New Mars Forums

As Bwhite noted under the Might Shuttle C Topic if I can paraphase his comment correctly, Even bad management can change a good model into a poor or bad one. Not to mention funding like wise can also be just as damaging.

I want to be the lint, lining those pockets.

From Private industry a good or bad business model is a make or break when it comes to making profit.

Earlier today I had posted the cost of the External tanks and of the shuttle operations launch use figures came from another forum member.

This sparked my interest in trying to justify why we are using the shuttle and for the same point why the CEV is ultimately needed to replace it.

Yes some cludged together combinations of off the shelf and or clean slate design are being thought of by not only us on this board but also by real rocket makers.

Existing rockets we know in the delta and atlas for the lift of payload capability and of there approximate cost.

But does these make for a good business model for the private industry.

If any one knows more specific cost of pieces we could see if changes could be made to make rocketry costs lower. This could be done for each rocket in use and can be applied to others including the SDV, clean slate approach to the CEV and to others still yet to be thought of.

So lets run the numbers for the Shuttle.

Each orbiter vehicle cost to build a specific amount and are either amonitized or averaged per flight use. We at various points have had a max of 6 though we have lost 2 and one was never meant to fly leaving the remainder (3) to be used until retired.

Anybody know the cost of each to compile the data with?

Each when initially used most likely had new or reconditioned SRB motors per flight for the totals used so far of course times 2. In addition there has been changes made to there design due to oring leakeage when cold but also thrust enhancements as well over time.

Does any one know these cost per unit?

Each shuttle use get one External tank cost 40 million. Thou the tank has gone though changes to make it lighter over time. I dont know the cost saves or additional cost for having done these things.

Fuel and Oxidizer cost is probably been pretty constant but may have gone up in price over time like everything else for the most part does.

By time we have all the figures the best model will either show expendables or Re-usable to be the better for private business model to use I hope.

This may not be the correct post location but here is some info on drilling.

Planetary Drill Automation Field Test at Arctic Crater

For the first time, a full-scale Mars-prototype deep drill has been tested under field conditions at a high-fidelity Mars-analog site. The first Drilling Automation for Mars Exploration (DAME) field season deployed a modified Honeybee Deep Drill.

http://www.marsonearth.org/reports/07.3 … pdate.html

There were 11 completed external tanks at Michoud when Columbia disintegrated over Texas and Louisiana. Those tanks, which cost $40 million apiece, must be retrofitted.

The Michoud plant's work force stands at about 2,000. Under existing contracts, Lockheed Martin will continue to produce external tanks through 2008.

Official: Redesigned shuttle tanks will be safest ever
http://www.2theadvocate.com/stories/081 … s001.shtml

So lets see if I have the thought on the number of tanks still yet to be made. Roughly 30 flights give or take to complete the ISS minus the 10 equals, 20 tanks at 40 million a piece to make. Or 800 million spead over the next 3 or 4 years in budgetary demands.

X-prize contestant still in the hunt for the 10 million.

Canadian Arrow Drop Test Scheduled for Saturday
http://www.canadianarrow.com/

http://www.hobbyspace.com/AAdmin....04.html

No Green Light for Hubble Rescue 
http://www.wired.com/news/space/0,2697, … _tophead_6

Not really a change but only no cash funds have been put forth yet and a critical design review is 9 to 12 months away.

No need to land on the ground to create a place to live on venus. Create a balloon system and energy transfer exchanger from the heat of the atmosphere to create electricity to keep it flying non stop. Collect gasses from atmosphere for breathing and for water. Basically a floating atmospheric base. The same could work I think for an airplane like system as well.

Addition resources on Dexter

Hubble: Robot to the rescue?
NASA moves forward with a plan to service the Hubble Space Telescope without the space shuttle.

http://www.astronomy.com/asy/default.aspx?c=a&id=2377

India's space agency
http://www.isro.org/

See the other topic for other details on solar sails.

Japan launches Solar Sail
at last someone did it!

I had remembered seeing an article earlier this year about one of the European launchers having foam problems as well. It was on there Ariane 5 rocket. So the shuttle ET tank is not the only place that has had this happen.

http://www.spacedaily.com/2004/04022712 … spbqj.html

As far as the weight of the mars habitat and such, switching to lighter alloys where ever possible in the construction is definitely the way to go.