not another funny coincidence that the math in the position of the face united with the pyramids imitates things we find in Egypt. Are you an expert in math or physicist theorist? Your work, with all do respect, is other, dear Bob.
And I have to say if other geologist finds 24 anomalies maybe he knows what he's talking about and gives the benefit of the doubt.
The whole controversy didn't start with Hoagland but Kelly Laney and members inside Nasa in first place, then the information passed to ASU webpage, then it was used Laney IR image with fractal process and the discussion continues with other people as Carlotto, Graffeo Lahoz, Robert Morningstar, Van Flander...shall I continue? Hence, please don't try to grab onto Hoagland cos he's not alone in this investigation.
The math in association with the Egyptian eye:

http://www.aadm.com/cydonia/Cydonia2.ht … donia2.htm
This sphinx face, the other complete sphinx and this Fibonacci math is not randomic odditity at all if you know that in Arabian language the very name CAIRO means Mars. But you wouldn't notice this if you don't understand ancient religion or why Freemasons choose what they choose, you're just a geologist, period, end of the line.
Are you an expert in cryptography? Would you realize the ancient technique used by ancient civilizations like Incas, Mayas, Egyptians? I doubt it. The statues were not supposed to be seen like our modern art. They became alive in a game of shadow and light in specific times of the day or months, specifically in equinoxes, solstices, eclipses, etc. So, mabe you're gonna be one of those millions of tourist going to Machu Picchu completely BLIND regarding what is there. Of course you're gonna swear by God is just mere "coincidence" due to your lack of knowledge:
http://www.infoperu.com/peru/eng/cusco/ … achu4.html
http://www.infoperu.com/peru/eng/cusco/ … achu5.html
http://www.infoperu.com/peru/fr/cusco/m … achu4.html
http://temakel.com/simbolismoanimalllam … lllama.htm
http://www.aamefe.org.ar/puma/puma.htm] … a/puma.htm
http://www.channel4.com/history/microsi … inca4.html
http://www.channel4.com/history/microsi … nca3c.html
http://www.channel4.com/history/microsi … inca5.html
http://www.channel4.com/history/microsi … inca6.html
It's not just a matter of keen eye but to know WHERE and check the shadows at the proper time and remember the legends associated to the geological facts. In other cases the mountain won't present feature at all but shadows will appear at the expected time with the figures of animals ...again hybrid animals united with man...as in the same Cuzco in the mountain Pitusiray in Sacred Valley, Cuzco (never mind I am perfectly aware you know NOTHING about this either!).
It's a real pity we can't see a controversy right here right now between you and other geologist (let's say R.Nicks) and discuss 24 anomalous objects in the frame 80881 (who discussed about this in Pasadena conference), yap I know your answer with anticipation, don't tell me, you're gonna say "he's not prepared". It's always the alternative answer in the ego aspect. Not me, I tell you. It doesn't matter who I am. I don't have to present my "resume" (as you did) to back up my comments. The reader shall investigate over and over and judge. It's not for my fame or fortune. It's subjective, Mr. Geologist.