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#426 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Amateur solid-fueled rockets to *orbital* space? » 2017-06-08 16:48:16

I found this page after a web search that says the "White Thunder" propellant used by the Cesaroni P150 motor is Ammonium Perchlorate Composite:

FRIDAY, DECEMBER 4, 2009
APCP Chemistry
Happened across some information about Ammonium Perchlorate Composite Propellant that I think is pretty interesting.
The chemical formula is NH4ClO4. It burns with aluminum, the fuel of choice in white motors, like Aerotech's White Lightning, Cesaroni's White Thunder, and NASA's SRBs, with the equation 10Al + 6NH4ClO4 → 4Al2O3 + 2AlCl3 + 12H2O + 3N2. (source)

http://amateurgeek.blogspot.com/2009/12 … istry.html

The size of these motors isn't like an "Estes" model rocket engine, BTW. The P150 is 6 inches wide, 3 feet long, weighs 70 lbs with an aluminum casing, and puts out a max. 2,000 lbs of thrust. Some refs I've seen suggest their max combustion pressure is in the range of 1,000 psi.

For my vacuum optimized nozzles, I'm assuming an altitude compensation method that allows their effective area ratio to exceed that of a nozzle at the rockets diameter, such as by using an aerospike for example.

When these companies make their solid motors, do they bind the propellant to some lightweight casing then slide this into the aluminum casing, or do they bind the propellant to the aluminum casing directly? If it is the former then it would be easier for amateurs to just use the filled lightweight casing to slide into a filament wound casing they built themselves.


  Bob Clark

#427 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Amateur solid-fueled rockets to *orbital* space? » 2017-06-07 23:23:32

GW Johnson wrote:

The only problems are(1) what kind of propellant,  and (2) who makes that propellant.  Designing the rocket stages themselves is no real problem,  especially if you can cartridge-load pre-made propellant grains in sleeves.  Those sleeves can double as your case insulation.  The biggest design problem to overcome is adequate vehicle attitude control,  same as von Braun faced at Peenemunde long ago.

As for what propellant,  something primitive like fireworks propellants or sugar nitrate has too low an Isp to be useful:  something in the range 80 to 180 sec Isp.  It takes a "real" propellant to do a launch job.  Even the AN composites and the plain double base propellants are too limited at 200-220 sec Isp.  It really takes either a composite-modified double base that uses AP not AN,  or an AP-composite to get enough Isp to serve.  These fall in the range of 240-260 sec sea level Isp. 

Propellants like that are very dangerous to make,  especially the double base,  because you have to handle raw nitroglycerin.  Even the AP is quite dangerous,  because all by itself it is a class 1.1 mass detonable material. The folks who do this for a business do this with remote operated equipment.  The danger is just too great.  It is not a job for amateurs. 

But,  there are folks who make such propellants for the amateur rocketry folks.  Some of it is AP-composite,  too.  High dollar stuff,  but that's what you need. 

A part of the design is chamber pressure:  both thrust coefficient and Isp are greatly improved at higher chamber pressures.  I'm unsure what pressures the amateur rocketry propellants are used at,  but it's likely under 1000 psia.  Most of the real tactical size rockets run in the 2000-4000 psia range.  It was only square-cube law effects (steel is only so strong) at giant sizes that reduced the shuttle SRB's to 900 psia.  A 20-inch diameter case made of D6ac will hold 2400 psig at a wall thickness of about 0.12 inches and 10% below ultimate tensile in hoop stress.  It'll do that maybe once to 5 times.  Smaller,  and wall thickness is thinner. 

That kind of thing isn't simple roll and weld stuff,  it's thick wall seamless tube in the annealed state cold-rolled to shape and then very carefully heat treated to strength.  According to Mil Handbook 5,  the ultimate tensile strength (if everything is done to spec) can be 220 ksi,  with 190 ksi yield.  D6ac is a semi-austenitic martensitic high-alloy stainless.  Fairly easy to form,  machine,  and weld. 

GW


Thanks for that info. My calculation was assuming I could get vacuum Isp's in the 285 s range, like the Star solid rocket motors made by ATK.

I found a company that makes solid rocket motors for amateurs called Cesaroni that offers motors that can get 224 s sea level Isp.

Pro150_specs.png
http://www.pro38.com/products/pro150/motor.php

Could you get 285 s vacuum Isp by using long, vacuum optimized nozzles?

These motor use an aluminum case. I was thinking of using fiber wound casings to save on the empty weight. This can save 50% on the casing weight over aluminum. Amateurs have used fiber wound casings for their solids such as the USC team:

1000w

However, I don't know if the Cesaroni motors use the dangerous propellants you mentioned. After the high energy solid propellants are made, can they be safely handled by amateurs who want to fill their own casings?

   Bob Clark

#428 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Amateur solid-fueled rockets to *orbital* space? » 2017-06-07 13:50:49

elderflower wrote:

The old Scout rocket was a solid, wasn't it?

Yes, it was. There have been several all-solid orbital rockets over the years:

http://www.astronautix.com/s/scouta.html

  Bob Clark

#429 Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Amateur solid-fueled rockets to *orbital* space? » 2017-06-06 19:09:02

RGClark
Replies: 54

I was impressed by this university teams launch to 144,000 feet of a solid fuel rocket:

USC Rocket Propulsion Laboratory Breaks Record.
Amy Blumenthal | March 16, 2017
Student-run RPL launches rocket of own design to 144,000 feet.
https://viterbischool.usc.edu/news/2017 … ks-record/

I did a rocket equation calculation that showed a 3-stage rocket of solid-fuel stages with altitude compensating nozzles could reach orbit. Based on the USC experience this should be something within the capabilities of most universities.

But how difficult is it to fuel a solid fuel rocket of say a few hundred kilos size?

  Bob Clark

#430 Unmanned probes » SpaceX Falcon Heavy Test Flights For Key Science Targets. » 2017-05-09 07:35:53

RGClark
Replies: 0

Two key questions in planetary science are 1.)whether the lunar shadowed craters really do contain high amounts of water ice, and 2.) what is the makeup of the mysterious Martian moon Phobos?

The upcoming test flights of the new SpaceX rocket the Falcon Heavy could answer these questions:

Test flights of the Falcon Heavy for missions to the moons of Earth and Mars, Page 1.
http://exoscientist.blogspot.com/2017/0 … y-for.html


  Bob Clark

#431 Re: Interplanetary transportation » Space X - If at first you don't succeed... » 2017-04-11 07:19:41

RobS wrote:

Space X has just updated the data about the Falcon Heavy here: http://www.spacex.com/falcon-heavy . The payload numbers have been increased almost 20%!

Payload to LEO: 63,800 kg
Payload to GTO: 26,700 kg
Payload to Mars: 16,800 kg
Payload to Pluto: 3,500 kg

This means that two Falcon Heavies have about the same payload (127.6 tonnes) as the Saturn V (118 tonnes originally, 140 tonnes eventually). Mars Direct was designed based on a 140 tonne to LEO rocket able to throw 40-46 tonnes to TMI (depending on the delta-v needed). So the Falcon Heavy is getting rather close to those numbers, and of course it is a LOT cheaper; at 90 million per launch ($180 million for two), it can put almost as much into LEO as a Saturn V, whose launch in today's dollars would be over a billion dollars. I would not be at all surprised that a few tweaks (a larger second stage, for example) wouldn't push a Falcon Heavy's payload up to 70 tonnes. That's only another 6%!

Yes, this will make the SLS even more problematical since two launches of the FH can equal or surpass the payload of the final, proposed version of the SLS, at a fraction of the price.
 
Note also that with cross-feed fueling the FH could match the cited 70 metric ton (mT) payload of the first version of the SLS. (Actually many people think this first version of the SLS will have a payload capability closer to 90 mT.)

  Bob Clark

#432 Re: Human missions » Blue Origins capsule for New Shepard. » 2017-04-04 14:02:59

Perhaps these images can give a better idea of the size of the motor:

new-shepard-crew-capsule.jpg

index.php?action=dlattach;topic=10685.0;attach=477875;image

e5estzty1uxc9sqnxudj.jpg

BlueOriginCapsule.jpg


It's likely also there is a safety covering over the motor of some appreciable thickness. So the actual diameter would be less than what appears in the images.

  Bob Clark

#433 Re: Interplanetary transportation » VASIMR - Solar Powered? » 2017-04-04 06:16:16

Antius wrote:

From what I have read on VASIMR, the thruster uses microwaves to produce cold plasma, which is then accelerated magnetohydrodynamically.
This concept could work extremely well if the propellant were wastes or unprocessed natural materials, such as lunar or asteroid regolith or material gathered from the Martian moons.  This would make VASIMR a usable propulsion system for early missions to establish bases on the moon, asteroids or Mars and should result in greatly superior mission mass ratios.
A return mission to the moon could begin by launching a single VASIMR tug, which would function as a lunar transfer vehicle and a reusable SSTO lander.  Upon return from the lunar surface, the lander would carry enough lunar regolith to propel the transfer vehicle back to LEO, where it could rendezvous with the ISS and for a return trip to the moon.  The lander would remain in lunar orbit awaiting the next mission.
Subsequent missions would only need to lift the crew, food and water, propellant for the lander, spare parts and any lunar surface payload.  This would improve the economics of maintaining a lunar base.
One question would appear to be: Can VASIMR function using refractory oxides as a propellant?


I like the idea. It could open up the entire Solar System to human exploration. I believe any material can be used as the propellant, though some materials are more efficient than others.

   Bob Clark

#434 Re: Human missions » Blue Origins capsule for New Shepard. » 2017-04-04 04:01:02

In a video animation of the tourism flight there are shown handholds on the solid rocket motor:

PhS8AH.gif

  Be careful to mind your head!

   Bob Clark

#435 Re: Human missions » Blue Origins capsule for New Shepard. » 2017-04-04 03:29:40

RGClark wrote:

...
Thanks for that analysis. It is notable that the SpaceX abort system also has a similar low ISP and requires also in the range of 1,000 kg of propellant. They solve the CG/CP positioning problem by having a long trunk. And on at least the SpaceX abort test they also put fins on the trunk. This may have been to help insure a straight flight but it would also help to bring the CP further rearward.
So the simplest answer may be install a trunk on the Blue Origin capsule to bring the CP rearward.

Apparently, SpaceX does intend the fins to stay on the trunk for the crewed Dragon2:

crew-dragon-second-contract-1.jpg?auto=format%2Ccompress&ch=Width%2CDPR&fit=crop&h=347&q=60&rect=0%2C106%2C1620%2C912&w=616&s=b646a5af48ca1d18101a980b61758258

Bob Clark

#436 Re: Human missions » Blue Origins capsule for New Shepard. » 2017-04-03 10:30:09

GW Johnson wrote:

...

What I suspect here is that I have been sizing motors to the wrong thrust-time spec. 

GW

Your suspicion is correct. I found this after a web search:

Blue Origin conducts in-flight abort test; booster lands successfully.
Curt Godwin
October 5th, 2016
NewShepardAnim2.gif

As expected, the abort motor’s 70,000 pounds (310 kilonewtons) of thrust rocketed the capsule hundreds of feet from the booster and out of its path, allowing the craft to then descend to the desert floor under its three parachutes. Had occupants actually been on board New Shepard, they would have experienced a high load factor (g-force) for the duration of the abort motor’s firing – approximately two seconds – before entering a nominal descent profile.
Straight as an arrow.
The booster was able to power through the abort and make its way to space – without the capsule. While some of Blue Origin’s computer simulations showed this was possible, the likelihood of it actually happening was low.
However, as soon as the capsule’s abort motor had activated and cleared the module away from the booster, it became obvious that the rocket not only had survived the full brunt of the thrust from the escape pod, but also continued seemingly unperturbed by the fact that it had lost 8,000 pounds (3,600 kilograms) from its top.

http://www.spaceflightinsider.com/organ … cessfully/

So the thrust is 70,000 pounds at only 2 seconds. The capsule weight is 8,000 pounds which must include the solid motor weight. The dry weight of the capsule would be less perhaps 7,000 to 7,500 pounds. The size of the motor can be estimated from the diagram.

The acceleration is in the range of what I expected, about 9 to 10 g's. But I'm surprised the burn time is so short, only 2 seconds. I wouldn't think you would have enough time to clear a possible debris field from the rocket in that time.

Still, a burn time only 1/3rd as long suggests a motor 1/3rd as long, so perhaps 4 to 5 feet. This would certainly be containable in a trunk for the capsule.


  Bob Clark

#437 Re: Human missions » Blue Origins capsule for New Shepard. » 2017-04-03 05:16:19

GW Johnson wrote:

...

It takes 4 of these to meet the 80,000 lbth for 6 sec spec.  They're not very large size.  If you only ever combine 4 motors from the very same mix,  they will always have exactly the same burn time.  Given a reliable,  repeatable igniter,  they will always burn out within millisec of each other. 

There's no way to put this type of grain design into something 12 feet in diameter.  It's some other grain design.  I don't know what that might be. 

GW

Even breaking up the motor into 4 parts only reduces the length from 16 feet to 12 feet? That might still be too long.

  Bob Clark

#438 Re: Human missions » Blue Origins capsule for New Shepard. » 2017-04-02 19:27:31

GW Johnson wrote:

...
So,  there's an easy-to-build solid motor that will give you about 80,000 lb thrust for 6 seconds.  A D6ac case OD might be near 19 inches,  and with gas collection spaces at the faces of the grain,  and a nozzle, the motor assembly might be about 195-200 inches long.
Just goes to show that solids really are designed,  not scaled.  The last time a company just scaled a big solid,  they had to take a billion-dollar write-off in one year,  for destroying a USAF test stand facility. 
Just scaling a design is also why the Titanic was vulnerable to that iceberg,  and why its lifeboat count,  while legal,  was inadequate.   
GW


Thanks for that. The problem with scaling up a solid motor probably explains all the difficulty in getting the hybrid motor to work right on the Spaceship2.

I think the ca. 200 inch, over 16 feet, long solid would be too long for the capsule. Suppose you made the solid the width of the capsule about 12 feet with the same thrust and burn time? Or if you used four solids with the same total thrust and burn time, though with 4 solids you might have a problem getting them all to ignite at the same time and the same similar burn rates?

  Bob Clark

#439 Re: Human missions » Blue Origins capsule for New Shepard. » 2017-04-02 06:14:25

GW Johnson wrote:

Solids don't scale,  they have to be designed.  Otherwise,  somebody's expensive thrust stand is going to get blown up,  and maybe somebody killed. 

What I read just above says you want 80,000 lb thrust for 6 sec.  The total impulse of that is 480,000 lb-sec.  If the specific impulse is in the vicinity of 245 sec (a realistic goal to be exceeded,  if possible),  then the propellant mass required is about 1959 lbm. 
That is a big motor.  The as-cast volume of the propellant would be about 31,100 cu.in,  if the propellant density is 0.063 lbm/cu.in. That desity and Isp goes with an AP-HTPB-Aluminum propellant.  .2 to .7 in/sec is an achievable burn rate at 1000-1500 psia with that material. 
If I was to attempt a keyhole slot at L/D ~ 4,  cross sectional loading could be 80%.  The insulated inside volume of the case could be about 39,000 cu.in.  That would be around a 23 inch dia case ID,  and about 93 inches long inside.  Web fraction might be as high as 75%,  for a propellant web of 8.66 inch.  That must burn in 6 seconds,  for a burn rate of 1.44 in/sec.  Very few propellants are practical with burn rates that high. 
What that means is I need a longer L and a smaller ID with that keyhole.  Try L/D = 6.  Get ID = 20 inch.  Web = 7.5 inch.  Burn rate = 1.25 in/sec,  still too high.  Longer L/D is impractical with the keyhole,  as it gets too progressive. 
We could try a finocyl type design,  with which I had less experience.  To get around 0.5 in/sec burn rate,  we'll need a web of about 3 inches.  We'll need lower web fraction ~.67 and average cross sectional loading ~.65 for this type of design.  We will need about a 9-inch ID motor that is somewhere around 940 inches long,  which is not practical.  Too much void space and too small a web needed. 
I would have to think about this.  The really long multi-motor they used for the rocket sled may not be so ridiculous.  Perhaps I could go back to a high volume-packing L/D = 5 keyhole if I was to cluster multiple motors together.  Dunno yet. 
GW

Thanks for that analysis. It is notable that the SpaceX abort system also has a similar low ISP and requires also in the range of 1,000 kg of propellant. They solve the CG/CP positioning problem by having a long trunk. And on at least the SpaceX abort test they also put fins on the trunk. This may have been to help insure a straight flight but it would also help to bring the CP further rearward.
So the simplest answer may be install a trunk on the Blue Origin capsule to bring the CP rearward.

  Bob Clark

#440 Re: Human missions » Blue Origins capsule for New Shepard. » 2017-04-01 13:17:49

GW Johnson wrote:

From what I heard and read,  it was noisy and it really shook. 
Solids are more noisy and vibration-inducing than liquids.  I used to build them. 
GW

It's likely the solid abort motor has to be placed forward into the passenger compartment for reasons of positioning the center of gravity in relation to the center of pressure.

So perhaps it could be placed further to the rear if it were a smaller mass. We might also be able to give the capsule a trunk like SpaceX's Dragon to move rearward the center of pressure.

In regards to getting a smaller solid motor I found this remarkable example, called the Super Roadrunner. It's used on the last two stages of the rocket sled at the Holloman Air Force test track:

January 15th, 2006 at 8:30 pm
The Fastest Rocket Sled On Earth.

The final two stages each use single Super Roadrunner, or SRR, rocket motors. Designed specifically for the HHSTT, they weigh in at a mere 1100 pounds apiece. Yet, during burns of just 1.4 seconds, each produces a total of 228,000 pounds of thrust.

tb_rocket-lg-2.jpg
lg_vibration-lg-1.jpg
http://www.impactlab.net/2006/01/15/the … -on-earth/

Being able to develop 228,000 pounds of thrust to fully expend ca. 1,000 pounds of propellant in only 1.4 seconds amounts to an extraordinary burn rate. But 228,000 pounds is more than what we need for the abort motor. So perhaps we can get an even smaller mass by reducing the thrust on a small scale version of this motor.

The SpaceX Dragon abort system get's about 8 g's. Let's say the Blue Origin capsule weighs in the range of 10,000 pounds. Then for a 8 g acceleration we would want the thrust to be 80,000 pounds, a third that of the Super Roadrunner.

We also need the solid rocket motor to be smaller because based on the images it would be too long to fit under the capsule. So the question is can we scale down a solid rocket motor by just reducing the size?

Also, the 1.4 second burn is actually too short for our purpose. While we do want the high thrust to pull the capsule away from the launcher rapidly in an emergency, we need a longer burn time to get sufficient distance away. For the SpaceX Dragon abort test, the SuperDracos had a 6 second burn time. So how can we get a longer burn time for the miniature Super Roadrunner solid motors?

  Bob Clark

#441 Re: Human missions » Blue Origins capsule for New Shepard. » 2017-03-31 10:40:12

RobertDyck wrote:

Apollo LM, museum display. You realize the grey cylinder on the floor of the back part is the cover for the ascent engine.
https://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/LMSimulator.jpg http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2643/408 … d84685.jpg http://www.hq.nasa.gov/pao/History/SP-350/i4-4a.jpg
Still. This is for space tourism. The New Shepard abort engine is "in your face".


Thanks for that. I wonder what that must have sounded and felt like with that engine firing right under your rump.

  Bob Clark

#442 Re: Human missions » Blue Origins capsule for New Shepard. » 2017-03-31 03:06:16

GW Johnson wrote:

That thing in the middle is a solid rocket motor,  or the end of one?

The rest of it looks pretty nice. 

GW

Well, it's the propellant chamber. But for solid rockets the propellant chamber is the combustion chamber when ignited.

Bob Clark

#443 Human missions » Blue Origins capsule for New Shepard. » 2017-03-30 08:32:14

RGClark
Replies: 33

Blue Origin released some interior images of the capsule they intend to use for the New Shepard suborbital tourism rocket:

Take a Peek Inside Blue Origin’s New Shepard Crew Capsule.
Published: 29 Mar , 2017
by Nancy Atkinson
17458383_1518234718221709_2632460151475955651_n.jpg?oh=e1d91a04b72e90cde9edbbb0e2f46547&oe=594C61EE
http://www.universetoday.com/134783/tak … w-capsule/

I don't like the solid rocket escape motor being placed in the center of the passenger cabin. From discussion on other forums I understand this is a center of gravity issue. They need the heavy mass of the solid rocket motor to be placed forward for stability reasons.

Still, I get a very visceral negative reaction to this arrangement. Anyone else get that reaction?

  Bob Clark

#444 Re: Human missions » Apollo 11 REDUX » 2017-03-23 07:48:25

GW Johnson wrote:

Over at "exrocketman",  I had it very roughly estimated as about $4-5 B to put a 6-man research installation on the moon for about 3 months,  and something like $1 B per year to keep it open continuously.   But not if "old space" does it.  Nor if NASA does it. 

Whether such a thing should precede Mars,  I dunno.  All I did was bound the problem as a clean-sheet design,  using Falcon-Heavy to set thrown masses.  Anything that Bezos can do with his New Glenn rocket should fall in the same ballpark. 

GW

That $4-5 billion initial cost is much less than what the ISS was. Anyone know what is the yearly cost of the ISS?

  Bob Clark

#445 Re: Single Stage To Orbit » Reusable LOX/Kerosene SSTO with drop tanks » 2017-03-15 07:36:30

In his presentation last year on the Interplanetary Transport System (ITS), at about the 54 minute mark Musk discusses that the second stage in its tanker form or in its spaceship form will be able to reach orbit when used as a single stage. He states though the tanker will not be able to land, presumably because of insufficient reserve fuel. Then it could be an expendable SSTO.

Making Humans a Multiplanetary Species - YouTube.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7Uyfqi_ … .be&t=3240

A simulation of the ITS upper stage tanker as an SSTO:

ITS Tanker SSTO - YouTube.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kzyzwr-5XXY

It suggests it can get a total mass of 190 metric tons to LEO as an expendable. Since the dry mass is 90 metric tons, this means a 100 metric ton payload to orbit.

   Bob Clark

#446 Re: Human missions » Apollo 11 REDUX » 2017-03-14 08:31:07

Discussion of possible landers for returning us to the Moon here:

http://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.php … 74#p135674

Bob Clark

#447 Re: Human missions » COTS Lunar lander Inititative » 2017-03-14 08:19:24

SpaceNut wrote:

Wow what ever happened to this program?

With the current administration wanting to return to the Moon perhaps the Xeus lander will get funding. More about the Xeus lander:

Xeus.
Under Development in Partnership with ULA.
http://masten.aero/vehicles-2/xeus/

I actually favor multiple commercial approaches to our returning to the Moon, such as the lunar cargo lander being planned by Blue Origin:

Jeff Bezos and Blue Origin propose ‘Amazon-like’ delivery to the moon in 2020.
BY ALAN BOYLE on March 2, 2017 at 7:32 pm
http://www.geekwire.com/2017/blue-moon- … ding-2020/

  The planned lander is to carry a 10,000 pound payload to the lunar surface. This is about the size of the gross mass of the ascent stage of the Apollo lunar  lander.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_Lu … cent_stage

Actually a lighter ascent stage could be formed using the, already built and tested, methane Morpheus lander:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Mo … ifications

Then the Blue Origin cargo lunar lander planned for 2020 could serve as the descent stage of a manned lander in 2020 also.

  Bob Clark

#448 Re: Human missions » Apollo 11 REDUX » 2017-03-09 00:31:58

Another hypergolic stage still in production is the hypergolic upper stage on the Ariane 5:

http://www.astronautix.com/a/ariane5-2epsl10aestus.html

The Ariane 5 can use a hypergolic upper stage or hydrolox one depending on mission.

Going for all hydrolox stages for the in-space propulsion for a lunar mission would make for a smaller mission size. But hypergolics would offer surety of ignition at least for the stages needed for Earth return.

  Bob Clark

#449 Re: Human missions » Apollo 11 REDUX » 2017-03-08 08:50:59

Orbital Sciences has been investigating giving their Cygnus capsule life support capability for use as a deep space habitat. They've also investigated giving it a heat shield to make it reusable. A Cygnus given a heat shield and life support could work as a lightweight capsule for a lightweight lunar sortie design, launchable on a single Delta IV Heavy or Ariane 5:

http://exoscientist.blogspot.com/2013/0 … ights.html


Bob Clark

#450 Re: Human missions » SpaceX 2018 Lunar Flyby » 2017-03-08 08:32:26

This *might* be doable with a single Falcon 9 v1.2 and Dragon V2, no Falcon Heavy required:

According to the SpaceX site, the F9 v1.2, http://www.spacex.com/falcon9 can get 8,300 kg, 18,300 lb, to geosynchronous transfer orbit (GTO), https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geostatio … sfer_orbit.

GTO is an intermediate orbit to GEO frequently used for communications satellites.

It takes about 2,500 delta-v to get to GTO and about 3,100 m/s delta-v to reach the Moon, translunar injection, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Translunar_injection. So you would need about 600 m/s additional delta-v to get to the Moon.

The Dragon V2 is said to carry 1,390 kg of propellant for its Superdraco thrusters. The Isp of the Superdracos, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SuperDraco) is only 240s at sea level. But with just a nozzle extension we can get the vacuum Isp to the 320 s range.

Then the delta-v possible for a 6,400 metric ton dry mass Dragon V2 would be:

320*9.81ln(1 + 1,390/(6400)) = 616.9 m/s.

This is just barely enough. But rocket engineers always like to carry some extra fuel on flights. Also that calculation doesn't even include the weight of the astronauts.
We could store some extra fuel in the trunk of the Dragon. If we had 1,600 kg total propellant in the Dragon and trunk then we could get a delta-v of

320*9.81ln(1 + 1,600/(6400 +200)) = 681 m/s.

This would allow 200 kg more for the astronauts and supplies.


Bob Clark

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