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#276 Human missions » China's Plans For Moon Exploration Are More Advanced Than NASA's » 2018-01-01 20:33:42

EdwardHeisler
Replies: 3

[Excerpt]

China’s moon mission to boldly go a step further
China may achieve a feat never attempted by the US or USSR – landing on the far side of the moon
By Stuart Clark
The Guardian
December 17, 2017

This time next year, there may be a new world leader in lunar exploration. If all goes according to plan, China will have done something no other space-faring superpower has been able to do: land on the far side of the moon. China is rocketing ahead with its plans for lunar exploration. In 2018, they will launch a pair of missions known collectively as Chang’e 4. It is the fourth mission in a series named after the Chinese moon goddess.

The first component of Chang’e 4 is scheduled to lift off in June. It will be a relay satellite stationed some 60,000km behind the moon and will provide a communications link between Earth and the lunar far side. Once this link is established, it will allow China to send the second part of the mission: a lander to the far side’s surface.

Landing on the far side of the moon is something no one has tried before. “The Chinese are pushing back the frontier with such a technically challenging mission,” says Brian Harvey, space analyst and author of China in Space: The Great Leap Forward.

China’s lunar exploration programme started in 2007 with Chang’e 1, a simple lunar orbiter. In 2010, Chang’e 2 also went into lunar orbit before setting off for a trek across the solar system that culminated in a flyby of asteroid Toutatis in 2012.

In 2013 Chang’e 3, deploying the Jade Rabbit rover, made headlines for the first soft landing on the moon since 1976. So far, so impressive, but all China had done was catch up with the achievements of the US and USSR. Chang’e 4, however, will be a space first.

Nobody has landed on the far side of the moon, mainly because of the communications difficulty. Yet the scientific payoff is huge. Being in the shadow of the moon allows stray radio signals from Earth to be blocked so the view of the radio universe is unparalleled.

Heino Falcke, Radboud University, Nijmegen, is hoping to take full advantage of this by supplying a radio telescope to the Chinese mission. His aim is to test how easy it will be to pick up signals from the early universe before there were any stars.

“China has always made a big play about wanting to do international collaboration,” says Harvey. “I think there may be an element of wanting to do it to show the US that they have an international reach, despite the America effort to stop them.”

But it is safe to say that China’s plans are the most advanced. After Chang’e 4, they are on course for a series of other robotic lunar missions that will build towards an attempted human landing in about 15 years. The key to this is the Long March 9 rocket, which is in development and due to fly in 2028-2030. It’s a behemoth that will be able to land something bigger than the Apollo lunar module, which carried pairs of astronauts to the moon and back in the 1960s and 70s.

“It is reasonable to presume that China will have its own people on the surface early in the 2030s,” says Harvey. And this puts them well in the lead over Nasa, which has no firm plans for landing people at present.

The ultimate question is whether the Chinese spirit of international collaboration could extend all the way through to the human landings, with their rockets carrying other nationalities? Maybe.
This summer, ESA astronauts trained with their Chinese counterparts for the first time. It was a survival exercise unrelated to lunar exploration, but it signalled an openness on both sides. “The reception was warm. We truly felt the spirit of belonging to one universal astronaut family, sharing the same values, goals and vision,” said ESA astronaut Matthias Maurer at the time. Clearly, the moon is where humankind is going next. The surprise is that the Chinese are now poised to have such a leading role in the endeavour.

That may prove a bitter pill for the US to swallow as Nasa are prohibited from working with the Chinese. In spring 2013, the US Congress passed a further law effectively banning Chinese nationals from even setting foot inside a Nasa facility.

Given the pace of Chinese progress, this could prove to be an own goal. On 11 December, the 45th anniversary of the Apollo 17 lunar landing (the last time people walked on the moon), President Trump signed Space Policy Directive 1, which directs Nasa to take astronauts to the moon with the help of US commercial space industry.

Yet there is little detail about how and when this might happen and how much the White House is prepared to spend. “Trump’s directive was very vague,” says Harvey. “We’re still no more definite about when the Americans will set foot back on the moon.”

https://www.theguardian.com/science/201 … -discovery

#277 Re: Not So Free Chat » The New Mars Forums Pet Section » 2017-12-29 12:12:41

June%2024%202011%20049.jpg


Here's my cat, Sally!   She likes the tree.

#278 Not So Free Chat » Physicians Support A Single-Payer Medicare-for-All Health Care Program » 2017-12-28 19:52:11

EdwardHeisler
Replies: 20

Who is PNHP?
Physicians for a National Health Program is a non-profit research and education organization of 20,000 physicians, medical students and health professionals who support single-payer national health insurance.

Beyond the Affordable Care Act
A Physicians’ Proposal for Single-Payer Health Care Reform

Summary

The Physicians’ Proposal for Single-Payer Health Reform was drafted by a working group of 39 physicians and has been endorsed by more than 2,231 other physicians and 149 medical students. The most important feature of the Physicians’ Proposal is the removal of all financial barriers to medical care.
The plan would save enough on administrative overhead to provide comprehensive coverage to the uninsured and to upgrade coverage for everyone else, thus requiring no increase in total health spending. In addition, it would put in place effective mechanisms to control costs, lowering the rate of medical inflation and making the health system sustainable for future generations. Significantly, it would restore free choice of clinician and hospital to all Americans.

Access
Every resident of the U.S., including all immigrants, would be covered for all necessary medical care. Patients would receive a National Health Program (NHP) card entitling them to care at any hospital or doctor’s office. Medical bills for covered services would generally be eliminated, although the NHP might seek reimbursement from other national health insurance systems for care provided to tourists who fall ill while visiting the U.S.

Benefits
Coverage would include outpatient and inpatient medical care as well as rehabilitation, mental health care, long-term care, dental services, and prescription drugs. In effect, the plan improves on traditional Medicare’s benefits and expands coverage to all Americans. It would eliminate premiums, co-pays, deductibles, and co-insurance.

Administration / Administrative Savings

The program would be federally financed (like Medicare) and administered by federal, state and regional boards. Private insurance which duplicates NHP coverage would be prohibited.  Replacing the complex and redundant private insurance bureaucracy with a streamlined single-payer program would greatly simplify administration for doctors and hospitals. Overall, cutting administrative spending to Canadian levels would save about 15 percent of national health expenditures, freeing up nearly $500 billion annually for expanded and improved coverage.

Effective Cost-Controls

The initial increase in government costs would be fully offset by savings in premiums and out-of-pocket costs. According to estimates from the Government Accountability Office, the Congressional Budget Office, and several private consulting firms, the administrative savings possible with a single payer are enough to cover all of the uninsured and to upgrade coverage for the under-insured without any increase in total health spending.
Future costs increases would be contained by the NHP’s ability to set and enforce overall spending limits, negotiate prices, and improve health planning.
Hospitals and other health facilities would be on a budget.  Most hospitals, clinics and nursing homes would remain privately owned and operated, receiving an annual “global” lump sum budget from the NHP to cover all operating costs. Capital funds would be distributed separately on the basis of health planning goals.   
Physicians would be paid based on a simple fee schedule covering all patients or by salary.  Physicians in private practice would continue to practice on a fee-for-service basis with fee levels set in negotiations with the NHP. Physicians working in nonprofit hospitals, clinics, capitated group practices, HMO’s, and integrated health systems would be salaried.
Medications would be purchased wholesale.  The NHP would negotiate prices with pharmaceutical companies as other countries around the world do today. The NHP would pay pharmacists wholesale costs plus a reasonable dispensing fee for prescription drugs on the NHP formulary.
Investor ownership would be proscribed.  Investor ownership of the health care delivery system (hospitals, clinics, etc.) would not be allowed because it raises costs and reduces quality. Regionally dominant health systems and Accountable Care Organizations would be publicly controlled to prevent them from exploiting oligopoly market power.

Financing

The program would be paid for by combining current sources of government health spending into a single fund with modest new taxes that would be fully offset by reductions in premiums and out-of-pocket spending.

Further details of the Physicians’ Proposal are offered in an editorial in the June 2016 American Journal of Public Health, “Moving Forward from the Affordable Care Act to a Single-Payer System” by Drs. Adam Gaffney, Steffie Woolhandler, Marcia Angell, and David Himmelstein.
You can read the editorial at http://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/10 … 015.303157    The full physicians proposal is online at www.pnhp.org/nhi

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The conservative case for single payer

Efficient. Effective. Practical. Make no mistake, there is a strong conservative case to be made for single payer. This is important because, as our health care crisis deepens, we need to make sure we’re speaking to all Americans. Only then can we can build a broad-based movement that pressures Congress to do the right thing.

Dispel common myths

Myth: Single payer is socialized medicine!
Reality: Medicare-for-all applies the principles of the free market to the delivery of health care. Under traditional Medicare, doctors and hospitals compete to attract patients through service, quality, and access - rather than competing to be in the best-reimbursed insurance plans. Medicare-for-all would open up this patient-centered free market to all Americans.

Myth: Single payer would lead to rationing!
Reality: Today's private health insurance is incredibly restrictive, with narrow provider networks, cost-sharing, and a growing list of treatments that simply aren't covered. Private insurance comapnies have a financial incentive to deny care, and they often do. Medicare-for-all would make it much easier for patients to access medically necessary care.

Myth: Single payer would stifle innovation!
Reality: Americans are justifiably proud of our nation's leadership in medical innovation, but may not realize that most of those innovations are paid for using public funds. As pharmaceutical companies engage in trivial research designed to extend patents, our National Institutes of Health funds truly pioneering work. Medicare-for-all would strengthen the alignment of research with our most pressing health needs.

Expose the Canadian boogeyman

Some of the most pervasive myths about single payer relate to Canada’s Medicare program. Many Americans have heard that Canadians suffer long wait times, and flock to the United States to seek medical care. Thankfully, these myths are easily disproven. Consider the following:
•    The 2002 Health Affairs study Phantoms in the Snow found that an exceedingly small number of Canadians seek care in the U.S.
•    Waiting lists in Canada can be primarly attributed to lower health spending. Despite this, Canadians do not have to wait to be treated for life-threatening diseases and report fewer unmet health needs overall (see this NBER paper, Table 12).
•    Former Canadian Medical Association Journal editor-in-chief and one-time market proponent David Woods says single payer is essential to controlling costs.
•    George Mason University law professor Frank Buckley believes Republicans should embrace single payer, and points to the benefits of Medicare in his native Canada.
•    Bottom line? Canadian health outcomes are better than American health outcomes, including longer life expectancy and fewer chronic conditions. These gaps have been growing ever since Canada fully implemented its Medicare program in the early 1970s.

Cutting overhead and bureaucracy

Your conservative representative may agree with you that single payer would provide high-quality care, but they may also also argue that the private sector is more efficient than the federal government, and therefore a better steward of our health care dollars.
However, it is our current, market-oriented system that generates the greatest amount of waste and profiteering. Conservatives who hate bureaucracy should be champing at the bit to do away with private insurance company overhead. A February 2017 estimate published in the Annals of Internal Medicine found that single payer would generate $504 billion in administrative savings annually.

Economists and public health experts have consistently shown that single payer is an efficient and effective use of resources. Here are some prominent examples:
•    PNHP co-founders, Drs. David Himmelstein and Steffie Woolhandler, argue that single payer would allow for Liberal Benefits, Conservative Spending.
•    Nobel laureate Angus Deaton favors single payer “because it will get this [health care] monster that we’ve created out of the economy and allow the rest of capitalism to flourish.”
•    Nobel laureate and noted health care economist Kenneth Arrow lauds the Canadian system (with its private practitioners) and says single payer is “better than any other system.”

Boosting American business

Conservative members of Congress often voice concern over the global competitiveness of American business, and rising health care costs are harmful in that regard. Under single payer, U.S. firms might contribute as much to health care as they do now via a payroll tax, but they would no longer need to shop for group policies. They would also be spared the outrageous annual cost increases that have become commonplace in the large- and small-group markets.
For workers, single payer would allow those who are not a good fit for their jobs to seek more productive employment elsewhere instead of staying put in order to preserve health benefits. And would-be entrepreneurs would no longer fear striking out on their own due to a lack of health insurance.

Ultimately, improved Medicare-for-all would ensure a healthier, more financially-secure workforce. Thankfully, employers are starting to take notice:
•    The group Business Leaders Transforming Healthcare "strongly supports legislation to transition the United States to a publicly funded health care system."
•    MCS Industries founder and owner Richard Master has produced a documentary, FIX IT: Health Care at the Tipping Point, that lays out the business case for single payer.
•    Berkshire Hathaway vice-chairman (and longstanding Republican) Charlie Munger says single payer is the solution to America’s health care woes.
•    Micro Trap Corporation CEO and former GOP state legislator David Steil urges Congress to pass single-payer reform in order to “truly enhance American competitiveness.”
•    Marks Group owner and prominent blogger Gene Marks considers himself a “smaller government, fiscally right-of-center guy,” but has concluded that single payer would be best for business.

http://www.pnhp.org/gop

#279 Re: Not So Free Chat » "Sorry America, We're Not Going Back To The Moon" Article From Forbes » 2017-12-20 19:05:08

Terraformer wrote:

The current budget is plenty enough - provided they don't use the SLS. If you're talking just about Lunar sorties, the Dragon capsule is good enough. Get Bigelow to develop a surface hab, and someone else to develop a lander, and you're set. Launch everything on Falcon Heavy. Sure, it'll take two launches rather than one, but that's not a deal breaker.

Yes, the Trump government could do that.   But they won't.

#280 Not So Free Chat » "Sorry America, We're Not Going Back To The Moon" Article From Forbes » 2017-12-20 12:32:08

EdwardHeisler
Replies: 5

Sorry America, We're Not Going Back To The Moon
Ethan Siegel , Contributor
December 19, 2017
Forbes
Astrophysicist and author Ethan Siegel is the founder and primary writer of Starts With A Bang! His books, Treknology and Beyond The Galaxy

Last week, President Trump signed Space Policy Directive 1, designed to refocus NASA's mission on human exploration and spaceflight. Proclaiming, "This time, we will not only plant our flag and leave our footprint, we will establish a foundation for an eventual mission to Mars and, perhaps someday, to many worlds beyond," Trump made a promise that should sound familiar to American citizens, as many incoming presidents (including Obama and both Bushes) have made similar plans and proclamations. Like all plans, to bring this one to fruition will require a tremendous investment of resources: in people, in equipment and facilities, in research and development, and in terms of money as well. With no plans for adequate, additional funding to support these ambitions, these dreams will simply evaporate, as they have so many times before.

If you look at the percent of the federal budget currently being invested in NASA, you'll find that you have to go all the way back to 1959, the first full year of NASA's existence, to encounter a time where we invested less in the agency than we do today. When we chose to go to the Moon, it was accompanied by a tremendous increase in the resources we devoted to the endeavor: up to nearly 5% of the federal budget. Today, that figure sits at just 0.4% of the budget (0.11% of our GDP), or less than one-tenth of what we invested in NASA the last time we sent humans to the Moon.

NASA's crewed spaceflight missions since the end of Apollo have focused on low-Earth orbit. But if the goal is to explore the Universe, and to take humanity deeper and farther into the cosmic sea than we've ever gone, a return to the Moon won't accomplish that. The vision of the Trump administration, laid out earlier this year, involves a shocking proposal, to build a lunar space station orbiting the Moon. In no way, shape, or form does a lunar space station prepare us or aid us in going to either the Moon or Mars. Instead, it's a project that merely serves to:

provide a use for the Space Launch System (SLS) that's already developed,

provide a potential application of the Orion capsule system,

and provide potential partnership opportunities with Russia on an orbiter and Europe/Japan on the habitation modules.

It's a proposal that should make you furious. If you want to go to the Moon, you design a system to put humans on the Moon. If you want to go to a different world, you design a system to put human beings on that world. If you want to go to deep space, you figure out what you need to go to deep space — and you go. Instead, the plan will spend a great deal of money without yielding appreciable results. If you want to accomplish something great, you don't look at the technology you've already developed and ask, "what can we do with it?" Instead, you must look at the goal you want to achieve and ask, "what will it take to accomplish this?" You also have to provide funding for it, and plan it on a realistically short timescale.

If the goal is to go to Mars, we've already done extensive research into how much it would cost and what type of technological development it would require. To do it safely and responsibly, it would take a sustained investment totaling somewhere in the ballpark of $50-$150 billion, spread out over the course of approximately 10 years. The plan would involve landing a slew of equipment on the Martian surface, along with robots and rovers designed to self-assemble stations and habitats, and then a crew of human beings, who would stay for anywhere from 6 to 18 months before returning home. The largest and heaviest things ever landed on the Martian surface are far lighter than what a crewed mission would require, and the only way you ensure the safety of the crew on such an endeavor is through practice.

When we decided to first go to the Moon in 1961, this was the vision and the rationale laid bare before the American people:

"There is no strife, no prejudice, no national conflict in outer space as yet. Its hazards are hostile to us all. Its conquest deserves the best of all mankind, and its opportunity for peaceful cooperation many never come again. But why, some say, the moon? Why choose this as our goal? And they may well ask why climb the highest mountain? Why, 35 years ago, fly the Atlantic? Why does Rice play Texas?

We choose to go to the Moon. We choose to go to the Moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win, and the others, too."

The spinoff technologies alone have benefitted American society in far more ways than giving us teflon and a space pen; advances in cooling suits, kidney dialysis, physical therapy, athletic shoes, home insulation, water filtration, freeze drying, pipeline protection, gear for firefighters, and so much more have come about directly from the Apollo program on its own. No one can promise what the returns will look like on a mission to Mars, but there are two things we can be certain about.

1. Going back to the Moon won't get us any closer to Mars. If we want to go to Mars, we should make that our goal and invest in it; if we want to go to the Moon, we should make that our goal and invest in it. Pretending that one has anything to do with the other is a delusion.

2.Unless we increase our funding to achieve whatever goal we set our sights on, we'll continue to have our crewed spaceflight program stagnate, while China, India, Japan, Russia, and more all continue to grow theirs.

America is home to some of the greatest scientists, engineers, astronauts, administrators, and organizations in the entire world. With the people and facilities we have today, we could put a human on the Moon or even on Mars within the next 10 years, if only we invest in it. But grandstanding, lofty promises, and a dearth of funding will yield the same results they always have: a nation whose greatest dreams go unfulfilled. What we can accomplish as a species is limited only by what's physically possible and what we invest in it. Our ambitions to venture beyond low-Earth orbit are achievable, but only if we make it so. Unless there's a plan to increase NASA's funding to sufficient levels to send humans to worlds beyond our own, America is never going to get there.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswith … 082e162a5c

#281 Re: Not So Free Chat » Oxford University Astrobiologists Study: Aliens May Be More Like Us » 2017-12-20 08:26:59

louis wrote:

I guess you would have to ask what would happen if indeed an agency reports to the President that UFOs have been confirmed as a reality and are indicative of another intelligent, in fact more advanced, species in the solar system. How would that be handled. The President would probably set up a committee of senior advisers to come up with a policy response.  If you were on a committee how would you advise? You might well respond as follows:

1. This information having been established, it will soon find its way to the media and then the public one way or another.

2. The information could prove very disruptive in the short term. The media will go into a sustained frenzy.  Markets might well react negatively. Investments in future technology might well be affected if investors feel that capital investment is going to made worthless by some "gift" of new technology  from aliens. There may be responses of panic, of religiose fervour.  At the least the government will be accused of hiding the truth from the public.


3. We therefore recommend a moderately paced build of information flow to the public.

- NASA should educate the public about similar solar systems elsewhere in the cosmos and the strong likelihood that they can sustain life.
- Trusted persons recently released from government service should be permitted to talk openly about some UFOs being  real aircraft. 
- NASA should release more photos that reveal a past civilisation on Mars. NASA should neither confirm nor deny but stress this underlines the need for us to visit the planet.
- Supportive persons in Congress should be briefed and encouraged to set up investigations. Government should respond that it has nothing to hide and is willing to co-operate fully.
- During long Congressional Hearings the idea of alien life forms in our solar system should be normalised.
- The President should estbalish a formal Commission which can then confirm the existence of such life forms.
- If contact has been made, such contact can be revealed.

Why the President of the United States?    Especially the current one!   LOL

It could just as likely be done by the President or Prime Minister of Great Britain, Russia, China, etc., before the United States.   Or after international consultations, the United Nations.

#282 Re: Not So Free Chat » Oxford University Astrobiologists Study: Aliens May Be More Like Us » 2017-12-19 21:20:38

louis wrote:

And now we have an ex DoD official confirming that some at least of these UFO sightings are real - they are verified aircraft not optical illusions...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont … qwsaypXh6w

Hmmm...does feel like things are changing.

We had the NASA announcement about similar solar systems to ours.

Now we are told the US government thinks UFOs are probably real but can't explain them...

Are we being readied for some big announcement?

What's next? Some revelation from Mars?

I keep an open mind on all these things. I think that's the best approach.

Like you, I'll keep an open mind and find nothing wrong with a serious scientific investigation of this matter.   I was mostly surprised that the Department of Defense declassified and released the videos.

But I and most others would need to see hard evidence that UFO's are from some other star system.   Until that happens we can only speculate.

#283 Re: Not So Free Chat » Politics » 2017-12-19 13:22:12

Terraformer wrote:

To be fair, Robert, Canada only has a land border with the United States, and an ocean between it and the rest of the world, with the exception of Russia, Norway, and Denmark (Greenland), who would have to send troops through a frozen hell to get to you. Who is going to invade Canada?

Who is going to invade the United States?   Russia, China, North Korea, Vietnam, Mexico or Canada?

If invaded by Russia or China that would mean the almost immediate destruction of the United States and the invading nation via nuclear war.   

And the UnitedStates has a domestic military force of over 100 million people.   Plus we have the regular army, navy, air force, coast guard and national guard.   

And invading army would have trouble taking over any major American city in block to block fighting, much less the entire nation.

Don't worry, the Russians aren't coming .... nor are the Chinese, or Koreans, or Kurdistanians.    But look out for the Kardashians!

The United States spend more money for war and the military than all other nations of the Earth combined. 

European nations and Canada spend only a tiny fraction of their budget for the military-industrial alliance because they are not trying to police the world and they are not paranoid.       They are not shaking in their boots or hiding under their beds scared to death of Russians and those oriental people.    They are not so easy targets of extreme right-wing zenophobic, racist and anti-science propagandists.

#284 Re: Not So Free Chat » Oxford University Astrobiologists Study: Aliens May Be More Like Us » 2017-12-19 13:02:11

CalvinSteen wrote:

Hmm, interesting view on extraterrestrials, overall.

I agree with that view.   I don't think they are likely to look like giant bugs such as ants that would enjoy us for a late night snack!

I just wonder if Trump will propose building a trillion dollar space wall to keep the illegal aliens out.

LOL

#285 Re: Human missions » Trump's Weak Space Policy Directive-1 A Big Nothingburger » 2017-12-15 20:44:01

Oldfart1939 wrote:

Before sitting in judgment of this announcement and being totally negative, let's wait until the Senate gets it's act together and confirms the nomination of Jim Bridenstine as the Administrator of NASA. On the flip side--I'm somewhat encouraged that there was any announcement at all. At this point, NASA is without any direction internally. Trump doesn't direct NASA other than through directives which are then implemented by the administrator.

I don't think it was much of an announcement.    The Trump space directive kept all but one paragraph of President Obama's 14 page 2010 directive!

Check out Obama's directive at:

https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/si … -28-10.pdf

Again, there is no change except for a single paragraph!   We'll have a better idea of the Trump government space policy and objectives when they submit the 2019 NASA budget authorization request. 

But, you're right.   I'm not very optimistic about the prospects for a serious and well funded NASA plan to send human explorers to Mars or even the Moon.

I think Space X along with China, ESA, etc., will lead the way on that.    And the Senate may not confirm Bridenstine.   I don't support him for the reasons I laid out in other posts.    I think he's only interested in enriching himself and his friends by mining operations on the Moon and cares little about scientific discovery and going to Mars   He's no Elon Musk or Robert Zubrin.

We shall see.   I hope I'm wrong.

#286 Human missions » Trump's Weak Space Policy Directive-1 A Big Nothingburger » 2017-12-15 18:56:34

EdwardHeisler
Replies: 5

Federation of American Scientists
A New Category of Presidential Directives
by Steven Aftergood
December 14, 2017

President Trump created an entire new category of presidential directives to present his guidance for the U.S. space program. The new Space Policy Directive 1 was signed on December 11 and published in the Federal Register today.

“President Donald Trump is sending astronauts back to the Moon,” enthused NASA public affairs in a news release.

But the directive itself does no such thing. Instead, it makes modest editorial adjustments to the 2010 National Space Policy that was issued by President Obama and adopted in Presidential Decision Directive 4.

Obama’s policy had stated:

“Set far-reaching exploration milestones. By 2025, begin crewed missions beyond the moon, including sending humans to an asteroid. By the mid-2030s, send humans to orbit Mars and return them safely to Earth;”

Trump’s new SPD-1 orders the deletion and replacement of that one paragraph with the following text:

“Lead an innovative and sustainable program of exploration with commercial and international partners to enable human expansion across the solar system and to bring back to Earth new knowledge and opportunities. Beginning with missions beyond low-Earth orbit, the United States will lead the return of humans to the Moon for long-term exploration and utilization, followed by human missions to Mars and other destinations;”

And that’s it. At a White House signing ceremony on December 11, President Trump said grandly that “This directive will ensure America’s space program once again leads and inspires all of humanity.”

But it’s hard to see how that could be so. The Trump directive does not (and cannot) allocate any new resources to support a return to the Moon, and it does not modify existing authorities or current legislative proposals.

Interestingly, it also does not modify the many other provisions of Obama’s 14-page space policy, including requirements “to enhance U.S. global climate change research” and “climate monitoring.” Unless and until they are modified or revoked, those provisions remain in effect.

https://fas.org/blogs/secrecy/2017/12/s … directive/

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So the Trump government is dropping Obama's timeline for sending humans beyond the Moon in 2025 and around Mars in the 2030's.
No new timelines and architecture were provided in Trump's "Space Directive", just general "sustainable" ideas that won't require major funding.

#287 Human missions » We Already Have A Deep Space Gateway. It's Called Planet Earth » 2017-12-15 16:47:51

EdwardHeisler
Replies: 0

We have already used this Earth based gateway to explore much of our solar system and the stars.

NASA will not send humans to land on the Moon, much less Mars.

It's unlikely the Trump government will budget money for such "expensive" projects in the 2019 NASA appropriation.   Instead, they will appropriate tens of billions over the next several years to further the militarization of space and for U.S Air Force to establish a new branch of the military, known as a Space Corps, by January of 2019.

The Chinese National Space Administration in collaboration with the European Space Agency,  the Roscosmos State Corporation for Space Activities (Roscosmos) the European Space Agency and Space X will lead the non-military human scientific exploration of Mars and the Moon before NASA does.

#288 Human missions » NASA Misses Two Congressional Deadlines Outlining Their Space Plans! » 2017-12-11 11:55:39

EdwardHeisler
Replies: 2

[Excerpt]

Space News
President to sign space policy directive Monday
by Jeff Foust — December 11, 2017

Congress has already offered its view of NASA exploration priorities in the form of NASA authorization legislation. The latest NASA authorization, signed into law in March, endorses a “stepping stone approach to exploration” with “missions to intermediate destinations in sustainable steps” while maintaining a long-term goal of human missions to Mars.

That bill directed NASA to develop an “initial exploration roadmap” that outlined its plans, to be delivered to Congress by Dec. 1. A separate provision instructed NASA to perform an independent assessment of the feasibility of a human mission to Mars specifically in 2033, due 180 days after the bill’s enactment in March . NASA has not announced the status of either report.

http://spacenews.com/president-to-sign- … ve-monday/

#289 Space Policy » Senate May Not Vote To Approve Bridenstine As NASA Administrator! » 2017-12-02 11:20:42

EdwardHeisler
Replies: 0

Marco Rubio's reservations put Trump's NASA nominee in jeopardy
LEDYARD KING, THE NEWS-PRESS Washington bureau
November 18, 2017

Florida GOP Sen. Marco Rubio continues to harbor deep reservations about Rep. Jim Bridenstine’s nomination to be NASA’s next administrator, dimming the Oklahoma Republican’s chances of running the space agency.

“I remain very concerned about the politicization of NASA, not even because he would do it on purpose but just given some of the resistance he’s already engendered,” Rubio said in an interview Friday. “I don’t think NASA at this critical stage of its history can afford that ... As of this moment, I can’t assure anyone that I would support his nomination if it came to a vote.”
Rubio’s comments are his strongest yet and suggest that his initial misgivings when President Donald Trump announced Bridenstine’s
nomination in early September have only grown.

A broad swath of Democrats from Washington Sen. Patty Murray to Florida Sen. Bill Nelson have already announced their opposition to Bridenstine over a range of his past statements, including ones skeptical of climate science and opposing same-sex marriage.

Earlier this month, the Senate Commerce, Science and Transportation Committee narrowly forwarded his nomination to the full Senate. The vote was 14-13 with every Democrat opposed to Bridenstine.

If that party-line opposition holds, Bridenstine will need almost all of the 52 Republicans in the 100-seat chamber to support him. But if other Republicans are as skeptical of his nomination as Rubio is, Trump’s choice to run NASA might not even get a vote.

Rubio and Bridenstine have a history.

During the 2016 presidential campaign, Bridenstine appeared in ads on behalf of Texas GOP Sen. Ted Cruz that suggested Rubio, then a candidate for the White House, was soft on terror and slammed Rubio’s support of immigration reform.
After Cruz dropped out, Bridentstine became an enthusiastic supporter of Trump and was said to have spent months lobbying the White House for the NASA administrator job.

Bridenstine would be the first elected member of Congress to run the agency that has a reputation for being nonpartisan. During his confirmation hearing earlier this month, the three-term congressman and former naval aviator pledged to keep working across the aisle on issues important to the space program.

In the interview Friday, Rubio never mentioned the campaign ads. But he did say Bridenstine’s political background could be harmful.

“NASA is very important to the state of Florida. And it is really important to me that whoever runs NASA is a professional and commands the respect of NASA’s workforce but is also someone we think we can work with in a productive and constructive way,” he said. “As of this moment, I’m not convinced that Congressman Bridenstine fits that profile.”

http://www.news-press.com/story/news/po … 877400001/

#290 Not So Free Chat » China Starts Cutting Edge Space Science Projects » 2017-11-29 16:36:50

EdwardHeisler
Replies: 1

[Excerpt]

China Starts Cutting Edge Space Science Projects After Declaring First Missions Successful
Chinese Academy of Sciences
November 24, 2017

China has declared its dark matter, x-ray observatory, microgravity and quantum space science missions successful, and is turning attention to a new batch of cutting edge projects.

The Chinese Academy of Sciences (CAS) last Tuesday declared that the four missions making up its pioneering Strategic Priority Program on Space Science have been successful in terms of science, management and execution.

The missions, launched between December 2015 and June 2017, are the 'Wukong' (or DAMPE) dark matter probe, the Shijian-10 retrievable satellite, the Quantum Science Satellite 'Mozi', and the Hard X-ray Modulation Telescope (HXMT), also known as 'Insight'.
CAS sees the missions as having improved China's global standing in space science and beyond, but looking to the future the next batch of missions were officially opened on Tuesday.

The next phase of missions are already under development and will be launched around 2021, as part of a wider, long-term vision for space science.

These are SMILE, a space-weather observatory mission being developed in collaboration with the European Space Agency, a global water cycle observation mission (WCOM), the Magnetosphere, Ionosphere and Thermosphere coupling exploration mission (MIT), the Einstein Probe (EP), and the Advanced Space-based Solar Observatory (ASO-S).

Operating in the new field of transient astronomy, the Einstein Probe will survey large portions of the universe for exotic space phenomena using very sensitive wide-filed X-ray camera and telescope.

EP will also aim to locate the electromagnetic wave counterparts of gravitational wave events, and survey the skies for phenomena including supernovae, neutron stars and transient activity in galactic centres.

WCOM will further understanding of the global water cycle and its variations, while SMILE will investigate how charged particles coming from the sun interact with the Earth’s magnetosphere. MIT will involve sending four spacecraft to various altitudes to simultaneously investigate the magneto-, iono-, and themospheres at the Earth’s polar regions.

ASO-S will study the connections between the solar magnetic field, solar flares and coronal mass ejections.

Also launching around this time will be the Space Variable Objects Monitor (SVOM), a collaboration between CNES, the French space agency and China National Space Agency (CNSA).

The SVOM spacecraft aims to study Gamma Ray Bursts (GRBs) - the most powerful explosions in the universe - emanating from the era of the first generation of stars. The phenomena are triggered by the deaths of massive stars or merger of two smaller stars.

http://english.cas.ac.cn/newsroom/news/ … 6544.shtml

#291 Re: Human missions » Keeping the Focus on Mars: New Space Editorial November 2017 » 2017-11-26 10:46:46

Oldfart1939 wrote:

Politicians. NASA. Both need a serious wakeup call. They are asleep at the switch.

With few exceptions they are wide awake and completely uninterested in the unprofitable scientific exploration of Mars.

They are very interested in profit making Moon ventures that can enrich them and the militarization of space. 

And that's about it.

#292 Human missions » Keeping the Focus on Mars: New Space Editorial November 2017 » 2017-11-25 20:11:28

EdwardHeisler
Replies: 8

Keeping the Focus on Mars
by Hubbard Scott
Editor-in-Chief
New Space. November 2017

My purpose in this editorial is to explain as clearly as I can why I think human exploration as well as robotic science and the space entrepreneur must maintain a focus on the exploration of Mars.

In my lifetime, I have heard four Administrations present a major space exploration initiative. Vice President Pence's recent statements are the latest. To date, the only promise that has become reality was President Kennedy's speech in 1961, where he committed the nation to sending a man to the Moon before the end of the decade and returning him safely.1,2 It is well worth noting that to achieve JFK's vision required about $200 billion (in today's money) and a budget profile that peaked at 4% of the Federal budget.*

Then there came George H.W. Bush in 1989 and his Space Exploration Initiative (SEI) that promised a return to the Moon (with human astronauts) and then on to Mars. After a now infamous 90-day study, Bush 41's plan was pronounced dead on arrival at the Congress due to a rumored (but never published) ∼$500 billion price tag.

George W. Bush made a Kennedy-like proclamation with his talk at NASA headquarters in 2004 that unveiled the so-called Constellation program that would, yes, return U.S. astronauts to the Moon and then on to Mars. (I was in the room as a NASA Center Director for that talk. When a group of us senior folks took a look at the budget assumptions, we were dumbfounded by the math. The plan did not look executable even in 2004.)

Constellation was reviewed by a blue-ribbon committee in 2009, which found the program would require multi-year increases adding about $3B to NASA's annual budget.3 That path was declared unsustainable and replaced by a much more modest NASA in-house program (Space Launch System plus the Orion capsule) and the beginning of what became the Commercial Cargo and Crew Programs.
President Obama tried his hand at a presidential space statement in 2010 in a speech at the Kennedy Space Center. (I was also present for that talk but now as a Stanford faculty member.) This time the Administration avoided the Moon and proclaimed that U.S. astronauts would dock with an asteroid and then eventually go on to Mars. Obama's speech caused NASA to produce two outcomes: one was the ill-fated Asteroid Redirect Mission (ARM) that never enjoyed the support of Congress, the science community, or even NASA's own Advisory Council.4 The other result was a NASA Journey to Mars that was constructed in a series of phases that would retire risk and eventually get humans to Mars in the 2030s. The most recent Journey to Mars approach adopted an approach to orbit Mars with humans first, then land in a subsequent mission. That plan was championed by a paper published in this journal5 and a workshop I co-chaired.6 While NASA's Journey was not highly detailed, most of us in the Mars community thought it built on a reasonable set of assumptions and might be contained within a plausible budget if appetites were limited.

Very recently, in October 2017, the new Administration, through Vice President Pence, has announced both to the resurrected Space Council and in an Op-Ed that NASA should study a plan for “human missions to the moon” as a “stepping-stone” for later human missions to Mars.7,8 Pence also called for a “full review” of commercial space regulations to identify areas that can be streamlined.
In the narrative thus far, you should have noticed a trend: these human space-flight initiatives ultimately required large amounts of funding to be successful, but except for Apollo, that funding never appeared and the program was canceled. So, we must ask, what are the risks and rewards of Pence's proposed path?

During the Augustine review, one of the “budget busters” of the Constellation plan was the cost of developing a full human-rated lunar landing system plus infrastructure in addition to new launch vehicles.† Clearly, a major cost risk in Pence's plan will be the same. By adding human surface lunar missions, one of two things will likely happen: the new costs will push back the Journey to Mars to some date much further in the future than 2033 or some other part of NASA will be cut to make up the difference.

There may be other ways to mitigate the cost risk: adding international partners, adopting a minimum lunar plan such as the minimum Mars approach, or perhaps using some acquisition strategy such as the Commercial Cargo Program. Pence's statements did not explicitly suggest these possibilities, although a subsequent message from Acting Administrator Lightfoot clarifies: “Specifically, NASA has been directed to develop a plan for an innovative and sustainable program of exploration with commercial and international partners to enable human expansion across the solar system, returning humans to the Moon for long-term exploration and utilization, followed by human missions to Mars and other destinations.”9 In my opinion, asking for a realistic cost assessment of this new plan should be clearly demanded by all stakeholders, including the public.

What are the benefits of making lunar surface exploration part of the future NASA plan? In my view, the only unambiguous value is perceived U.S. leadership. The European Space Agency (ESA), as articulated by Jan Woener, the Director of ESA, has for several years been calling for a “Moon Village.”10 The Chinese have publicized plans to send humans to the Moon and have already landed a robotic mission in 2013. I can imagine a politically sensitive Administration desiring to counter the claims of the Chinese, even at the expense of delaying the real prize—exploring Mars.

The Moon is scientifically much less diverse and interesting than Mars. For example, no one claims that life could have originated on the Moon—unlike Mars. The technologies needed for landing and living on an airless body like the Moon are quite different from Mars. Lunar technologies will have limited benefit to future Mars exploration. Finally, some claim that the Moon's resources, especially water ice, can be exploited for future exploration. In general, the Moon is extremely dry. There are data from previous missions to suggest that there may be more abundant water ice trapped at the poles of the Moon, but getting there and mining in temperatures nearing absolute zero will prove very challenging and expensive. By comparison, Mars has water in much greater concentrations distributed more broadly across the planet.

In the meantime, NASA's science organization is moving ahead with planning for what some have long considered the Holy Grail of planetary science: a Mars Sample Return mission. The first leg of the Mars Sample Return campaign is well into development: the Mars 2020 mission with its sample caching hardware. The other two elements of the return—collecting the sample tubes and sending them back to Earth—are now being openly discussed.11 These carefully selected samples hold the promise of giving us an answer to whether life ever emerged on Mars. This is a truly profound question.

As described above, there are now the beginnings of some well thought out affordable humans to Mars plans. And last but certainly not least, the door appears open for commercial and entrepreneurial entities to engage in the deep space program. Elon Musk's vision for going to Mars first stated in 2016 and recently updated12,13 holds out the potential for drastically reducing the cost of transport to Mars. This issue of New Space contains the details of how Lockheed Martin Corporation (LMCO) would create a Mars Base Camp.

I strongly advocate completing the Mars Sample Return. That initiative alone will show continued U.S. leadership and perhaps provide answers to the most fundamental questions humans ask: “Are we alone?” I also believe that any future human exploration plan must keep moving toward Mars for all the reasons described earlier. And if even part of the SpaceX or LMCO Mars plans are executable, these innovators can play a critical role as well.

To end up where I began: from almost any perspective, Mars is the goal for human and scientific exploration. As taxpayers and citizens, we must challenge this Administration to demonstrate how including a human lunar surface program and in parallel continuing the Journey to Mars will be affordable and sustainable. These are very exciting times for space exploration and must not be derailed by an abrupt shift in direction.

REFERENCES

1. JM Logsdon. 2011. John F. Kennedy and The Race to the Moon. New York: Palgrave Macmillan.
2. JM Logsdon. 2015. After Apollo? Richard Nixon and the American Space Program. New York: Palgrave Macmillan.
3. NR Augustine, WM Austin, C. Chyba et al. 2009. Review of U.S. Human Spaceflight Plans Committee: Seeking A Human Spaceflight Program Worthy of A Great Nation. Washington, D.C.: NASA. https://www.nasa.gov/pdf/396093main_HSF … Report.pdf Accessed October 8, 2017.
4. R Lightfoot. 2013. Asteroid Redirect Mission. Mission Formulation Review Results and Status. https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/file … AGGED2.pdf Accessed October 8, 2017.
5. H Price, J Baker, F Naderi. 2015. A Minimal Architecture for Human Journeys to Mars. New Space 3(2): 73–81.
6. The Humans Orbiting Mars Workshop. www.planetary.org/multimedia/video/the-space-advocate/the-humans-orbiting-mars-workshop.html Accessed October 8, 2017.
7. M. Pence America Will Return to the Moon—and Go Beyond. The Wall Street Journal. https://www.wsj.com/articles/america-wi … 1507158341 Accessed October 8, 2017.
8. K Chang. Space Council Chooses the Moon as Trump Administration Priority. The New York Times. October 5, 2017. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/05/scie … pence.html Accessed October 8, 2017.
9. NASA Statement on National Space Council Policy for Future American Leadership in Space. October 5, 2017. https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/nasa … dership-in Accessed October 8, 2017.
10. J Foust. Space Agency Heads See the Moon on the Path to Mars. Space News. April 5, 2017. http://spacenews.com/space-agency-heads … h-to-mars/ Accessed October 8, 2017.
11. TH Zurbuchen. Presentation August 28–30, 2017. Review of Progress Toward Implementing the Decadal Survey Vision and Voyages for Planetary Sciences. Washington, D.C.: The National Academies of Sciences, Engineering, and Medicine. http://sites.nationalacademies.org/ssb/ … ssb_177619 Accessed October 8, 2017.
12. E Musk. 2017. Making Humans a Multi-Planetary Species. New Space 5(2): 46–61.
13. E Musk. Becoming a Multiplanet Species. International Astronautical Conference. September 29, 2017. Adelaide, Australia.

http://online.liebertpub.com/doi/full/1 … .29012.gsh

#293 Not So Free Chat » This is your last chance to stop ISPs from messing up your Internet. » 2017-11-22 13:15:42

EdwardHeisler
Replies: 14

The FCC just announced its plan to slash net neutrality rules, allowing ISPs like Verizon to block apps, slow websites, and charge fees to control what you see & do online. They vote December 14th. But if Congress gets enough calls, *they* can stop the FCC.

What is net neutrality? Why does it matter?
Net neutrality is the principle that Internet providers like Comcast & Verizon should not control what we see and do online. In 2015, startups, Internet freedom groups, and 3.7 million commenters won strong net neutrality rules from the US Federal Communication Commission (FCC). The rules prohibit Internet providers from blocking, throttling, and paid prioritization—"fast lanes" for sites that pay, and slow lanes for everyone else.

We are Team Internet. We support net neutrality, freedom of speech.
Nearly everyone who understands and depends on the Internet supports net neutrality, whether they're startup founders, activists, gamers, politicians, investors, comedians, YouTube stars, or typical Internet users who just want their Internet to work as advertised—regardless of their political party.

For more information go to:
https://www.battleforthenet.com/

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#294 Re: Not So Free Chat » 500 Attend 2017 Flat Earth International Conference » 2017-11-21 21:56:38

RobertDyck wrote:

I could post various videos of ships "sinking" over the horizon.

Well, it's obvious that those ships fell off the edge of our planet and were never seen again!

Even the great ice wall could not stop them from falling.    They must have been on icebreakers.

#295 Re: Not So Free Chat » 500 Attend 2017 Flat Earth International Conference » 2017-11-21 20:06:27

This man is about to launch himself in his homemade rocket to prove the Earth is flat
By Avi Selk 
Washington Post
November 21, 2017


Seeking to prove that a conspiracy of astronauts fabricated the shape of the Earth, a California man intends to launch himself 1,800 feet high on Saturday in a rocket he built from scrap metal.

Assuming the 500-mph, mile-long flight through the Mojave Desert does not kill him, Mike Hughes told the Associated Press, his journey into the atmosflat will mark the first phase of his ambitious flat-Earth space program.

Hughes’s ultimate goal is a subsequent launch that puts him miles above the Earth, where the 61-year-old limousine driver hopes to photograph proof of the disc we all live on.

“It’ll shut the door on this ball earth,” Hughes said in a fundraising interview with a flat-Earth group for Saturday’s flight. Theories discussed during the interview included NASA being controlled by round-Earth Freemasons and Elon Musk making fake rockets from blimps.

Hughes promised the flat-Earth community that he would expose the conspiracy with his steam-powered rocket, which will launch from a heavily modified mobile home — though he acknowledged that he still had much to learn about rocket science.

“This whole tech thing,” he said in the June interview. “I’m really behind the eight ball.”

"I’m a believer in the flat Earth,” Hughes said. “I researched it for several months.”

The host sounded impressed. Hughes had actually flown in a rocket, he noted, whereas astronauts were merely paid actors performing in front of a CGI globe.

“John Glenn and Neil Armstrong are Freemasons,” Hughes agreed. “Once you understand that, you understand the roots of the deception.”

The host talked of “Elon Musk’s fake reality,” and Hughes talked of “anti-Christ, Illuminati stuff.” After half an hour of this, the host told his 300-some listeners to back Hughes’s exploration of space.

While there is no one hypothesis for what the flat Earth is supposed to look like, many believers envision a flat disc ringed by sea ice, which naturally holds the oceans in.

What’s beyond the sea ice, if anything, remains to be discovered.

He won’t be able to test the rocket before he climbs inside and attempts to steam himself at 500 mph across a mile of desert air. And even if it’s a success, he's promised his backers an even riskier launch within the next year, into the space above the disc.

“It’s scary as hell,” Hughes told the AP. “But none of us are getting out of this world alive.”

Read the full article at:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/spe … 26f1324cab


skynews-rocket-man-california_4161263.jpg?20171120115807

#296 Re: Not So Free Chat » 500 Attend 2017 Flat Earth International Conference » 2017-11-18 20:43:30

Antius wrote:

I've heard of the flat Earth society before.  But I always assumed that 'flat Earth' was satire for a more general anti-science scepticism.  I had no idea these people really did believe the world was flat.  I suppose the title should have been a give away!  I wonder if these people ever fear falling off the edge of the world?  If you believe the world is flat then traveling too far must be a constant anxiety :-)

If you walk, drive and fly around in circles you won't fall off!    And you will always get back to where you came from!

#297 Space Policy » From China Daily: "China aims to be world-leading space power by 2045" » 2017-11-18 18:49:21

EdwardHeisler
Replies: 4

China aims to be world-leading space power by 2045
(China Daily)   November 18, 2017

China plans to grow into a global leader in space technology by 2045, according to a route map drawn up by China Aerospace Science and Technology Corp, the major contractor of the country's space programs.
The following are the milestones China is expected to achieve in the following three decades.

-2020: Long March 8 carrier rocket, a medium-size launch vehicle, will make its debut. The application of the new rocket will significantly lower the cost of sending a satellite into low-medium orbit, boosting the country's ability to provide commercial launch services.

-2025: Suborbital spaceflight will be realized. Suborbital spaceflight reaches an altitude between 20 and 100 kilometers, often described as between the highest altitude an airplane can reach and the lowest level a satellite operates.
A suborbital carrier vehicle is able to fly in suborbit, allowing common people to go into space, Lu Yu, a senior rocket engineer from CAST, was quoted as saying by China News Service.

-2030: The 100-ton heavy-lift carrier rocket will be launched. According to the plan, the heavy carrier rocket will have a carrying capacity of 100 tons, compared with the 20-ton-level rocket used currently.
Lu said the heavy-lift carrier rocket will provide strong support for the country's manned lunar-landing mission and the Mars probe's return journey. He said China will by then join the ranks of world-leading countries in space transport capabilities.

-2035: The reusable carrier rocket will be developed. The route map shows an intelligent carrier rocket equipped with advanced power will be widely used in space transport by 2035.
By then, common people will be able to take reusable carrier vehicles to travel in space, Tang Yagang, the director of carrier rocket development at the China Academy of Launch Vehicle Technology, was quoted as saying by China News Service.

-2040: The nuclear-powered space shuttle will be built. It will enable large-scale resource exploration in space and mining on asteroids, as well as the building of space solar-power stations. Lu said between 2040 and 2045, a future generation of carrier rockets will be used in longer-term and multiple space trips.

-2045: China will become an all-round world-leading country in space equipment and technology. By then, it will be able to carry out man-computer coordinated space exploration on a large scale, Wang Liheng, a member of the Chinese Academy of Engineering, told China News Service.

Lu Yu forecast that by 2045, with advanced space transport capabilities, China will be able to carry out large-scale exploration on planets, asteroids and comets in the solar system, as space exploration enters a stage of rapid development.

http://en.people.cn/n3/2017/1118/c90000-9294285.html

#298 Not So Free Chat » 500 Attend 2017 Flat Earth International Conference » 2017-11-18 12:37:23

EdwardHeisler
Replies: 38

Time for a little comic relief.  Edward Heisler

What in the World? Flat-Earthers Gather at First Conference
By Stephanie Pappas, Live Science Contributor |  November 17, 2017

A conference aimed at disputing the idea that the world is round just wrapped up in North Carolina.

The first-ever 2017 Flat Earth International Conference (FEIC) was held in Raleigh on Nov. 9 and 10, featuring some of the big names in round-Earth denial. Among the speakers were Darryle Marble, who once took a level on a plane to "prove" the Earth doesn't curve; Mark Sargent, the creator of the Flat Earth Clues YouTube Series, who believes all life is enclosed in a "Truman Show"-like dome structure; and Jeran Campanella, a YouTube and online radio personality, who makes flat-Earth, 9/11 Truther and other conspiracy theory videos.

The conference was hosted by Kryptoz Media, which produces DVDs and other media arguing that "scientism" is an agenda designed to keep people from God, and the Creation Cosmology Institute, an organization with little online footprint except a now-deleted YouTube channel.   

The conference featured talks such as "NASA and Other Space Lies," "Flat Earth with the Scientific Method," "Waking Up to Mainstream Science Lies" and "Testing the Globe." The conference organizer, Kryptoz Media's Robbie Davidson, is a Christian creationist, and that philosophy emerged in sessions such as "Flat Earth & The Bible" and "Exposing Scientism," the latter of which decried evolution and the Big Bang theory of the universe's origin.

Flat-Earthers believe that Earth is not a globe, but a flat plane. Beliefs on how the "true" globe is laid out vary, but many YouTube personalities who push the conspiracy theory say that the planet is a disc surrounded by an ice wall. Flat-Earthers argue that NASA and other scientific agencies digitally fake pictures of the globe from space and that there is a vast conspiracy to keep the truth of the flat Earth from the public.

No one knows how many people really subscribe to flat-Earth beliefs. The Flat Earth Society, the oldest organization devoted to the belief, claims 555 members. Marble boasts 22,954 subscribers to his YouTube channel. About 500 people attended the conference in Raleigh, Davidson told Live Science via email.

The next annual Flat Earth International Conference will be held in Denver, from Nov. 15 -16, in 2018. Davidson said he expects up to 1,500 attendees.

https://www.livescience.com/60972-flat- … rence.html


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Excerpt from my Mars Paper sent to the archives.

TRUMP MADE AN HONORARY MEMBER OF AN EARTH STUDY SOCIETY!

In recognition of Trumps understanding of and appreciation of scientific endeavors an organization involved in the study of our planet granted Trump honorary membership in their society earlier this year. 

John Davis, the Secretary of the Society publicly announced:   “Universities have a history of granting honorary degrees to men of great significance.   Therefore I’m suggesting that this Society make Donald J. Trump a lifetime honorary member of the Zetetic Council of the Flat Earth Society."

In response a member of the Flat Earth Society commented on their discussion board:   “I totally agree.   I think that Trump has the qualities needed to be a flattie.”   Another Flat Earth member chimed in:   “Perhaps someone should propose a flat Earth curriculum be taught at Trump University”.

#299 Interplanetary transportation » "SLS and Deep Space Gateway are certifiably toast" thanks to Space X » 2017-11-15 21:48:54

EdwardHeisler
Replies: 23

The following is a major excerpt from an article written by Dick Eagleson.    It was posted in the Space Review on October 2, 2017.
I think it is right on target.   The writer pointed out that Elon Musk has a clear battle plan and is "willing, but quite able, to fight back" against the "Old Boy Network" in NASA and Congress.  Let's hope so.

The full article can be read at:
http://www.thespacereview.com/article/3339/1


Many of the changes to BFR from the Interplanetary Transport System (ITS) seem aimed squarely at minimizing the time to reach initial operational capability. The decrease in diameter from 12 to 9 meters allows fabrication of BFR in SpaceX's existing Hawthorne factory, so scratch the time needed to build a bespoke factory elsewhere. The Raptor engine version slated to power BFR seems likely to be either the same as, or only a modest upgrade of that which has already been tested at McGregor. The 42 Raptors of ITS would have produced 685,000 pounds-force each at sea level. The 31 Raptors of BFR will produce 385,000 pounds-force each. So a smaller BFR powered by smaller Raptors is intended to allow a first Mars mission of twin BFR's by 2022 in place of now-cancelled Red Dragons.

Looking at the economics of the newest BFR, absent the haze of sentiment, I see why Elon is, in essence, announcing the coming phase-out of Falcon 9, Dragon 1, and even of Falcon Heavy and Dragon 2 before the latter have made their first flights. All will still fly and do useful work, but BFR is an even more productive cash cow than the Falcons and Dragons could have been if kept in indefinite production and service. With BFR there is no non-recoverable second stage, no problematical payload fairing, no time-consuming ride back to port on drone ship for the first stage. For ISS crew and cargo there is no comparable ride back to port for a capsule splashing down in an ocean. BFR is 100 percent recoverable, 100 percent “feet-dry,” and, literally, gas-and-go.

The variable cost per mission of BFR is dominated by propellant. Given that LNG is cheaper than RP-1, a full propellant load for BFR may not cost a lot more—maybe not even as much—than one for an Falcon Heavy. The Falcons already provide SpaceX with very handsome gross margins per mission. BFR will considerably improve those numbers.

For the rest of launch services industry:
A propellant-dominant mission variable cost structure provides margin to keep launching and making some money even in the face of anything but outright giveaway levels of subsidy by any foreign government or private launch services competitor. I don't see any governments or private operators being likely to actually try such a thing, but BFR’s economics serve pretty effective notice that there would be no point in making the effort.

For NASA:
SLS is now certifiably toast. Elon slit its throat in Adelaide. How long it will take the shambling corpse to notice it is dead and actually fall down is now a matter for the Vegas oddsmakers. Aside from the sporting question of whether the first BFR test flies before SLS EM-1 gets off the ground, BFR will provide the capability to put 20 metric tons more payload at a whack into LEO than even the decade-distant-at-best SLS Block 2. That’s over twice as much LEO throw weight as the anemic SLS Block 1 and almost half again more than the SLS Block 1B. Oh yeah, SLS costs $2 billion a copy, is production-limited to two missions per year, max, and is expendable. BFR, once built, will fly for close to the cost of propellant, will be able to do so on an extremely short turnaround, and will be 100 percent reusable. Did I mention that BFR's payload volume will also be bigger than SLS's? Somebody play Taps already.

Also for NASA:
The Deep Space Gateway is now certifiably toast. When a 2-BFR mission can put 150 tons on the Moon and bring 50 tons back many times per year, it becomes straightforwardly possible—if I may indulge an American West analogy—to quickly and cheaply put as many Ponderosa main houses as one cares to on the actual lunar surface (or subsurface). By that standard, the notional DSG is just a “line shack” out in the middle of nowhere.

Yet again for NASA:
Space-borne astronomy and planetary science could be a lot cheaper if sponsoring groups could take advantage of BFR’s ample Earth-escape throw weight to not build probes that are prodigies of light weight. More savings yet could accrue from making maximum use of the cavernous payload bay of the freighter version of BFR’s upper stage to avoid all the origami engineering needed to get probes inside existing payload fairings. Such projects, when BFR's many advantages make them cheap enough, are increasingly likely to originate outside of NASA's ambit.

For Blue Origin:
Elon has seen Jeff Bezos his 7-meter payload fairing and raised him 2 meters. And, in addition, done away with the fairing entirely in favor of a door that comes back along with the rest of the freighter version of the BFR spaceship. He's also rendered the economics of New Glenn’s non-reusable upper stage(s) problematical by, in essence, doing with BFR what Blue Origin doesn't plan to do until New Armstrong. “Gradatim” may simply not be fast enough to keep up.

For Blue Origin and Virgin Galactic:
Elon’s Adelaide presentation about point-to-point suborbital service on Earth is more problematical of accomplishment than the purely space-related aspects of BFR. But if SpaceX establishes this service on even one such route, it pretty well kills the nascent sub-orbital space tourism business as currently envisioned by both Virgin Galactic and Blue Origin. Even at Concorde-like ticket prices, an antipodal BFR flight would cost a small fraction of what both Virgin Galactic and Blue Origin seem set to charge. The flights would also last much longer and involve much more zero-G time than the flight profiles planned by Virgin Galactic and Blue Origin. Plus, you'd actually get to go somewhere instead of just up and back. But the real killer is that the space tourists might well be outnumbered by in-a-hurry businesspeople who are willing to pay for speedy transport and might see also getting a set of astronaut wings as just a nice souvenir of the trip.

The twin changes of SpaceX's message at this year's IAC compared to last year’s are those of speed-up and autarky—going it alone—regarding BFR. Last year, I think, Elon was still hopeful that he could convince NASA into joining his ITS-based Mars crusade and bring some non-trivial government cash to the marriage too. Over the intervening year, though, SpaceX's relations with NASA have, on net, appeared to deteriorate.

The ISS people have thrown in with SpaceX and seem to be increasingly embracing practical reusablity. SpaceX has friends other places within NASA as well.

Musk now realizes, in my opinion, that there is no significant NASA money in prospect for his Mars project and also that there is still a sizable bloc in NASA and Congress alike that still cherish hopes of smacking down SpaceX and restoring the status quo. The revised BFR plans are, in part, a way of minimizing future NASA and congressional leverage over what SpaceX does. They are also a way of simultaneously holding a number of traditional NASA and congressional “rice bowls” at risk. The Old Boy Network has long been used to being able to squish troublemakers pretty much at will. SpaceX, though, is not only willing, but quite able, to fight back. The BFR revisions showcased in Adelaide are, in addition to being a roadmap, also a battle plan.

#300 Space Policy » China/Russia Agree to Cooperate on Deep Space Exploration & Spacecraft » 2017-11-09 20:42:43

EdwardHeisler
Replies: 4

China, Russia agree cooperation on lunar and deep space exploration, other sectors
by GBTIMES
Nov 02, 2017


China and Russia agreed to a deal on Wednesday committing the countries to cooperation in six space-related areas for the period 2018-2022.

The deal was one of around 20 agreements signed by Chinese Premier Li Keqiang and his Russian counterpart Dmitry Medvedev in Beijing at the 22nd regular meeting between the heads of government of China and Russia.

A press release from Roscosmos space agency states that the cooperation between Russia and China in the field of space consists of six sectors, including lunar and deep space, joint spacecraft development, space electronics, Earth remote sensing data, and space debris monitoring.

The programme had been agreed between Igor Komarov, head of Roscosmos, and Tang Dengjie, administrator of the China National Space Agency (CNSA).

Both countries are developing new launch vehicles, including China's Long March 8 and super heavy-lift Long March 9, and Russian Angara rocket family, and each has Moon exploration programmes, CLEP and Luna-Glob.

Roscosmos public communications had not replied to a request for further information on the specifics at time of publishing.

https://gbtimes.com/china-russia-agree- … er-sectors


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Russia, China sign rocket engine cooperation agreement
Science & Tech
June 27, 2016
Interfax

The governments of Russia and China have signed an agreement aimed at providing legislation governing cooperation in the development of rocket engines and launch vehicles, Roscosmos said.

“An agreement was signed between the Russian government and the Chinese government on measures to protect technologies in connection with cooperation in the sphere of exploration and use of space for peaceful purposes and in the creation and operation of launch vehicles and ground-based space infrastructure in Beijing during the official visit of Russian President Vladimir Putin,” a report posted on the Roscosmos website said.

According to the report, the agreement was signed by Roscosmos Chief Executive Igor Komarov and Xu Dazhe, who represented the China National Space Administration (CNSA).

https://www.rbth.com/news/2016/06/27/ru … ent_606453

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